film and Music

[StonedApe]

Are film and music getting "worse". We've been having a bit of a discussion on the movie Avatar and it seems there is a sentiment that mainstream film is turning to junk. I have to agree, what do you think?

[Scatterbrain]

No, generally past music and movies are overrated in relation to the present's.

[StonedApe]

I think it really depends on what you look at. In terms of the best movies and films, I think they are getting better. But as far as what's popular or accepted as good I think things are getting worse. Like as far as popular rap, rock, jazz, funk, just about any genre it seems to be getting worse.

[Oneironaut Zero]

Are film and music getting "worse". We've been having a bit of a discussion on the movie Avatar and it seems there is a sentiment that mainstream film is turning to junk. I have to agree, what do you think? I agree with Scatterbrain. I think that the sentiment that "the old days are better than today" is one that is repeated throughout history. Granted, I'm not completely 'guilt-free', because I feel the same bit of resentment toward nu-skool rap vs. old-skool hip-hop, but I believe there are many more notable differences. To a certain degree, I believe that "mainstream" has always appealed to an audience that those who try to keep their tastes to the more "exquisite" end of the spectrum might tend to disagree with. Mainstream has never professed itself to be the most sophisticated of venues. It is simply the most easily received by the masses. I still maintain my opinion that there is some very impressive (if not flat-out amazing), mainstream entertainment out there. But such a judgment is a matter of taste, and cannot be mistaken for objectivity.

[CRAZY BONE]

Are film and music getting "worse". We've been having a bit of a discussion on the movie Avatar and it seems there is a sentiment that mainstream film is turning to junk. I have to agree, what do you think? Well mainstream has always been full of junk as far as I know, but that doesn't mean all of it is junk. I mean, unless you only watch indie films, chances are most of your favorite movies were released in theatres (which is what mainstream is, right?). Tons of great movies get released into the mainstream such as Brokeback Mountain, Ray, Jarhead, etc. take your pick. I chose these as example films because they were still sucessful even though they're not the types of films that audiences would normally flock to. I think more than any other genre, horror movies have suffered the most in the mainstream. What's even worse is that they are remaking all of the classics like A Nightmare on Elm Street, The Fly, The Wolf Man, and Creature from the Black Lagoon. We already know how badly they fucked up Halloween, Friday the 13th, and Amityville Horror. Thank god I have Shutter Island to look forward to, that is, if they don't screw the pooch on that one too. As far as music goes, auto-tune is the new trend, and I'll admit that there are some pretty good songs to come out of this, but it's mostly crap I'd say.

[Universal Mind]

Are film and music getting "worse". We've been having a bit of a discussion on the movie Avatar and it seems there is a sentiment that mainstream film is turning to junk. I have to agree, what do you think? Yes. In the 1970's, the entertainment corporations learned something I wish they had never figured out. They can make a lot more money in a short time if they stop concentrating on blowing people's minds and instead concentrate on making as many people as possible like their stuff just enough to buy it. The entertainment we have now is about barely hitting the buy threshold and gaining mass numbers of customers in a hurry. That is why stuff is so pathetic now. Why they gave up the idea of long term investment is something I can't answer. Lady Gaga probably rose to the top much faster than Led Zeppelin did, and her albums probably sell a Hell of a lot more than theirs did on opening day, but her sales will be completely dead in a few years. Led Zeppelin, on the other hand, will still be making people rich hundreds of years from now, even thousands of years from now. Quick bucks are the big trend in entertainment these days, and I am not sure why. However, there are exceptions. I like some popular music that's out now, and I absolutely love the some of the ambient space music and jazz that is coming out.

[StonedApe]

I wasn't trying to say it's all bad, just that it seems people generally will enjoy anything as long as it's produced well and has a recognizable form. And record and movie execs seem to be taking advantage of this fact and making a lot of shitty media, hyping it then making assloads of money on it.

[CRAZY BONE]

Quick bucks are the big trend in entertainment these days, and I am not sure why. Well If I was in the buisness of making money I would go for the quick bucks too. Why the hell should I care if someone is getting rich thousands of years after I'm dead. I want my money now!

[Mes Tarrant]

What examples of good movie soundtracks can you think of that would trump the average soundtrack of today, though? I don't know about music in general, yes, maybe it's getting "worse," but people's tastes are also changing. But I can't really think of an old movie that has an epic orchestral soundtrack or whatever that is better or more memorable than say the music from LOTR, A Beautiful Mind, or countless other pieces that maybe aren't very complex but are haunting or memorable in their own way.

[StonedApe]

I think that's really what I'm on about. Peoples tastes are changing, but not of their own will, through maketing and manipulation. People should like what they like because it's good, not because someone wants to make money off of them. Like why , does this exist? WHY!!!!

[CRAZY BONE]

What examples of good movie soundtracks can you think of that would trump the average soundtrack of today, though? Jarhead, Vanilla Sky, and Friday come to mind.

[Black_Eagle]

Seeing as entertainment has changed over time, it is certainly possible that one would have sentiments that entertainment of the past is superior to music of the present. But I think great pieces of entertainment get pumped out at a fairly even rate. I hypothesize that, when looking back on the past, it's easy to allow yourself to lump all the great things together and turn a cheek to the far more numerous things that weren't so great.

[StonedApe]

I think that more quality music is being made today than in the past, it's just that most people still listen to crap. And it seems like there's a lot more crap and a lot worse crap. I think that before 1940 this crap didn't even exist.

[grasshoppa]

No, generally past music and movies are overrated in relation to the present's. I love old movies. I watched an old western the other day with jimmy something and bruce wayne (or john wayne?). It was awesome, so old school, the acting wasn't better, but I did feel like they were more like characters rather than superstars in a movie. My name is nobody is another good one I agree with Scatterbrain. I think that the sentiment that "the old days are better than today" is one that is repeated throughout history. Granted, I'm not completely 'guilt-free', because I feel the same bit of resentment toward nu-skool rap vs. old-skool hip-hop, but I believe there are many more notable differences. The music in the 90's was way better than the music in the 00's. I was young in the 90's so I didn't listen to much music, but now I listen to some, and I definately prefer 90's music. Moreso than any other era of music actually. Even 90's films were better. I mean, you got slience of the lambs, a bunch of jim carrey classics....Loads better than Bruce almighty and the bullcrap sequals to sotlambs. I genuinely think that the entertainment industry was better in the 90's, not just because everything was better back in my day type deal

[Beeyahoi]

I think we're just now coming out of a slump when it comes to film, but about 85% of music is still shite.

[Universal Mind]

Well If I was in the buisness of making money I would go for the quick bucks too. Why the hell should I care if someone is getting rich thousands of years after I'm dead. I want my money now! I only mentioned the thousands of years to illustrate the lasting power of music that gains extremely passionate fans. It should be important to music executives because they can make really good money off it for the rest of their lives, and so can their descendants. Quality music is an excellent long term investment.

[Speesh]

I've always found music and movies to be two entirely separate mediums when it comes to quality and creativity. I don't know to much about the movie industry (all I'd ever want is that they cool it with the relentless sequels and remakes) but I've definitely got a take on music. IMO music in the 00s is was as good as that of the 70s. Probably 95% of the stuff I listen to (excluding jazz and classical) is either from 67-74 or 2000-present. The amount of overall creativity and talent in music after 74 just dropped like a rock, when as UM said the entertainment corporations figured it out. Back then the mainstream reflected the greater scope of music out there, so as the mainstream declined so did the rest of the music. However now with the rise of internet and such the mainstream, while still profitable, doesn't exert an influence over the rest of us. Also with the recording technology out there now, not only is there a lot more stuff, but there's a lot more good stuff. I'm very happy I'm growing up in these times as opposed to the 80s. But hey, that's all subjective isn't it. Some people love the music of the 80s and 90s. I can make the claim that music is getting better as communication technology increases.

[Mes Tarrant]

I didn't think Vanilla Sky qualified as an "old" movie, I guess I should clarify what y'all meant first. I'm very happy I'm growing up in these times as opposed to the 80s. But hey, that's all subjective isn't it. Some people love the music of the 80s and 90s. I can make the claim that music is getting better as communication technology increases. I pretty much agree with you. I think saying that music is getting worse now is equivalent to sitting in your ol' rocker in your front yard, yelling at the kids who accidentally step onto your lawn and mumbling, "Kids these days. When I was young, we did X Y and Z..." If I had to pick one music time period to listen to exclusively for the rest of my life, it'd be this one, to be honest.

[Alric]

There is a lot of good stuff out there, but if you are talking about general main stream stuff, then yea it is getting a lot worse. Especially movies. People are just not creative. How many movies are old movies that have been redone? How many are sequals? You look at new movies coming out in the last 5 years, it is flooded with old shows and movies being redone, and everything has a sequal, because they are cheap lazy ways of making a new movie. Nearly every movie that comes out is either redone movie, a sequal or based off a book. At least you can some times get away with making a book into a movie, but there is still almost no movie writings who create original work. In fact, most of the orginal movies are the animated stuff, most of which is for kids. And even though its often for kids, its normally better than a lot of the crap you see coming out.

[StonedApe]

I think saying that music is getting worse now is equivalent to sitting in your ol' rocker in your front yard, yelling at the kids who accidentally step onto your lawn and mumbling, "Kids these days. When I was young, we did X Y and Z..." I do feel like that sometimes, but then I remember that I currently am part of the music scene, albeit far far from the mainstream. I really don't think it's the same. There's a difference between not liking rock music because it's loud and uses electric instruments and not liking mainstream rap because it is just the same phrase repeated 50 fucking times in a row. People used to complain about music because it was experimental. I'm complaining about music because creativity doesn't seem to be a requirement for it any more. As a musician I feel as if music can't be experimental enough. That's where the real joy of music comes from for me, creating and exploring entire landscapes of sound.

[Carôusoul]

There is alot of great music and fantastic films today, but they aren't as mainstream as they used to be. I do however certainly think that mainstream film and music is getting worse. I blame this largely on teenagers and children being marketed to more. -_-

[Luanne]

I could say the amount of quality films and music is always same. It's just about what you personally run into and what is brutally presented to you, and of course those plenty fine pieces of art that you unfortunately miss. You base your opinion on that flawed statistic. But that opinion stays subjective and individual. You can not compare present with past. You can't, cause you're in it. You observe the change in people, in their criteria, their lifestyle, you're under a lot of influence. It's still running. It's like, you can't give a valid opinion on some movie while watching it, before seeing the end, before sleeping it over. On the other hand, you can give a valid opinion while observing the painting, cause it's static, it's done. We have just closed the '00, we have to give it some time to be able to compare them to earlier decades. But we'll be able to compare them, cause they will both be in the past. That's about comparing the existence of art, but when it comes to mainstream I totally agree with UM. Yes. In the 1970's, the entertainment corporations learned something I wish they had never figured out. They can make a lot more money in a short time if they stop concentrating on blowing people's minds and instead concentrate on making as many people as possible like their stuff just enough to buy it. The entertainment we have now is about barely hitting the buy threshold and gaining mass numbers of customers in a hurry. That is why stuff is so pathetic now. Why they gave up the idea of long term investment is something I can't answer. Lady Gaga probably rose to the top much faster than Led Zeppelin did, and her albums probably sell a Hell of a lot more than theirs did on opening day, but her sales will be completely dead in a few years. Led Zeppelin, on the other hand, will still be making people rich hundreds of years from now, even thousands of years from now. Quick bucks are the big trend in entertainment these days, and I am not sure why.

[Xei]

Nope I completely disagree. The 2000s have been a great year for film. Pixar has made a series of animated masterpieces. The Lord of the Rings is the greatest epic film ever created. The number of films with engaging stories is the same or greater than ever... examples include Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind and Children of Men. Avatar was an incredible excersice in escapism and the people who see it as an example of filmographical decadence are luddites. There has always been good music and bad music and the only reason you could have for concluding that all music is bad is that you base your judgement exclusively on what's on the radio and TV... which would make you a bit of an idiot. Good, innovative music is still made. Two albums in my very short list of masterpieces have been made this decade, namely Radiohead's Kid A and Arcade Fire's Funeral. Last decade was also very good with OK Computer, The La's, The Stone Roses, and Loveless, the last of which I consider the greatest album ever made.

[Universal Mind]

The Lord of the Rings movies are great for times when I want to get to sleep in a hurry, and Radiohead works really well when I want to torture my ears.

[Xei]

Thanks for your input.