Thread: Grammar 101

I do not fully understand a few. I was busy sniffing glue in grammar school



examples:

Joe's state is Ohio.
Since it is not actually Joes. Do you add an apostrophe?

Quotes:

Seeker said that ice dawg said " blah blah bla blalbla"
Who are you actually quoting? Seeker said it, But it is once removed.
I would guess the original person?

And when you quote words. For what reason? Other than what they were meant for, Quoting others words

Howitzer is acting a bit "freakish" this morning.
Words with emphasise?

I think quoting is for reference. As for the Joe statement, I would keep the apostrophe.

Originally posted by Howetzer
I do not fully understand a few. I was busy sniffing glue in grammar school *

*

examples:

Joe's state is Ohio.
Since it is not actually Joes. Do you add an apostrophe?

Quotes:

Seeker said that ice dawg said " blah blah bla blalbla" *
Who are you actually quoting? Seeker said it, But it is once removed.
I would guess the original person? *

And when you quote words. For what reason? *

Howiezer is acting a bit "freakish" this morning.
Words with emphasise?

It's Joe his state is ohio, so that's an 's.

And seeker said that icedog said "I sniffed glue", then seeker told you that icedog said 'bla'.

Not that hard, is it?

if it is possessive, it always gets and apostrophe:

Joe's state is Ohio.


unless it's a pronoun like "it":

This is my favorite rose bush. Its blooms are pink.

Joe posseses Ohio as his homestate.

Quotes are for reference or emphasis

eg. I learned how to get girls from watching the "James Bond" films.
or emphasis (more like sarcasm) He's acting weird today because he probably just "waxed his banana"

Originally Posted by AirRick101

Quotes are for reference or emphasis

No, no, no, no, no!! Quotes are NOT for emphasis. This is one of my big pet peaves, and it is a complete misunderstanding of their purpose.

There are two uses for quotation marks, the first of which everyone seems to grasp: defining a section that comes from another source, such as words spoken in conversation or the text of a cited article.

The second is similar in idea, but works as a summary reference to a concept, and implies there is no necessary agreement between the current speaker and the citation itself. The easiest way to get this idea across is to exchange the quotes for the phrase "so-called," or "alleged."

For example, if I say to you:

I finally got to meet John's "beautiful" wife.

Does it sound to you like I thought she was beautiful? Of course not. The sentence implies that John has been telling us how beautiful his wife is, but she turned out to be less than stunning. It is functionally the same as saying "I finally got to meet John's alledgedly beautiful wife.

This is why I always laugh when I see a store advertising something like:

Come in for the "lowest prices in town!"

It immediately suggests that they are in fact NOT the lowest in town.

heh, i am really bad for putting quotations around words/phrases. this is because they are not as "objective" as people make them out to be.

i really am too groggy today to explain it, but can only give that example.

roughly, it is signifying that one does not accept the popular, accepted meaning/usage of a particular word or phrase.

another example: johnny went to war and killed twenty men....he came back a "man".

the above means that in general opinion killing people makes one a "man", but the author does not agree, and defines "man" in a way that does not involve killing.

To really stand out from the crowd Howetzer, if you're to use quotes, make sure to follow proper punctuation rules (which SO many people get wrong):

commas, periods, question marks, and exclamation marks always always *always* appear within the quotes, irrespective of whether or not they were originally part of the quotation. Always. No exceptions.

Double hyphens, semi-colons, and colons appear outside of the quotes; not within.

Eg.

So then I turned to him and said, "Run, run little man!"

Frank suddenly stopped the car in front of "Ed's Pub"; he had an eerie feeling he had been there before.

You may also get away with using a colon in the last one, since the second thought actually explains the behaviour of his action.

Frank suddenly stopped the car in front of "Ed's Pub": he had an eerie feeling he had been there before.

In fact, a double-hyphen perhaps too could be used.

Frank suddenly stopped the car in front of "Ed's Pub"--he had an eerie feeling he had been there before.

I must confess in some instances it's ambiguous to me which to use.

If using semi-colons and colons though, the two ideas must always be sentences that could stand complete on their own.

Originally Posted by icedawg

If using semi-colons and colons though, the two ideas must always be sentences that could stand complete on their own.

Not true. In sentences in which your would normally use a comma but one half of the sentence also contains an unrelated set of commas, you would use a semi-colon; for instance, a list.

"When I went to the store I bought four things; eggs, milk, bread, and some time away from my insane family."

oooh, thanks for that Xaqaria! I'm a "-" abuser, mostly because I fear the proper use of the colon and semi-colon. That little tid-bit might just help me kick the dash/hyphen addiction.

What is the correct way to quote a quoter?

Example;
Seeker quotes shakespeare. The next thread I discuss seekers opinion and about him quoting shakespeare.

Just read title and 1st post.

My grammar is appauling.

I have just finished watching "2 weeks notice"
(Yes, that's on topic)

/Evs

Originally posted by icedawg
colons, and colons

Thanks everyone!

And Ice. Are you a grammar school teacher or something?

Originally posted by icedawg
commas, periods, question marks, and exclamation marks always always *always* appear within the quotes, irrespective of whether or not they were originally part of the quotation. *Always. *No exceptions.

That means that sentences may possibly end without any punctuation, but instead with a quotation mark. I don't believe it. Maybe you just got the two groups switched? That's how it makes sense to me...Keep the sentence enders out of the quotes, keep the sentence continuers in the quotation marks.

That means that sentences may possibly end without any punctuation, but instead with a quotation mark. I don't believe it. Maybe you just got the two groups switched? That's how it makes sense to me...Keep the sentence enders out of the quotes, keep the sentence continuers in the quotation marks.

Nope, he's right. I didn't hear about the ; : and -- part, but that makes obvious sense.

[quote]Thanks everyone!

And Ice. Are you a grammar school teacher or something?

This is basic english grammar ... it's okay we all forget this stuff

colons, and colons

I laughed my ass off when I saw this. Thank you.

PS: Ice, it's "e.g."

Originally posted by Neruo+--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Neruo)</div>

It's Joe his state is ohio, so that's an 's.
Not that hard, is it?[/b]

States are capitalized. I did not think that was too hard. + a run on sentence?

<!--QuoteBegin-ataraxis
This is basic english grammar ... it's okay we all forget this stuff

I am not trying to be a provocateur but...
I don't give a shit what is considered basic hard, normal or excepted. To me, if I feel something is %&#*@ up, I have issues with it.
Just as people argue hand over fist over the doctrines of the Bible, why cannot people disagree with basic English?
I think in a linear manner in many issues to avoid confusion.
The state of Ohio does not belong to Joe.
A word to be emphasized should be underlined or bold.

Another good example.
Let's say today is Friday. Most people I run into would consider next Saturday to be actually 8 days from Friday. Actually being the Saturday after the next.
You can't argue that that is not wrong.
I simply ask: What is the next Saturday? The true answer is tomorrow.

Just venting. I have just always wondered why some areas are just accepted while others are not.

Another Q. > Los Angeles' free ways suck. (before the existing s or after

[quote]Another Q. > Los Angeles' free ways suck. (before the existing s or after[/color]

You'd have two s's. *wonders if punctuation on that is right* If the word ends in an -s in the singular, to form the possessive you still would add 's. You only add the appostraphe in the case of plural possession. For example:

The wolf's teeth are sharp. (Singular)
The wolves' teeth are sharp.

And another thing, I'm not a grammar Nazi, persay, but I am a language major so I appreciate it when people use proper grammar. Commas in English gave me the most trouble.

[quote]Another Q. > Los Angeles' free ways suck. (before the existing s or after[/color]


Correct: "Los Angeles's freeways suck"


Though iff I were writing, I would instead write "The freeways of Los Angeles suck", purely because I think that when dealing with some proper nouns, using apostrophes for the possessive is just a bit clumsy, and doesn't read well.

Originally posted by icedawg
commas, periods, question marks, and exclamation marks always always *always* appear within the quotes, irrespective of whether or not they were originally part of the quotation. *Always. *No exceptions.

i think question marks depend on whether or not they are part of the original quote.

Did Seeker just say, "I had a lucid dream"?
vs.
Seeker asked, "Did you have a lucid dream?"

Seeker said that ice dawg said " blah blah bla blalbla" *
Who are you actually quoting? Seeker said it, But it is once removed. *
I would guess the original person?[/b]

again, depends on context.

Seeker told me that Icedawg said, "I had a lucid dream."
vs.
Seeker said, "Icedawg just said, 'I had a lucid dream.'"
vs.
Seeker said, "Icedawg just told me that he had a lucid dream."

in the first case, the only direct quote is icedawg's, so it's the only one in quotation marks. in the second case, i am directly quoting seeker, who directly quotes icedawg, so they both belong in quotation marks. in the last case, i am directly quoting seeker, who gets quotation marks, but he is not directly quoting icedawg, so he doesn't get them.

(direct quote=saying the actual words that the other person said. indirect quote=saying the idea, but not the actual words.)

commas, periods, question marks, and exclamation marks always always *always* appear within the quotes, irrespective of whether or not they were originally part of the quotation. Always. No exceptions.

i think question marks depend on whether or not they are part of the original quote.

Did Seeker just say, "I had a lucid dream"?
vs.
Seeker asked, "Did you have a lucid dream?"[/quote]

Nope...I'm 100% positive.

However, I have noted that Americans like to--just as an example--uppercase the first letter following a colon, which so far as I can tell is not the case with proper English rules. It is possible the U.S. culture has also added its own interpretation to punctuation within quotation marks. Regardless, I stand by what I said in regards to proper punctuation with quotation marks, completely and absolutely.

Originally posted by icedawg
5.103 If the material introduced by a colon consists of more than one sentence, or if it is a formal statement, a quotation, or a speech in dialogue, it should begin with a capital letter. Otherwise it may begin with a lowercase letter:

To Henrietta, there seemed no possibility of waking from her nightmare: If she were to reveal what was in the letter, her reputation would be ruined and her marriage at an end. On the other hand, if she were to remain silent, her husband would be in mortal danger.

Henrietta's distress seemed insupportable: not only had her lover abandoned her at the last moment, but she had already sent a note to her husband announcing her intention of leaving him.

I wish only to state the following: Anyone found in possession of forged papers will immediately be arrested.

Originally posted by The Blue Meanie



Correct: "Los Angeles's freeways suck"


Though iff I were writing, I would instead write "The freeways of Los Angeles suck", purely because I think that when dealing with some proper nouns, using apostrophes for the possessive is just a bit clumsy, and doesn't read well.

I do not think that is correct.
Is it not Los Angeles' Freeways suck? I really do not know. That is why I am asking. But that ti me does not seem correct. (what about freeway's ???)

I think I know less than when we started.

Well, if you were using "Los Angeles" as an adjective, then you wouldn't have to use an appostraphe. You could just say "Los Angeles freeways suck." If you wanted to make it possessive, though, since Los Angeles is singular it would be "Los Angeles's freeways suck."

[quote]

I do not think that is correct.
Is it not Los Angeles' Freeways suck? I really do not know. That is why I am asking. But that ti me does not seem correct. (what about freeway's ???)

I think I know less than when we started.

It can be either. Both Los Angeles's and Los Angeles' are perfectly acceptable, it's up to the writer to decide how many ezeses are too many.

Imagine that. Modern English, a dynamic language?