Thread: Who will you vote for? UPDATED

Hmm...

He seems to act more like Joel Osteen. Like he ust studied him, then imitated him.

Originally Posted by Seismosaur

Uh.. No?

I thought that was plain common knowledge

He's not Muslim at all.
His father was raised Muslim, but he's an atheist. His stepfather wasn't religious neither is his mother.
He's a Christian. Unless he's been setting up an alibi since at least 1988.

From WIKI.

In Chapter 6 of the book, titled "Faith," Obama writes that he "was not raised in a religious household." He describes his mother, raised by non-religious parents, as detached from religion, yet "in many ways the most spiritually awakened person that I have ever known." He describes his Kenyan father as "raised a Muslim," but a "confirmed atheist" by the time his parents met, and his Indonesian stepfather as "a man who saw religion as not particularly useful." The chapter details how Obama, in his twenties, while working with local churches as a community organizer, came to understand "the power of the African American religious tradition to spur social change":

It was because of these newfound understandings—that religious commitment did not require me to suspend critical thinking, disengage from the battle for economic and social justice, or otherwise retreat from the world that I knew and loved—that I was finally able to walk down the aisle of Trinity United Church of Christ one day and be baptized.

He joined Trinity United Church of Christ in 1988. A megachurch with 10,000 members, Trinity is the largest congregation in the United Church of Christ.

What difference should it make if he is muslim?

None.

It makes a difference when he is an extremist muslim. Which he is lol.

Originally Posted by wasup

Are you seriously going to vote for Huckabee?

As a matter of fact, I am. I may not agree with him on everything, but I feel that he is the most trustworthy. For one thing, he was the only Republican who didn't dance around the question of whether or not they believe that the Bible is the Word of God. Regardless how you answer that question, at least he didn't throw out some politically correct jargon like everyone else.

And I don't like politics. In fact, I hate politics. A bunch of people spending their lives trying to figure out what everyone wants to hear in order to put themselves in a position of authority... Wrapping what could be easily taken care of in bureaucracy and nickel-and-diming the heck out of anyone they can... Ignoring basic moral principles in favor of appeasing those who wish to rationalize wrongdoing...

Personally, I'd rather spend my time trying to make a positive difference in the lives of those around me than spend hour upon hour trying to come up with the lesser of two (or four/five) evils... or figuring out who's "good" is "better." I'll do my part politically, but I still don't like politics.

I'm voting for Hillary.....
and yes I know she is annoying, and my reasons for voting for her are biased because I am a Christian.



-patience

Originally Posted by Amethyst Star

As a matter of fact, I am. I may not agree with him on everything, but I feel that he is the most trustworthy. For one thing, he was the only Republican who didn't dance around the question of whether or not they believe that the Bible is the Word of God. Regardless how you answer that question, at least he didn't throw out some politically correct jargon like everyone else.

And I don't like politics. In fact, I hate politics. A bunch of people spending their lives trying to figure out what everyone wants to hear in order to put themselves in a position of authority... Wrapping what could be easily taken care of in bureaucracy and nickel-and-diming the heck out of anyone they can... Ignoring basic moral principles in favor of appeasing those who wish to rationalize wrongdoing...

Personally, I'd rather spend my time trying to make a positive difference in the lives of those around me than spend hour upon hour trying to come up with the lesser of two (or four/five) evils... or figuring out who's "good" is "better." I'll do my part politically, but I still don't like politics.

So you think the USA should be turned into a theorcracy where the word of the bible is king and the constitution should be adapted so it does not contradict the bible?

Cause thats what Huckabee wants to do.

Wow, whatever happened to Separation of state and Church guys?

I'm sorry, but this makes me slightly angry.

What about it? I am voting because of my religious personal opinion. Just like others are voting for THEIR personal opinions. No matter how much we fight for it there will hardly EVER be a separation between state and church, from a country that was made BASED off religion.

At least I'm being honest that my voting is biased. I'm not trying to be correct and say my vote won't be biased, because it is. By my beliefs though, the last candidate I would ever vote for is Obama, and if I had to vote for him, I simply wouldn't vote at all.

Sad but true..... religion is part of who I am....

-patience

Originally Posted by PatienceMarie

What about it? I am voting because of my religious personal opinion. Just like others are voting for THEIR personal opinions. No matter how much we fight for it there will hardly EVER be a separation between state and church, from a country that was made BASED off a religion.

At least I'm being honest that my voting is biased. I'm not trying to be correct and say my vote won't be biased, because it is. By my beliefs though, the last candidate I would ever vote for is Obama, and if I had to vote for him, I simply wouldn't vote at all.

Sad but true..... religion is part of who I am....

-patience

Sorry to burst your bubble, but regardless of what your pastor or parents say, The United States of America is a SECULAR Country. It was NOT BASED off a religion at all.
I agree, it is sad, it's very sad that religion has to dictate your life, and if you want to talk, PM me, I'm a recovering Christian of 17+ years.

Originally Posted by Xox

Wow, whatever happened to Separation of state and Church guys?

To both Xox and dragonoverlord: Don't twist my words, please.

I respect Huckabee for his genuine faith. He’s willing to state what his beliefs are and not compromise his convictions. Obama and Clinton (and possibly McCain?) profess to be Christians, and it’s not my place to judge whether they are or not as I have not met them personally. Huckabee, however, by his words and history, has shown that he remains true to what he believes even if his beliefs may be considered “unpopular.”

As far as “separation of church and state,” I believe that that means that government will stay out of telling people what to believe and how to worship. That doesn’t mean that elected officials can’t have their own moral opinions based on their religion, but rather they should rather take the time to discuss why they’re making a decision and take in the opinions of others.

A president does not have absolute power (contrary to how some foreigners view the president… SOME, not all). With exceptions spelled out in the Constitution, the President requires the support of Congress and the Judiciary in order to implement policy and pass bills. There are some things I don’t agree upon with Huckabee, but at this point in time, his view of what will make America better is closer to my views than the other candidates.

If Colbert were running, though, I would probably have to think long and hard about switching my vote, though.

EDIT: And to imply that the US is a "secular country" is to say that the US is an "atheistic country", or at least an "agnostic country." By that standard I would have to disagree. It is as religiously diverse as any other country in the world, if not more so.

Originally Posted by PatienceMarie

What about it? I am voting because of my religious personal opinion. Just like others are voting for THEIR personal opinions. No matter how much we fight for it there will hardly EVER be a separation between state and church, from a country that was made BASED off a religion.

At least I'm being honest that my voting is biased. I'm not trying to be correct and say my vote won't be biased, because it is. By my beliefs though, the last candidate I would ever vote for is Obama, and if I had to vote for him, I simply wouldn't vote at allSad but true..... religion is part of who I am....
.

-patience

I have to agree with Elis D on this one.

Your country wasnt based of christianity. You want proof? Look no farther then your constitution and im quoting here. "The treaty of Tripoli ratified unaminuously by congress and passed by the President said the following As the government of the united states of america is not, in any sense founded on the christian relegion..."

Furthermore there is evidence to suggest that your very founding fathers were not christians

On your pledge of allegiance the words "under god" wre not added until 1954 until a catholic organazation was able to have the pledge modified witht eh word. On your money the words in god we trust were added much later after the creation of your country.

Your country is not founded on chrfistianity!!!

I won't ask any more questions of you but why do you not like Obama?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w4fQA9mt-Mg

Opps excuse e moi.

And Elis D, calm your panties. My pastor or my parents? Good one.

I'm not even discussing anything else in public, but I'd be glad to discuss it through PM DL .

People get offended too easily over someone elses beliefs. Sorry for stateing MY PERSONAL OPINION.

Even though I admitted it was biased and what-not.

-patience

Originally Posted by Amethyst Star

To both Xox and dragonoverlord: Don't twist my words, please.

I was not referring to you when I said that, Ame. I was talking to Patience.

And I see where you're "coming from", but from my eyes, Huckabee wants state and church combined. Basically, enforcing religion in government.


As for what Patience said - I'm totally agreeing with Elis on this one. I can't believe people are voting off their "personal religious belief."

Read the constitution.

Okay so I'm not entitled to vote for who I want to just because it best supports MY interest??

That's like me telling you YOU can't vote because you don't believe in what I'M saying.

Seriously. Stop being a complete and total hypocrite.

At least I admit I am voting because of a biased religious belief. Holy hell. Everyone votes because of what THEY believe is right because of THEIR personal interest.

If not then voting would always be unanimous.

-patience

edit: ME read the constitution? Last time I checked everything I have said today is in protection with Amendment 1. I never knew voting because of what I believe religion wise was against the constitution. Oh and read above. I already said excuse me.

Ya i never said that you couldnt vote for who you want. by all means. Im just saying that the USA wanst founded on your relegion.

Originally Posted by dragonoverlord

Ya i never said that you couldnt vote for who you want. by all means. Im just saying that the USA wanst founded on your relegion.

No that was meant for Xox.

People are getting panties in bundles here for nothing.

I don't get it.

-patience

I would never vote for a democrat.

The "feel good" party.

Religion has a funny way of trying to run your personal life. You can't marry this person. Science is bad. The devil is around every coner blah blah blah. I would really rather have an athiest run America than a devout religious person "cough Huckabee"

Originally Posted by PatienceMarie

No that was meant for Xox.

People are getting panties in bundles here for nothing.

I don't get it.

-patience

Lol "panties in bundles."

Anyway, go ahead vote for whoever the hell you want. But, this is not a country founded on religion. I was referring to "Separation of State and Church" earlier.

Oh that's your "personal beliefs" eh? I don't have a problem with your "beliefs". I have some as well, much like you. But I see you're voting based off religious belief, okay then..


Oh I agree Nazzul.

Originally Posted by Grod

I would never vote for a democrat.

The "feel good" party.

The Flying Spaghetti Monster is going to send you to the Burning lake of macaroni for that you evil person.

First off, Huckabee is a media whore who will degrade himself and sacrifice any dignity for a vote. He does ridiculous things on TV shows, not to mention showing up on Colbert Report all the time simply to look "cool" (notice how he doesn't ever talk about the actual issues) and has a goddamn ad compaign with Chuck Norris.

Secondly, he is an idiot. "I didn't major in math. I majored in miracles!" Like, what the hell? Furthermore, he said that he believes the "ten commandments are the only laws we really need." Honestly, is this the type of nation you would like to see? Besides forcing his belief systems on America, he would be incredibly oversimplifying society. No, the "ten commandments" are not the only laws we need. To say so is, frankly, retarded.

Lastly, separation of church and state means that while yes, candidates are allowed to have morals based on religion, their actual decisions should not be based off any religious convictions. Imagine all the oppression and regression that would occurr if we elect a theocratic leader such as Huckabee. Bush looks liberal compared to Huckabee's view of stem cells and abortion. Honestly, does the Christian Bible tell you that aborting a baby of a poor rape victim (poor in the sense she will not be able to raise a child correctly) who will die or will need intense medical care if she gives birth is "ungodly?" If so, you seriously need to reevaluate your faith. Stem cells as well. If you are against stem cells, you damn well better be against masturbation, condoms, birth control, and sodomy. In all cases we are killing "potential life," no? And let's just leave alone the fact that somehow the Christian bible opposes stem cells, which can save MILLIONS of lives, as well as providing new opportunities for all.

Also, if you support Huckabee, you better damn well hate gays. Gays will no longer be able to marry at all. Government-supported homophobia and intolerance will be the policy under Huckabee.

And you are seriously misunderstanding the concept of the United States as a "secular country." Indeed, the people are not secular in nature as a whole (however I would say that this is largely changing as religion grows obsolete through the processes of education and the availability of information through mediums such as the internet), but a "secular nation" refers to its policies. Its policies would carry no inherent religious convictions. As I mentioned above, religious policies would cause huge regressions and the retardation of the societal advancement as a whole. If one observes patterns of society, it can be seen that the level of conservative theism is more or less inversely proportional to the advancement of science.

I cannot argue with your belief that certain religion-derived laws are the best choice for America. Indeed, it is your belief. I can point out the illogical nature of such beliefs (as well as the inconsistency with fundamental theistic beliefs such as tolerance (gays) and the preservation of life (stem cells), but for certain ideas it really comes down to your personal belief. For example, praying in school. We already pray to the flag essentially (which I refuse to do), but perhaps Huckabee would introduce more concrete permissions to do this. Do you believe intelligent design should be taught in classes as an alternative theory? Huckabee would most likely make it so. He doesn't believe in evolution. To have a theory completely void of any logical bearing taught along evolution, a theory (remember, theory being in the context of science) with more independent strings of evidence than gravity, is an insult to your intelligence, my intelligence, the intelligence of our nation, an insult to our progression as cognitive human beings and an insult to humanity as a whole. And if you want vote Huckabee, you better damn well support the teaching of the flying spaghetti monster being taught alongside evolution as well. To me it is not a particularly demanding concept that theories with actual scientific merit, actual evidence, be taught to students. To let intelligent design be taught as a legitimate theory would legitimize the teaching of children of math as a product of the devil, of technology as tiny gnomes doing subdivide tasks, of history as the decisions of gnomes, music the collective euphony of microscopic singing gnomes. Vote Huckabee, Vote Gnomes.

Ultimately, it comes down to your philosophy. It is selfish and intolerant to force others to obey YOUR religious convictions, as well as make them suffer the detriments that such convictions would cause on society. If you believe that you and other Christians are the only ones who should not have belief systems forced on them, and you believe that every other person of any other creed should be forced to abide by Christian ideals and Christian practices, vote Huckabee. I cannot vote. But if I could, I would vote for Obama. Why? He promises a secular government. I don't really care about a candidates religion as long as they promise their beliefs will not affect their decisions.

What are we electing here? The pope? The candidates are running for the position of the president of the United States not the leader of the Church. Therefore vote appropriately.

Originally Posted by Xox

I was not referring to you when I said that, Ame. I was talking to Patience.

And I see where you're "coming from", but from my eyes, Huckabee wants state and church combined. Basically, enforcing religion in government.


As for what Patience said - I'm totally agreeing with Elis on this one. I can't believe people are voting off their "personal religious belief."

Read the constitution.

Once again, I excused myself earlier for being wrong,

AND DARN TOOTEN I AM!!

I am voting for someone I support that has the same religious background as me!

Couldn't get any better.

Oh yeah.... did I already mention I am making a biased vote? Just incase I didn't... I'm making a biased vote.

-patience

Originally Posted by PatienceMarie

By my beliefs though, the last candidate I would ever vote for is Obama, and if I had to vote for him, I simply wouldn't vote at all.

What is it about Obama that conflicts with your beliefs? Is he the wrong denomination? To all appearances he's a much more involved Christian than Hillary. Of all the candidates, he seems to have the most simultaneously sincere and sophisticated religious life, though I'd rather a non-Christian could take the highest office in this country.

P.S.--I voted for Obama today.