Thread: LD - Spiritual Perspective

Originally Posted by WakingNomad

here's the excerpt:

I saw Earth in front of me. I could spin the image of the Earth around like Google Earth. I saw Japan was asleep. Then, I thought about Australia, and the Dreamtime. Suddenly I was in Australia. It was night. I was in The Outback. I was The Maxx. "This will never do," I thought. I have to become an animal. I thought about the great animals of Australia. I became a red kangaroo. I went bounding over the plain. A freshwater crocodile appeared and attacked me, biting me in the stomach. I teleported away, healed my wound, then, I leapt up and stomped on his head. He got pissed, and as I turned for another attack, he lunged up at me, exposing his underside, so I punched him in his chest.The crocodile disappeared.

I saw an Aboriginal man playing a didjeridoo on the plain. I became me again. I heard other men playing far far away in a canyon. I sat down in front of the man on the plain. I pulled out a didjeridoo. He opened his eyes and looked at me. He was a little surprised to see an outsider in the dreamtime. He smiled at me benignly, then began playing again. We both played together. I got lost in the music. Stars began pouring out of his didjeridoo, and I stopped playing, transfixed. The stars flew up into the sky, forming constellations.

I saw a dingo, a crocodile, owls, kangaroos, koalas, and other animals. The constellations told a great story, The Story, the story of our origins, our past our future, it was all the same, it was all one. I was overwhelmed. I couldn't understand it, but I kept staring up at the constellations. I felt like crying.

Then, I was playing with the man again. We both stopped our song at the same time. He looked at me, and smiled again. It was time for me to leave Australia.

Very interesting. Your Dream describes the belief of some Indigineous Australians that this reality was created out of the Dreamtime by the Ancestor Spirits in their Songs.

Very powerful Dream.

Originally Posted by saxonharp

Practice with a soda straw stuck down in a glass of water (or whatever liquid you prefer). Breathe in through your nose so that both your lungs AND your cheeks are as full of air as they can possibly be (yes...puffy cheeks are the secret to circular breathing) Blow out through your mouth (using your diaphragm) until your lungs are about 1/2 empty then continue to blow out through your mouth by pushing the air in your cheeks out by constricting your mouth. As you are pushing out with your cheeks, use your diaphragm to draw air into your lungs through your nose very quickly to replenish your lungs and cheeks.

Rinse, repeat.

It takes some people longer than others to get it. Personally, I'm still working on it.

Have fun!

Thanks I think I'll try it with a glass of water (not really a soda person).

Originally Posted by saxonharp

Practice with a soda straw stuck down in a glass of water (or whatever liquid you prefer). Breathe in through your nose so that both your lungs AND your cheeks are as full of air as they can possibly be (yes...puffy cheeks are the secret to circular breathing) Blow out through your mouth (using your diaphragm) until your lungs are about 1/2 empty then continue to blow out through your mouth by pushing the air in your cheeks out by constricting your mouth. As you are pushing out with your cheeks, use your diaphragm to draw air into your lungs through your nose very quickly to replenish your lungs and cheeks.

Rinse, repeat.

It takes some people longer than others to get it. Personally, I'm still working on it.

Have fun!

This is going off-topic, but since it's been asked...
I disagree with the above technique. If you want to learn to circular breathe through a straw in water, do this. If you want to learn to circular breathe through a didjeridoo, play a didjeridoo. The main reason I disagree with this technique is the embouchure is completely different between a didjeridoo and a straw in water. I tried this technique out of curiosity after playing for didjeridoo for about 7 or 8 years, and it took me a couple days to do the straw in the water thing. The only purpose I see for this is that you see your results in our visual oriented society. When you circular breathe the first time, you know anyway, so this technique is really a hindrance.

The traditional way of learning to play is you make your own didjeridoo, then teach yourself to play it in the outback on a walkabout mimicking the sounds of nature.

If you want to learn to circular breathe through a didjeridoo, buy or make a didjeridoo, then learn to play it.

A couple videos on playing:

How To Circular Breathe

How To Play the Didj

Back on topic: I recently had quite a few terrifying Castaneda-esque dreams.

A lot of my lucid dreams are very spiritual: meeting gods, seeing into past lives, meditating with Tibetan monks, my third eye opening, falling asleep in a dream, and last night I was attacked by bright balls of light biting into my flesh like pit bulls.

this is true,
a good dij will create a back-pressure with its vibrations so you can
circular breath without the sound cutting out.
But, I would think if you learn to do it with a straw in water, then going to a dij should be easy.

back to Casteneda too:
I've had dreams where I encounter seemingly random objects that are just gushing with energy, as if the objects themselves are pure energy. Usually they're so powerful that I feel an emotional attachment to these objects...even though they're just random objects.

Originally Posted by WakingNomad

This is going off-topic, but since it's been asked...
I disagree with the above technique. If you want to learn to circular breathe through a straw in water, do this. If you want to learn to circular breathe through a didjeridoo, play a didjeridoo. The main reason I disagree with this technique is the embouchure is completely different between a didjeridoo and a straw in water. I tried this technique out of curiosity after playing for didjeridoo for about 7 or 8 years, and it took me a couple days to do the straw in the water thing. The only purpose I see for this is that you see your results in our visual oriented society. When you circular breathe the first time, you know anyway, so this technique is really a hindrance.

The traditional way of learning to play is you make your own didjeridoo, then teach yourself to play it in the outback on a walkabout mimicking the sounds of nature.

If you want to learn to circular breathe through a didjeridoo, buy or make a didjeridoo, then learn to play it.

Fair enough. That's just how I learned to do it.

Originally Posted by HonerableMoUsE

this is true,
a good dij will create a back-pressure with its vibrations so you can
circular breath without the sound cutting out.
But, I would think if you learn to do it with a straw in water, then going to a dij should be easy.

The easiest thing is to simply learn to play didjeridoo. You can make one out of PVC and and some beeswax for about 20 bucks. Why waste time learning how to circular breathe with a straw in water? You are still going to have to completely readjust your embouchure and to learn to make the basic drone. I am not saying this to brag on myself, but I feel I have to give myself some credibility. I have been playing didjeridoo for over 10 years. I can circular breathe for about forty-five minutes. I taught one person, (the only one who committed to more than one lesson) to circular breathe as second nature in three weeks. My video on how to play the didj has over 35,000 views on youtube.

I am not saying this to brag, seriously. I am very passionate about the didjeridoo. I love it with all my heart. I hope no one takes this as a personal attack or me being argumentative. I say all of this because I just don't want to see people wasting time on this technique when the best way is to do it the way the originators of the instrument have been doing for thousands of years. I think they know what they are talking about.

back to Casteneda too:
I've had dreams where I encounter seemingly random objects that are just gushing with energy, as if the objects themselves are pure energy. Usually they're so powerful that I feel an emotional attachment to these objects...even though they're just random objects.

Interesting. So, have you tried to see the energy of these objects?

Do you think they are scouts?

Originally Posted by saxonharp

Fair enough. That's just how I learned to do it.

I sincerely apologize if I sounded offensive, saxonharp. I would love to play didjeridoo with you if you ever come to Hawai'i. I am going to start a monthly didj circle going here on Oahu soon. Sorry!

Originally Posted by WakingNomad

Interesting. So, have you tried to see the energy of these objects?

Do you think they are scouts?

I would like to think they were scouts. But, for the few times it has happened to me, it has never felt dangerous or threatening. It can best be described as a feeling of nostalgia. and the detail of the objects becomes exquisite, almost to the point that they don't belong...but I can't tell for sure, I wasn't lucid either, it was just one of those super-vivid dreams that stick in your memory as if it actually happened.

Once, there was a piece of paper with some abstract drawing on it that pulled me in....it issued forth streams of bright colored light...it reminded me of that Mac screen-saver...haha.

The same stuff I've once seen coming out of the sky in a dream too.

man, didj sessions in Hawaii...arrg, what a life.

Well, there you go. I've learned how to circular breathe.

Ha me to! Its a pretty cool breathing technique, learning this one is like a meditation in itself, very hard to master.. but ok I don't know if there is a point in circular breathing if i don't play the didjeridoo.

Originally Posted by ChaybaChayba

Ha me to! Its a pretty cool breathing technique, learning this one is like a meditation in itself, very hard to master.. but ok I don't know if there is a point in circular breathing if i don't play the didjeridoo.

That's the strangest thing! It isn't hard for me at all. Damn, I'm a natural. Perhaps I should buy me a didjeridoo...

well, do you play the clarinet?

http://www.laoutback.com/

Originally Posted by ChaybaChayba

Ha me to! Its a pretty cool breathing technique, learning this one is like a meditation in itself, very hard to master.. but ok I don't know if there is a point in circular breathing if i don't play the didjeridoo.

Nah, I only play my whistle :p

Originally Posted by HonerableMoUsE

I would like to think they were scouts. But, for the few times it has happened to me, it has never felt dangerous or threatening. It can best be described as a feeling of nostalgia. and the detail of the objects becomes exquisite, almost to the point that they don't belong...but I can't tell for sure, I wasn't lucid either, it was just one of those super-vivid dreams that stick in your memory as if it actually happened.

Once, there was a piece of paper with some abstract drawing on it that pulled me in....it issued forth streams of bright colored light...it reminded me of that Mac screen-saver...haha.

The same stuff I've once seen coming out of the sky in a dream too.

man, didj sessions in Hawaii...arrg, what a life.

The paper pulled you in?

Crazy. I asked to see a scout in my dreams on the moon. A cute little silver cube appeared and led me to myself in the dream world in a village on the moon. The dream's in my DJ. That was a cool dream.

Should I create a didjeridoo thread in the off-topic forum?

Hi LuAnn,

Just wanted to comment on your great question. I definitely think that there is a spiritual dimension to what we're doing when we're lucid dreaming. There's another word for it - called Soul Travel. Everyone who dreams (even the non-lucid kind) is out of their body and moving into other dimensions as Soul. As Soul, each of us is free and eternal and unlimited. A dream is simply a remembered experience in the other worlds. As a spiritual being - as Soul - I can move anywhere in any of these higher worlds - that is, those worlds that are of a higher vibration than the physical world. I've been able to glimpse past lives, for example, in the dream state and learn some of the keys to things that challenge me today. As Soul, I can travel along the time track - in a dream. Lucid dreaming is becoming awake in one of these other worlds - and these worlds are very real. To be able to come and go at will into these dimensions is a great blessing, but I think it depends on what we intend to experience there. There are spiritual masters and Golden Wisdom Temples where you can study during these dream travels. Lucid and other kinds of dreams are all ways of knowing oneself as a spiritual being. If you're interested in finding more about dreams and your spiritual life, you can visit www.eckankar.org. There's a great book available titled The Art of Spiritual Dreaming that can be purchased at book stores, or ordered from that Web site.

Originally Posted by barbarab

Hi LuAnn,

Just wanted to comment on your great question. I definitely think that there is a spiritual dimension to what we're doing when we're lucid dreaming. There's another word for it - called Soul Travel. Everyone who dreams (even the non-lucid kind) is out of their body and moving into other dimensions as Soul. As Soul, each of us is free and eternal and unlimited. A dream is simply a remembered experience in the other worlds. As a spiritual being - as Soul - I can move anywhere in any of these higher worlds - that is, those worlds that are of a higher vibration than the physical world. I've been able to glimpse past lives, for example, in the dream state and learn some of the keys to things that challenge me today. As Soul, I can travel along the time track - in a dream. Lucid dreaming is becoming awake in one of these other worlds - and these worlds are very real. To be able to come and go at will into these dimensions is a great blessing, but I think it depends on what we intend to experience there. There are spiritual masters and Golden Wisdom Temples where you can study during these dream travels. Lucid and other kinds of dreams are all ways of knowing oneself as a spiritual being. If you're interested in finding more about dreams and your spiritual life, you can visit www.eckankar.org. There's a great book available titled The Art of Spiritual Dreaming that can be purchased at book stores, or ordered from that Web site.

I agreed with everything you said, but I am not sure what you mean by Golden Wisdom Temples, but now I want to visit in dreams a temple of Knowledge about dreams, and read ancient scrolls in dreams.

How about reading about the true history of the planet in dreams?

I checked out that website. I agree with everything that religion teaches, actually, but I would not join because I don't feel I would learn anything new. I like how they put in laymen's terms how to soul travel. I learned some of these concepts already from studying other religions such as Taoism, Buddhism, Hinduism, and even Christianity. Many religions emphasize the importance of dreams. I think it's interesting that Eckanar gets specific on things. I am going to try some of the exercises, such as the one with the blue curtain tomorrow night.

I may try to contact the founder of this religion in a dream. I want to see what he would do. He has a strange way of talking which is so slow, it's almost hypnotic which disturbs me. Maybe he realizes some of these concepts are so foreign to Westerners, that he has to speak slowly. I share lucid dreams, and I soul travel, but I can't tell people that right away. It's too much for people to wrap their brains around at first. I have to say, "Have you heard of lucid dreaming?" to lead into it.

Thanks for sharing.

Originally Posted by WakingNomad

I sincerely apologize if I sounded offensive, saxonharp. I would love to play didjeridoo with you if you ever come to Hawai'i. I am going to start a monthly didj circle going here on Oahu soon. Sorry!

Ho'oponopono... S'all good bra.

I'm more inclined personally to dismiss the idea of sprituality and pseudoscientific claims in areas like this. Such a thing is a prime example of the "God of the gaps." Dreams are not well understood at all. But that doesn't mean that spirituality is the explanation for them.

Our best understanding of the topic is that dreams are merely vivid hallucinations directed by the subconscious. What exactly drives lucid dreaming is unknown; all we really know is that we can do it. An effective study of what drives lucid dreaming would be an analysis of fMRI scans of those in normal dreams versus those in lucid dreams. No such study has been done, possibly because of lack of widespread acceptance of lucid dreaming, the recent nature of the field of study, and the relatively recent advent of said fMRI machines and the accompanying expense that nobody's willing to pay for.

But in time, the field will grow, the machinery will get cheaper, and the "gaps" of knowledge will be filled in. When this happens, relatively few people will still cling to the notion of spirituality in terms of dreaming in the face of logical scientific arguments.

Originally Posted by WakingNomad

Should I create a didjeridoo thread in the off-topic forum?

Yes, do that....I would like to see how many dream view lurkers are also didj players...not many I'm guessing

Originally Posted by mini0991

I'm more inclined personally to dismiss the idea of sprituality and pseudoscientific claims in areas like this. Such a thing is a prime example of the "God of the gaps." Dreams are not well understood at all. But that doesn't mean that spirituality is the explanation for them.

Our best understanding of the topic is that dreams are merely vivid hallucinations directed by the subconscious. What exactly drives lucid dreaming is unknown; all we really know is that we can do it. An effective study of what drives lucid dreaming would be an analysis of fMRI scans of those in normal dreams versus those in lucid dreams. No such study has been done, possibly because of lack of widespread acceptance of lucid dreaming, the recent nature of the field of study, and the relatively recent advent of said fMRI machines and the accompanying expense that nobody's willing to pay for.

But in time, the field will grow, the machinery will get cheaper, and the "gaps" of knowledge will be filled in. When this happens, relatively few people will still cling to the notion of spirituality in terms of dreaming in the face of logical scientific arguments.

I believe that everything that we view as spiritual will one day be explained by science. But, until then, I am not going to waste time waiting for science to prove something until I believe in it.

I used to believe that dreaming was all in my mind, up until about a month ago, when I started having shared lucid dreams. Then, I realized that it had to be in at least two minds, which led me to believe that it's possible for dreams to be in more than two minds.

Originally Posted by Kordan

Thanks I think I'll try it with a glass of water (not really a soda person).

Mount Olomana, the mountain in your sig.

Originally Posted by WakingNomad

I used to believe that dreaming was all in my mind, up until about a month ago, when I started having shared lucid dreams. Then, I realized that it had to be in at least two minds, which led me to believe that it's possible for dreams to be in more than two minds.

Sounds interesting. Can you give a link to where you detailed your experience?

Originally Posted by mini0991

I'm more inclined personally to dismiss the idea of sprituality and pseudoscientific claims in areas like this. Such a thing is a prime example of the "God of the gaps." Dreams are not well understood at all. But that doesn't mean that spirituality is the explanation for them.

Our best understanding of the topic is that dreams are merely vivid hallucinations directed by the subconscious. What exactly drives lucid dreaming is unknown; all we really know is that we can do it. An effective study of what drives lucid dreaming would be an analysis of fMRI scans of those in normal dreams versus those in lucid dreams. No such study has been done, possibly because of lack of widespread acceptance of lucid dreaming, the recent nature of the field of study, and the relatively recent advent of said fMRI machines and the accompanying expense that nobody's willing to pay for.

But in time, the field will grow, the machinery will get cheaper, and the "gaps" of knowledge will be filled in. When this happens, relatively few people will still cling to the notion of spirituality in terms of dreaming in the face of logical scientific arguments.

That is certainly one way to look at things. If I may, I'd like to submit that your view and those whose you call "spiritual" are not mutally exclusive. "Scientifically" understanding how something works is not the same as understanding why it works. The answers to both of those questions can describe exactly the same experience without impinging on one another.

At least, that's what Sir Isaac Newton professed.

I like Newt. I'll go with him on this.

Originally Posted by saxonharp

That is certainly one way to look at things. If I may, I'd like to submit that your view and those whose you call "spiritual" are not mutally exclusive. "Scientifically" understanding how something works is not the same as understanding why it works. The answers to both of those questions can describe exactly the same experience without impinging on one another.

At least, that's what Sir Isaac Newton professed.

I like Newt. I'll go with him on this.

Most of what's typically described as "spiritual" is derived from fictitious ancient texts originally posited as truth but later found to fail even basic tests of logic.

Now, given the state of current knowledge, one can either assume that what's unexplainable is simply unexplainable, or what's unexplainable is explainable by faith in a particular belief. It's more accurate to say both schools of thought are neither right nor wrong, it's merely what one chooses based on their personal faith. I personally have none. Others differ. It's not wrong to have faith, but it's wrong to assume faith is *the* absolute answer to something.