Thread: Why do people whine about animal testing???

Originally Posted by stonedape

thats most people I know. I understand your from a rural area, but most people I know here are dumb as hell. The school system sucks. Most people I know watch at least an hour of TV a day. They are constantly shown a false reality that they feel they need to have. TV is full of propaganda. It is basically nothing but it. Very few telivision shows are in any way artistic. By that I mean creative or original in any way. they are just a copy.

Medicine should not be. I want medicine from people who care about me not people taking advantage of me.

But they still experience pain.

well television is only entertainment, there's nothing educational about it, it's there for people to waste time, and yes too many people waste too much time watching it

i'd rather have an animal go through pain than a human, and not all tests involve pain

Telivision is brainwash. People will beleive anything that they hear on the news. The see a constant barrage of ads that tells them what to buy. I stopped watching telivision a few moths ago and it's really fantastic. It clears your mind of a lot of bullshit.

And some tests do so nevermind the ones that don't. Animals still experiencing pain. And we already have damn good painkillers so if a human is in pain for a disease(in most cases) it is because they can't afford good drugs. Some things like cancer cause excessive pain and painkillers are not enough but this is not the case with most people with most diseases.

Originally Posted by stonedape

look what i'm really getting at is that poeple have existed for a long ass time without animal testing. so it is therefore not necessary. I beleive it is wrong to kill things if it is unnecessary.

You are going to die. At some point your ass is gonna be dead. Why do you need to kill other shit to make you live for just a little bit longer. I measure my life by the quality of existance not by the amount of time I've been alive.

The problem I have with the modern way we treat animals is that we fucking cheat. If your gonna kill something at least give a chance. use a bow or gun or something. Don't lock it up and a cage and slowly fuck it up over time.

And when I said If people would just take care of themselves they wouldn't need medicine tested on animals, I meant that 90% of people really don't take very good care of themselves anymore. At least not in america. I mean look at the shit people eat. Fast food is honestly disgusting. I don't see how people can eat it. And the rest of the time people just eat shit prepackeged shit out of a box. Try a homecooked meal sometime, you won't regret it. And a lot of people don't get much physical activity anymore. I mean nobody walks anywhere, they just drive.

It's idiots like you who cause all the counterproductive bullshit that pushes society back.

Originally Posted by stonedape

Telivision is brainwash. People will beleive anything that they hear on the news. The see a constant barrage of ads that tells them what to buy. I stopped watching telivision a few moths ago and it's really fantastic. It clears your mind of a lot of bullshit.

And some tests do so nevermind the ones that don't. Animals still experiencing pain. And we already have damn good painkillers so if a human is in pain for a disease(in most cases) it is because they can't afford good drugs. Some things like cancer cause excessive pain and painkillers are not enough but this is not the case with most people with most diseases.

yes i'll agree, tv is garbage. if i watch it i usually watch it for some type of sporting event.

we also try to find cures for cancer through animal testing, there will always be a form on testing of either one of the following: animals, humans. the question is which do you want it to happen to? would you rather an animal be hurt or a human being to be hurt? when they test for something that has the possibility to kill a human, i highly doubt they'll let them volunteer for that. most things humans can volunteer for they have to fill out a paper dealing with allergic reactions, etc. etc., if a human is dumb enough to volunteer for something harmful then so be it, but most won't

Yes and keep culture and spirituality alive. Our species is weak as hell. We just hide behind technology. If technology fails, just about everyone who lives in the city is fucked. People know nothing of how to survive on their own.

Cancer is not that hard to prevent. Most people get cancer at a late age in life, or are very unhealthy. I don't disagree that some kind of animal testing will always exist. That doesn't mean I have to support it. The best way to stop people from doing some thing stupid is to enlighten them about, not make laws against it. Our species could be much stronger if it took care of itself instead of relying on others to take care of it.

Originally Posted by stonedape

Yes and keep culture and spirituality alive. Our species is weak as hell. We just hide behind technology. If technology fails, just about everyone who lives in the city is fucked. People know nothing of how to survive on their own.

well technology is sort of like evolution, in evolution you can start with traits you need then overtime when you no longer need it you can lose it, used to people had to grow/raise their own food to survive but over time when technology increased the need for that diminished little by little.

Originally Posted by stonedape

Cancer is not that hard to prevent. Most people get cancer at a late age in life, or are very unhealthy. I don't disagree that some kind of animal testing will always exist. That doesn't mean I have to support it. The best way to stop people from doing some thing stupid is to enlighten them about, not make laws against it. Our species could be much stronger if it took care of itself instead of relying on others to take care of it.

how is cancer not hard to prevent? being healthy doesn't mean you won't get cancer, do you know who lance armstrong is? he's had cancer.

our species may be stronger mentally like that, but not physically, there's a high possibility you wouldn't exist today if animal testing had never happened.

Originally Posted by nitsuJ

well technology is sort of like evolution, in evolution you can start with traits you need then overtime when you no longer need it you can lose it, used to people had to grow/raise their own food to survive but over time when technology increased the need for that diminished little by little..

Yes but too much technology makes people lazy. People can evolve good traits as well as bad traits. Our society is developing too fast. We no longer stop to think if things will have a positive or negative impact on the world. Businesses have to advance quickly to stay competitive. The result is chain stores all over the fucking place. Cities all look the same now. A bunch of fucking wallmarts and mcdonalds. This is why culture is dead in america. And now we're trying to spread it to the rest of the world.

Originally Posted by nitsuJ

how is cancer not hard to prevent? being healthy doesn't mean you won't get cancer, do you know who lance armstrong is? he's had cancer.

But the fact is that most people who get cancer are unhealthy or old. And sometimes young, healthy people just randomly go into cardiac arrest and die. It happened to a kid who went to my highschool. People die accept it.

Originally Posted by nitsuJ

our species may be stronger mentally like that, but not physically, there's a high possibility you wouldn't exist today if animal testing had never happened.

It's a fact that I wouldn't exist without animal testing. But I wouldn't have existed if it weren't for slavery, or the holocaust either. If almost anything in that major was changed in the past my parents would never had met. It's not necessarry to sacrifice physical strength to become mentally strong.

Originally Posted by stonedape

Yes but too much technology makes people lazy. People can evolve good traits as well as bad traits. Our society is developing too fast. We no longer stop to think if things will have a positive or negative impact on the world. Businesses have to advance quickly to stay competitive. The result is chain stores all over the fucking place. Cities all look the same now. A bunch of fucking wallmarts and mcdonalds. This is why culture is dead in america. And now we're trying to spread it to the rest of the world.




But the fact is that most people who get cancer are unhealthy or old. And sometimes young, healthy people just randomly go into cardiac arrest and die. It happened to a kid who went to my highschool. People die accept it.



It's a fact that I wouldn't exist without animal testing. But I wouldn't have existed if it weren't for slavery, or the holocaust either. If almost anything in that major was changed in the past my parents would never had met. It's not necessarry to sacrifice physical strength to become mentally strong.

so you're half african american/jewish?

and no it's not necessary but it's better. we don't have to exhaust our bodies and depend on ourselves to live anymore, it's a better world.

Originally Posted by nitsuJ

so you're half african american/jewish?

and no it's not necessary but it's better. we don't have to exhaust our bodies and depend on ourselves to live anymore, it's a better world.

No, but but if you change any moment in the past which creates like a dominoe effect which influences all future events. No matter how small the influence it still makes a difference.

How do you know it's better? We don't exhaust ourselves, but we do become lazy. Life is not better, it is easier. easy is not always best. Most people take the extra time they have and watch tv, or talk about inane bullshit on facebook or some other internet site. There are too many distractions in our western culture.

Originally Posted by stonedape

No, but but if you change any moment in the past which creates like a dominoe effect which influences all future events. No matter how small the influence it still makes a difference.

How do you know it's better? We don't exhaust ourselves, but we do become lazy. Life is not better, it is easier. easy is not always best. Most people take the extra time they have and watch tv, or talk about inane bullshit on facebook or some other internet site. There are too many distractions in our western culture.

i don't really know how things that happened during wars would effect what happened in the future, as far as i can think of i'd still be here if WWII and slavery never happened

it's better physically, as in we don't wear our bodies down as fast as ancestors would have, and yes, entertainment is a cause for the world being fatter.

but the thing on animal testing isn't being dependent on medicines among other things, it's to increase our chances of survival and make survival easier for the future human beings and to advance us in this world.

Have you ever heard of the butterfly effect? It's like that. If you change a major event in someones life it will affect the outcome of their future. For example, say WW2 never happened, then a lot of people wouldn't have died. These people will change the course of history simply by existing. Lets say you have a mom and a dad. Your mom and dad meet at age 30, get married at 34, and then at 37 have you. Now lets back up to when they were 18 and didn't even know each other yet. Your mom is seeing a different guy who she goes to high school with. Now we have to split the univers into two paths. One with WW2 and one with no war. In the one with WW2 your moms boyfriend from high school gets drafted and dies in the war. A few years later she meets your father, and they have you. Now jump to univers without WW2. Your mom stays with her high school boyfreind, they get maried and your father doesn't so you don't exist. At least not in your current form.

But we don't need to survive any longer than we currently do. And old people slowly die, senile and not knowing anything. Death is natural.

Originally Posted by nitsuJ

all companies are only there to make money.

The only problem is that medical related companies only want to make money, and most don't care at all about the health of people or animals.

Originally Posted by nitsuJ

and over those thousands of years from animal testing we've increased our chances of survival and made lives better with it, animals are selfish creatures as far as i'm concerned, they could care less about their own kind, they're out for themselves.

It's interesting to note that whenever a major disease hits a population, there is a percentage of people who either don't die from it, or don't even succumb to it at all. By finding cures for diseases, you are allowing weaker genetics to multiply, which leads to a population that is overall more likely to be affected by diseases.

To sum up my position, I "whine" about animal testing because it is completely irrelevant in my opinion. Sure, some new surgical procedures developed using animal testing, but the majority of our medical technology could easily exist using human test subjects. Testing cosmetic products on animals is just silly. Is it that surprising that most synthetic chemicals are bad for you? It shouldn't be.

Originally Posted by stonedape

Have you ever heard of the butterfly effect? It's like that. If you change a major event in someones life it will affect the outcome of their future. For example, say WW2 never happened, then a lot of people wouldn't have died. These people will change the course of history simply by existing. Lets say you have a mom and a dad. Your mom and dad meet at age 30, get married at 34, and then at 37 have you. Now lets back up to when they were 18 and didn't even know each other yet. Your mom is seeing a different guy who she goes to high school with. Now we have to split the univers into two paths. One with WW2 and one with no war. In the one with WW2 your moms boyfriend from high school gets drafted and dies in the war. A few years later she meets your father, and they have you. Now jump to univers without WW2. Your mom stays with her high school boyfreind, they get maried and your father doesn't so you don't exist. At least not in your current form.

But we don't need to survive any longer than we currently do. And old people slowly die, senile and not knowing anything. Death is natural.

yes i know about the butterfly effect but my parents weren't effected from WWII, they weren't even born at the time, some people would be effected from it but not all

Originally Posted by Schmaven

The only problem is that medical related companies only want to make money, and most don't care at all about the health of people or animals.



It's interesting to note that whenever a major disease hits a population, there is a percentage of people who either don't die from it, or don't even succumb to it at all. By finding cures for diseases, you are allowing weaker genetics to multiply, which leads to a population that is overall more likely to be affected by diseases.

To sum up my position, I "whine" about animal testing because it is completely irrelevant in my opinion. Sure, some new surgical procedures developed using animal testing, but the majority of our medical technology could easily exist using human test subjects. Testing cosmetic products on animals is just silly. Is it that surprising that most synthetic chemicals are bad for you? It shouldn't be.

but why would a human put themselves in danger of something going wrong? and if the researcher knows there's a chance of something going bad i doubt they'd allow humans to be test subjects

Originally Posted by Seismosaur

It's idiots like you who cause all the counterproductive bullshit that pushes society back.

Ugh. Sometimes I think you're so wonderful, and then I read a post like this and I'm back to square one with you.

Originally Posted by kichu

Ugh. Sometimes I think you're so wonderful, and then I read a post like this and I'm back to square one with you.

He's right though.

Originally Posted by Seismosaur

It's idiots like you who cause all the counterproductive bullshit that pushes society back.

Seismosaur, don't have kids...

Originally Posted by nitsuJ

but why would a human put themselves in danger of something going wrong? and if the researcher knows there's a chance of something going bad i doubt they'd allow humans to be test subjects

If I knew there was a chance of something going bad, I would look at what I was doing, and ask myself, "where is this potential problem stemming from?" and try to improve on my design before moving on to the testing phase. Scientific analysis is a handy skill to have.

I am not saying all animal testing is bad, just most of it. If you can use common sense, or a book to figure the effects on something, then testing it is kind of redundant. Personally, I wouldn't be able to work as an animal tester. Similarly, I don't really care that animals are killed in the harvesting of the food I eat, but I still feel bad when I run over the little buggers with my lawn mower.