Thread: Al-Qaeda doesn't actually exist, it's just fear-mongering on the part of the American goverment

Originally Posted by SolSkye

Any rational person would know they are refering to conventional weapons since nuclear weapons haven't been used in any armed conflicts since they were first implemented. You are obviously searching for some lame excuses to immediately write the documentary off as some bad journalism without giving it a chance. When I said had you actually made the time to watch it, I meant the entire documentary not the 8minute clip which only brings up one of the many good points in there. However, I knew you wouldn't make the time to actually watch anything but the 8minute one since you love to choose to remain uninformed.

But, hey man...by all means...that's your prerogative. Do what you like. However, I'm not going to sit here and try and have a rational debate with someone who doesn't even aquire the knowledge to debate.

I watched what you posted, but I didn't watch the links within a link that add up to about four hours worth of stuff. Summarize that Dr. Chivago length arugment, and I will analyze it. And how many times do I have to keep making the same points and challenging you to counter them before you finally do it? I keep blasting holes in your bizarrre hypotheses, and all you do back is act condescending and tell me I am uninformed. I have countered your points, so come back with something, if you have anything. I don't think you do.

How does posting a link to memo written in Jan 2001 refering to al Qaeda blast holes in anything? They clearly talk about the Jan 2001 meeting in which they came up with the term al Qaeda in the clip, what's your point? Even if the name was rolling around before that time, that doesn't prove anything. As I said before, the name al Qaeda was originally the computer file of the thousands of mujahideen who were recruited and trained with help from the CIA to defeat the Russians. Definitely not the people we so quickly like to associate with the word today. Bin Laden didn't even know about the term before 9-11 because his small group lacked any real organization enough to be called anything.

Rather than continue using flawed logic to debate wording on what kind of weapons were used to blow holes in the mountains of Tora Bora where the supposed al Qaeda network of bases that didn't exist were, why not show me evidence of the advanced network of bases Rumsfeld pointed out ACTUALLY existing? Better yet, How about showing me some evidence of any WMD's in the possession of either known 'al Qaeda' terrorists or Saddam Hussein? That's right...yet again you can't...Because it's all clearly speculative BS that NEVER panned out since it's...*gasp*...NOT REAL.

My point has been there is no real threat from any organization called al Qaeda, because it's not really there. It's just some scare tactics used to make a few people look like they have a lot more organization, and are a lot more dangerous than they actually are...

All the supposed sleeper cells that president Bush twarted were all cleared of charges and quietly brushed under the carpet but those arrests were viewed of as great victories in the war on terror that you probably thought of as real, didn't you? Tsk Tsk..Silly sheeple... Trix are for kids...

ABC News: Secret FBI Report Questions Al Qaeda Capabilities
No 'True' Al Qaeda Sleeper Agents Have Been Found in U.S.

A secret FBI report issued this month and later leaked to the press states, “Al-Qaeda leadership’s intention to attack the United States is not in question. However, their capability to do so is unclear, particularly in regard to ‘spectacular’ operations. We believe al-Qaeda’s capability to launch attacks within the United States is dependent on its ability to infiltrate and maintain operatives in the United States. To date, we have not identified any true ‘sleeper’ agents in the US.… Limited reporting since March indicates al-Qaeda has sought to recruit and train individuals to conduct attacks in the United States, but is inconclusive as to whether they have succeeded in placing operatives in this country. US Government efforts to date also have not revealed evidence of concealed cells or networks acting in the homeland as sleepers” ABC News notes that this seemingly contradicts the sleeper cell depiction seven men arrested in Lackawanna, New York, in 2002. It also differs from warnings by FBI Director Robert Mueller and other US officials, who have warned that sleeper cells are probably in place. [ABC News, 3/9/2005] In 2002, it was also reported that no sleeper cells can be found in the US (see March 10, 2002).

The video talks about how a trial (not the meeting or the memo) BEGAN in January of 2001 and how the U.S. government needed a group to associate with Bin Laden to make it easier to prosecute him. Then it talks about how Bin Laden never used the term "Al Qaeda" until after 9/11. I took that to mean that they were suggesting that as the birth of the term, or close to it. If Bin Laden hadn't used the term yet, then the term couldn't have been around for too long, yet it had been. Bin Laden might not have used the term on video before then, but of course he had been using the term before then if the U.S. government was associating him with it.

Is that all you're going to talk about? I have made so many repeated points. Do I need to post them again? Where are the petitions I keep asking for? When are you going to tell me how your sources have more credibility than the big cut-throat corporate media? What about the other points I have made? Do you have counters for them?

Originally Posted by born_2_kill

seriously everybody in east knows that bin laden never existed

By the way, that is the funniest thing I have read in this thread. Who is the actor playing Bin Laden? Is that Robert De Niro covered in make-up and towels?

Yea, Yea, Yea. You were still searching for stupid excuses and you know it. Why must you continue to suck on the mass media teet as if it's milk is so pure and true?

Look around and taste all the different kinds of milk before you start formulating opinions...You might find the milk you came to know and love has actually been spoiled for some time now... :p

Originally Posted by SolSkye

Yea, Yea, Yea. You were still searching for stupid excuses and you know it. Why must you continue to suck on the mass media teet as if it's milk is so pure and true?

Look around and taste all the different kinds of milk before you start formulating opinions...You might find the milk you came to know and love has actually been spoiled for some time now... :p

Your empty condescenscion is worth zero. Let's see you actually do something. So AGAIN, counter the points I keep making. You remind me of somebody who shows up on a basketball court and tells everybody they suck without ever actually playing.

Let's start with these...

1. How are your sources more credible than the big corporate cut-throat media who actually stand everything to lose, due to the nature of large scale competition, for lying?

2. Where is the petition signed by more than a billion Arabs who say the government is wrong about the meaning of the term "Al Qaeda"?

3. How do tens of thousands of people work together in the world's biggest conspiracy and never have a leak big enough to stop them from fooling the world and getting national governments to cooperate because they are fooled by the illusion?

And from other discussions...

4. Where is the petition of Pentagon workers who claim no airplane crashed into the building when they were at work? Do you have any videos or sworn statements or anything of the kind?

5. Who flew the airplanes into the World Trade Center? Who was willing to die for somebody else's hoax?

6. What players in the conspiracy of the thousands it would have taken have come forward to admit 9/11 was a hoax?

I'll play devil's advocate here and act as if my unanswered laundry list of points doesn't exist and you have all the answers...

1. I never said they are more credible but if you watch it, there are some interesting points brought up. As for what they have to lose, when the politicians are the ones feeding them the lies as truth from the get-go it's not that hard to just report it as fact. When you watch surface-level mass media, that's what you understand and what you get. Those that scratch beneath the surface of those lies to see them for what they are, are then ridiculed for their discovery by dumb sheeple, like yourself, that have to admit they were wrong for buying into the whole facade in the first place.

2. Why would I need a petition of what the term means, and how on earth does that make a valid point? I simply stated that the term was created of the American government to refer to the jolly band of men fighting the russians in Afganistan, and evolved into this vast imaginary terror network with access to and possession of WMD's, 'dirty bombs', and 'sleeper cells' already existing in the U.S. from there. How about this? How about you try actually showing me some proof of this organization's legitimacy to ANY of their supposed claims and I'll give you a cookie? Waaait a minute...you can't.

3. 10's of thousands? Not sure where you got that number, but I'm sure not that many know of much. The grunts on the front lines are just dumb cannon fodder that just need to know where to point their guns for good ol' Uncle Sam in order to feel their communal 80 IQ points are going to good use. Obviously, goverment is a hierarchy. They have 'need to know' levels in government where the lies are a part of what you need or don't need to know. If you question, why, it's the same as questioning your country's motives as 'righteous' and determines your level of involvement on the, 'need to know'. I firmly believe you have to be cut of a certain breed to be at the high ends of goverment. You don't think massive cover stories are ever used in goverment even within different members of the same organization? Psshh...talk about naive. Oh, and don't forget...*whispers*... we were never in Cambodia.

Do you honestly trust all the things purported by politicians? 'I'm here for the greater good', and all that crap. Please don't tell me you are that naive.

4. 5. and 6. can be dealt with in their perspective thread... Although, I never claimed to know what happened at the trade centers, just what I personally saw being 5 minutes away from the Pentagon. Too bad you can't keep an open mind enough to even entertain the thought

Originally Posted by SolSkye

I'll play devil's advocate here and act as if my unanswered laundry list of points doesn't exist and you have all the answers...

No, you never answered the questions before now. Stop lying. And what does supposedly answering them again have to do with playing devil's advocate? Playing devil's advocate is taking a position you don't agree with to illustrate the other side of an argument. Considering your apparent level of intellectual dishonesty, I guess that is what you have been doing this whole time. Freudian slip?

Originally Posted by SolSkye

1. I never said they are more credible but if you watch it, there are some interesting points brought up. As for what they have to lose, when the politicians are the ones feeding them the lies as truth from the get-go it's not that hard to just report it as fact. When you watch surface-level mass media, that's what you understand and what you get. Those that scratch beneath the surface of those lies to see them for what they are, are then ridiculed for their discovery by dumb sheeple, like yourself, that have to admit they were wrong for buying into the whole facade in the first place.

I'm not talking about that one video. I am talking about your sources in general. And the corporate media gets its information from many things other than the mere words of politicians. They also expose the lies of politicians. You are way off. But maybe your insults make up for that, at least in the world of your own mind. You have my support.

Originally Posted by SolSkye

2. Why would I need a petition of what the term means, and how on earth does that make a valid point? I simply stated that the term was created of the American government to refer to the jolly band of men fighting the russians in Afganistan, and evolved into this vast imaginary terror network with access to and possession of WMD's, 'dirty bombs', and 'sleeper cells' already existing in the U.S. from there. How about this? How about you try actually showing me some proof of this organization's legitimacy to ANY of their supposed claims and I'll give you a cookie? Waaait a minute...you can't.

I asked for a petition because surely there would be one if the American government is flat out lying about what a term in a language means. If our government said the term "le stylo", which means "the pen" in French, really means "space bomb", don't you think French speaking people would be all over it? Of course you do.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washing...truggles_x.htm

Originally Posted by SolSkye

3. 10's of thousands? Not sure where you got that number, but I'm sure not that many know of much. The grunts on the front lines are just dumb cannon fodder that just need to know where to point their guns for good ol' Uncle Sam in order to feel their communal 80 IQ points are going to good use. Obviously, goverment is a hierarchy. They have 'need to know' levels in government where the lies are a part of what you need or don't need to know. If you question, why, it's the same as questioning your country's motives as 'righteous' and determines your level of involvement on the, 'need to know'. I firmly believe you have to be cut of a certain breed to be at the high ends of goverment. You don't think massive cover stories are ever used in goverment even within different members of the same organization? Psshh...talk about naive. Oh, and don't forget...*whispers*... we were never in Cambodia.

I am talking about, for one thing, members of the CIA, DHS, and FBI who have gathered (Oh yeah... supposedly gathered) intelligence on the workings of Al Qaeda. Then you can talk about military personnel and interrogators at Guantanamo Bay. Also, airport workers and local cops could be discussed. And the officials who analyze the Bin Laden and the gang tapes. And who takes care of the actors who play Al Qaeda members? The list continues. But not a single leak? Damn, they are bad ass!

Originally Posted by SolSkye

Do you honestly trust all the things purported by politicians? 'I'm here for the greater good', and all that crap. Please don't tell me you are that naive.

How many times do I have to tell you that I don't ever trust anything solely because a politicians says it? Your delusions about me seem unshakable. Hopefully it's only that you need to read more carefully.

Originally Posted by SolSkye

4. 5. and 6. can be dealt with in their perspective thread... Although, I never claimed to know what happened at the trade centers, just what I personally saw being 5 minutes away from the Pentagon. Too bad you can't keep an open mind enough to even entertain the thought

I entertained it and defeated it. As for the "in their perspective thread...", let's see it, finally.

By the way, the link I posted earlier about the 2001 meeting has links to memos from 2000 regarding American actions concerning Al Qaeda. Did you catch that? I am talking about official documents, not babblers with mohawks.