Whats with the Bush Administration and the Media?

[dragonoverlord]

In Iraq something like 2% of the Insurgency are Al Qaeda militants. Obviously Al Qaeda comprises a very small minority of the Insurgency. So why is the Bush Administration and the media seemingly so enthusiastic to blame al qaeda for everything that happens there and pin most of the things that go on down there on Al Qaeda when statistically speaking it is very unlikely Al Qaeda is behind a majority of the attacks on the occupying armies and sucide bombings. Whats with the distortions in the media? Its almost if the Bush Adnistration is intentionally making this fallacy about al qaeda up to justify the occupation? Furthermore i notice the Bush Administration in particular is reather keen to label the insurgency "thugs and baby killers" when the insurgency is not all united under one banner thus the actions of one insurgent cant speak for the actions of onother and plus about 76% of all the attacks in Iraq are directed at occupying soldiers.

[Half/Dreaming]

I can't wait until we have a new president to make fun of. You see this in the media because the Bush Admin has been backed into a corner from literally 30 or 40 sides. In the eyes of the rest of the media, Goerge Bush has done EVERYTHING wrong. Hes only saying what can keep him alive.

[Kushna Mufeed]

Whats with the distortions in the media? Distortions in the media? Wha? This is new...

[Alric]

The recent military surge has been able to surpress the recent increase of freedom fighter activies against the US occupation forces. This is a major blow against the Iraqis, and we have been able to seize control of vital areas to prevent the Iraqis from further violence against our troops. Hmm doesn't sound the same does it?

[dragonoverlord]

Distortions in the media? Wha? This is new... Ya but these distortions are ones that caught my eye more then the other ones...

[dragonoverlord]

The recent military surge has been able to surpress the recent increase of freedom fighter activies against the US occupation forces. This is a major blow against the Iraqis, and we have been able to seize control of vital areas to prevent the Iraqis from further violence against our troops. Hmm doesn't sound the same does it? Alric what are you trying to get at im abit confused at what your trying to get across?

[Alric]

That to the media its more important that we look good than to actually report the facts, which makes us look horrible at times.

[27]

Is it really hard to tell why? Because they want people to think that going into Iraq was the right thing to do. That we're attacking those that attacked us. I can't believe the number of people that don't realize that there was no Al Qaeda in Iraq before 2003.

[Universal Mind]

In Iraq something like 2% of the Insurgency are Al Qaeda militants. Obviously Al Qaeda comprises a very small minority of the Insurgency. So why is the Bush Administration and the media seemingly so enthusiastic to blame al qaeda for everything that happens there and pin most of the things that go on down there on Al Qaeda when statistically speaking it is very unlikely Al Qaeda is behind a majority of the attacks on the occupying armies and sucide bombings. Whats with the distortions in the media? Its almost if the Bush Adnistration is intentionally making this fallacy about al qaeda up to justify the occupation? Al Qaeda might make the news more than the others because they are better at doing the wonderful things they do for the world than the untrained nut bags who aren't so professional at sending retarded girls into public places to mindlessly kill lots and lots of people and animals, but I think most Americans are under the same impression that I am. That is the impression that most of the insurgent psychopath terrorists who despise democracy are regular Iraqi Joes who have been brainwashed by ther horrible culture that we are there to civilize and keep free, now that they are free. Their mental state is a good indication that democracy/freedom (thus prosperity and civilization) is necessary in that part of the world. Furthermore i notice the Bush Administration in particular is reather keen to label the insurgency "thugs and baby killers" when the insurgency is not all united under one banner thus the actions of one insurgent cant speak for the actions of onother and plus about 76% of all the attacks in Iraq are directed at occupying soldiers. They are LITERALLY thugs and baby killers. It does not mean they are all united. The fact that most of their attacks are against Coalition soldiers, who are people too and people who deserve much more respect than most people, does not take away the fact that the thugs and baby killers are thugs who kill babies on purpose. My opinion is that you are bitching about the wrong people. After what Al Qaeda did in Spain, don't you have anything bad to say about the terrorists who want YOU dead? I can promise you that they are not our soldiers. Most of our soldiers would risk their necks to save your life. You can take that one to the bank. Do you think any of the thugs and baby killers in the Iraqi insurgency would be willing to do that? No, they would not, but they would love to kill your sinful infidel Western ass. That is a fact. One of the soldiers you are talking about is Half/Dreaming. Did you know that? He is about to go over there to fight as a matter of fact. Can you tell me in all honesty that you have more of a problem with him than you do with Al Qaeda and other terrorists? I keep seeing you bitch about my country, and ONLY my country, and my country is on your damn side. The recent military surge has been able to surpress the recent increase of freedom fighter activies against the US occupation forces. This is a major blow against the Iraqis, and we have been able to seize control of vital areas to prevent the Iraqis from further violence against our troops. You sound like you actually want the insurgent terrorists to target innocents and kill them. Could you explain your term "freedom fighter"? It is freedom that they are against, and their actions are the very thing keeping us there. If they hadn't been mindlessly killing people all over the place, we would have had no reason or even an excuse to stay there. What are those psychopaths doing to help the cause of "freedom"? They are killing Iraqi civilians in large numbers ON PURPOSE in the name of ending democracy. What could you possibly like about that? What are they helping?

[Alric]

I just copied what they usually say and changed the words. Thats not really my opinion of how it went, I was just showing how easy is to spin the facts to make it look however you want. They are basicly iraqi rebels. The media tries to make them sound worse by calling them insurgance. Though someone could also call them freedom fighters to make them look better. All three words basicly mean the same thing but they are changed in a subtle attempt to influence your outlook. Of course what the media is currently doing isn't exactly subtle anymore. To put it simply its war propaganda.

[Universal Mind]

I just copied what they usually say and changed the words. Thats not really my opinion of how it went, I was just showing how easy is to spin the facts to make it look however you want. They are basicly iraqi rebels. The media tries to make them sound worse by calling them insurgance. Though someone could also call them freedom fighters to make them look better. All three words basicly mean the same thing but they are changed in a subtle attempt to influence your outlook. Of course what the media is currently doing isn't exactly subtle anymore. To put it simply its war propaganda. I just don't understand why anybody would ever dream of calling them "freedom fighters" in seriousness. They HATE the idea of freedom. The Western club going, strip club loving, beer drinking, VH1 and Paris Hilton celebrating, spring break world they see the U.S., Canada, Europe, and Australia (honorary Western nation) as being is what has them pissing fire. They think freedom in Iraq means Iraq is way up in line to join the sinful infidel party. Freedom is exactly what they are fighting against, not that what they are doing is effective in that direction. Can anybody else tell me how the rotten bastards we are talking about are "freedom fighters"?

[27]

I just don't understand why anybody would ever dream of calling them "freedom fighters" in seriousness. They HATE the idea of freedom. The Western club going, strip club loving, beer drinking, VH1 and Paris Hilton celebrating, spring break world they see the U.S., Canada, Europe, and Australia (honorary Western nation) as being is what has them pissing fire. They think freedom in Iraq means Iraq is way up in line to join the sinful infidel party. Freedom is exactly what they are fighting against, not that what they are doing is effective in that direction. Can anybody else tell me how the rotten bastards we are talking about are "freedom fighters"? Bullshit. I have a lot of respect for you, UM, but you are just buying into Bush propaganda. They don't attack us because they hate freedom. They attack us because we are over there. They hate us because we occupy their countries and set up military bases. Their goal is to drive us into wars that we cannot win. They are trying to bankrupt us. And when we spend trillions of dollars on this war, they get exactly what they want. The last thing the terrorists want is for us to withdraw.

[Universal Mind]

Bullshit. I have a lot of respect for you, UM, but you are just buying into Bush propaganda. They don't attack us because they hate freedom. They attack us because we are over there. They hate us because we occupy their countries and set up military bases. Their goal is to drive us into wars that we cannot win. They are trying to bankrupt us. And when we spend trillions of dollars on this war, they get exactly what they want. The last thing the terrorists want is for us to withdraw. You are buying into left wing fanatic propaganda. Some of the insurgents are Al Qaeda, right? Have you read the answer to Q2 of Bin Laden's letter to America? It details exactly what I am talking about. It is also a fact that the other asshole insurgents are brainwashed Muslims who believe that the MTV lifestyle I talked about is as infidel as it gets. The governments who make their women bury themselves under blankets to go to the quick stop should clue you in on the reality of what I am talking about. Insurgents are coming from every country in the Middle East. How is the insurgency making us not be in Iraq? It is our reason for being there. It was the reason for the surge. It is the reason John McCain is talking about being there another 100 years. The insurgency is not a countermeasure to our presence. I would love for you to explain how it possibly could be. It is a countermeasure to the stability of democracy. They are terrified of democracy. Did you ever read what Zarqawi said about democracy? He said it is evil and that it must be stopped. Read the full answer to Q2 of this... http://www.buzzle.com/editorials/11-24-2002-30919.asp Analysis: http://www.dreamviews.com/community/...ad.php?t=44733 Zarqawi quote: http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/009294.php By the way, don't you know after reading my posts in the R/S forum that I come nowhere near trusting stuff just because Bush says it? The son of a bitch said I am not a real American because I am an atheist. He is not exactly my favorite person on Earth. I just think his Middle East policies make logical sense for the long run. They are exactly what I would support even if he had never said anything about them and we had zero troops in the Middle East.

[dragonoverlord]

OK Universal mind i wrote a really long reply and when i was typing it out it said i was loged out and it got deleted so ill write a shorter more condensed version. The Insurgents in Iraq who are al qaeda comprise something like 2% yet the bush administration veeers attention to them as the main focus to give the war some semblance of legitimacy to it by making it look like its an al qaeda vs USA struggle. I dont think the Insurgency are baby killers or thugs. Thats a gross generalization on your part and is somewhat akin to saying america is the "great satan a country of lust and random orgy sex" One of the soldiers you are talking about is Half/Dreaming. Did you know that? He is about to go over there to fight as a matter of fact. Can you tell me in all honesty that you have more of a problem with him than you do with Al Qaeda and other terrorists? I keep seeing you bitch about my country, and ONLY my country, and my country is on your damn side. I wish Half/Dreaming good luck with his deployment to Iraq and i hope he comes out whole, both phychally and mentally just the way he entered Iraq. In Iraq its war and im not really taking sides or condeming attacks on american soldiers or vice versa. Its war, if i could have i would make everyones bullets miss their mark so that no one gets hurt. After what Al Qaeda did in Spain, don't you have anything bad to say about the terrorists who want YOU dead? I can promise you that they are not our soldiers. Most of our soldiers would risk their necks to save your life. You can take that one to the bank. Do you think any of the thugs and baby killers in the Iraqi insurgency would be willing to do that? No, they would not, but they would love to kill your sinful infidel Western ass. That is a fact. Your soldiers have a legendary code of conduct and i dont doubt they would help me out of a tight spot in iraq if i were in one. But its war, thats life. I have a problem with the occupation of Iraq not with the soldiers, if an insurgent plants a roadside bobm and a humvee goes over it and blows thats war and you shouldn't be blaming the iraqi insurgent who is pissed off over the occupation in his country, you should be blaming busha nd cheney the ones who got you in. Here is a video that i think sums it up for me:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FApMGh40mY

[Universal Mind]

The Insurgents in Iraq who are al qaeda comprise something like 2% yet the bush administration veeers attention to them as the main focus to give the war some semblance of legitimacy to it by making it look like its an al qaeda vs USA struggle. Al Qaeda is the most trained, organized, advanced, and destructive of all of the subgroups. They also have presence in our country and are the biggest threat to us domestically. That is why they make the news so much. I dont think the Insurgency are baby killers or thugs. Thats a gross generalization on your part and is somewhat akin to saying america is the "great satan a country of lust and random orgy sex" They target innocents even though it is what keeps us there. Why in the world do you not condemn them? I wish Half/Dreaming good luck with his deployment to Iraq and i hope he comes out whole, both phychally and mentally just the way he entered Iraq. By wishing him good luck, so you say, you are wishing that he kills insurgents. Why do you wish him luck with that? Could it be because you sort of see where we are coming from in this fucked up nightmare? Would you equally wish insurgent terrorists luck in trying to kill him? In Iraq its war and im not really taking sides or condeming attacks on american soldiers or vice versa. Its war, if i could have i would make everyones bullets miss their mark so that no one gets hurt. That would be great. Then Iraq could be a free country in peace without those insurgent thugs and baby killers screwing up their country. Imagine what kind of shape Iraq would be in by now if it weren't for those insurgent pieces of shit. Are you ready to condemn them yet? Your soldiers have a legendary code of conduct and i dont doubt they would help me out of a tight spot in iraq if i were in one. Then you doubt incorrectly. I know them. They would help you, and they would risk their lives to do it. Guess what the insurgent terrorists would do to you. I have a problem with the occupation of Iraq not with the soldiers, if an insurgent plants a roadside bobm and a humvee goes over it and blows thats war and you shouldn't be blaming the iraqi insurgent who is pissed off over the occupation in his country, you should be blaming busha nd cheney the ones who got you in. Bush and Cheney force the insurgent scum to act irrationally and kill people pointlessly? I don't get your point on that at all. If I go to the mall and shoot up a crowd because your post pissed me off, does that mean you are to blame? Of course not. The insurgent terrorists are responsible for their irrational actions that pointlessly hurt people in large numbers and stand in the way of progress in Iraq. Tell me this... What good are the insurgents doing? How does their targetting and killing of soldiers and civilians help anything? How are they being forced into it when what they do goes directly against the current you claim they support? How is their irrational killing helping anything at all? I can tell you all about what it is hurting.

[Alric]

There wasn't any Al Quada over there untill we invaded the country. If you agree there is only a small number of Al quada over there now, then the idea of being over there makes no sense at all.

[skysaw]

I just don't understand why anybody would ever dream of calling them "freedom fighters" in seriousness. They HATE the idea of freedom. The Western club going, strip club loving, beer drinking, VH1 and Paris Hilton celebrating, spring break world they see the U.S., Canada, Europe, and Australia (honorary Western nation) as being is what has them pissing fire. I wouldn't call them freedom fighters either. On the other hand, I'm sick and tired of the argument that they are "freedom haters." They are haters of the west, Christianity, and especially the US. But nobody hates freedom. If it were freedom they were attacking, how come we never hear about them attacking Norway, for example? They have much more personal freedom than we do. Or Sweden, or Iceland, or Switzerland, or the Netherlands? All of these places are much more "free" than the US in almost any way one could measure.

[Alric]

Well how would we feel if cuba starting stocking nuclear missiles? Then canada got invada by China. Then in mexico there was a military coup and their leader got replaced and suddenly they were great friends with China. Then China begins to send battleships and aircraft carriers to surround our country on both sides. Then mexico invades the country to the south of them. Then china builds huge military bases in canada. Then China comes in and kills off our military and you see tanks driving up and down he streets, everyday for years to come. So why are there insurgances? It might have to do with the high deal of stress of having stuff explode all around them, and having an occupation force in their country. There probably scared to death, and worried about what is going to happen and some of them probably snapped. They are desperate for it to stop so they lash out and do crazy stuff. Then a group comes in and says they can get rid of all the problems, and they are willing to believe it. Its there only hope.

[Half/Dreaming]

On the other hand, I'm sick and tired of the argument that they are "freedom haters." They are haters of the west, Christianity, and especially the US. But nobody hates freedom. Yes, there are people who HATE freedom. Especially Islamic extremists. They believe free human beings are more sinful, and since they have freedom they are more likely to care less about God. To them, the best way to please God is to force a certain lifestyle on everybody. Freedom threatens their lifestyle. Wether or not it is because they have no self control, I do not know.

[skysaw]

Yes, there are people who HATE freedom. Especially Islamic extremists. They believe free human beings are more sinful, and since they have freedom they are more likely to care less about God. To them, the best way to please God is to force a certain lifestyle on everybody. Freedom threatens their lifestyle. Wether or not it is because they have no self control, I do not know. Ridiculous. If that were the case, they'd be more than happy to have the US come over and oppress them, instead of fighting back. And just where are those attacks on Scandanavia again?

[27]

Skysaw speaks truth.

[dragonoverlord]

Qaeda is the most trained, organized, advanced, and destructive of all of the subgroups. They also have presence in our country and are the biggest threat to us domestically. That is why they make the news so much. Not per se. In 2003 when you guys invaded and oeverthrew Saddam. His Army was out of a job. These were people with varying degrees of military training and knowhow. Many of these layed of workers joined militias and the insurgency. Shia militiamen get somewhat extensive training in Iran where among other things they learn how to handle explosives. Both of these are examples of people more trained better then al qaeda. And no i disagree, of all the subgroups i would have to say probably the Wahabies who come in from Saudi Arabia who do more then 50% of the suicide bombings are the most dangerous. Like i said Al Qaeda is always pinned for things that happen in Iraq and they are talked about the most because the USA wants to draw a line between the war in Iraq and 9/11 to justify the war. They target innocents even though it is what keeps us there. Why in the world do you not condemn them? I condem those who target innoncents, but i hardly would call Coalition Soldiers innocents if you are lumping them into that group. What keeps America in Iraq is hardly a feeling of responsibility for the people who live there. You're reasons for entering were equally illegitimate. Bush and Cheney force the insurgent scum to act irrationally and kill people pointlessly? I don't get your point on that at all. If I go to the mall and shoot up a crowd because your post pissed me off, does that mean you are to blame? Of course not. The insurgent terrorists are responsible for their irrational actions that pointlessly hurt people in large numbers and stand in the way of progress in Iraq. Tell me this... What good are the insurgents doing? How does their targetting and killing of soldiers and civilians help anything? How are they being forced into it when what they do goes directly against the current you claim they support? How is their irrational killing helping anything at all? I can tell you all about what it is hurting. Well actually alot of the tactics the insurgents use against civilans are quite intune with some mandates of Guerilla War.... It's not irrational killing at all, if your country was invaded alot of your fellow americans would take up arms against the invaders and occupiers. they wouldn't just sit there and take the ocupation. No one has ever done that. France didnt do it, Poland didn't do it. The Afghans didn't didn't sit tight and let the soviets take their country, no they fought back and drove out the Soviets. And as i recall your country funded the Mujahedin to fight the soviet occupiers.

[Alric]

Saying they hate freedom and want to destroy it at all cost is just a way to dehumanize them. That way people don't have any problem talking about killing thousands of people, because they are lesser people. They are crazy and uncivilized, and nothing but animals so its ok to kill them in mass. The reality however, is they are humans. And humans don't kill each other because they are free. Its a ridiculous arguement to claim they want to kill us because of our freedoms. I think Universal has the right idea. They want to kill us because we are loud mouth, drunken idiots with no morals, who wont get out of their face. Thats what they believe. Threatening to nuke iran and stuff isn't exactly improving our image either.

[dragonoverlord]

So why are there insurgances? It might have to do with the high deal of stress of having stuff explode all around them, and having an occupation force in their country. There probably scared to death, and worried about what is going to happen and some of them probably snapped. They are desperate for it to stop so they lash out and do crazy stuff. Then a group comes in and says they can get rid of all the problems, and they are willing to believe it. Its there only hope. I agree with you,People dont take tolightly when there countries are invaded and occupied. ITs natural that an insurgency would rise up to the challenge. It has happend in many countries before and Iraq is no different as we can see. I think Universal has the right idea. They want to kill us because we are loud mouth, drunken idiots with no morals, who wont get out of their face. Thats what they believe. Threatening to nuke iran and stuff isn't exactly improving our image either. NO,they want to kill you because you're loud mouth,drunken idiots who invaded their country. lulz

[ninja9578]

You can watch the RPN and they'll figure out a way to spin everything in a positive light for Dubya. They'll say things like "The no child left behind act hasn't caused any more 911 attacks"