Thread: Why oblivion instead of lucidity?

Originally Posted by SKA

Anomanderis, where you say that our subconscious mind chucks us out of the dream when we become conscious.

I tend to disagree. I had lucids in the middle of the night and slept till morning. Also I had lucids were I maintained Lucidity the entire dream.
Why most lucids are short and we are quickly awakened uppon lucidity is because of 2 reasons I believe:
- Getting over excited, releasing a mayor dose of Adrenaline, and
- Getting Lucid as we are about to wake up anyway since our consciousness is then naturally slowly awakening.

I totally agree with you and I'm just saying that the belief-system of your subconscious is one critical factor for attaining and then sustaining the state of lucidity. This is the problem with language, that i couldn't transfer my thoughts into words. Or I just screwed up :p
If we had the subconscious mind as an accomplice to lucidity and not a hindrance, then it would actively seek to keep us lucid. Not helping is not equidistant to chucking out, but that is a matter of philosophy.

http://www.dreamviews.com/community/...ead.php?t=6214 - that is the HILD technique by Gothlark.

Even though I think Gothlark's technique is a bit iffy (don't know why, exactly, just have that feeling), but what he did very well was incorporate visualization into the programming. Since your subC "thinks" in visualizations and truly, it cannot tell the difference between what you perceive with your senses and what you visualize them to feel. To be most effective, the visualization should be 1st person and be as real as possible - actually feel the things that you're imagining - this is called tactile imaging.

The basic steps to hypnotizing yourself (aka direct access to the subC):

1)Think through how it'd be most effective to get the message to your subconscious - what kind of mantras and visualizations to use.
Note that these should be present tense. In your visualizations you should be already experiencing the result you want to arrive at.
2) Relax as much as possible, as far as possible. Relax your whole body.
3) Say to yourself your purpose for the hypnosis and be confident that it will work. Know that it'll work.
This step may take time if you haven't done this before, so do take your time and get relaxed.
3) Go into the hypnotic state - usually done by imagining one is falling down or just moving downwards.
5) Use your already thought up visualizations and mantras to get the message to your subC.
Stay in this stage as long as you'd like.
6) When done, confirm your purpose and know that you have already accomplished it.
6) Come out, go to sleep, what ever catches your fancy, but don't start consciously thinking about whether it's going to work or not - just let it go.

This is the basic scheme that i think i'll follow.

Interesting. I used to do self hypnosis and was quite good at it. I learned it so I could lessen my hatred of homework and be les lazy. I then started using the same relaxation and falling visualizations to assist with WILD. I never thought to use it that way. Removing the subconcious block would be a golden key to LDing. Briliant! However, it seems like it would take a long time and a lot of sessions to undo such a deeply engrained and accepted concept.

Night 1:
Seems to have failed, since i do not remember being lucid, although dream recall stayed at about the same level as usual (~5-8 dreams).

This seeming failure could be the result of me not thinking ahead what kind of visualizations to use and because i wasn't keeping my mind focused on the task at hand. Haven't done any deep meditation for a while now and a couple of times it seemed that i was gonna lift out of my body, so i went with that instead of focusing on hypnotizing myself.
The key to success is in finding the right combination of visualization + mantra that my subC would accept the easiest.
Tonight i'll try using already thought up visualizations and mantras with the help of guided self-hypnosis.

Zobey, even if it took a long time to achieve, it would be like dream yoga - unlimited lucidity. Even though dream yoga has much more benefits (like waking lucidity ), since it works on a different principle, self-hypnosis should be more easily achievable.

My will be done.

I think i figured out why i'm failing. You see, my fallacy was how i thought my subC could actually tell if i was dreaming or not. If my subC cannot tell the difference between what i visualize and what i actually see, then how can it tell when i am dreaming and when i'm not?
This obviously means that the things i've been programming during self-hypnosis cannot have any effect at all.

But what would be the most efficient way to get my subC to understand that i should be lucid in my dreams? Any ideas?

Originally Posted by anomanderis

But what would be the most efficient way to get my subC to understand that i should be lucid in my dreams? Any ideas?

have you looked into subliminal messages?