Thread: Your View Om Communism

Originally Posted by Hominus

by the way, universal, a member of the staff told me that people are complaining about how i argue. Am i unfair? Do you think what i do and what i post warrant complaints? I dont feel so. I just want to know if people are complaining about you too.
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I do admit it is weird they complained about you, universal seems much more -as said in poker- on 'tilt'.

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Originally Posted by Hominus

.....................word
keep in mind, all you america haters, that the US is THE LEADING country in humanitarian affairs. We send aid to countries Europe doesnt give a damn about.[/b]

Keep in mind, all you america lovers, that the US is THE LEADING country in bombing other countries. We send bombers to countries Europe doesn't even see as a danger to the world. (for they arn't.)

First of all, learn to quote.

The quoting mechanism was screwing up for you similarly two days ago. You find some weak stuff to be arrogant about. Tell me more about your cookies.

[/quote] Only using the lesser parts of my argumentation clearly shows that you are using immoral and pathetic forms or debate. By the way it was you that had something to say about my country first, even though we weren't discussing it. Allso, it's clear that the dutch education system is way way better then the american one. You seem to be a nice example. [/quote]

Does the Dutch Education system teach you to leap to bizarre conclusions? It is all you do here, in the process or squirming with hateful envy. And tell me what all you know about my law degree and the top ranked schools from which I gradutated. (Suggestion: Ignorant insults result in such comments. You can stop learning the truth whenever you are ready.)

[/quote] Sorry about that, it was a bit harsh. At least I didn't feel like I lied.
First of all. Build some democracy in your own countries. I am quite sure that all experts will say that my country, as are most all europan countries are a better example of democracy then your country is. [/quote]

Jealous Europeans don't qualify as experts, as does nobody with an hate-filled inferiority complex.

[/quote] And oh, getting your troops bombed daily by two groups of people now killing themselves and allso their own governments policemen... that is democracy? I though it was called anarchy.

Lol, democracy, hilarious. You americans allready just about left afganistan, and left behind anarchy that will just result in some extremist government for sure, but only after years of civil war between parties. Nicely done, America.
Am I actually coming to a country across the ocean to invade them, under the motto of 'spreading democracy', but then leaving becouse you can't win, leaving the country in anarchy? Am I doing that? What seems more silly? That, or debating about a sick state that has killed so many... [/quote]

A common fallacy you rationalize there. Let me correct you. A transition phase is not the measure of the rest of history. The civilians of which you speak can vote now, and they do it in greater percentages than Americans. We are in the very early stages of liberating the Middle East. Sorry to break the good news to you.


[/quote] Well good luck in politics. Unless your dad is in some rich higher circles, with I doubt he is, your ideal america will never be true. While I actually could go into politics in the netherlands, with enough dedication hell, I could maybe even become prime-minster. At least I have so much more power over my country then you have. But I don't even have the need to change that much. As long as I have my cheap weed and my rights : ) [/quote]

You just called your country pathetic, although you didn't mean to. And for your information, to counter yet another false assumption, my father is a millionaire. However, I don't give a damn about running for office. To be successful, I would have to be as full of shit as you are. But don't let that encourage you. You would have to be much smarter.

[/quote] Like my right to burn both dutch and american flags. But lets start with an american one, just for fun : )
yeah. I wished I cared for the people in afganistan as much as the americans do. Man.. what an example. [/quote]

You would have to start with giving a damn about at least one person other than yourself. Good luck.

[/quote] How much do you care about the people in guantanamo bay? I do care about them. And I care about poor american brainwashed nitwits getting totally traumatised by the war.
Yet I enjoy more freedoms then you do. You can't deny that. : ) What freedoms do you have I havn't? [/quote]

The economic freedom to not be a piss ant who hates the successful. I have the freedom to be riiiiiiiiiiiiich here. I can't legally screw prostitutes and smoke marijuana and take mushrooms, but getting away with such stuff is easy as cake here. Besides, I quit smoking marijuana and have plenty of hot non-prostitute women in my country that are even hotter than your prostitutes. I can order the ingredients for ayahuasca legally, and salvia divinorum is legal here. I also live in the mushroom capital of the universe. All you have to do here is know a cattle farmer and get permission to walk on his farm. So try another excuse for asserting superiority.


[/quote] You should love to better your country. Yet you seem unwilling, but you especially seem powerless.
yeah I couldn't hear you becouse of the legalness of magic mushrooms. Allso, I thought is was even legal to carry around little doses of hard-drugs here. [/quote]

But you still have the dangers of an underground market. That is my biggest problem with drug prohibition. I don't care about shooting heroin and snorting cocaine for myself. And improve your reading comprehension so you can read what I have said about bettering my country, like in this very paragraph.

[/quote] Allso, in abortion, gay-marridge, equal rights and such, we are way ahead of your country, let alone the state you live in.
Ever been to the netherlands? Man the last time I saw a windmill was a loooong time ago.
I have the right to piss about your country. Soon, you will not even have that right. You will not be able to burn your own flag, while I will be. Ironic. [/quote]

You do have some areas of social freedoms that we don't have, but those issues are less important than good economics and defense, as illustrated by your wormy jealousy. I am not going to be jealous of you because two men can get married in your country. Sorry.

[/quote] You seem like a sad person, universal. To bad you don't actually go into the army and see the democracy america is spreading though the world, with bombs. [/quote]

But I live in the country that you are so envious of, so I don't believe you. What's it like to be such a worm?

[/quote] Just for you, I will allso post some pics tomorrow of this small american flag I still have lying around from some trip to america a few years ago, getting burned. Just to demonstrate how burning a flag does not harm anyone, but dropping those flags, attached to bombs, does.
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I am sure you will make your father very proud.

Originally Posted by Hominus

.....................word
keep in mind, all you america haters, that the US is THE LEADING country in humanitarian affairs. We send aid to countries Europe doesnt give a damn about.

by the way, universal, a member of the staff told me that people are complaining about how i argue. Am i unfair? Do you think what i do and what i post warrant complaints? I dont feel so. I just want to know if people are complaining about you too.

I have not gotten a complaint, but I should probably chill with the Neruo bashing. Where I see hostility, I start reacting as though I am on the religion forum. It has slipped my mind a few times that we are not supposed to be rude here. But I don't initiate rudeness. When people call my country a terrorist state, they are initiating the hostility. If that is accepted, the I assume that my responses will be accepted.

I have made a lot of comments about American economic and military superiority, but that is obviously to counter the arguments of the people who are bashing America, and in the cases of a few rotten individuals, to press their buttons. It is not stuff I think too much about in other situations. Some of your posts have seemed to have the same purpose, and that is probably what they are complaining about. But I don't think you have been the initiator of the conflicts in this forum.

word X5

Ok... I read like the first three pages and just decided to skip the rest. First, I've been out for a time, and well, Neruo, not to take it against you, you always post on the same basic base of little knowledge you have about big issues and make defending stands against thing you obviously don't know or understand, and last time I saw you on a topic discussin comunism(that I remember), you weren't in favor of it! :s. Now as for the other two(sorry forgat your nicks) who keep defending capitalism and teaming up on nonsense, should actually read a couple of books and understand a bit comunism, and how it is actually supposed to function, and capitalism, wich you also do seem not to understand or even know how it works, and less talk about economy do to how you guys actually think it works.

I don't mean to be offensive, but I once got tired of discussing this tipe of things with people here who seem to blur out to much opinions without knowing anything about what their talking, and making dicussions useless. Anyone else who doesn't know much who you would really like to discuss this kinds of things I'd recomend you studied up a bit and understand the seriousness of this issues before bringing them up, or be more neutral on opinions and learn from people who give more insightfull or acknowledgeable facts.

Last time we talked, I was against cuba, what I still am. I really doubt fidel wants the best for your country.

And really, if anyones vision is likely to be clogged on this topic it is you, becouse you actually grew up in a (supposably) communist country. I am sure there is nationalism there allmost as much as there is in america.

Originally Posted by Sortilegio

Ok... I read like the first three pages and just decided to skip the rest. First, I've been out for a time, and well, Neruo, not to take it against you, you always post on the same basic base of little knowledge you have about big issues and make defending stands against thing you obviously don't know or understand, and last time I saw you on a topic discussin comunism(that I remember), you weren't in favor of it! :s. Now as for the other two(sorry forgat your nicks) who keep defending capitalism and teaming up on nonsense, should actually read a couple of books and understand a bit comunism, and how it is actually supposed to function, and capitalism, wich you also do seem not to understand or even know how it works, and less talk about economy do to how you guys actually think it works.

I don't mean to be offensive, but I once got tired of discussing this tipe of things with people here who seem to blur out to much opinions without knowing anything about what their talking, and making dicussions useless. Anyone else who doesn't know much who you would really like to discuss this kinds of things I'd recomend you studied up a bit and understand the seriousness of this issues before bringing them up, or be more neutral on opinions and learn from people who give more insightfull or acknowledgeable facts.
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Thank you for adding absolutely nothing. Since you are the one guy here who understands communism and the only one who understands capitalism, why didn't you explain them and give your opinions? If you think I don't understand capitalism, you are just being really ignorant. Let's see if you can analyze it better, or even at all. The same goes for communism. I want to add that it is hilarious to see somebody insult my level of knowledge while using the worst grammar and spelling I have ever seen on this web site. Perhaps you should learn how to speak English before you try insult what people say when they are speaking it. You might have interpreted my words as saying that moon pies are rough on squirrels. It looks like you might as well have.

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/communism

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/capitalism

Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Originally Posted by Bonsay

I agree, comunism is the best. :bravo: Though it really can't work. People are and always will be greedy.
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Comminism works within the US in small groups in the midwest.Theyre called "communes" basiclly a bunch of hippies that farm and share everyhting they have.

http://60sfurther.com/Communes.htm

I don't doubt that it would work, with the right people ofcourse.

Originally Posted by TheNocturnalGent

Comminism works within the US in small groups in the midwest.Theyre called "communes" basiclly a bunch of hippies that farm and share everyhting they have.

http://60sfurther.com/Communes.htm
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It works when everybody wants it to work. But that is not something that could ever happen in large populations. Watch what happens when you put large numbers of welfare recipients and heroin addicts on those communes. The hippies there will buy guns and start yelling, "If you don't work, you don't eat!" and, "Who the Hell pawned our CD collection?!!!!!"

Originally Posted by Universal

It works when everybody wants it to work. But that is not something that could ever happen in large populations. Watch what happens when you put large numbers of welfare recipients and heroin addicts on those communes. The hippies there will buy guns and start yelling, "If you don't work, you don't eat!" and, "Who the Hell pawned our CD collection?!!!!!"
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haha, i dont disagree. I dont think communism can work on a large scale unless absoluley everyone involved was in agreement. A utopian government is no government. The best way to this is through Communism but for it to work on any scale any higher powers or people would have to step down and join the common man

Originally Posted by Universal

It works when everybody wants it to work. But that is not something that could ever happen in large populations.
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Man, finally. That was all I wanted to hear from you about communism

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Besides that, once (or if) we solved all the hunger and poverty and war in the world, would an utopia-like-world have communism (theoretical communism, there would be no need for political parties ect.) as form of society? Or like just extreme socialism, what would kind of be the same. Not like anyone really has to work then, becouse of robots and such..

Basicly, by the time communism could work, it is allso obsolete.

I was thinking the other day America should have a communist revolution. The proletariat are being fucked by the bourgeoisie as much as ever. and the prols are already armed. im sure they could get funding from hugo chavez, fidel, iran, north korea too. karl should have wrote his plans and ideas in a slightly easier way for the "worker" to understand...maybe this could have happened by now...america is already industrialized with unfair wealth distribution. why don't the working poor rise up?

so am i batshit crazy? maybe? or viva la revolution...why not..?

I find the Bush regime in the US much more scary than communism ever was, and I grew up during the 'Cold War'!

The american pubic is much too ill equipt to ever star a revolution. The governemnt controlls the media. Even if a revolution did start it would be immediatelystamped as terrorism. The chance of the idea of a revolution remaining completely in the dark of the american governement is slim to none.

Originally Posted by ;318926

I was thinking the other day America should have a communist revolution. The proletariat are being fucked by the bourgeoisie as much as ever. and the prols are already armed. im sure they could get funding from hugo chavez, fidel, iran, north korea too. karl should have wrote his plans and ideas in a slightly easier way for the "worker" to understand...maybe this could have happened by now...america is already industrialized with unfair wealth distribution. why don't the working poor rise up?

so am i batshit crazy? maybe? or viva la revolution...why not..?
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Without the rich, the poor would be much poorer. Who do you think creates jobs? The poor use the products the rich create and work the jobs the rich create, except when they leech off the government resources the rich create. "Rising up" against the rich is biting the hand that feeds you.

Unequal distribution of wealth is just as natural as unequal distribution of grades and unequal distribution of intelligence. Trying to artificially create equal distribution of wealth screws everything up by taking away incentive, which is the big generator that makes things happen. Without incentive, things get watered down for everybody. If the poor rise up against the rich over unequal distribution of wealth, it will be a result of unequal distribution of intelligence. It will be suicide.

There are two kinds of people in the world. There are those who feel better about themselves by making their own situations better. Then there are those who feel better about themselves by hatefully downplaying those who have made their own situations better. The latter are a pathetic and despiccable bunch. I wish they would start trying to improve themselves instead of just copping out by dogging and trying to screw things up for those who did. The success haters are the ones who would "rise up" against the rich. I quote "rise up" because I think the literal interpretation is a good thing. I wish they would actually rise up. But what they wish to do is not truly rise up. They want to make the rich "lower down". They obsess their lives over it instead of getting fire up about making themselves better. That is what is so terrible and pathetic.

I am not saying that all poor people are like that, and I am not saying that everybody who thinks there is injustice regarding special priviliges for the rich is like that. I just think that the type of person who shows up with a militia at the White House because he is mad about not having enough money needs to put the gun down and start doing his best to climb a corporate ladder instead. It will make him much happier in the long run.

Why were you discussing communism and how everybody gets paid equally at the same time?
Communism is an ideal system without money.
What you were discussing is called socialism, which is supposed to eventually lead society to communism. But even then you weren't discussing it correctly, because in socialism not everybody gets paid equally, too! Jobs are different, and fees are still different. They just aren’t as much different as in capitalism. For example, if in capitalism the gap between the rich and the poor earnings can easily be 1 to 1000, in socialism it would be controlled to be 1 to 20 or something alike. As a result, all the money that the rich normally take away from the society gets sorted more or less equally instead.
There’s another big difference. In socialism the people who do hard jobs get paid decently for their hard work, and those who sit on their chair in the office get paid less, because their jobs aren’t as hard.
Mind you, socialism is not social-democracy: social-democracy is capitalism that tries to be kinder to poor and jobless people by giving them free money. And socialism is an entirely different system.

Anybody who favors communism has no ambition. Its not about "teating everybody fairly". Its about having somebody else control your life. Those who cant succeed want communism. Those who dont have the ability to take care of themselves want communism. They want everything structured.

Communism will never work because a communist nation can never advance. Look at America. The a large portion of important inventions the modern world has seen came from Americans. In communism, there is no incentive. There is no reason to come up with the next cool thing. The government will just get all the money and dole it out evenly to people who dont deserve it. Its counter-progressive.

That is all assuming that it is a TRUE communist nation, as opposed to the government just killing you and stealing the invention.

Originally Posted by Intended

Why were you discussing communism and how everybody gets paid equally at the same time?
Communism is an ideal system without money.
What you were discussing is called socialism, which is supposed to eventually lead society to communism. But even then you weren't discussing it correctly, because in socialism not everybody gets paid equally, too!

That might be a record dormancy thread resurrection. I'll have to check. Did you hunt this one down on page 50 or something? Wow.

Communism is not socialism, but it still involves the same basic principle-- prevention of social heirarchy, at least to a major extent. Although communism involves the government's ownership of everything and the people's ownership of nothing, there is equal distribution of wealth because 0 = 0. It is about prevention of success, with the supposed aim of the prevention of failure. But for the reasons I stated, it guarantees failure. It itself is a failure. There must be unequal distribution of wealth, and it must exist very close to its natural state. Job values are not equal. That is a fact of nature. Major tampering with that law of nature through equal distribution of wealth, or the destruction of the unequal distribution of wealth (since you prefer to have it put that way), results in major destruction.

Look at America. The a large portion of important inventions the modern world has seen came from Americans.

Please stop this patriotic nonsense. It proves nothing.
Let’s look at Tibet. Do you know why in Tibet they don’t make inventions? Because their land is bad for growing things, their air is heavy (you can’t work for a long time). They can’t even have capitalism or socialism, because there’s nothing to distribute, equally or unequally. Tibetans often have a little to eat and seek refuge in spiritual practices. Foreigners don’t normally put a lot of money in Tibet, because it doesn’t pay off.
Think of it. It’s the circumstances that make Tibetans live like that. Such circumstances exist for every country, making one have an easy and quick way to success, another have a hard and slow way to success, and yet another to have no way to success.

In communism, there is no incentive. There is no reason to come up with the next cool thing.

Sure, if you work for money that’s true for you, but if you can’t imagine working for pleasure that’s really sad. People who actually invent simply love their jobs, they’re fanatics. That means you’ll never invent anything important, so you might want to take it into account and change your attitude.

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There must be unequal distribution of wealth, and it must exist very close to its natural state.

Indeed, but it is unnatural for it to be as unequal as 1 to 1000000.
Look at animals if you want natural: you’ll never see 100 foxes catching 100 hares, and then have a single fox eat everything and have all others die of hunger. While in capitalism such a possibility is artificially made true.
And please don’t repeat the old lies about how all the poor can make their situation better if they try hard enough: see, if they could all do it, capitalism would die at once! The biggest flaw of capitalism is that you can’t afford a 100% of people suscessful, because for capitalism to work the unsuccessful are needed.

Job values are not equal

Indeed, hard work and sitting on a chair aren’t equal. But for some reason in capitalistic societies hard work costs less than mere sitting on a chair and banging your hands on the keyboard. See, the majority of people who sit on their chairs are parasites.

It is about prevention of success

Only as long as you view success as being the one who’s 1000000 richer than 99% of others. It’s called greed, and if it’s greed that drives you, it makes no sense to talk to you.

That might be a record dormancy thread resurrection.

I didn’t know it was that old. Found it by reading one person’s posts through his profile.

Im a proud finn, im gonna be killing commies in the future

Im a proud finn, im gonna be killing commies in the future

Sorry, commies don't want to occupy a waste land.

Think of it. It’s the circumstances that make Tibetans live like that. Such circumstances exist for every country, making one have an easy and quick way to success, another have a hard and slow way to success, and yet another to have no way to success.

I agree, another thing people who think communism has destroyed Tibet are stupid. Look at Tibet before communism and it didn't even have a decent supply off water, plus they were slaves to the dalai lama(look it up also CIA coup). Atleast communism is actually making the Tibetan peoples lives better, unlike capatalism. American would not have been so successful if they didn't have such good land that could grow cotten and other stuff.

When people stop critizing GM crops then maybe poor countries can start to become richer. When we run out off OIL then it will test how good america is I think after the Iraq war america can't invade another country for OIL.

Please stop this patriotic nonsense. It proves nothing.

I also agree, the history of america is just killing red indians and then lots of black people become slaves, nothing to be proud off.

Look at America. The a large portion of important inventions the modern world has seen came from Americans.

The modern airplane and the light bulb, wow.

Major tampering with that law of nature through equal distribution of wealth, or the destruction of the unequal distribution of wealth (since you prefer to have it put that way), results in major destruction.

The wall street crash

Originally Posted by wendylove

Sorry, commies don't want to occupy a waste land.

they tried three times.

they tried three times.

The cold war has changed everything, now commies don't want to occupy a waste land.