Every one, i need help in deciding wherether to contiue this

**Ginko** · 09-21-2003 07:45 AM

Alright pepole im am debating whether to continue this lucid dream stuff on what i heard. Please read All of my words before you give up and go to another forum. Heres how it goes:
I was talking to my father about this lucid dream stuff and he warned me not to contine on to astro projection. i asked Why? and he told me of a story about what happend to a freinds son and warned me it was another way of opening yourself up. By this time i was getting kinda creeped out. It goes like this, his son was getting good at astro projection. His son had just seperrated from his body and was looking at it from a few feet away. When all of a sudden a shawdow like figure came out of nowhere and looked at him. Then started to rush tword him or his body, when all of a sudden the boy freeked out and woke up then told his father. His Father told mine that his boy never tryed this stuff again.

Ok by now you might know what im getting at. Then he gave me a bible lesson on how how in adam in eves time demons walked the earth. But because they were having babies with that of humans. God took away there physical form or somthin like that. And my father said when you leave your vessel (body) it is possible for any one of these demons to enter. Bassically another way of inviting spirits.

OK, by now every 1 who is atheists is probbley saying how much of a bunch of bull this is. and this has nothing to do with lucid dreaming. What i am looking for is any one who has knowledge of astro projection or the difference between lucid dreaming and Astro... I have had the feling before of desia view in all sorts of places i know iv never been yet i can tell you where things are at and where the bathrooms are located. Any 1 who knows anthing about what iv said, any experiences, or just words of encoragement. Im not going continuie to any of this lucid dreaming stuff.

**Kid M** · 09-21-2003 01:11 PM

I am basing this purely on information that I have gathered on both subjects, rather than from personal experience since I have very little of that myself.

Lucid dreaming and astral projection have a lot in common when it comes to the basic mechanics of these processes. When you are asleep your astral body ALWAYS projects out of your physical body. This has been happening since the day you, me and everyone else were born. The only difference is whether you remain conscious and gain control over your astral body, or whether you simply go with the flow, and let your subconscious roam the astral plane (commonly known as dreaming).

If you manage to successfully project, and you lack the concentration needed to maintain a fully conscious experience, then you will either wake up, or you may find that logic will start to wither and intuition will start taking over and you may basically enter a lucid dream. If you use the WILD technique to induce lucidity, the process also closely resembles that of an astral projection. When your brainwaves change from beta to alpha and you enter a trance, the WILD technique suggests going with the hypnagogic imagery that follows and entering a lucid dream. Manuals on astral projection suggest externalising your point of consciousness and attempting to "climb" out of your body.

To shed some light on this dark figure that you mentioned here's a little extract from an astral projection FAQ:

"Q: Is there any chance that someone else could get into my physical body while I'm off travelling in my Astral body?
A: No. There is no danger of that happening, you are attached to your own physical body by the silver cord, so only you can get in, that is unless you decide to become a medium or to channel, in which case all kinds of negative entities can get in without you knowing (not recommended).

Q: What is the best way to get rid of an unwanted attacker while trying to leave the body?
A: These entities are quite harmless really and cannot hurt us in any way, however they will try to distract us from time to time so that we are unable to split from our physical bodies."

As well as that, fear is probably one of the primary factors that accounts for FAILED projections, and this statement I am basing on personal experience. I've come closer to a successful astral projection that to a lucid dream, even, and it was fear which seemed to take over and ruin everything.
Religious fear, I imagine is even worse. If you are a Christian, then it's going to take quite a lot of convincing to prove to you that astral projections and lucid dreams are a pretty straightforward natural process. As usual, when people don't have enough knowledge about a subject they tend to create religious explanations for it, and furthermore they tend to be negative ones.

I'm not going to be the person that's going to question your religious beliefs in relevance to LDs and APs -- you have to do it yourself. But I can assure you, with enough facts to back me up that lucid dreaming is quite natural and you have little to worry about.
You may want to search the internet for in-depth descriptions of APs and their mechanics if you want to keep fear at bay, but just remember that fear is inevitable at first and if you are a religious person that fear may well have religious grounds, but once you overcome it, you will find that you had little to be afraid of...

**Ginko** · 09-22-2003 12:57 AM

Thanks man, i can now continue lucid draming without woring about how lucid dreaming might invite spirits of some sort. Kool man 4 taking the time to say somthin. But im still staying away from that astro stuff and im not going to try and use the WILD tecknique to try and induce Lucid dreaming.

**zwishenzug** · 09-22-2003 03:02 AM

To me, dreaming is only an altered state of consciousness (although it's very similar to waking consciousness). Everything exists inside your head. You don't open yourself to demons or anything else (I believe in Christianity). Besides, with God on your side, what do you have to fear of demons?

It sounds to me like astral projection is dreaming a desired dream. I don't think there is anything to actually spiritually visiting a real place. Just dream places. But, that's just my take.

As for your friend who had the dark thing rush to him or his body, it sounds to me suspiciously like a nightmare. Good luck with your faith and dreams.

**DreamCoil** · 09-22-2003 06:25 AM

The demon thing is very common, it's known as 'sleep paralysis'
Basicly it's hallucinations that occur when a person is about to fall asleep or just wake up, and then realise that they can't yell or move at all.
Often people say they felt a presence of a demon or something evil with them

the demon has been reported to attack and the victim can then barely breath.
It happens because a person will awake from REM sleep but there body will still be asleep (hence the paralysis) and they cannot move, also images and such will still be occuring from the REM sleep, so basicly it's like dreaming awake... I can only guess that people belive demons are near them because there paralysized body induces a sense of fear that is very extreme hence they assume that some sort of demon is attacking them.
I think thats what it is, I remember ready about it but thats about all I can remember.
Iv'e had this happen to me before and it scared the crap outta me

**Ginko** · 09-23-2003 04:52 AM

I just got mailed from some 1 and ill stick with his explantion but yours sounds intresting. I couldn't help but laugh when i read what happend to you. But i know where your coming from when scary dreams seem so real your about to take a $^@p in your pants. I think that parilisation thing might have happend to me once but its a faint memory

**Aneas** · 09-23-2003 12:47 PM

I have been successfully dreaming lucidly and astrally projecting (there IS a difference) for 32 years. Referring to an unknown entity as a "demon" is what humans do when they don't understand something. What we do not understand, we fear. Fear is an enemy that is easily vanquished by confidence and knowledge.

**Aneas** · 09-28-2003 09:24 PM

When I am dreaming lucidly I am conscious of my surroundings as being completely dream induced. I am able to control absolutely my body and all aspects of the dream. Also the substance of my dreams have a unique feel about them. This is one of the main things that allow me to know immediately that I am dreaming.

When I astrally project my body maintains a certain vibrational consistency. I have no control over my surroundings. I can move from one point to another within the same plane by thinking of moving. I can travel to higher planes by speeding up the vibrational frequency of my body. Unfortuantely I can retain no memory of what happens in these planes, I am engulfed in a white light and I have no idea what happens afterwards.

**zwishenzug** · 09-28-2003 09:36 PM

So what exactly are these "planes" that you go to? I thought astral projection was projecting your consciousness to a specific area of the world. These "planes" sound suspiciously like uncontrollable lucid dreams, or low-level lucidity.

**Aneas** · 10-01-2003 07:42 PM

As I stated, I have no memory of what happens. I would imagine that these planes are other dimensions. Everything exists at a certain vibrational frequency. When I first leave my body I feel as though I am in an earthquake. It is a slow, pounding vibration. Look at it this way... Lets say that there are nine levels or planes of existence. The first plane (or base plane) vibrates at level 1 and can go no higher. The second plane vibrates at level 2. Therefore, it must also be capable of existing at level 1, because level 1 is the base. It is aware of itself and plane 1, but not plane 3. This continues up until plane 9 which encompasses all the lower planes within itself. The essence, or soul, vibrates at a much higher rate than that which is coded for our material plane. The "silver cord" that is said to connect our astral body to our physical body allows us to exist within the parameters of this level. Death occurs when this cord is severed and our essence, which is vibrating much faster, automatically gravitates toward the plane that shares its frequency.

If you have ever truly had an out of body experience you would understand about the vibrations. There are many people who have had a near death experience who describe meeting other beings who vibrated at a very fast rate.

When I speed up my vibrations during my travels I move upwards to planes that exist in such a manner that I am not able to recall the event with the limited brain functions of the physical body.

I've been dreaming and travelling for 32 years. I know the difference between dreaming and travelling. I wish everyone could experience all that I have. I am grateful beyond belief for being blessed with the opportunities that I have been given. it's what you can't see that is the most amazing.

**nerve** · 10-01-2003 07:54 PM

i'm confuzed..

astral projection and O.B.E.s are the same thing right?

how do you have them?

is there anyway you can get hurt while doing it?

**Curios** · 10-01-2003 08:04 PM

Yeah, i would not worry about what these people are telling you about spirits taking over your body while dreaming. Im sounds like bunch of crap. Like i think Aneas said its just fear eating you up not really demons. Once you overcome the fear the demons go away. It could be Jesus or god or whatever makes you feel confident.

**Aneas** · 10-01-2003 08:26 PM

Yes, Astral projection and OBEs are the same. The worse that can happen is that your perception of reality could be forever altered. There are books on how you can accomplish an OBE. Like lucid dreaming, it's hard for me to explain. One popular techniques is to imagine yourself on the ceiling looking down at your body. I always found it helpful slow down your heartrate and breathing as much as possible, and then speed up the heart quickly, but not the breathing.

**Ginko** · 10-01-2003 08:52 PM

Just fyi ppl im looking for this topic to fade away in the mist of other post so if you plz wouldn't post any more under this topic. I Recomend nightmare with a twist. I will continue lucid dreaming, i know as long as i beieve in my God i have nothing to fear.

**nerve** · 10-02-2003 03:12 AM

um...how 'bout....no

**Curios** · 10-02-2003 03:33 AM

I heard that derams of falling can be a sign of a bad landing coming back into the body. Or if you jerk youR body while starting to doze off this is a bad exit. If you wake up and cant move or talk you are half in and half out of the body. We cannot move until we are totally in body. Any input Aneas you seem to be more aware of OBE.

**jill1978** · 10-02-2003 07:00 PM

Aneas, what your descripeing is truely amazing to me because That's how I amagine things. When you describle the different feeling in a dream I have the same kinda sensation, and it's almost physical to start....I dont really even know how describe it, but something like sinus pressure, or a tightness behind my nose....This might sound really crazy but it's something involveing my nose area!
I would also like to ask you if you've always had these gifts, or is it something you learned and practiced, and if someone were to have their cord cut, what would be the worldly explination for their death

**Ginko** · 10-02-2003 07:52 PM

Alright who are you talking to. Better not Be me. I had a dream night mare that scared the crap out of me and u r calling it kool. HA thats funny. I dont know what made me become lucid and wake me up. But all i know is it was hard pulling myself togther and ovcoming parliyse. Oh and i dont ever plan on astro projecting or OBE

**Ginko** · 10-02-2003 07:53 PM

Originally posted by Shawndow
Just fyi ppl im looking for this topic to fade away in the mist of other post so if you plz wouldn't post any more under this topic. I Recomend nightmare with a twist. I will continue lucid dreaming, i know as long as i beieve in my God i have nothing to fear.

**zwishenzug** · 10-05-2003 02:08 AM

NEVER!!! Why not post under a topic that keeps evolving?

**Lucid-Wannabe** · 10-10-2003 07:36 AM

lol

**nerve** · 10-10-2003 02:46 PM

Originally posted by Shawndow+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Shawndow)</div>

<!--QuoteBegin-Shawndow

Just fyi ppl im looking for this topic to fade away in the mist of other post so if you plz wouldn't post any more under this topic. I Recomend nightmare with a twist. I will continue lucid dreaming, i know as long as i beieve in my God i have nothing to fear.

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um......no? are YOU the Admin? do YOU control the board? ...then STOP trying to...