Originally posted by Seeker


Oneironaut you draw the line at possibly hurting real astral beings as your limits, this is commendable, however, are you hurting your own spirit by doing these things? *

One thing I am afraid of is moral erosion. *If you do something long enough in a lucid dream, how long is it going to be before you begin to wonder what it would be like to do that thing in waking life? *All you guys reading this, I know you've had thoughts of raping someone at some time, most likely because of how the woman has treated you. *Does raping in a lucid dream provide an outlet for your anger or does it erode you resolve never to commit a rape?

As far as my spirit is concerned, I don't believe I'm hurting it. The reason being is because I believe in the harmlessness of my dream actions. Think about it this way: I strongly believe in my ability to separate an experience that I would see only as fictional and an experience that I would see, even in the slightest, as threatening to my morals. It is not that I am slowly eroding away to a negative force, because I honestly believe that there is no negative force in my imaginary actions. There is no guilt because there is no wrong. Stepping on a dog’s foot in waking life makes me feel guilty. Playing Grand Theft Auto does not.
Do I find the concept of peoples’ cars getting stolen and shooting cops fun? Absolutely not. Is it an interesting experience when put into the storyline of a videogame where there is a vast distinction between fantasy and make believe? I think so. Why? Because violence without consequence is not violence. Fighting without a desire to seriously injure the other person is Sparring. It is mutual sport, most professionally, without any negative energy.
When two Shaolin monks are practicing day in and day out, sparring each other for conditioning, does it mean they are “enjoying violence?” No. They are doing what they are doing for self defense and experience. Even if they Love sparring. Even if they eat sleep and breathe martial arts, does this mean that every fighter is more prone to commit acts of violence outside of their morally inconsequential training? I really don’t think so. Of course some of them are, but that is a testament to the morals they had before taking up martial arts, or the views of morality that they developed Outside the scope of martial arts training, itself.
Why is this? Because any disciplined Monk/Martial artist is able to make that distinction between sport and violence. There is a barrier there that only the morally undisciplined (imo) cross. THAT is precisely how I see fighting in my dreams. It is a way to experience something without consequence. It is a way to fulfill (generally) every human’s thirst for action and adventure without breaking any waking world morals to do it. I think the ability to live on two sides of that proverbial fence is but one interpretation of the essence of yin and yang.

As far as the rape analogy goes: I have never, and will never (as far as I’m concerned) thought about rape in any sort of positive light. Not even to the credit of pure curiosity. Even so, I know where you’re coming from. There is always the possibility that someone’s curiosity can get the better of them and they can become more desensitized to the concept of rape, child molestation, etc. etc. but, just like with my martial arts analogy, I think this is unique from person to person, not universal, and stems from moral instabilities that go a little deeper than “exposure to the experience” alone.

In other words, what is dangerous to the morals of some is absolutely benign to others. It depends on their beliefs, background, philosophy, and virtues. Is imagination an outlet for wish-fulfillment or an arena for inconsequential experience? Only the person doing the imagining can say.