Thread: Obama 2008!!!

Originally Posted by drewmandan

Ok, I'll bite. Bin Laden is the head (supposedly) of an active extremist terrorist organization with agents worldwide, and is supposedly planning more strikes (for the sake of argument, let's say this is true). Ayers is under extreme government scrutiny and couldn't plan going to the washroom without them knowing.

Bin Laden is responsible, either directly or indirectly, for thousands of deaths all over the world. Ayers is responsible for not one single injury, let alone death.

Bin Laden is in the habit of destroying buildings and naval vessels. Ayers detroyed some statues 40 years ago.

Bin Laden is wanted, dead or alive, by a dozen governments. Ayers is a college professor.

See, you're comparing apples and oranges. Instead of comparing Ayers to Bin Laden, which is one hell of a stretch, why not just say this:

"McCain gave a pro-Ayers speech in Ayers' living room after Ayers bombed the Pentagon and some statues and admitted to it. Ayers got McCain's political career off the ground after those attacks. Ayers and McCain were partners in public speaking and served on boards together after the attacks. Ayers is unrepentant for his terrorist attacks to this day.

Ayers did injure somebody when trying to kill people when bombing the United States government. He also bombed the Pentagon. That is what he has in common with Bin Laden. Also, all of the points about, "Uh, it doesn't mean there's anything wrong with Obama," are what I was countering. Strong associations with terrorists who attack the United States are a very big deal. That is my point, and my analogy illustrated it.

Originally Posted by Oneironaut

Oh, it goes much deeper than her lack of knowledge of the Bush Doctrine:



Not to say she's an idiot, but seriously...Vice President (and a "70 year old man's ailing heartbeat away" from being President) of the most powerful nation on the planet? Really. This woman was not ready for Prime Time.

She did need to brush up on some things. I don't think it would have taken long. She is a genius and a great communicator with an excellent reputation as the governor of Alaska. But the McCain camp could have done much better in getting her ready. The McCain team could have done a lot better in a lot of areas. They sucked.

Originally Posted by Oneironaut

I will tell you how I view his associations:

Think about Barack's (supposed) demeanor. His entire philosophy. He is all about reaching across isles and trying to be both tolerant and understanding of all points of view, even when he doesn't agree with them. I can completely identify with that. Terrorism (as a method) is indefensible, on the surface. It's so easy to label something "terroristic" and say "DIS' IS BAD!!" without any context. Although, many of the motives behind various terrorist attacks are actually pretty legitimate. A moderate - such as Obama seems to be - would take all sides of the spectrum into consideration, and would find it possible to condemn such acts, even while being connecting with the offender on some other level.

I doubt very much that Obama has applauded Ayers for his acts (I haven't seen/heard the speech he supposedly gave - only reports that it happened, usually with the hint of spin. If you have a link to what was actually said at the speech, I would love to hear/see it).

I would like to know more about his association with Ayers than what they cherry-pick through to put up on FOX News. Simply the fact that he is associated with the man, while a brow-raiser, does not persuade me to immediately delegitimize him as a true American who loves his country. There has to be more to it. And, as of now, I haven't seen it.

The same goes for Reverend Wright. The truth is, many of the most harshest critics of anything or anyone (whether it be a nation, a person, a novel, a video game, etc...) are also the most passionate lovers of the same. It is because they do love said item that they are moved to so much emotion, when said person/place/thing is behaving in a despicable way. You and I have had the debate before about whether Wright was addressing America As A Whole, or "America" meaning the U.S. Government, in relation to the world stage (which is what he, himself, said). So I really don't want to go back into it. I simply want to make the point that, where you are really quick to say "ZOMG, Wright said Goddamn America!" I am looking at the context, and I don't quite feel the same way you do about it.

To address your "name change" paragraph: Drew actually beat me to it. How can you possibly compare someone who participated in some statue and building bombings (which, I agree, is a method of protest that I don't necessarily support), with someone who led an attack that took thousands upon thousands of lives?

If Obama has a lax attitude about Ayers' terrorism, then he should not have been elected. He has been elected, so I am not going to say he should not be president at this point, but I find it profoundly disturbing that somebody with such a lax attitude about terrorism could be elected president. I also don't know of what "context" could possibly justify what Ayers did. It was mindless hate that was meant to hurt very irrationally. It was despiccable. Ayers admitted that he was targetting innocent people, and he has yet to apologize for it. I want a president who hates his guts and everything he represents. Obama does not fit that description.

Ayers did not just bomb statues. He bombed the capitol building, the Pentagon, and NYC Police Headquarters, and he intended to kill. He did it to express hate toward the United States. That is not like some 15 year old vandalizing a statue. I'm glad you don't "necessarily" agree with it.

Ayers said way more than, "God damn America!" He called our country the "USKKK of A." He accused our government of inventing AIDS to kill black people. He blamed 9/11 on the victims. He said lots of horrible garbage. And Obama admits to going to that extremist church twice a month for twenty years. Only extremists go to extremist churches for 20 years. That is a huge problem. Also, when the nut Pfleger (white racist against white people) gave his awful pitch at the church, the congregation cheered him on and agreed with him. That means it is a racist church. There is no way Obama did not know that, and he was a regular member there who was supertight with the preacher. That whole picture of "context" is inexcusable, big time.

If McCain had gone to a white church where the white congregation was racist and the preacher called our country the "US Black Muslims of A", I think you would have had a big problem with it.

UM thinks Palin is a genius.

Great minds think alike.

Did anyone go to the Chicago rally? Anyone going to the inauguration?

Originally Posted by drewmandan

UM thinks Palin is a genius.

Great minds think alike.

She did need to brush up on some things. I don't think it would have taken long. She is a genius and a great communicator with an excellent reputation as the governor of Alaska.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=MWZHTJ...d.php?t=128204

Wow, wow. She really is a genius.

Stop argueing, obama is president and nothing is going to change it unless he gets asassinated, just four years (i think)untill you can argue all over again

Originally Posted by Oneironaut

Oh, it goes much deeper than her lack of knowledge of the Bush Doctrine:

Oh my God, that's the video. I had trouble getting it to play last night, so I gave up and assumed it was one of her infamous interviews. I saw that Fox report. I think it is such a crock of shit. (Liberals are suddenly believing Fox News? ) Some McCain workers have been trying to scapegoat Palin for the loss, and that is the junk they are talking. It is way too far fetched for me to believe it without some kind of evidence other than angry hearsay. However, IF it by some strange chance is true, then I admit that Sarah Palin is not qualified to be president of the United States, vice president of the United States, the mayor of Vaiden, Missisippi, a school teacher, or a high school graduate. I just find it so hard to swallow.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

I saw that Fox report. I think it is such a crock of shit.

I wondered how long it was going to take Fox News to join the ranks of the "elite liberal media" once McCain lost and they started kissing Obama's ass (which a lot of Fox anchors have now started to do).

The Republican party is split into two factions at this point - those who believe Sarah Palin is the future of the party and those who blame her for McCain's loss.

She IS the reason he lost so badly, but at the same time he signed off on that decision so he is just as at fault for picking her dumb ass. If the Republicans choose to get behind her for a 2012 run (which I certainly hope they do), Obama is going to be a two-term President for sure barring any huge scandal or lackluster performance.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

She did need to brush up on some things. I don't think it would have taken long. She is a genius and -

I once had a lot of respect for you because when you spoke about Iraq you seemed to know what you were talking about.

But what the fuck happened to you? The woman is a perfect example of why there needs to be an intelligence test before your name goes on a ballot for any kind of public office.

She thinks the earth is 6000 years old!
She was in a ceremony to have WITCHES removed from her body!
She doesn't support the use of fruit-fly for genetic research!
She was divisive and spoke hateful, borderline-racist garbage at her rallies.
Where was the genius in her plan to offend all the coastal cities by stating that the 'real Americans are in the heartland and small towns'?

She is a shining example of everything that is wrong with the US these days, and I would love it if she ran in 2012 (as 60-something% of registered Republicans would like) because that's a sealed deal win for 8 years of Obama.

Keep right on drinking that Kool-Aid though.

But Alex, she has alot of good foriegn policy experience. Keeping an eye on Russia and all... And whenever one of them came over we'd always ask, "Hey, watcha' doing over here?" And if they could give a good reason, well then alright. But if not, then well, we'd say, "Hey, get back on over there!"

I smell racism in here... so obvious...won't even call out names

I don't think Palin lost the election for him, she helped. But he voted with Bush 90% of the time, that's what lost him the election. He tried to distance himself from Bush as much as possible, but voting records don't lie.

"I just want to give McCain my full support."
"Uhh, thanks Gearoge. Umm, I have to go..."
"I want America to know where I stand."
"Wait, George..."
"A vote for John McCain is a vote for George W. Bush."

Originally Posted by Alextanium

I once had a lot of respect for you because when you spoke about Iraq you seemed to know what you were talking about.

But what the fuck happened to you? The woman is a perfect example of why there needs to be an intelligence test before your name goes on a ballot for any kind of public office.

She thinks the earth is 6000 years old!
She was in a ceremony to have WITCHES removed from her body!
She doesn't support the use of fruit-fly for genetic research!
She was divisive and spoke hateful, borderline-racist garbage at her rallies.
Where was the genius in her plan to offend all the coastal cities by stating that the 'real Americans are in the heartland and small towns'?

She is a shining example of everything that is wrong with the US these days, and I would love it if she ran in 2012 (as 60-something% of registered Republicans would like) because that's a sealed deal win for 8 years of Obama.

Keep right on drinking that Kool-Aid though.

If all of that is true, which I really doubt, it means she is crazy, not stupid. Religion is the issue that makes Republicans irrational, and lots of them are brilliant. Sarah Palin might be a very religious Christian who believes the general ideas of Christianity's nuttiness, but don't tell me she is not intelligent. The idea that she is stupid is absurd. But keep drinking the left wing Kool-Aid.

Palin manipulating crowds:


If you go to thunderf00t's channel there's some more videos focused on Palin.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

If all of that is true, which I really doubt, it means she is crazy, not stupid. Religion is the issue that makes Republicans irrational, and lots of them are brilliant. Sarah Palin might be a very religious Christian who believes the general ideas of Christianity's nuttiness, but don't tell me she is not intelligent. The idea that she is stupid is absurd. But keep drinking the left wing Kool-Aid.

So it's OK to have a crazy person in office?

Originally Posted by drewmandan

So it's OK to have a crazy person in office?

You misread my words again. I was talking about a hypothetical. Read my post again.

The craziness that comes in the form of religion is bad for personal liberties, but it fortunately doesn't affect a person's ability to handle economics and, in most cases, foreign policy. Obama and Biden are Christians too, so it's not like a vote against Palin was a vote against Christianity entering the executive branch. The religious lunacy has been there since the beginning of the country. Sarah Palin would not have been anything too new in that regard.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

You misread my words again. I was talking about a hypothetical. Read my post again.

The craziness that comes in the form of religion is bad for personal liberties, but it fortunately doesn't affect a person's ability to handle economics and, in most cases, foreign policy. Obama and Biden are Christians too, so it's not like a vote against Palin was a vote against Christianity entering the executive branch. The religious lunacy has been there since the beginning of the country. Sarah Palin would not have been anything too new in that regard.

Wrong.

Deist founding fathers:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundin...tates#Religion

Obama on public reason:
http://video.google.ca/videosearch?q...um=4&ct=title#

Palin...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sixDDLSN46s

More Palin...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwkb9...eature=related


Get. Your. Head. OUT OF YOUR ASS.

Originally Posted by drewmandan

Wrong.

Deist founding fathers:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundin...tates#Religion

Obama on public reason:
http://video.google.ca/videosearch?q...um=4&ct=title#

Palin...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sixDDLSN46s

More Palin...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iwkb9...eature=related


Get. Your. Head. OUT OF YOUR ASS.

In what way does that prove me wrong? I didn't say every person in the history of the U.S. federal government has been a Christian. I said the lunacy has always been in the executive branch, meaning it has always been represented by at least some of the people in there. Of course, I think religion is automatic lunacy. So what is your point? Get your head out of your ass so maybe you can finally start comprehending my posts.

By the way, why are you such an asshole? How old are you?

Why do you think Palin is so smart?

I hope obama fails, i only feel this way due to spite tho.

Originally Posted by Grod

Why do you think Palin is so smart?

Her education, her ability to make good points, her record in Alaska, and her articulation skills.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Her education, her ability to make good points, her record in Alaska, and her articulation skills.

lawl

Wow.

The CIA brought crack into the inner city, whats to doubt they brought aids?

Tested LSD on unknowing US Soldiers.

I'm not saying what Ayers did was right, but I will say this country has committed many atrocities.