Thread: The levels of lucidity.

That's what I said. To be lucid is to know you're dreaming. To understand is something else.

There are only 2 levels of lucidity. The "I know I'm dreaming" level, and the "I do not know I'm dreaming" level. You can't know it 'more'.

Originally Posted by Marvo

That's what I said.

But, that's not what you are saying.

To be lucid is to know you're dreaming. To understand is something else.

But, to understand requires that you first know, which means that understanding is a higher level of lucidity (knowing). Knowing is knowing but understanding is knowing what it means.

There are only 2 levels of lucidity. The "I know I'm dreaming" level, and the "I do not know I'm dreaming" level. You can't know it 'more'.

You actually can "know it more". Ask just about anyone here at DV. "I do not know I'm dreaming" is not a level of lucidity. It's a level of non-lucidity.

I don't care what anyone else thinks. According to what lucid means in the connection with dreaming, there is only one possible level. To know that you're dreaming.

Control and awareness is something else.

You were right on the last one though, it's a level of non-lucidity, I was wrong there.

Originally Posted by Marvo

I don't care what anyone else thinks.

So be it.

Originally Posted by Marvo

You were right on the last one though, it's a level of non-lucidity...

Do you agree that there are levels of non-lucidity or is that clear-cut black and white as well?

Huh? There should only be one level. You can't be less of something you arren't.

What I meant about not caring was to this.

Ask just about anyone here at DV.

I'm quite sure other people will agree with me. It's quite obvious, that you can't be more aware that you're dreaming. Either you know it, or you don't.

As I said, awareness and control is something else. So is understanding.

I've been watching this discussion with interest. The Levels thing is something that really seems to apply to my lucid dreams, as my awareness of ability to control circumstances and even stay lucid varies wildly. Another thing that varies is my "immersion" in the dreams - how much "into" the dream I am and how realistic it all feels. That ranges from a sense of watching a lousy cartoon to more intense than real life.

So I think you guys are getting tangled up in semantics here. Sure, you are either aware or not - but how aware are you? How much of your consciousness is ENGAGED? You can be aware there is a dog crouching off to the left of your field of view, or you can be staring the critter down... much different levels of awareness there, too.

With LDs, that level of engagement varies wildly, along with control, sensation, ability to THINK, and general awareness of the circumstances. None of these can be defined in a binary manner.

IMHO. Your mileage may well vary.

60% - (Semi-lucid) You know it is a dream on a subconscious level. Your actions generally go ungoverned by the laws of the dream world. You may sometimes effect the dream world (such as manipulation of objects, or time) but it doesn't come to your attention you are doing it.

So THIS is why sometimes my dreams seem real and I think I'm awake but I do really stupid things that would usually get me beaten up or something... Thank you for explaining it!
The lucidity levels are interesting because of what could trigger them... I believe dreams are always vivid and we either are present in them or not...