LD related muscle spams?

**Superadam051** · 01-29-2013 06:45 AM

The title isn't very clear and is very vague at describing what this post is about. I've already seem tonnes of posts about having Small "jerks" and "spasms" that is part of entering a lucid dream, but i have a problem. When i try to lucid dream, for the past 3 nights now in fact (the closest i've probably been to LD) i will probably nearly enter SP but before i do my body starts to have these really REALLY irritating spasms kind of and they are quite big and long term. I'm not talking about full on uncontrollable muscle spams but small ones that are incredibly frequent and i can't control them, it is both worrying and dashing my confidence of trying to LD and being so close. What are these spasms and what can i do if i'm doing something wrong. Note they are not in a dream because 1) I'm writing this and they are still very small but existent 2) They persist after i get up and assure myself it's not a dream. I am also writing this at 5:41am whilst just trying to LD but encountered the problem again.

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**paigeyemps** · 01-29-2013 01:48 PM

Hi Superadam051, first of all, you need not worry about "achieving/getting to SP". When you are on your way to sleep and feel sensations like tingling or hallucinations or numbing, those are not necessarily sleep paralysis. They are normal sensations that have to do with your body falling asleep and your mind being awake to notice them. SP is NOT required to have a lucid dream.

From what you're saying, the spasms sound like an actual physical problem. If you're having them even when you're awake (though really small), there might be something wrong with you physically. I suggest you have it checked out with your doctor. Ofc you don't have to tell him about the LDing part

But yea, I understand you might have some vibrations and other odd sensations when attempting to LD (namely WILD) as you are hyperaware of your body and the feelings might seem to get more intense. But i don't think you should be having those spasms at normal waking hours.

Good luck

**Superadam051** · 01-29-2013 05:54 PM

Thanks for the reply, seemed like no-one was replying lol. The spasms are relatively new when i try to LD and have only happened as i mentioned above, and now that i think of it it does sometimes happen to the same severity when i get really cold or am exposed to intense cold really quickly or stuff like that. Either way they don't happen at all and has only happened then and i was just curious because they put me off so much and force me to get up for it to completely stop. Nothing I've researched is the same as this and i really don't know what it is. I have a doctors soon for something else and i guess i could ask but would they know about stuff like this? P.S. Your Dream Journal sounds pretty awesome, i cracked a smile at your fight with Samantha.

**paigeyemps** · 01-29-2013 11:05 PM

Lol thanks! And I hope everything is fine with the spasms :3

**dreamer7** · 01-30-2013 02:59 PM

i thought spasms were normal? often when i try to Mind Awake Body Asleep my legs arms hands will randomly move... or jerk..

it has happened a few times when i am concentrating on something, or watching a movie too not often tho

**Sensei** · 01-30-2013 03:14 PM

I only have muscle spasms if I am accidentally trying to WILD at bed time. As I enter NREM I will start twitching. It doesn't happen if I try WILD in the middle of the night since I am more "in the zone".

So unless you are trying to WILD without prior sleep, I cannot help.

**Superadam051** · 01-31-2013 03:28 AM

Originally Posted by BrandonBoss

So unless you are trying to WILD without prior sleep, I cannot help.

I guess i was trying to WILD without prior sleep, seems after reading up a bit more this wont produce results; aside from the problem I'm getting

**Sensei** · 01-31-2013 03:31 AM

Yeah. Some people actually succeed at it, but it is precious few.

Good luck!

**jarrhead** · 01-31-2013 03:33 AM

Originally Posted by Superadam051

I guess i was trying to WILD without prior sleep, seems after reading up a bit more this wont produce results; aside from the problem I'm getting

It can succeed. I used to get LDs with about 80% success rate WILDing upon first sleep, and around 95% after waking up at night at my peak.

You just have to be supremely motivated. Staying 100% still for 2 hours and not letting your thoughts drift takes a lot of discipline and motivation.

**Superadam051** · 01-31-2013 03:45 AM

How long do you normally have to wait to WILD "from cold" is it around 2 hours? I thought it was less than that and looking back i was rushing, i can maybe wait that long, it's just i'd need something to keep myself from giving up or straying off task, any ideas?

**jarrhead** · 01-31-2013 04:05 AM

It takes me about an hour and a half to two hours. A method I made a while back combining things from LaBerge and common WILDing and use of supposed lucid aids would usually take me just over two hours, because I was already very awake by that point. Basically the idea is sleep two hours less than normal (6 or 8 depending on your biological workings), stay awake for two. In that two hours, take fish oil, drink green tea, whatever you do as an aid. Then go back to sleep with headphones playing a very particular BB that does both waves and mantra, while maintaining itself as a piece of MUSIC that you can keep playing in your head.

**Sensei** · 01-31-2013 05:00 AM

Originally Posted by jarrhead

It takes me about an hour and a half to two hours. A method I made a while back combining things from LaBerge and common WILDing and use of supposed lucid aids would usually take me just over two hours, because I was already very awake by that point. Basically the idea is sleep two hours less than normal (6 or 8 depending on your biological workings), stay awake for two. In that two hours, take fish oil, drink green tea, whatever you do as an aid. Then go back to sleep with headphones playing a very particular BB that does both waves and mantra, while maintaining itself as a piece of MUSIC that you can keep playing in your head.

Hey! I have always heard that very few people can actually do that. Since you are someone that can do this, I was wondering if this is true or if anyone can do this and it just takes practice.

**jarrhead** · 01-31-2013 05:46 AM

I think so. I was never a natural lucid dreamer. I never even knew it was possible or that lucid dreams existed until I was 14. I used to say "How cool would it be to control your dreams?" just as I would fantasize about being the king of ancient Egypt.

It just takes enough dedication and, the biggest part, is a genuine, intrinsic motivation. Nobody that doesn't REALLY want to LD will be able to sit completely still and keep their thoughts controlled for over an hour without any hints of aggravation or boredom.

Also, to relate back to OP, you have to be comfortable. These little spasms happen even when you're awake sometimes, and are very common when hitting sleep. Your muscles are actually a huge part in bloodflow. If you stayed perfectly still without spasms throughout all your sleep, you'd wake up with bruises and whatnot (hence people with bed sores).

Don't worry about these spasms unless they become painful, crippling spasms (like the ones I had in my back and neck the past few months. These generally don't happen until you're either very old or you exercise a ton. Like where you get prescribed antispastic medication).

It's like being a great instrument player. Anyone (well not ANYONE, but 99% of people) can do it, it just takes a lot of practice, and therefore very few can do it. Some are better than others naturally, but anyone can do it with practice and dedication.