Thread: failed Magic Mushroom experiement

I've been curious as to how a low-dose of psilocybe mushrooms would effect the dream state. Last night, i finally attempted a session. I slept for 3 hours then awoke to take two 0.4ish gram pills of magic mushrooms. I immediatly returned my head to my pillow and tried to fade back to sleep. Unfortunatly, my mind was too active and excited that I was not able to return to sleep. After about 20 minutes, the effects started to kick in and it became evident that I would not be able to get to sleep.

This experiement has failed, however I will try again soon. I'm going to stick with the .8 grams, but I will take some melatonin which should help me fall back to sleep.

The best dreams I've had have always been when I've had some dairy products before going to sleep, may it be hot milk or some chocolate or a yogurt. Dairy product dreams, as I call them, are the best and most craziest dreams I have and I love them.

When I consume excessive amounts of water during a week, my dreams turn to very relaxing, calming and soothing dreams, often where I am flying and I'm really chilled out. I don't know why consumption of water should cause that.

However, I've never tried drugs to inflict different dreams. Alcohol dreams are ok, though I don't remember them very well.

TB

i dont think hes talkin about dairy products lmao shrooms arent exactly in that category? well they come out of a cows ass so hmmmm

Yeh I know, Jay, sheesh. Just sharing my thoughts and experiences from consuming different products, that's all .

TB

I have believed for a while that psychedelic drug experiences are just partial experiences of the lucid dream state. The other day, I did some 7x salvia divinorum, a drug that makes mushrooms look like glasses of milk. I had four experiences on it, and I decided that the experiences I was having, as mind blowing as they were, were really just drug induced lucid dreams. (I wanted to have one last session on psychedelic drugs before leaving them behind and getting all the way into lucid dreaming.) Well, in the first two experiences, I was still percieving the outside world. In the second two, I had friends hold extra lighters on the bong bowl so that the salvia would get extra hot and work better (which is recommended on the web sites), and I went into a 100% hallucinogenic state where strange humanoid figures were doing stuff so bizarre I don't even know how to really describe it. The best summary I have been able to give of the experience is "Sesame Street Armageddon." However, the experience is always really uncomfortable and uncontrollable. Every time I come out of it, I think immediately about how I don't ever want to do it again. The fun is not in the experience itself. The fun is in looking back on the experience after you come out of it. The more hallucinogenic the experience, the less lucid it is. In other words, the greater the dream factor, the lesser the lucidity factor. It was as if I was waking up from dreams after forgetting I was even dreaming. I was much more lucid in the less hallucinogenic states.

My point is that psychedelic drugs like salvia divinorum are just inducers of lucid dream like states. They usually only give a sample of it, but sometimes they might produce the real thing, except the hallucinations can't be controlled and very often involve an element of terror. Lucid dreams, however, are the full blown effect and involve extreme levels of awareness and are controllable and peaceful. If one ever does get scary, the situation can be handled with confidence, especially since one can always wake up from them immediately if necessary. Therefore, I don't think mushrooms could really add anything to a lucid dream because the most they can do in the first place is cause a mimicking of lucid dreaming, and the worst they can do is add terror and make the dream less controllable.

You''re a bunch of drugaddicts!

I had a bad experience about a year ago taking half an ounce of mushrooms before going to sleep as I read through different sources on the erowid.org website that psilocybin is supposed to make lucid dreaming really intense and easy to drift into. Well...perhaps for some people but for me it had a caffenating effect and I couldn't get to sleep. Futhermore, I spent six hours tripping into my deep subconscious in a pitch black room...I laughed, I cried, I got scared and I ventured too far into the schema of my mind because that was the only option you have when faced with a black void. Be warned!

Originally posted by Universal Mind
I have believed for a while that psychedelic drug experiences are just partial experiences of the lucid dream state. The other day, I did some 7x salvia divinorum, a drug that makes mushrooms look like glasses of milk.

Jesus, tell me about it. That is a drug that should only be done in the comfort of ones' bedroom. It's like teleporting into the non-conscious of a chair.

You''re a bunch of drugaddicts! [/b]

Careful about your judgements PutBoy. Because someone uses drugs, doesn't make them a drug addict, or a bad person. Although if you were just joking, then n/m.

toomanypossibilities, your problem was rooted in the fact that you took the dose of mushrooms at the wrong time. You aren't supposed to have the mushroom's effects active during your sleep, it is after the experience in which a lot of vivid and lucid dreams occur. Next time take the shrooms in mid-afternoon or early evening (they will last 6 hours), and when you feel the trip ending and your body relaxing, go to sleep. It may take longer than usual to fall asleep because of how active your mind is, but if you take melatonin to counter this, you may fall asleep faster. Your dreams that night should be more spectacular than usual, but as is the case with some psychedelics, the night after the experience may harbor the most impressive dreams. My basic point is, don't worry about having the shrooms be in effect while you sleep, just enjoy the trip, and wait until you can fall asleep. The shroom dosage shouldn't be too important, but the larger the dose may create more profound effects on your subconscious that will help boost dreaming. Another thing to remember is that if you suddenly take shrooms when you do not have a history of using them regularly, the dreaming effects may not be immediate. If you use them once a week, after a few weeks, the dreams will undoubtedly become more and more enhanced. I am not recommending regular use, but am stating that that is usually the case.

seenoevil, half an ounce of shrooms is a lot. 1/4 of an ounce is even a lot. Are you talking about dried or wet ones, though? I can imagine how that much would create such an intense trip. But even if it was a "bad" trip, sometimes those are the ones that teach us the most.

UniversalMind, You may be right that Salvia emulates a lucid dream, as the experiences are indeed very similar. But with Salvia we often see both what is going on in the real world, and in our minds, plus the fact that some people claim they can leave their body on it and travel around in the real world.

Originally posted by Matchbook
UniversalMind, You may be right that Salvia emulates a lucid dream, as the experiences are indeed very similar. But with Salvia we often see both what is going on in the real world, and in our minds, plus the fact that some people claim they can leave their body on it and travel around in the real world.

I was able to see what was going on in the real world along with my hallucinations until I got better hits, and then I saw absolutely nothing at all in the real world. My point was that the salvia experience and all other psychedelic drug experiences are just partial lucid dream states. If you think that is better than a full lucid dream state, then I can respect that opinion, but if I am going to lucid dream at all, I want to go all the way with it.

Originally posted by seenoevil


Jesus, tell me about it. That is a drug that should only be done in the comfort of ones' bedroom. It's like teleporting into the non-conscious of a chair.

That is SUCH an accurate description of some of the stuff I experienced on it.

Did it happen to ring a bell when I mentioned the experience of Sesame Street Armageddon?

Hallucinogens are not all the same. Some efect diffreent areas of the mind. Some actually starve your brain cells of oxygen and therefore you hallucinate. There is no conclusive evidence linking drug altered states and lucid dreaming and many of the greatest lucid dreamers are completely drug free. So if you are using illegal drugs and talking about them in a public forum I think its not a stretch to suggest you may have a drug problem. In fact I am going to suggest to the moderators that this whould not be a site where people are instructed about how to use illegal drugs.

regards,

EJ

Just thinking, why does everybody think ALL mushrooms come out of cows asses???
Yes it is possible to grow in cow dung, it does not come from the cows ass even in that case.
And its just one species...

Originally posted by ElijahJones
Hallucinogens are not all the same. Some efect diffreent areas of the mind. Some actually starve your brain cells of oxygen and therefore you hallucinate. There is no conclusive evidence linking drug altered states and lucid dreaming and many of the greatest lucid dreamers are completely drug free. So if you are using illegal drugs and talking about them in a public forum I think its not a stretch to suggest you may have a drug problem. In fact I am going to suggest to the moderators that this whould not be a site where people are instructed about how to use illegal drugs.

regards,

EJ

The point is that dreams are full blown hallucinogenic states where the mind does all kinds of crazy stuff, and lucid dreams add lucidity and control to the situation, and that is the most hallucinogenic drugs can ever hope to do. That point was meant to be motivation for people not to bother with hallucinogenic drugs, in case you didn't pick up on that. By trying to contradict me, you are not helping people avoid hallucinogenic drugs.

Also, talking about drugs is not a sign of a drug problem any more than talking about food is a sign of an obesity problem. None of the drugs we have mentioned in this thread cut off oxygen to the brain. Alcohol is one that does, and I don't bother with it. How do you feel about that mass killer of a drug? Should it be illegal too?

Friend, I read all the post in this thread and you are not in anyway trying to discourage people from using drugs. Also you have no way of scientifically validating your assertion about what state of mind lucid dreams exists in because you subjected yourself to a mind altering drug. To properly study such things you must use test subjects while you remain sober and rational. But you cannot do that because it is illegal, so your whole premise is flimsy.

BTW alchohol is a drug and a plague, but only to those who do not use it properly. Some drugs such as marijuana may be legalizable but the fact they are currently illegal means that they are off limits for scientific reasearch in humans.

And you are right talking about drugs does not make you a druggy, but doing illegal drugs makes you a criminal and you just confessed here to ingesting illegal drugs on at least three occasions. If there was ever a shake up at this site your IP could be tracked. It would seem to me that the last thing you would want to do is be talking on the internet about illegal activity. You would find more privacy in a cafe.

So this is not necessarily a judgment I am making about you just a word to the wise that what you are doing here is not science and it is not very smart to be talking about it where everyone from CIA to Osama Ben Laden can read it. Thats the base level. Beyond that there is no need to take drugs to experience LD's this site is full of the proof you need for that so why do it at all?

Later Dude,

EJ

Elijah, SALVIA DIVINORUM IS LEGAL IN THE UNITED STATES and most other countries. So are certain types of psychedelic mushrooms, such as amanita muscaria. Look it up. Also, I have in fact been making the point that because hallucinogenic drugs provide only partial experiences of the lucid dream state, there is no point in doing them. In your reading "all of the post in this thread," did you happen to read my point in my first post that my last salvia session was meant to end my hallucinogenic drug career and that I plan to get way into lucid dreaming instead? I have been preaching here lately that lucid dreaming is better than hallucinogenic drug experiences and should be done instead of them.

I have not scientifically validated the specific parallels between the neurology of the lucid dream and hallucinogenic drug states, but I have done a great deal of both activities, and I have illustrated what the experiencial parallels are in my own experiences. I do know what happens in my consciousness because it is what I am.

As for alcohol being dangerous only when used improperly, that is true about pretty much all of the other drugs. Synthetic heroin, in the form of Oxycontin, Dilaudid, Lortab, etc., is prescribed very commonly, but it has ruined the lives of zillions of people who have used it improperly. What was your point? Also, even though marijuana is illegal, it is still used in experiments on humans. The marijuana field in Oxford, Mississippi is where the government gets the pot used for the experiments. Right by the marijuana field in Oxford is the government's salvia divinorum field. Oxford is also where I drove last Tuesday to buy my one gram of 7x salvia divinorum LEGALLY at the Local Color head shop. I also bought a bong there and then went to the cemetary where William Faulkner is buried and tripped my head off without breaking any laws whatsoever before driving back to Jackson and tripping very legally with my friends. I was looking forward to getting through the day and being drug free for life as I work on becoming a guru of lucid dreaming. You should be cheering on such a message.

Now that you know that salvia divinorum and certain types of hallucinogenic mushrooms are legal, if you have sent your message to the moderators already, the moral thing for you to do will be to send another message stating that you were wrong. Peace.

I will follow up with the moderators. If what you say is true (on your intentions I now sense that it is) then I must say I am shocked that something with such strong effects would not be controlled if only that we never fully know what this stuff does to us physiologically. It would seem wise to control anyhting that can so alter a persons perceptions that they converse with Faulkner on a stroll through the cemetary (I know you did not claim this it is hyperbole). But then a gain $2.50 can by you at least two packs of Heavenly Blue Morning Glory seeds, which once the nauseating chemical often applied to them is washed off can be quite a strong hallucinogen. Simply chew them until the acrid taste fills the mouth and hold them like chewing tobacco.

Ok so, I know a few things myself. I am glad you are not advocating it because honestly there is no need.

Apologies for any misunderstanding. BTW I sent a note to Seeker to have him check out the thread it was not incendiary and I doubt he would fail to discern your intentions.

Magic Mushrooms? I'll have to look that up. Of course you've seen Altered States a classic film. An important question for me about these things is this. What motivates our quest for other realities? It seems like the answer could encompass the definition of humanity.

Peace!

Oh so if its legal (I must eat crow now) that issue is gone but the broader ethical issue of using something that would be controlled if it were to become big (LSD was legal for most of the sixties) is linked as far as I can tell to the whole drug scene issue. So I have been put to shame for not knowing more before I spoke, but the idea of being a druggie is simply, the substance whatever it is is something a user takes to escape and that eventually leads to addiction or generally social uselessness. Almost any mind altering substance can serve as drug of choice for some portion of the drug using population.

Hell this opens up a big can of worms that I did not intend to get into but I will have to take some time to think about it and eventually write about it on my blog site. I'll let universal mind know when I post my article.

Cheers

Ok, now the story comes out. i am gonna post on my blog site about this, but I will note the following. A 3-minute search on the interent show that Us officials and states are moving to list Salvia as an illegal hallucinogen. Mostly because it is being sold as a hallucinogen. I will predict that within five years salvia will be illegal everywhwere in the US.

The ethical issue appears to be the very question of controlling drug use at all and as Umind pointed out alchohol is a drug. Because there must be literally thousands of plants that have drug like affects on the human body. When we criminalize drug use we are actually trying to limit supply to what?..... Hmm....there is an issue here no doubt about that. Is there a difference between recreational and addictive drug use. How do you define them? When does drug use constitute a destructive behavior? The cultural use of salvia is a case in point. Someone should start a thread to discuss this there is alot here.

EJ

ElijahJones,
I agree that the topic of psylocibe use would be better suited in a different forum, but since my experiment was focused on the dream state, it was relevent.

I agree with you that drugs can a plague, but just as you said, only to those who do not use them properly. There are a many good uses for drugs.
You said: "Some drugs such as marijuana may be legalizable but the fact they are currently illegal means that they are off limits for scientific reasearch in humans. "
I say: Scientific research with marijuana and even more potent drugs are going on all the time.
A few decades ago LSD has was used by scientists and therapists to treat a multitude of psychological disorders, with surprising sucess. And yes thats a fact, but don't take my word for it, look it up.

I did not take mushrooms so that I could go hit the bar and get F*ked up. I took them as a tool to experience an altered state of consciousness. Yes, I know there are more natural ways of doing so, but I would take a person years to develop the abilities to alter their conciousness to the extent of a mushroom trip. It is something I plan to do one day, but at this present juncture in time, mushrooms will do the trick.

I can't even begin to describe here the insights that resonated deep within me from that day, but if feeling soulful and spiritual is a crime, then lock me up baby. The fact is there isn't going to be a shakeup on this site, but thanks for the dose of paranoia.

The War on Drugs is and always has been a war against the people. Right now your country is conducting a War on Terrorism. Why,? to defend freedom of course( or at least that's what they're telling you). Have you ever stopped to ask yourself what freedom is? I can tell you one thing for sure, freedom and democracy are not synonymous.

The topic of this thread is about to take a reckless high speed turn, but since you brought up the topic of Bin Laden, I feel I need to educate you. Bin Laden did not attack the US, the US Gov did. Lets play a game. You go out and gather evidence that points to Bin Laden orchestrating 9/11, and for every piece of evidence you find i'll try and match it with one that points at the US gov being responsible. Whoever comes up with more wins.

I bet you won't play my game, because FOX News has already figured it out for you, how altruistic of them.

The idea that Terrorism can be defeated by fighting a War against it is completely illogical, because War is a form of Terroism. Then again, if you want to create a perpetual state of emergency as justification to pillage and plunder the planet, then a War on Terrorism is a clever solution.

ElijahJones,

Please spend less time trying to control other people and what they talk about. If you do not appreciate the content of some of the threads, even if they are still dream-related, simply avoid those threads, don't you think? Now if someone had a thread called "How much LSD should I take??" and a discussion ensued, then I could see why that should be prohibited. But this is all being discussed in relation to dreaming... or at least it was until you came along and started complaining about the content of the thread.

It's apparent that you have read and heard some things about drugs, but it is also equally as apparent that you are misinformed about them as well. Just because one drug may keep oxygen from brain cells does not mean that they all or even most of them do. If you don't have a river of knowledge on psilocybin (pertaining to this thread) then please do not be gushing forth about it. I respect that you may be against drugs, and can also understand why, but don't try to take away free speech or change other people's ways, please. If part of your motivation here is harm reduction, and preventing possible dangerous information or suggestions about drugs from leaking on here and ending up hurting someone, I can agree with that.

Also, if you don't understand why people want to be in an altered state or experiment with another form of reality, then you probably can't relate well enough, and that's ok. But please let people's business be their own. I'm sure the moderators have been aware of what are in these drug-related threads, but most people that are opposed to it simply avoid the threads it seems. But you have to realize there are quite a few people that combine their interest of lucid dreaming with psychedelics.
(Elijah, please don't take offense to my words. I just don't like to see other people trying to control actions of other people on the forum, especially when they don't seem to relate with those people.)

Universal Mind,

I didn't mean it to sound like I prefer Salvia to lucid dreaming, not at all. I was simply marking the differences between Salvia and a lucid dream; noting that with Salvia you often see reality and hallucinations all at once, whereas most lucid dreams are contained within our own minds.

toomanypossibilities! u are afreaking genious!! finally someone who is at my level of knowledge.



heres to expanding our minds to truth!

I seriosly doubt that any police force, whilst looking for drug users would look on this website. Although it is a website about people creating anything and everything through their dreams which does sound like some/most of us use drugs. I find that while on MJ i dont have as many dreams i would if i didnt use for a while but im gunna go to sleep tonight after a few goldy spotts so youl have to check my dream journal to see wat happens. Im yet to do mushys but i do plan on doing them because of the trippy experiences ive heard from many different people. Everyones made some interesting comments on the topic but in the words of Matchbook "Because someone uses drugs, doesn't make them a drug addict, or a bad person." Unless your taking about A-class drug users, thats just another story.

Elijah, thanks for your apology. I can understand a concern against the abuse of drugs. You are preaching to the choir as far as that goes. I come from two family lines of alcoholics, I have lost several friends to drunk driving wrecks and opioid overdoses, and I have had my own struggles with marijuana and the results of binge drinking. That is why I decided recently to quit everything. I want to do absolutely no mind altering substances whatsoever. That includes caffiene, tobacco, and anything else like that. For me, opening the door to any of them opens the door to all of them. I just realized that recently. However, I am nowhere near supporting telling other people that they can't do them. I think the war on drugs is anti-freedom, anti-American, and a counterproductive disaster that has resulted in a great deal of mass tragedy that would have not otherwise happened. The gang problem and its influence on American pop culture and American life in general is awful. There are drug addicts all over the place mugging, burglarizing, car jacking, stealing from and lying constantly to their family members and friends, and doing whatever else it takes to buy the drugs that are so expensive because they are illegal. If the drugs were legal, they would destroy themselves in peace and not take down everybody around them. The fight needs to be on the demand side. Fighting drugs on the supply side is a tragic joke. The government (last I checked) spends $639 per second on the war on drugs. We could cut out the war on drugs and thereby cut out a whole universe of crime while providing room for tax cuts that would really help our economy a great deal. Our prisons would finally have room enough for murderers, rapists, and armed robbers to stay as long as they should, and they could be convicted much faster. No matter what bad you might say would result from legallizing all drugs, still a trendous amount more good would result.

I think people crave altered states of consciousness because they are so interesting and philosophically educational. I don't think they are an escape from reality. Drug induced altered states usually induce anxiety and often make people freak out about reality on a much more paranoid level than they otherwise would. Altered states give a new format for experiencing and understaning existence, and they are really fascinating.

Matchbook, I understand what you were saying. I was just arguing my point that drugs are not necessary. The last few times I did mushrooms, I wished I could go all the way with the experience and have a lucid dream.

Toomanypossibilities, I am completely with you on the idea that my government is chasing its tail and shattering everything in the room with the war on drugs. However, I am light years from agreeing with you on the war on terror. War is awful, extremely awful. The thing is, the most unfortunate part about human life on Earth is that we are sometimes forced to choose between awful and far worse than awful. The goal of the war on terror is to reduce the threat of terrorism as much as possible. While the war might be pissing off more would-be terrorists, we are picking off tons of them and taking down the gigantic power houses that fund them and could potentially give them weapons that could wipe out many thousands of people in a single bound. We are also creating democracies where tyrranical governments once ruled. The result will be that eventually those countries will prosper and there will be less poverty and the social instability that comes with it. This will lead to a much smaller tendency for people to seek to end their own lives for the purpose of killing masses of innocent people on purpose. They will have things to live for and will be more educated and functional. War sucks, but liberation is a great thing. So is bringing down terrorist governments. As for your game about Bush being the antichrist and controlling the Illuminati for the aliens or whatever it is you think is going on, Bin Laden already confessed with great pride on tape. It was shown on every major news channel that is not controlled by an anti-American propaganda organization. If you win the argument, you are going to have to explain how so many capitalist organizations that are obsessed with financial profits and are in severely intense competition with each other and have everything to lose for fabricating stories (like Dan Rather and the New York Times reporter), and in this case, putting on a fake video, would be willing to roll such crazy dice. You will also have to explain how there has not been a single leak from any of the zillions of people who would have had to have been in on such a wild, bizarre conspiracy.

The good news about altered states of consciousness is that it doesn't take years to achieve all of them. You can learn transcendental meditation in one sitting. Getting in a sensory deprivation tank can spin your head into another dimension the first time you ever try it. I also don't think learning lucid dreaming takes that long for people who are extremely dedicated. It took me a while to get the hang of it because I was very undisciplined because I was so skeptical. Once I had my first long lasting, controllable lucid dream, I 100% believed in it and was very soon able to start having them all the time.

By the way, if anybody wants to argue about the war on terror, please take it to the philosophy forum. People come to the lucid dreaming forums to talk about cool altered state type stuff, not the horrific tragedies of war.

Universal Mind and everyone else...

This was never intented to be the topic of this thread, but i'm going to just try and end the war on terror debate right here. I don't mean to suggest that Bin Laden didn't have anything to do with 9/11, I'm quite positive he did. The idea I mean to present is that 9/11 NEVER would have happened if the US government hadn't of taken the ACTIVE steps to ensure its success. There are a great number of well documented books that prove this(Crossing the Rubicon comes to mind), but instead I will refer you to a video.

Are you aware that on 9/11, there were actually three buildings that collapsed? If not, then you are completely in the dark regarding what really happend on 9/11. The best video i've seen to date then helps explain what happened is 9/11: The Road To Tyranny by Alex Jones.

A membership to his website only costs six bucks, you get access to over a dozen full lenght documentaries that can be found at this link... http://www.prisonplanet.tv/video_other.html

I suggest spending the six dollars, downloading 9/11: The Road to Tyranny (and any other videos that may interest you), and then cancelling your membership.

With that said, i'd like to thank everyone for offering their opinions in this thread, but since the thread is now miles off topic, it should pretty much end here. Anyone is welcome to PM me if they wish to talk more.