FREAKED OUT

[sand]

i had a ld last night for the third time. at first i thought yay but thought nothing after and just started to fly, change scenes and so on. what really freaked me out is that it lasted for a day and i knew i couldnt be sleeping for a day. after like 4 hours i was like whoa shouldnt i be awake by now? i kept on thinking about it for a while and trying to get ways out of it i tried closing my eyes, inflicting pain, actually think that im waking nothing worked. i started to get really freaked out. i kept thinking i will never leave this dream and i kept looking for a way out (couldnt find one) i thought i was goin mad. then a couple of hours later i heard this buzzing noise it kept getting louder and louder i tried to find this noise and when it got to the point where it was so loud and close that it was like it was next to my ear, i woke up it was my alarm clock. i was soooo happy that it woke me up ( for once) that just really freaked me out.

[Kaniaz]

I have had an experience like this, when time seems to drag on in your dream. Anyway, just remember you'll never be able to sleep forever. You'll always wake up eventually, wether you've had enough sleep or something in the outside world disturbs you enough (there is only one case I know about when anybody has slept for a long time [60 years, in this one]. Scientists still haven't figured out why she slept so long).

[EGNAZIO]

Yeah Iknow what your talkin about man, and it really freaks the crap out of me if that where to ever happen to me. But It hasn't yet an I'm thankful, and thats the only thing that really freaks me out about Lucid dreaming. And when I'm actually lucid I'm hoping that that never happens to me in my sleep stage...

[Seeker]

A lot of us here have experienced time dialation like you did. My longest so far has been about two weeks. How disoriented were you when you woke up? It seems to increase with longer dreams.

[Damone]

The other morning after waking up from an LD I was the most disoriented I had ever been before. Even as I got out of bed I felt like I do when I LD and as I walked through the house I'd clatch a glimpse of people in the corner of my eyes like some kinda ghosted image in my head. It took about 30 minutes before I felt normal. At least now I know it's common.

[Rtex]

I know what happened, it was like that about the first day or so, then I decided to enjoy the extended period of the dream, and eventual forgot I was dreamin, I thought everything that was happening was Real Life. So you can imagine how weird it was when I woke up.

[Serinanth]

Yeah you kinda feel like you get kicked in the ass when you wake up from a dream like that Sand... if you ever get stuck again, worry about it for a little while. But you have to try and keep your sanity, they can last alot longer, just keep it in your head that NOW is real, regardless of whether your in a dream or not. Dont worry about which one is more real than the other, or about waking up, kuz if your stuck its going to be like trying to wake up here while you are consious... all that will get you is closer to insanity. I would suggest just letting the dream take its course, you said you can change the scene and stuff but just try letting everything unfold and then when you do wake up, tell us of it =)

[Lowercase Society]

did it almost feel like the dream world was pressing down upon you...like Claustrophobia or something of the like? that would freak me out so much.

[WerBurN]

ya, ive had dreams that lasted weeks, but those usually arent lucid...whenever im lucid i always have this huge fear that im not going to wake up in time (im always procrastinating on something and if i ever oversleep something is bound not to get done)...in the end i always end up waking myself up, only to find that ive only slept for 2 hours or something stupid, and i sleepy crappy for the rest of the night cause i was lucid, but screwed it up by being paranoid

[teddy]

Greetings all - my first post in this forum, just thought id offer a comment or two. I feel like a bit of a fish out of water since ive been trying to stop lucid dreaming for a few years now and finally decided to research how it could be done - hence my browsing this forum. If anyone has any suggestions as to how this can be effectively achieved (i.e. - how to remain unconscious whilst sleeping) - please let me know. I find thinking all day long is enough without committing to the same issues throughout the night. As far as time dilation is concerned, i find the only way to avoid paranoia in these instances is to hyperventilate. This is one of the only functions not restricted in REM sleep, since paralysing ones own respiratory system during dreams would be a selective mutation that would quickly eliminate ones genetic line, whereas restricting body movements etc is probably a good idea for survival purposes. So my partner hears me and wakes me up - or, alternatively, if im sleeping alone, my body will naturally awaken due to extreme duress - this will probably cause me a heart attack in the next ten years. I would like to know what people think is responsible for the apparent time dilation effect experienced in some lucid dreams. I havent studied any form of sciences for about 7 years now but i understand that time is relative to gravitational fields, and is a tool to guage the 'distance' between events. Throughout the day our minds are 'active' within our bodies, and 'feel' gravitational forces accordingly. ie. i feel as though the weight of my body and mind are drawn towards the earth as i type this. This is very important so that i can function throughout the day as a member of a hunter/gatherer species, and survive. When we sleep, particularly in REM sleep when the brain / mind disassociates with the body (to avoid running around and jumping off buildings as we dream) - what sort of gravitational construct is placed on the thoughts we are experiencing? If there is no value to the mass of thought, how would that thought then react to gravity - how would it react under relativity and would it be bound by any time constraints whatsoever? Probably a bit of rambling in all that - id like to see what people think nonetheless... if we have any physicists in here pls advise.

[Serinanth]

Firstly Welcome =) No worries, there is no such thing as a fish out of water here =). Well I could not give you a specific quantifiable gravitational force as I dont have the tools or the patience to go through the mathematics in my dreams... But it would vary, it depends on the place, some of us have explored deep space where there is very little to create a gravitational field. If this is true when man finaly takes to the stars and travels the interstellar void, this time dilation will manifest in the real world, thats just hypothetical though. But in most cases people can break free of gravity in their dreams, hence the superman effect =). Though the very long term dream that I did have I could not break free and fly I was very much restricted to the ground, I did not notice a change in how "Heavy" I felt, so I would guess that it was earth equivalent gravity. Our mind will usualy create something fammiliar in the ways of physical laws untill we go and bend or break them as we will. This is an interesting concept, Gravitation itself is very iffy to me though, the major component of the equation is a correctional factor that we had to come up with, it does not work all the time, and also breaks down at the quantum level (well most things do but thats besides the point) We still know too little about gravity I have never heard the Time/gravity correlation though, like I said its an interesting concept, I am gona look further into it =). I am sorry I cannot help you though, I was stuck there for a long time, it came to a point where I was no longer stuck and i became a resident. I tried to wake up for a long time, all I ended up with was headaches and extreme paranoia. Thankfully I came to the realisation that only Now is real and if Now exists within a dream then it to is reality, It kept me sane, and still does =). Some of us here know how you feel, your body is rested, but your mind is tired... very tired you just want to pass out, I found that alchohol will knock you out and you dont dream as much and you loose consiousness.. but its not healthy. You need to work on the level of your lucidity, like myself, I may be aware I am dreaming at times, but I cannot wake up, when you ae High Lucid, you are basically a god and can wake up without much problem. How long have you been lucid dreaming and contiually consious?

[teddy]

Thanks for the swift reply Serinanth. My query doesnt so much relate to the experienced gravitational field - i'm more talking about the actual real gravity of those thoughts. See, my understanding is that humans guage time according to gravitational perspective - ie. at a black hole or at the speed of light time is dilated according to the extreme gravitational field. But we only really experience gravity when we are waking, as our minds run in syncopation with our bodies to understand and relate to our world. In REM sleep, this is not the case as the mind 'detaches' from the body (any neuro scientists know what causes this?) - hence, no relative gravity, no concept of the passing of time. That might be why we fall asleep and wake up as if no time has passed - it doesnt actually stop time (or course) - it just dimishes our perception of the passing of time. Ive trawled the web for investigations into relativity / perceptions of time and thought (sleep) to no avail so if anyone finds anything... As far as myself, ive been a reluctant lucid dreamer for about 10 years (27yo) and a self denying alcoholic for most of that period. If i dont drink, my dreams revolve around the same complexities that plague my waking life - philosphical conundrums and so forth. Often i have sat in a lucid dream for seemingly ages pondering the very notion of wether i am experiencing gravity and wether the thoughts that create the very dream i am experiencing exist. ie. i consider them, but they are not tangible in any sense. like, for instance, you can experience whatever you like, but it is not real. and if it is not real, is it worth experiencing? I could sleep with a girl from work, but is it worth experiencing that as a fake emotion? After a heavy night on pills on Friday night i luckily came to the realisation of what ive been running from for so long with alcohol and resolved to fix it (we'll see how that goes..) - in the meantime im the luckiest alco getting round. I bought a house early last year and got engaged to my partner (of 11 years) recently - i would hate to think that all that could be wasted just because im too lazy to fess up to what i fear most... sleep.

[Crucible]

You seem to be very gifted as most would call it. Almost everyone here would love to have what you do. Only a few do. If you are lucid then you can do whatever you want. Having said that I do not really see a downside to it. I would gladly trade with you if it was possible. Anyways, good luck getting whatever is best for you.

[Serinanth]

Hmmm Well they did studies with lucid dreamers using eye movements, in a lab setting the dreamers slept and when they went lucid they made a prescribed series of eye movements, the muscles of the eye do not detach during REM... () Well using sensors they could keep track and time the first signal to another where the dreamer would count to 10 inside the dream, they found that dream time and waking time are relatively close. So the bunch of us that have experienced this time dilation are bonkers. Several theories have been stated, I dont know which is right though, all I know is that when you experience that kind of dream, that amount of time, when you sit there and wonder what the hell is going on and why is it happening its real enough. Of course the thoughts you have in dream are real. I myself have given up arguing with the scientist, the scientist in me freaked out, the philospher said I havent the foggiest, they shook hands and "Now" is reality and thats that =) You cant focus on which is more real, you will drive yourself crazy, you need to try and live, in both worlds. Dont sit and think about it, get up go and explore, you have been dreaming lucidly for only 10 years, and you are young. Aside from exploring this reality there is an infinite expanse to explore in your dreams. Think of all that you can do and see. Its worth experiencing.. Just think, no two humans ever experience this reality the same right? So how can it be real? Sure there are common things that we can all find and see in real life, but its the same in the dream world, there are commonalities, and no two experience it the same. I see little difference between this place and the dreaming, other than continuity and stability, which can be attribued to the fact that your not in the physical world anymore...

[Seeker]

:yumdumdoodledum: :yumdumdoodledum: Welcome teddy! :yumdumdoodledum: :yumdumdoodledum: Oh you night people! When do you ever sleep? Glad you have joined us!

[Lowercase Society]

Welcome teddy and EGNAZIO your doin great Seeker, but who will be able to fill your shoes when you become a mod?

[evangel]

Sand: I also have had a few instances where I thought I could not wake up... I have developed my own technique for waking myself up if a dream takes a negative turn, or it seems the dream time has gone on too long: If you have ever felt the burst of adrenaline if you have tripped or fallen (or startled) before? Well, though this usually only happens in the case of an accident or when someone startles you, you can also sort of jumpstart that adrenaline either by focusing very hard very quickly or by jumping off a high point (cliff, building, etc.) Somehow, the intensity of adrenaline helps me to wake, or at least change the dream. Welcome, Teddy. Sounds like you have a very inquisitive and analytical mind... Tried prayer?

[Blissful]

Originally posted by Seeker A lot of us here have experienced time dialation like you did. *My longest so far has been about two weeks. Seeker!!!! Two Weeks. You mean you slept for 2 weeks........no getting up, no water, no food, no nothing? How is this possible? Didn't someone come looking for you? Where were you when you rested for 2 weeks? Blissful

[GestaltAlteration]

I've experienced this twice... In fact I fogot about those two LDs untill just now. One I was in a horror dream; I knew I was dreaming Untill I couldent wake myself up! then I was starting to think it was REAL!! I was in increasing dispare untill finally I snaped out of it. Crazy..

[Serinanth]

blissfull, what seeker means is that he experienced 2 weeks time within the dream. He slept a normal amount of time, but to his perception he was consious for 2 weeks in the dream world

[sand]

evangel: i tried jumping off high points but when i hit the ground i didnt feel anything i was like i didnt fall at all. believe me i tried almost everything.

[Erfeyah]

I haven't experience time dilation but i think that i can help in my way. Philip Dick(no comments please ) wrote in one of his books that insanity it's like a "chinese fingertrap", the more you try to get out of it, the more the trap gets stronger. These feelings when you experience time dilation is normal because you are not ready for this experience. The thoughts in your mind talks to you agressively about your so far perceptions of reality, and madness. But what is madness? Since i started lucid dreaming, i talked to people that thought that i was mad, even though i explained them the concept and give them the proofs. What if one of this people experiences time dilation? The Yogis say that you have to be ready to face the true. What do you think a Yogi would do in a lucid dream that lasts for years? Imagine the prospects of self exploration without losing time from your waking life. Imagine the power of meditation combined with lucid dreaming. I can't say that i will do better when i experience time dilation but i won't in any case get away from the apple(see LS post), just because its hard to reach. I will prepare my self.

[sand]

android28 : but what it you grabe that apple and eat it, and its poisoned?

[Lowercase Society]

Originally posted by adroid28 Philip Dick(no comments please *) wrote in one of his books that insanity it's like a \"chinese fingertrap\", well i only read that much of the story, but i could ONLY guess what follows, i mean Philip Dick's chinese fingertrap...

[Erfeyah]

Sand wrote: android28 : but what it you grabe that apple and eat it, and its poisoned?[/b] Well if you are prepared, you will choose the tree and the way you are going to reach the apple very carefully... I try to learn as many things as i can about my self and i hope that i will be prepared to learn from my experiences. Serinath said that, you can use evil ways in your lucid dreaming but you have to be carefull because you will get what you give. That is a wise advice... P.S: Lowercase you just can't resist...