Thread: Is america a free country?

I'm looking for the kind of freedom that will allow our species to thrive and not act like a bunch of idiots. The school system in this country is the number one problem in our society. It is a problem that we could fix, yet we do very little to change it. The school system in america has been declining for a long time, yet we continue to use basically the same system. We make minor changes, but it's still basically the same. There is a constant overflow of facts, to the point that people just memorize things. They never go very in depth or give an overall understanding of a concept just more and more bullshit. History is altered to give people a further sense of american pride. I'm not saying that it's impossible to get a good education, but most people don't. They shove this unvalidated patrioticism down your throat from the age of 6. Americans are so arrogant now. Why should you be proud of something you had nothing to do with. Why are you so special, just for being born here?

I'm not that worried about my own freedom. Real freedom comes from within. I worried because my own family members act like idiots. They listen to terrible music, eat terrible food, Spend hours a day watching tv. It pisses me off that people will accept living like this. And they wonder why life seems so boring and theres nothing to do. I constantly hear this complaint from my younger brothers. There is so much more to life then what the average person experiences. People are so busy doing nothing that they don't have time to think. They don't have time to look around truly see how beautiful life is. I might have gotten carried a way a bit, but I'm just trying to do something to solve the problem, rather than let people run this country into the ground. Is our economy not bad? When you see a freind whos about to do something stupid you don't just ignore it, you have to talk to them about it. You try to change their mind. I'm sorry but bush got elected twice. If thats not a sign that somethings wrong with the electoral system, then I don't know what is.

And I'm not saying we some small group should overthrow the government and free the people. That shits retarted. I'm saying we should educate people so they will quit acting like a herd of cows. I don't know very many intelligent people who act like this.

This thread is about the fact that people in america think that they are free, though they are not. They have a false sense of pride based on the fact that they think they are free, when in fact they are not.

Our freedoms are being taken away because the public gets convinced that thers a terrorist threat. What threat? The only people who should be afraid at all are people in major cities. And even then, I mean how many terrorist attacks have taken in place in this country. I'm not sure but my guess is its less than 5. So why are we letting the government tap phones and commit ridiculous searches to find terrorism. You can get the answer right from your local news. They constantly show people a negative aspect of life. Violence and war and terror and theft and drugs and disease. Why all this focus on the negative side of life? People are scared for no reason. Life is so much more beautiful than that. These things make up only avery small part of life, yet we are so focused on them now. You cannot defeat terrorism with war, yet our government is fighting a war on terror. You don't have to force freedom on people here in america. They want freedom they just do not know how to achieve it. Mostly because they think that they are already free which as we discussed they are not. If people wanted to be controlled, then why would they claim to be free. They are just confused, and need to be taught to think for themselves. I don't think there are many people who have this ability that regret it. I've never met someone who thought "damn, I wish I didn't know how to think for myself, then I could just walk around being fat and stupid, and not let it really bother me." People want to be free. They want to express themselves. They are just too afraid because the government and the media have created a culture of fear.

I surrender to the stoopid. Let's all get stoned and wear dresses.

What's wrong with wearing dresses and smoking pot?? Skirts are better anyway..

Not really we all give up our rights under the social contract. So basically in all goverments we lose our rights.

Originally Posted by lizzy

A majority of Americans prefer to be policed and herded, rather than think for themselves and take care of business

That's because they are not fully informed because of their television sets and apathy. Programed to be lazy, with a short attention span. Given want they want junk for thought but in excess for entertainment. All below a 6th grade level mind you and deprived of what they really need.

Be honest.

Sandform wants more slush. Lets show him what the real crabbage is!

That was fun. Are you proposing that 9/11 was staged or that they used an unfortunate event to their advantage?

Because I'll agree that they use things like this to redirect focus...

But I wont agree that 9/11 was staged.

Originally Posted by Minervas Phoenix

That's because they are not fully informed because of their television sets and apathy. Programed to be lazy, with a short attention span. Given want they want junk for thought but in excess for entertainment. All below a 6th grade level mind you and deprived of what they really need.

Yup yup, and yup.

If only America was as smart as you Phoenix



As for 9/11 I don't know what to believe honestly.

The government story sounds fishy.

The conspiracy story sounds even more fishy.

I believe neither

But what I do believe is that the government wanted "another pearl harbor event" that quote is courtesy of the PNAC

(project for a new american century)

Cronies of cheney and bush started this neo-conservative think tank and in their manifesto they stated

They need a new pearl harbor, a catalyzing event...to rally the people to goto war

And they did it alright...they USED 9/11...the deaths of 3,000+ to benefit themselves by invading iraq and afghanistan

The reason for us being in afghanistan originally was to build an oil pipeline to the caspian sea.

And iraq was invaded to setup our ENORMOUS base which is bigger then the vatican...this base is the base of the NWO accoring to The rockefellers themselves


This is no lie either, no bull...no strings...

They probably LOVED 9/11...without 9/11 there wouldn't be a war on terror

There would be no patriot act giving more power to the president.

There would be no suspension of habeus corpus, and the military commisions act of 2007 wouldn't exist.

I don't think there is enough solid evidence to say that 9-11 was "staged", or even enough to determine on what level that the government was involved. But it's more than just redirecting our focus. The neo-cons act like terrorism is something that can be defeated. The war on terror cannot succeed. There have been terrorists for as long as there have been oppressive governments. Some people call these people terrorist, others call them freedom fighters. It all just matters what side you think that your on. But there are no sides. We are all human beings. Violence cannot solve our problems, only create new ones.

Zorro!

Yea honestly, the 'insurgents' in Iraq are just iraqi civilians who are pissed off about having their family murdered by "PRECISION GUIDED BOMBS"

Precision my ASS! Children and women and men don't deserve to be killed in their own homes minding their own business, they are freedom fighters...fighting for THEIR OWN FREEDOM!

I haven't heard of an al qaeda related death in iraq, al qaeda is a band of idiots who have a few rpgs...wowie what a threat.

I read a short story once that a US Marine posted on youtube...well i didn't read it i listened in..
Anyways so this is how it goes

He stops someone in the street who was going to attack, and he goes to him

"what are you doing here?"

The iraqi goes

"what the hell are YOU doing here, this is my country and im protecting my family...my daughter was killed last week by YOUR MEN, you guys are the terrorists..."

The marine actually let him go...took his weapons

Reporter: What do you think about western civilization?
Gandhi: I think it would be a good idea.

Originally Posted by sandform

Zorro!

Sandform I'm taking mental notes on your strategy. I will simply call this one. "Zorro distraction". [Desperation: 9.8 Lucid Alert: Red].

Originally Posted by Minervas Phoenix

Sandform I'm taking mental notes on your strategy. I will simply call this one. "Zorro distraction". [Desperation: 9.8 Lucid Alert: Red].

No my dear, this was in reference to comments on stand alone heroes from television. Taking mental notes would indeed be helpful, if you weren't a tool... Perhaps in this thread or another someone mentioned "Rambo" but it was a person from this thread, and then Stonedape commented on perspectives of terrorism sooo...

welcome to Minerva watch.

Update:
Sandform uses: Zorro justification shield.

Description:
To link zorro to non existent super hero discussion and then to the thread. Eliminate original Zorro tactic revelation. Throw in name call while Linking Zorro to past events for structure legitimacy.


While this was the obvious next move. There was one weak spot. People might not understand so readily how Zorro fitted it.

Suggestion to improve Zorro combo.
Instead of using the word 'tool'. Try the word 'idiot'.
Example: 'Taking notes would be useful. If you weren't an idiot'.

Reason? While a 'tool' is a useful description of someone who can't help anyone. Idiot seems more useless. This makes it more suitable to destroy your original Zorro distraction and build a new Zorro combo in it's place.

Final Tip:
Mentioning the word perhaps in your Zorro relevance story weakens it's realism. Safeguarding against verification while sometimes useful is not always the most powerful combo.

Desperation: 1.2 Lucid Alert: Green

Who said super hero?...I said Hero. Rambo was mentioned in the aids thread by Ranma, and then Stonedape mentioned terrorist perspectives. I mentioned Zorro. Feel free to see.

Originally Posted by ranma187

Why do you think in Hollywood movies like Dirty harry, and some Action movies like Rambo 3 and many other like it. You see people being terrorized by outlaws involved with authority figures until some lone warrior/hero like person comes along and saves them? Why is Hollywood Filled with this theme?

I called you a tool because you're not a moron you're just a tool. Though you might think I'm refering to the human penis I was actually refering to items which are mediums to accomplish goals. You are a pawn.

Meanwhile no one would have even noticed the zorro statement if you hadn't decided to place fake significance and purpose to it...like you do with many things.

Stay tuned to the Minerva's watch...pretty soon she expects a statement relating her to trolls to occur and it will be an accurate forecast.

Really who is using distraction tactics here Minerva? Someone who made a candid statement or the person who is trying to use the candid statement to prove a false point?

Why are we still talking about zorro?

Haha sandform, don't take me that seriously. You are now arguing with what was my attempt at humor nothing more than that.

Originally Posted by stonedape

Reporter: What do you think about western civilization?
Gandhi: I think it would be a good idea.

QFT!

Freedom is pretty hard to define. Lets say we have a perfect utopia, with perfect laws, it isn't really matter what they are (, or if they can even exist) in this case. But what if despite that perfection, you place a TV next to someone's house, displaying propaganda in favour of a governor, a product, a way to wear your hair. The person in the house Can choose not to watch to the tv. But of course he or she will. Is the person less free? If the person decides to wear his hair in a Mohawk, because for days on end the TV told him that was cool, was that a free choice? Mhhh, not completely.

The barrage of propaganda is obvious in America. But the question is whether freedom from things like propaganda is possible, or especially relevant. Everything could be called propaganda. Movie-reviews are, perhaps, not very different. Whether or not there is an intention behind something, things can drastically influence people's choices.

But this rigid complete freedom I am aiming at, is actually kind of non-existant. We always do what we do for reasons. There is so much you can objectively report. There is always bias in reporting about for instance politics.

Therefore, I guess all we can strive for is a government that tries to ensure maximum freedom, basically all freedom but those freedoms that would mean taking away other people's freedoms. But a government that also tries to keep people informed, proper education is essential to proper choice, or at least a government would do good to try to avoid misleading advertising, and such. Even then, it is pretty hard to say whether someone really made a free choice choosing coca-cola, and not pepsi.

-

However. America both fails in having laws that give maximum freedom in all cases, but those that endanger others. (Easy examples are drugs being illegal and gay marriage being illegal)

And in trying to secure some means to keep things like journalistic integrity alive. Letting people lie to your people on massive scale is taking away freedom of (informed) choice. Lying to your people yourself is undermining democracy itself.

But hey, after most of European countries, America is still relatively free. (Still, highly uninformed/uneducated for such a rich country.)

We are told we live in a "Democracy". According to etymology "Democracy" is made up of two Greek words. "Demos" meaning "The people, or Mob". And Cracy "rule of". So Democracy means "Rule of the people"

I would more correctly say We live in a Monecracy. Rule of The Money!
Money= Power in a monecracy. As you all know Power corrupts. And Ultimate power corrupts Absolutely.