Thread: 5htp

What exactly is 5HTP? An explanation would've been nice..

You don't hear much about 5HTP as a supplement for LD'ers, but I suppose it could be used that way.
Really, all 5HTP does is stimulate seratonin production, which can help you sleep at night, though I don't know if it would have an impact on attaining lucidity.
When you tried it before, did it have a noticeable effect, and have you ever tried melatonin or B6 before, to give a comparison of the effects?
If not, I'd suggest taking 50-100mg B6 (but NO MORE than 100 mg for starters). Also, try melatonin at 2-3mg.
Melatonin is a sleep aid, and B6 at those levels is known to dramatically increase the clarity of dreams.

One final note--whatever you do, do NOT take B6 and 5HTP at the same time. Give it a one week break between to be safe--taking both simultaneously can cause Serotonin Syndrome, which is not something fun, and can be lethal.

Originally Posted by laconix

What exactly is 5HTP? An explanation would've been nice..
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Ah, sorry. As Tsen said, it's a non prescription dietary supplement to help support the natural production of serotonin.

Originally Posted by laconix

You don't hear much about 5HTP as a supplement for LD'ers, but I suppose it could be used that way.
Really, all 5HTP does is stimulate seratonin production, which can help you sleep at night, though I don't know if it would have an impact on attaining lucidity.
When you tried it before, did it have a noticeable effect, and have you ever tried melatonin or B6 before, to give a comparison of the effects?
If not, I'd suggest taking 50-100mg B6 (but NO MORE than 100 mg for starters). Also, try melatonin at 2-3mg.
Melatonin is a sleep aid, and B6 at those levels is known to dramatically increase the clarity of dreams.

One final note--whatever you do, do NOT take B6 and 5HTP at the same time. Give it a one week break between to be safe--taking both simultaneously can cause Serotonin Syndrome, which is not something fun, and can be lethal.
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Yeah, this is what I'm not too sure on. I'm not well educated on what it is that affects your ability to attaining lucidity. If it were solely serotonin, then 5HTP could be a good choice. But in saying that, I've never taken B6 supplements, or Melatonin. Are they available over the counter at a chemist, or would they require a prescription?

I've only had 5HTP after taking certain serotonin expelling substances, to hasten its recovery and prevent mid-week lows. I don't recall it affecting my dreams, but as I said.. I was under the influence of other chemicals, which would have almost certainly affected it - lucidity wise.

I'd definitely be keen on trying them (precautiously as you mentioned) to find which is best.

Have you taken 5HTP before, Tsen?

Originally Posted by Nemesis

Ah, sorry. As Tsen said, it's a non prescription dietary supplement to help support the natural production of serotonin.
Yeah, this is what I'm not too sure on. I'm not well educated on what it is that affects your ability to attaining lucidity. If it were solely serotonin, then 5HTP could be a good choice. But in saying that, I've never taken B6 supplements, or Melatonin. Are they available over the counter at a chemist, or would they require a prescription?

I've only had 5HTP after taking certain serotonin expelling substances, to hasten its recovery and prevent mid-week lows. I don't recall it affecting my dreams, but as I said.. I was under the influence of other chemicals, which would have almost certainly affected it - lucidity wise.

I'd definitely be keen on trying them (precautiously as you mentioned) to find which is best.

Have you taken 5HTP before, Tsen?
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FYI, B6 and melatonin are usually available at your local pharmacy. Melatonin is also produced by the body just like serotonin.

Quote taken from Lars' Dreaming FAQ

1.5. Do substances like drugs, herbs and foods affect our dreams?
Yes. During REM protein-synthesis is highly active, so your body needs high levels of amino
acids. The neurotransmitter in use during REM is Acetylcholine. It is made from the B-vitamin
Choline and the vitamin B-5.

But there are more vitamins that can make us dream more. The body can synthesis the B-vitamin
Choline. But in order to do that it needs vitamin B-12, Folic acid (B-9), the amino acids
Methionine and Serine. Vitamins B-12 plays a role in the activation of amino acids during
protein formation. It has also the ability to increase the production of Acetylcholine and
normalize neurotransmissions in the brain.

Vitamin B-6 is another important vitamin. It is a co-enzyme, which participates in over 60
enzymatic reactions involved in the metabolism of amino acids. It is involved in the production
of several body proteins and neurotransmitters. It is particularly indispensable to the action
of amino acid neurotransmitters, like Serotonin, Dopamine, Melatonin, and Norepinephrine, which
effect brain function. It is also involved in the metabolism of Selenium, Calcium, and
Magnesium.

Melatonin is a neurotransmitter/hormone that is only active during sleep. It is being
metabolized when you fall asleep from Serotonin, a neurotransmitter that is being metabolized
from the amino acid Tryptophan. Melatonin increases non-REM sleep and makes it easier for you
to fall asleep. But it has also an interesting rebound effect that gives more frequent and
vivid dreams. The vividness might even give you a lucid dream.

The amino acid Tryptophan can be metabolized into Serotonin and Niacin (B-3). Vitamin B-6
promotes this conversion. Taking Niacin or Nicotine patches will increase the Serotonin
production. The more Niacin you take, the more Serotonin is produced and more Melatonin is
metabolized. Calcium and Magnesium promotes Serotonin production as well. Zinc is in every cell
of the body and is a part of over 200 enzymes, so Zinc supplements may increase REM-sleep, too.

DMAE (Dimethylaminoethanol) is a very important B-vitamin. It flows easily through the brain's
blood barrier, where it is converted into Choline. During REM, Choline is added the coenzyme A
(Vitamin B-5), and we have Acetylcholine, the neurotransmitter in use during REM.
5-HTP (5-Hydroxy-TryptoPhan) is a Serotonin precursor that also flows quite easy through the
brain's blood barrier. It is a good alternative to Melatonin.

Vitamin C helps metabolizing several amino acids and hormones. It is also important to have
adequate levels of amino acids. A few important ones are Phenylalanine, Tyrosine, Methionine,
Cysteine, Serine and Tryptophan.

Using Tobacco, Alcohol or Coffee prohibits the absorption of necessary vitamins and amino
acids. Depressants suppress REM sleep, one is Alcohol, but taken in right doses can create a
rebound effect so that you wake up remembering many vivid dreams. And anti-depressants may
increase dream recall. Caffeine will make you sleep lighter, will increase your dream recall
and maybe even give you a lucid dream. Herbs like Valerian, Mugwort, Mullein, Kava Kava,
Dittany of Crete, St. Johns Wort, Calea Zacatechichi, Salvia Divinorum, Scutellaria Indica,
Licorice Root, Vervain, Jasmine, Honeysuckle, Datura, Bee Pollen, Catnip, Hops, Scullcap,
Mimosa, Lavender, Damiana, Withania Somnifera, Passionflower, Chamomile, Cardamom, Gotu Kola,
Ginkgo Biloba, Ibogaine, Verbena, Rose, Cinnamon, Marigold, Nutmeg, Peppermint, Holly, Yarrow
and Anise may help you dream more, recall more or even have a Lucid Dream. Make sure you know
more about these herbs before you use them: some are to be used in pillows, some are to be
smoked, some are to be used in tea, etc. And finally we have psychedelic drugs like DXM that
may induce Lucid Dreams. Some of the drugs and herbs can be addictive, and be poisonous if
taken in too large doses. Crystals and Magnets may also affect your dreams.
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I've personally tried 5-htp with no positive effect yet, but that's not really an indicator as I have also tried B6, B5, melatonin and niacin without any effect on my dreams. The only thing that worked so far are nicotine patches and I don't think I want to go back on them.

Thanks GODLIGHT, that's really helpful! I'll definitely be heading to the pharmacy and asking what's best for me some day soon.

I've just woken up from an attempt at FILD (finger-induced LD). I got to the point where I was entering a dream, realised, and tried to open my 'dream eyes'. I couldn't though, as I felt completely paralysed. At this point the bed started shaking/vibrating, which startled me a bit.

I had a small block of cheese before going to bed. About, 70g. What chemicals in cheese help with lucidity? I've heard a lot about cheese giving people weird dreams, and so tend to eat some before going to bed some nights, just for that reason.

Thanks, I've learnt a lot from this already.

I haven't ever tried 5HTP myself, which is why I can't say definitively whether or not it would have a positive effect on LD'ing.
B6 and melatonin are both available over the counter, though. I've used B6 with moderate success, and melatonin with good success.

I've been trying 5HTP on and off for the past couple years. I dont see any significant impact on my ability to achieve lucidity. It might alter the dream imagery a little bit, but not much...

I also tried 5HTP a few years ago, the only effect it seemed to have on me was to give me low grade headaches the next day, this was at minimum dosage.

Also calcium inhibits absorption of zinc.. so I generally don't take any calcium together with my zinc...