Thread: would it be a sin?

Originally Posted by a_pirates_life_for_me

Do you think God would be stupid enough to have someone translate and write such a big thing with a bunch of people around with pens and paper and especially people that would do things like that.

No. Actually I just don't believe there is a God. But you missed the point... this is a thought question to show you the problem with believing what was put down on paper by men, not God. ANY man (or woman) can write something and claim it was inspired by God. If they were to bring that writing to you, by what criteria would you determine if it was in fact divinely inspired?

Plenty of ministers and "holy people" of our times claim to have spoken to God. If one of them presented you with a new bible so inspired, would you accept it as God's new word? And if not, why not? Wouldn't their communication with God hold as much weight as those who came before them?

Originally Posted by skysaw

If one of them presented you with a new bible so inspired, would you accept it as God's new word? And if not, why not? Wouldn't their communication with God hold as much weight as those who came before them?

Well first I would have to find out the same way that I found out about the other scriptures. By reading it, studying it, praying about it, etc. until I had a testimony that it was true. And if it was true, then yes it would hold as much weight, but i'm sure tha'ts not likely to happen any time soon.

Originally Posted by skysaw

ANY man (or woman) can write something and claim it was inspired by God. If they were to bring that writing to you, by what criteria would you determine if it was in fact divinely inspired?

Plenty of ministers and "holy people" of our times claim to have spoken to God. If one of them presented you with a new bible so inspired, would you accept it as God's new word? And if not, why not? Wouldn't their communication with God hold as much weight as those who came before them?

Originally Posted by a_pirates_life_for_me

Well first I would have to find out the same way that I found out about the other scriptures. By reading it, studying it, praying about it, etc. until I had a testimony that it was true. And if it was true, then yes it would hold as much weight, but i'm sure tha'ts not likely to happen any time soon.

Thank you for answering this, pirate... I thought the question had been had been lost in the shuffle.

I do think you considered the question carefully, and answered the best you could, which I very much appreciate. I wonder if I could bother you to carry this thought process a bit further.

Do you feel confident that you would be able reach a determination? Would you feel driven enough to examine a new text on that level if you had the initial suspicion you seem to regarding any new claims?

I guess what I'm really getting at is whether or not you might see how natural it is to have suspicion about a text's supposed divine inspiration. There doesn't seem to be a litmus test that would show you whether text A were more valid than text B. And if it takes as much study, prayer, and reflection to make a determination, have you given this much attention to all of the other religious texts out there? Might they not have as much an impact on you if you gave them equal time?

Originally Posted by skysaw

Thank you for answering this, pirate... I thought the question had been had been lost in the shuffle.

I do think you considered the question carefully, and answered the best you could, which I very much appreciate. I wonder if I could bother you to carry this thought process a bit further.

Do you feel confident that you would be able reach a determination? Would you feel driven enough to examine a new text on that level if you had the initial suspicion you seem to regarding any new claims?

I guess what I'm really getting at is whether or not you might see how natural it is to have suspicion about a text's supposed divine inspiration. There doesn't seem to be a litmus test that would show you whether text A were more valid than text B. And if it takes as much study, prayer, and reflection to make a determination, have you given this much attention to all of the other religious texts out there? Might they not have as much an impact on you if you gave them equal time?

sure I wouldn't mind carrying the thought process further Ok so this is something that I take quite seriously, so if you have anything to say against it... please go easy on me Also, hopefully no one would mind if I use a certain religion, but as for myself I believe in the book of mormon... I guess the bible too... but moreso the book of mormon. Ok so what we believe is in not believing in the church because someone told us it was true or because our parents or friends believe it, but because we have a testimony. Which is kind of what I was talking about with the whole believing, having faith, having a "burning feeling" that it's true (which the actual thing is more on a deeper level than just believing and feeling which is hard for people to understand if they haven't experienced it for themselves) to answer your question about giving other religious texts time, I have been to other churches besides just the LDS church, and the more than one religion believes in the bible, so I have tried more religions than just mormon, but I wouldn't say that I've given them equal time because I've been a mormon for longer because I've gained a testimony. Wow, i'm sure a lot of people on this thread are going to think I'm crazy. like I said... please go easy on me! So my answer to your question as to why I haven't given other religions more time... it's simply because I've already found the right one. And anyone reading this who is of a different religion, dont think I'm trying to convert anyone or anything... and I'm definately NOT telling anyone they're going to burn in hell or something for NOT being mormon, i'm not saying that at all. I really hope I didn't offend anyone with this and I hope I answered your question.

A certain heathen came to Shammai and said to him, "Make me a proselyte, on condition that you teach me the whole Torah while I stand on one foot." Thereupon he repulsed him with the rod which was in his hand. When he went to Hillel, he said to him, "What is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor: that is the whole Torah; all the rest of it is commentary; go and learn."

-Talmud

I have a few things to say...

1. All these arguments I imagine like a food fight happening while we try to prove our points. Which I find hillarious... Humble yourselfs people its like a colony of ants bickering back n forth. Priceless...

2. It is the work you do that makes you look good in front of God. Its called Merit! If you have very little merit you still look good in front of God. If people think that by faith-alone you are saved than your no better than the bible pounding religious fanatics who have been around since 300 AD. All hatred can be traced back to Paul is message say kill, let go off, whip them, enslave them or scare them into submission! Thats no better than The Pope saying by order of the Pope saying "Kill All Jews" or "Kill The Muslims" there against our religion they have hurted us! I WOULD NOT LISTEN WHY?! Because, the church is not Powerful God is and Christ is and he said to Love Each Other.

3. The Church preaches about eternal damnation or punishment(HELL). When in reality it is not true. Here is a PARADOX PEOPLE "IF GOD SENT JESUS INTO THE WORLD TO SAVE EVERYONE... WHY WOULD HE DAMN ALL THEM? SOME OF THEM?" Yes hell and heaven exist of course ITS TEMPORARY... Hell is temporary... You stay there until you repay your unforgiven sins. Your purged of them all.

4. The church keeps these words from you making you ignorant to the truth. Love, Respect and Self-Control is Christ message! Jesus Christ... Let me tell you something... You are divine brothers and sisters of earth of this argument and of this forum. Jesus was but a man however, Christ [Annointed One] was the divine. Jesus Christ came into the world to teach of the Divinity of Being Human. He said you experience God when you experience Love. God is Love....

5. So why does God mention all this revenge? Righteous Indignation it is called using love to show the world that love is powerful against Hate and Haters.

So altogether the bible is misinterpreted which means parts of God's word is misinterpreted... Let me ask you something since 300 BC has the General Pattern to Life Changed in a beneficial way? No, Church is an organization of powerful and tricky people. They have there power through the beliefs of others they pull on peoples beliefs and when they say this is wrong than guess what it is wrong to those believers they act by will of the church.

Yet we all know the church corced western society to goto war against Muslims because, they were in the holy land[The Crusades]. Now, wheres the love? Its Gone to the Power to Control People using Fear to Do or Give Things They Want and the church along with any ORGANIZED RELIGION will do anything to Keep That Power!

Pope John Paul II great man made the church look great. Now, Pope Benedict back to the hellfire and Damnation of things. Terrible!

------------------------ Thats was for the Believers -----------------------

Now what about athiest and agnostics...? There wrong to they say Gods Dead and Science explained him away... That invites arrogance and ignorance... Because, now, you have pissed over Ex-Followers of some faith doing and indulging in everything that is selfish and exhibit no control over there emotions and body.

1) The Athiest- I believe God's Dead...
2) Christian- Fuck you asshole your goin to hell...

Both exhibit ignorance...

Athiest denies God> God> Founded Western Religion and If Not Also Eastern Religion> Denies The Teachings and Morals from God since he doesnt exist> Athiest has no morals and thinks he is the master of his own life... "If I want something, I will steal it if I have no $$$"

Religious Guy Hears Hate of The Church rooted in a man who misinterpreted the meaning of Christ> Accepts Hatred> Uses it to scare unbeliever into submission...

Guess what it might get verbal and if it gets verbal one thing leads to another and might get physical! Both ignored The Teachings Christ... Love, Respect and Self-Control... Christ will say "Ignorance is Bliss!"

---------------------- For The Stereotypical Athiest -----------------------

Science was created by man to make ourselves feel like we are all-knowing and powerful beings in this large and currently empty of any other life universe! Humble yourselfs people and realize that we made science because, we try to discredited anothers way of life. We want to feel accepted... Through religion its acceptence by belief and science its acceptence by knowledge and "reason"... We need both and we want to be accepted by others... So what if it was Acceptence by Love, Respect and Self-Control. Than we shall see progress in life!

Originally Posted by Jimbo9889

1. All these arguments I imagine like a food fight happening while we try to prove our points. Which I find hillarious... Humble yourselfs people its like a colony of ants bickering back n forth. Priceless...

haha so true... except with that long comment you posted it seems that you're just another ant like us bickering back and forth about our arguments.