RAISE YOUR HAND!! - Intro Class Q&A

Hello Intro Students & Staff!!

If any of you students have a question regarding this class, your workbooks, or anything dream related, this thread is basically a place where you can "raise your hand if you have a question." Important questions, issues, and concerns can sometimes get lost in pages and pages of workbooks, and we don't want anything to get missed.

So if any of you feel like you had a question but it either wasn't answered, or not answered well enough, direct us to it here! I or one of the staff will make sure that you get the answers and attention you need.

Thanks for participating in the DreamViews Academy :)

I had a little question (maybe I'm a little attention whore lol):

I started my workbook 5 days ago. The only thing that I wanted to know is this:
Am I on the good path? What more/else could I do?

I always feel like I'm missing something. It would be nice to have some feedback ;)

I forgot a part of a lucid dream ! I thought you couldn't forget lucid dreams :? Is there anyway to combat that, because I had a very good recall that night aside from the first part which I remembered when I woke up the first time but then forgot it after I woke up for real. The only thing that I remember is that it was incredibly fun :(

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Originally Posted by Yossarian22

I had a little question (maybe I'm a little attention whore lol):

I started my workbook 5 days ago. The only thing that I wanted to know is this:
Am I on the good path? What more/else could I do?

I always feel like I'm missing something. It would be nice to have some feedback ;)

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Heh heh, no worries, Yossarian... I know how helpful a little feedback can be in order to help determine whether you're on the right track. I'll swing by your workbook and say hi. :D

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Originally Posted by areyoume

I forgot a part of a lucid dream ! I thought you couldn't forget lucid dreams :? Is there anyway to combat that, because I had a very good recall that night aside from the first part which I remembered when I woke up the first time but then forgot it after I woke up for real. The only thing that I remember is that it was incredibly fun :(

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Sorry to hear that, man! You know, this is a subject where there's not universal agreement. I know Sageous believes that lucid dream memories are every bit as vivid as waking life memories, but I know for a fact that I've forgotten chunks of lucid dreams before.

Then I think about it more and realize that I've forgotten big chunks of waking life, too, especially when I'm spaced out or bored. So maybe we're not contradicting one another. :chuckle:

Here's my view on dream recall in general, including lucid dream recall. Heck, this probably applies to waking life memories as well. I recommend going back over the dream in your mind the moment that you wake up. Start to finish, top to bottom, replay the whole thing in your mind. Don't move until you've done that. Once you are sure that you have the whole thing down, take at least a few notes. It may not have to be a complete dream description. For some people, a few sentences, keywords, or whatever are fine.

Dialogue will leave you the quickest, so I recommend writing it down first, verbatim or at least as much as you can remember. Then I'd map things out from a high level with keywords. That may be all you need.

It's a bummer, man, but the good news? You're gonna have lots more lucid dreams to remember. :goodjob2:

Hi Guys,
I have some issues which I need to sort out first, which I have mentioned in my workbook, so please check out mine when possible and provide assistance. Thanks is Advance.

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Originally Posted by Kamskun

Hi Guys,
I have some issues which I need to sort out first, which I have mentioned in my workbook, so please check out mine when possible and provide assistance. Thanks is Advance.

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Hey! I got your PM too. I checked out your workbook and replied. I think I got the questions you were asking. If not, please let me know where you were needing the help. :)

Ok, this is a quite basic question... So perfect for the Intro Class ;)
CanisLucidus has convinced me of the benefits of WBTB, but I have a bed partner that gets upset if I disturb her sleep because she gets insomnia quite easily. So I want to practice WBTB but it won't be as often as I would like, so I need to maximize my chances whenever I can do it.
Therefore, my question is: What have you found more effective to do during WBTB?
Thank you! :dreaming:

Hey dreambh, good question.

First of all, WBTB's don't have to involve a loud alarm, or alot of getting up and piddling around that could disturb an insomniac. In fact, you can train yourself to wake up naturally (as we discussed in our most recent podcast: http://www.dreamviews.com/dreamviews...mworlds-2.html). Then you won't wake up your bed partner with an alarm. Next thing, a WBTB routine doesn't have to be something where you get up and do things around the house. Other things you can do, after waking up naturally, are incubate a dream, put reality checks and lucid goals to memory, focus on awareness, prepare for SSILD or DEILD, anything that occupies your mind without waking up your partner.

All that said, when you DO have the time and privacy to do a more active WBTB, several things can help: waking early of course, getting up, going to the bathroom, drinking some water, reading DreamViews, reading your or others' dream journals (esp lucid entries), feeding/walking the pets, prepare the crockpot.. any activity that wakes your mind and body up a bit, but not too much. You want that balance of being awake and aware and focused on lucid dreaming, but not so crazy awake that you can't fall back to sleep in 30 min - an hour. I admit for me it's easy... I come from a long line of sleeper-inner-lucid-dreamers. For others, it's different. Once they're up, they're up. So their WBTB's are more productive if they wake up, but don't actually get up, and instead, prepare only mentally for their lucid dreams.

Hope this gives you some direction! Let us know how it goes :)

Thanks, OpheliaBlue!
I really though that to do WBTB I had to get out of bed.
And in the couple of weeks I've been in the Intro Class I've realized I do wake up naturally sometimes, even though I'm a deep sleeper. Actually having a light sleeper bed partner has a clear benefit, that is, even if she tries to be careful, from time to time she will wake me up during the night, so that's a chance to try WBTB.
I have to say it is difficult for me to wake up, and stay awake to do incubations, MILD, etc without falling asleep quickly, but I guess is a matter of focus and effort.
No one said WBTB was going to be easy!! ;)

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Originally Posted by dreambh

Thanks, OpheliaBlue!
I really though that to do WBTB I had to get out of bed.
And in the couple of weeks I've been in the Intro Class I've realized I do wake up naturally sometimes, even though I'm a deep sleeper. Actually having a light sleeper bed partner has a clear benefit, that is, even if she tries to be careful, from time to time she will wake me up during the night, so that's a chance to try WBTB.
I have to say it is difficult for me to wake up, and stay awake to do incubations, MILD, etc without falling asleep quickly, but I guess is a matter of focus and effort.
No one said WBTB was going to be easy!! ;)

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Great answers from OpheliaBlue! I don't have too much to add except a question: if you leave all the lights off but get out of bed and go to another room, is this likely to wake your partner?

My personal routine is to rely on natural wakings, then navigate in the darkness to another room. I make sure that the path is always clear and that I move slowly. (this has the benefit of reducing toe stubbings as well as making me less noisy!) Then I go to a completely different area of the house for the actual WBTB. I can do my dream journaling, reading, and meditation there. Then I return sloooowly back to bed.

If your partner sleeps too lightly for this to work (or if you don't think that you can become as silent as a ninja), then scratch that. :) But if you can get away with waking up in the middle of the night to pee, hopefully you can get away with this too. But only you can know whether an arrangement like this might work. Above all else, keep her happy!! :D

Hey, I have a question involving transitioning. In my workbook, I posted that I had come close to a lucid dream. I woke up naturally in the middle of the night and did FILD. Within seconds my body was tingling and I was hearing buzzing; at the time I thought it was sleep paralysis, but now I'm not sure, it might have been HI. Anyway, I waited in bed for a few more minutes, still moving my fingers slightly and staying still. After a few minutes, I sat up slowly and did a reality check. I was not dreaming, and then I couldn't get back to sleep for 2 hours.

So my question is how do you know when you're in a dream? Does it happen right when the HI fades, or do you have to wait a long time after that? I don't know if you spontaneously pop into a dream or start the dream in bed. I'm just having trouble pinpointing the exact moment to stop focusing and do a reality check.

I got a good answer for this, because I had to figure it out myself just last year! More when I get home and can post from my computer instead the phone :p

Edit: Ok. What I do when I get the buzzing tingling vibrations thing, I keep my eyes closed and completely relax (it helps even more if I can imagine that I'm focusing that buzzing into the mask of my face, but that may not be necessary for you, and may just be something to think about later).

Now, while in this relaxed state, with the buzzing and such, you can pick from a couple of things:

• Slooowly open your [dream] eyes, and yes, you may just find yourself in your bed in your room. So check for anomalies or anything out of place. This is where many people have a false awakening, because in this OBE style of WILD, you end up in your room and it can be a touch tricky to distinguish between dream and "oh did I just wake up for real?" If you discover that you are in fact dreaming already, then just get up out of bed and start your adventures! I start out a little slowly at first, just because I admit I have trepidations about moving too fast in the first few seconds, and worry I'll end up up moving/waking-up for real. Which brings us to the next one,
  
• If you find that during this buzziness phase, that you're trying to start your dream and opening your eyes, moving, getting up etc, and it turns out that you woke up for real, then I suggest an alternative: Instead of "opening your dream eyes" and getting up or moving in any way when you feel this buzzing, just keep your eyes closed. Then, imagine that (without opening your eyelids, or thinking of opening your eyelids), imagine that your eyelids are still closed, but becoming transparent. Imagine what you now see through them... maybe it's still your room (which is what I do 99% of the time), or maybe another scene entirely. Once this scene is fully established (I'd guesstimate 10-20 seconds if that), then this is where you continue with what I said about the getting up, or moving around slowly to get your bearings and do what you like to do best for getting yourself locked in the dream.

The good news is, you're already naturally making the steps for WILDs, which is awesome. I know it can be a little vague about when to know when the dream actually started. Honestly, it's for you to really experiment upon. I just told you how it's like for me. But there again, you have already made the first giant leaps by getting to that transitional phase. Now all you have to do is experiment with the timing. I'm actually really excited to see how this goes for you! Please keep us posted, and feel free to keep asking questions.

Also, someone who helped me alot when I was trying to figure all this out, was Sageous, per this thread from his WILD class (which you may want to look into): http://www.dreamviews.com/wild/13228...out-noise.html

And finally, gab's thread about all the different physical entry phases associated with WILDs: http://www.dreamviews.com/wake-initi...ntry-wild.html

Good luck and let us know how it goes!!

I have a little question... (Little in words)

Is really ANYTHING possible in a lucid dream? I know people say that You can not read text in a dream, but it has been proven along with a million other things that you can... I just wondered maybe there was something you can't do in a dream no matter how hard you try...

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Originally Posted by TheBooneMan

I have a little question... (Little in words)

Is really ANYTHING possible in a lucid dream? I know people say that You can not read text in a dream, but it has been proven along with a million other things that you can... I just wondered maybe there was something you can't do in a dream no matter how hard you try...

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Man, you all have some good questions!

My short answer is that anything you can imagine, you can experience in a lucid dream. Some people will have a difficult time accomplishing certain lucid tasks (this certainly includes me!) but these are almost always temporary. I view all of my failures as temporary. I believe that I can do just about anything if I only get good enough at the art of dream control. There are very, very few exceptions to this, IMO.

One area where many people believe there are limitations: how long you can make a dream last. Many believe that you can make a dream feel like it lasts much longer in "dream time" than it does in "waking life" time. But it's not clear how far you can take this, what the physiological limitations might be, and whether the "extreme" time dilation that people sometimes report might be some other type of phenomenon. We may be tackling this on the podcast before too long. :D

Time is the one constraint that may be beyond our ability to break. That may cut us off from certain goals. For example, I don't see myself counting from one to one-trillion in a lucid dream any time soon. :)

But apart from that? I can't think of any unbreakable rules. At one time or another, we're all going to come up against some task that seems too difficult at the time, but virtually all of these can be dealt with by expanding our minds and practicing.

Thanks Man! Really means the world to answer my questions dude, I just recently came from a Forum that was very mean and had no sense of humor (The Staff literally bullied everyone). But this place is just awesome! I haven't had a lucid dream that I can say I was proud of yet, but the staff and everybody makes me feel welcome and inspires me to try new things! And I want to thank you for the CanisLucidus!

My recall is not that bad (excluding some bad nights), but my lucidity is always zero. I think that is because I keep forgetting to RC through the day. What else can I do to increase my lucidity?

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Originally Posted by quorthonafull

My recall is not that bad (excluding some bad nights), but my lucidity is always zero. I think that is because I keep forgetting to RC through the day. What else can I do to increase my lucidity?

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Remembering your dreams is the starting place for learning to have lucid dreams. If you don't recall your dreams, even if you do have a lucid dream, you won't remember it! And, in order to be able to recognize your dreams as dreams while they are happening, you have to be familiar with the way your own dreams work. Before it will be worth your time to work on lucid dream induction methods, you should be able to recall at least one dream every night.
Getting plenty of sleep is the first step to good dream recall. If you are rested it will be easier to focus on your goal of recalling dreams, and you won't mind so much taking the time during the night to record your dreams. Another benefit of getting plenty of sleep is that dream periods get longer and closer together as the night proceeds. The first dream of the night is the shortest, perhaps 10 minutes in length, while after 8 hours of sleep, dream periods can be 45 minutes to an hour long. We all dream every night, about one dream period every 90 minutes. People who say they never dream simply never remember their dreams. You may have more than one dream during a REM (dream) period, separated by short arousals that are most often forgotten. It is generally accepted among sleep researchers that dreams are not recalled unless the sleeper awakens directly from the dream, rather than after going on to other stages of sleep.

It can be useful while you are developing your dream recall to keep a complete dream journal. Keep the journal handy by your bed and record every dream you remember, no matter how fragmentary. Start by writing down all your dreams, not just the complete, coherent, or interesting ones--even if all you remember is a face or a room, write it down.

When you awaken in the night and recall what you were dreaming, record the dream right away. If you don't, in the morning you may find you remember nothing about the dream, and you will certainly have forgotten many interesting details. We seem to have built-in dream erasers in our minds, which make dream experiences more difficult to recall than waking ones. So, whenever you remember a dream, write it down. If you don't feel like writing out a long dream story at 3 AM, note down key points of the plot. Also write down the precise content of any dialogue from the dream, because words will almost inevitably be forgotten in a very short time.

Possibly, all you will need to do to increase your dream recall is to remind yourself as you are falling asleep that you wish to awaken fully from your dreams and remember them. This works in a similar manner to remembering to awaken at a certain time in the morning. Additionally, it may help to tell yourself you will have interesting, meaningful dreams. A major cause of dream forgetting is interference from other thoughts competing for your attention. Therefore, let your first thought upon awakening be, "What was I just dreaming?" Before attempting to write down the dream, go over the dream in your mind, re-telling the dream story to yourself. DO NOT MOVE from the position in which you awaken, and do not think of the day's concerns. Cling to any clues of what you might have been experiencing--moods, feelings, fragments of images, and try to rebuild a story from them. When you recall a scene, try to recall what happened before that, and before that, reliving the dream in reverse. If after a few minutes, all you remember is a mood, describe it in a journal. If you can recall nothing, try imagining a dream you might have had--note your present feelings, list your current concerns to yourself, and ask yourself, "Did I dream about that?" Even if you can't recall anything in bed, events or scenes of the day may remind you of something you dreamed the night before. Be ready to notice this when it happens, and record whatever you remember.

If you find that you sleep too deeply to awaken from your dreams, try setting an alarm clock to wake you at a time when you are likely to be dreaming. Since our REM periods occur at approximately 90 minute intervals, good times will be multiples of 90 minutes after you go to sleep. Aim for the later REM periods by setting the alarm to go off at 4.5, 6, or 7.5 hours after you go to sleep. Once again, when you wake up, don't move and think first of what you were just dreaming before writing.

To remind yourself of your intentions and get yourself into the spirit of your dreams, read through your dream journal at bedtime. Learning to remember your dreams may seem difficult at first, but if you persist, you will almost certainly succeed--and may find yourself remembering four or more dreams per night. Of course, once you reach this level, you probably won't want to write them all down--just the significant or compelling ones. And, the more familiar you become with the style of your own dreams, the easier it will be to remember you are dreaming while you are dreaming--and explore the world of your dreams while still on the scene.

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Originally Posted by TheBooneMan

Thanks Man! Really means the world to answer my questions dude, I just recently came from a Forum that was very mean and had no sense of humor (The Staff literally bullied everyone). But this place is just awesome! I haven't had a lucid dream that I can say I was proud of yet, but the staff and everybody makes me feel welcome and inspires me to try new things! And I want to thank you for the CanisLucidus!

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Wow, what a nice thing to say! I very much appreciate that. If you stick with your LD practices, you will have lucid dreams that you're proud of. Getting to see people enjoy the experience of a great LD is super rewarding for us. It wasn't so long ago for me, and I remember the feeling of the first few LDs so well. I'm looking forward to seeing how things go for you!

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Originally Posted by quorthonafull

My recall is not that bad (excluding some bad nights), but my lucidity is always zero. I think that is because I keep forgetting to RC through the day. What else can I do to increase my lucidity?

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I've hit a bit of a dry spell myself, so I'm going to be going back to the my core, fundamental practices in order to break it. Maybe this list will be useful to you as well. Anyhow, here are the fundamentals that I return to when I need to reignite my LD practice. This is exactly what I will do until my dry spell breaks:

Ask yourself this throughout the day, particularly every time your awareness slips: “How do I know this isn’t a dream?” Demand specific proof from yourself that you're not dreaming. Where were you 5 minutes ago? Does any of what you're experiencing make sense?

Perform WBTB. 30 minutes or longer may work best. Spend this time thinking or reading about lucid dreaming and questioning reality.

Have a plan for your next lucid dream. Get excited about this plan. Visualize yourself following through and KNOW that you will succeed.

You can and will realize when you're dreaming. The next lucid dream is coming. It's just a matter of time. Now go get it!

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Originally Posted by OpheliaBlue

I got a good answer for this, because I had to figure it out myself just last year! More when I get home and can post from my computer instead the phone :p

Edit: Ok. What I do when I get the buzzing tingling vibrations thing, I keep my eyes closed and completely relax (it helps even more if I can imagine that I'm focusing that buzzing into the mask of my face, but that may not be necessary for you, and may just be something to think about later).

Now, while in this relaxed state, with the buzzing and such, you can pick from a couple of things:

• Slooowly open your [dream] eyes, and yes, you may just find yourself in your bed in your room. So check for anomalies or anything out of place. This is where many people have a false awakening, because in this OBE style of WILD, you end up in your room and it can be a touch tricky to distinguish between dream and "oh did I just wake up for real?" If you discover that you are in fact dreaming already, then just get up out of bed and start your adventures! I start out a little slowly at first, just because I admit I have trepidations about moving too fast in the first few seconds, and worry I'll end up up moving/waking-up for real. Which brings us to the next one,
  
• If you find that during this buzziness phase, that you're trying to start your dream and opening your eyes, moving, getting up etc, and it turns out that you woke up for real, then I suggest an alternative: Instead of "opening your dream eyes" and getting up or moving in any way when you feel this buzzing, just keep your eyes closed. Then, imagine that (without opening your eyelids, or thinking of opening your eyelids), imagine that your eyelids are still closed, but becoming transparent. Imagine what you now see through them... maybe it's still your room (which is what I do 99% of the time), or maybe another scene entirely. Once this scene is fully established (I'd guesstimate 10-20 seconds if that), then this is where you continue with what I said about the getting up, or moving around slowly to get your bearings and do what you like to do best for getting yourself locked in the dream.

The good news is, you're already naturally making the steps for WILDs, which is awesome. I know it can be a little vague about when to know when the dream actually started. Honestly, it's for you to really experiment upon. I just told you how it's like for me. But there again, you have already made the first giant leaps by getting to that transitional phase. Now all you have to do is experiment with the timing. I'm actually really excited to see how this goes for you! Please keep us posted, and feel free to keep asking questions.

Also, someone who helped me alot when I was trying to figure all this out, was Sageous, per this thread from his WILD class (which you may want to look into): http://www.dreamviews.com/wild/13228...out-noise.html

And finally, gab's thread about all the different physical entry phases associated with WILDs: http://www.dreamviews.com/wake-initi...ntry-wild.html

Good luck and let us know how it goes!!

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Thank you so much! No luck in the past couple because of messed up sleep cycles and headaches, but I should be set for tonight. But one more question I have; when to open my eyes. Do I do it while I see/hear/feel the HI imagery or after it's already gone? Or does the HI simply not matter and I only open my eyes when I'm significantly relaxed? And if it's the latter, how do I know that I'm significantly relaxed? Is there some trick to it or is it a guess-and-test type of thing?

Anyway thanks for the help. And one more question; did you change your avatar in the past week or so? cause i couldv'e sworn your avatar's eyes used to blue :?

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Originally Posted by CanisLucidus

Wow, what a nice thing to say! I very much appreciate that. If you stick with your LD practices, you will have lucid dreams that you're proud of. Getting to see people enjoy the experience of a great LD is super rewarding for us. It wasn't so long ago for me, and I remember the feeling of the first few LDs so well. I'm looking forward to seeing how things go for you!



I've hit a bit of a dry spell myself, so I'm going to be going back to the my core, fundamental practices in order to break it. Maybe this list will be useful to you as well. Anyhow, here are the fundamentals that I return to when I need to reignite my LD practice. This is exactly what I will do until my dry spell breaks:

Ask yourself this throughout the day, particularly every time your awareness slips: “How do I know this isn’t a dream?” Demand specific proof from yourself that you're not dreaming. Where were you 5 minutes ago? Does any of what you're experiencing make sense?

Perform WBTB. 30 minutes or longer may work best. Spend this time thinking or reading about lucid dreaming and questioning reality.

Have a plan for your next lucid dream. Get excited about this plan. Visualize yourself following through and KNOW that you will succeed.

You can and will realize when you're dreaming. The next lucid dream is coming. It's just a matter of time. Now go get it!

---

I did it! Even if it was for just one second, I finally made it again. I met with a friend, she said "it's been 60 years since the last time we saw each other", and I managed to realize that obviously, tha was false. A second later I started to feel my body and all faded out. I tried to DEILD without success.

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Originally Posted by quorthonafull

I did it! Even if it was for just one second, I finally made it again. I met with a friend, she said "it's been 60 years since the last time we saw each other", and I managed to realize that obviously, tha was false. A second later I started to feel my body and all faded out. I tried to DEILD without success.

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Beautiful!! :woohoo: I knew you'd get it! You had exactly the right idea trying to use DEILD in order to turn that short lucid dream into a longer one. Just keep after it. Now that you've proven to yourself yet again that you can do this, it's all just about putting in the attempts and time.

I see more lucidity in your future! Keep after it! :goodjob2:

A small but simple question, how did you guys learn to fly? I mean the question would be 'how to learn to fly' but I figured if I ask you first.

Does setting an intention help? Like before sleeping repeat a mantra like 'I will LD and I will remember to learn to fly'

Thanks in advance!

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Originally Posted by GTom

A small but simple question, how did you guys learn to fly? I mean the question would be 'how to learn to fly' but I figured if I ask you first.

Does setting an intention help? Like before sleeping repeat a mantra like 'I will LD and I will remember to learn to fly'

Thanks in advance!

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Hey GTom! Setting an intention certainly can't hurt. In particular, I'd recommend some visualization pre-bed or during WBTB, if that's your thing. Picture what flying will be like for you as a form of practice for the "real thing" when the time comes.

As for how I learned to fly, I actually started off by performing "Hulk jumps" around the dreamworld. This is one of those jumps where you just leap hundreds of feet into the air, sort of like The Incredible Hulk. For whatever reason, this was intuitive and easy for me. It's something I just naturally believed that I could do.

What I'd advise is just think about what style of flight sounds most natural and comfortable to you. What could you see yourself doing? If you visualize yourself flying, how do you look?

I'd say to just use this style of flight first. Next lucid dream, just start flying. Believe that you are rising up into the air and flying. Not that you will do it, but that it's happening to you right now. If you encounter glitches or hang-ups in your flight, just deny that they're happening. Seriously. Just keep thinking about how well it's going, that your flying is just fine, etc.

Confidence and intent is everything! And never underestimate how much confidence can be generated via simple denial. :goodjob2: Good luck... you are going to love flying! :superman:

How deep into the dream phase do you have to be for it to count as a truly lucid dream? I had an experience on my second day of this course where I woke up, went back to sleep, but the dream I had seemed very light - I was well aware of my body lying in bed, but I could see the dream scene in front of me. It was like a daydream, but when I tried to change the lighting with my mind, I couldn't get it to work, which suggests it could have been more than just a daydream.

I've had lucid dreams of varying depth in the past. I have had lucid dreams where I had no sense of my body, and they used to terrify me. They were always set in my house and I would run scrambling towards my bedroom to try and find my body (probably down to sleep paralysis). More often, I have normal lucid dreams where I could easily wake up myself up if I got overexcited or if I just wanted to.

But those dreams where I just wake up and go back to sleep sometimes feel too light, like I'm just lying in bed fantasizing in the aftermath of a dream. Could this just be the precursor to the actual lucid dream? I'm just confused about what this state is.

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Originally Posted by Pickman

How deep into the dream phase do you have to be for it to count as a truly lucid dream? I had an experience on my second day of this course where I woke up, went back to sleep, but the dream I had seemed very light - I was well aware of my body lying in bed, but I could see the dream scene in front of me. It was like a daydream, but when I tried to change the lighting with my mind, I couldn't get it to work, which suggests it could have been more than just a daydream.

I've had lucid dreams of varying depth in the past. I have had lucid dreams where I had no sense of my body, and they used to terrify me. They were always set in my house and I would run scrambling towards my bedroom to try and find my body (probably down to sleep paralysis). More often, I have normal lucid dreams where I could easily wake up myself up if I got overexcited or if I just wanted to.

But those dreams where I just wake up and go back to sleep sometimes feel too light, like I'm just lying in bed fantasizing in the aftermath of a dream. Could this just be the precursor to the actual lucid dream? I'm just confused about what this state is.

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Good question, and very cool experience. It sounds to me like you were slipping into very heavy hypnagogic imagery or what I sometimes call "half-dreams". This is in fact a very good stepping stone to WILD (and ultimately a full lucid dream.)

People have widely varying styles of WILD, but the one I most often employ is to passively watch hypnagogic imagery as I wait for a dream to start. Eventually, if things go well, they'll coalesce into one of these half-dreams that's like what you describe. It's oddly vivid, but feels more like a daydream... like something that's just on the border between daydream and nightdream.

When the time is right, I'll will my dream-hand to perform a nose-pinch reality test, touch the dream-ground, or otherwise interact with the scene in some way. I try to do this by willing it to happen rather than using my muscles. If things go well, a lucid dream starts.

It sounds to me like you're very close and moving in the right direction! It's a delicate time, so try not to let the excitement get to you. If you'd like a little more about this kind of situation, Ophelia and I talked about this in the most recent episode of the podcast:
http://www.dreamviews.com/dreamviews...eamworlds.html

Thanks CanisLucidus, that clears it up. I didn't think it counted as a lucid dream, but I now know what to do next time this happens. I'll check out the podcast when I have time.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CanisLucidus

Hey GTom! Setting an intention certainly can't hurt. In particular, I'd recommend some visualization pre-bed or during WBTB, if that's your thing. Picture what flying will be like for you as a form of practice for the "real thing" when the time comes.

As for how I learned to fly, I actually started off by performing "Hulk jumps" around the dreamworld. This is one of those jumps where you just leap hundreds of feet into the air, sort of like The Incredible Hulk. For whatever reason, this was intuitive and easy for me. It's something I just naturally believed that I could do.

What I'd advise is just think about what style of flight sounds most natural and comfortable to you. What could you see yourself doing? If you visualize yourself flying, how do you look?

I'd say to just use this style of flight first. Next lucid dream, just start flying. Believe that you are rising up into the air and flying. Not that you will do it, but that it's happening to you right now. If you encounter glitches or hang-ups in your flight, just deny that they're happening. Seriously. Just keep thinking about how well it's going, that your flying is just fine, etc.

Confidence and intent is everything! And never underestimate how much confidence can be generated via simple denial. :goodjob2: Good luck... you are going to love flying! :superman:

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Thanks a lot! I'll try that tonight

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Originally Posted by GTom

Thanks a lot! I'll try that tonight

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Oh, I thought of another flying tip! If you have trouble getting moving, pick a destination or "target" spot and focus on it. Imagine yourself getting closer to it or zooming in on it. I did this in one of my lucids from this morning and I realized that I had not mentioned it!

Hey guys, I just got back from moving, and waiting a week to get my internet back! So I'll be catching up in here as well as overdue PM replies. Just letting y'all know.

Glad to see y'all were in very good hands though. Thank you CanisLucidus for keeping this ship afloat, as usual <3

I could use some advice on something.
When you're just a beginner, what are good goals or actions to perform when you hit lucidity the first few times?

I've been focusing on one specific goal for a while, but I either forget it or fail to achieve it.
What are nice easy to achieve goals to perform, you know, to get the doubt and insecurity out of the way.

And welcome back Ophelia

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Originally Posted by Booney

I could use some advice on something.
When you're just a beginner, what are good goals or actions to perform when you hit lucidity the first few times?

I've been focusing on one specific goal for a while, but I either forget it or fail to achieve it.
What are nice easy to achieve goals to perform, you know, to get the doubt and insecurity out of the way.

And welcome back Ophelia

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I think that one goal that nearly everyone has is to fly. It's just that thing that can't happen in waking life, so we just want to do it when we're dreaming.

Otherwise, what are your goals. Everyone has their own reasons for wanting to lucid dream, so you should listen to what you want to do. Maybe before you go to bed, think about why you want to lucid dream and what kind of stuff you want to do. You may say that you want to become a massive shark in a pool, eat everyone, then throw up potatos, or just tickle a dream character until their legs fall off. It's up to you. Perhaps for now, start with more simple things, and then work your way up as you become more confident. If you do find yourself in a position perfect for completing a goal you have, go for it! I'd create a list and keep it somewhere, then read it over every couple nights before you go to bed, and add things on as you come up with new goals :)

I also have a question. When I WBTB, will turning on a light in my room hurt the attempt at all? So, pretty much, Is it ok for me to wake up to WBTB, and turn on a light?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Booney

I could use some advice on something.
When you're just a beginner, what are good goals or actions to perform when you hit lucidity the first few times?

I've been focusing on one specific goal for a while, but I either forget it or fail to achieve it.
What are nice easy to achieve goals to perform, you know, to get the doubt and insecurity out of the way.

And welcome back Ophelia

---

I like both of DragonMaster21's suggestions below (flying as well as goals that motivate you.) These are great.

I'd add one more that I think is the perfect starter goal. As soon as you become lucid, make it your goal to fully drink in the vividness of the scene. Challenge yourself to examine something really, really closely and in great detail. Your hands are a good candidate, but anything in the environment will work. You will be astounded at how much detail your mind can generate. Take the time to really appreciate this.

I like this goal because it's both fun and mind-expanding. It helps you to learn that the dreaming mind is capable of vividness that rivals and and sometimes exceeds that of waking life. It will give you a new perspective on dreams. You'll understand better why NLDs are so good at fooling us. And you'll understand just how amazing your journey into lucid dreaming will be.

A great side effect is that it tends to dramatically raise the overall vividness of the scene. I've been trying it recently as a starter for my LDs and I'm loving the effects.

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Originally Posted by DragonMaster21

I also have a question. When I WBTB, will turning on a light in my room hurt the attempt at all? So, pretty much, Is it ok for me to wake up to WBTB, and turn on a light?

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I believe that the major risk with leaving lights on during a WBTB is that it could harm your chances of falling back to sleep. If this isn't a problem for you, I think that this should be fine.

Exposure to light will inhibit your melatonin production. That could make falling back asleep slightly more challenging. However, lower levels of melatonin allow your acetylcholine receptors to operate more efficiently. Without getting into too many details, I'll just say that this is generally a good thing for lucidity and dream recall.

I generally choose to leave the lights off because I'm always a bit worried about WBTB insomnia. A secondary reason is that I personally theorize that WBTB (or biphasic sleep) may be a very natural human sleep pattern, one that was common before the Industrial Revolution. Without artificial light, our ancestors would have done their natural "WBTB" in a condition of darkness or moonlight. It seems prudent to flow with that pattern.

Maybe I'll experiment with this, though! If you have the flexibility to try it out for yourself, give it a shot both ways. Pay particular attention to how long it takes you to fall asleep, as well as dream recall and how easy it is to achieve lucidity.

Oh yes, I do have a lot of flexibility. One of my problems is that, I'll admit it, I'm a bit afraid of the dark :cheeky: . I wake up, and I'm afraid of something that is not and will never be there. Maybe I just need to face my fear, wake myself up, and just sit there in the dark and just deal with it.

Another question, what are some things I could do during a WBTB? I also have a hard time staying awake for 10 minutes without getting bored and going to sleep. Also, when I wake up, I usually go to the bathroom, and the lights are on in there. Will < a minute of light exposure be the same as 20 minutes of light exposure or should I put up a night light so that it's dimmer.

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Originally Posted by DragonMaster21

Oh yes, I do have a lot of flexibility. One of my problems is that, I'll admit it, I'm a bit afraid of the dark :cheeky: . I wake up, and I'm afraid of something that is not and will never be there. Maybe I just need to face my fear, wake myself up, and just sit there in the dark and just deal with it.

Another question, what are some things I could do during a WBTB? I also have a hard time staying awake for 10 minutes without getting bored and going to sleep. Also, when I wake up, I usually go to the bathroom, and the lights are on in there. Will < a minute of light exposure be the same as 20 minutes of light exposure or should I put up a night light so that it's dimmer.

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No worries on any of that. Personally, I somewhat doubt that light is a make-or-break issue for WBTB so long as you have no trouble getting back to sleep. In fact, Ophelia's main WBTB approach used to be to get up for a while during the daylight hours of morning, get the kids off to school, and then go back to sleep.

To me, that says that as long as you can get back to sleep, it's probably not going to be a big problem. Definitely don't let it stop you from attempting WBTB unless you get insomnia. WBTB is just so effective that you hate to pass it up if you don't have to.

As for things to do to alleviate boredom, definitely give yourself something to look forward to. I like the idea of reading about lucid dreaming. At various times I've read Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming and Are You Dreaming? during WBTB. Another thing I've enjoyed is playing a low-key adventure game like Myst. I talked about this a bit in the most recent podcast: http://www.dreamviews.com/dreamviews...eamworlds.html

If you have something fun you look forward to doing, you'll be much more motivated to actually do it. Just don't have so much fun you forget to go back to sleep. :)

I'm asking another question about WBTB:
As you can see at the Competition #14 I'm becoming an expert on doing WBTB...with little results, he he, although I feel that's maybe because I rarely stay up for more that 15 minutes and I may need 30 minutes at least, so I need to work at that.
Anyways, back to my question, I've always consider myself a heavy sleeper, but I'm experiencing some episodes of insomnia now when doing WBTB, which is something new for me. How can I prevent and combat insomnia at WBTB?
Thanks in advance!

question where do i get my workbook? when should i do reality checks? and what should i do once i get lucid?

Hey guys! Sorry for the delayed reply. You Lucid Titan, CanisLucidus, is away for a couple weeks.

To dreambh: Something I've been hearing more and more about with folks who say "Once I'm up, I'M UP." My boss for example, can't go back to sleep once she wakes up in the morning, regardless of how early. I'm the opposite, and I can sleep in and/or nap forever. I'm not sure if that's your case or not, but if WBTB is depriving you of sleep, then I'd definitely go with DILDs. At least until you sort out your insomnia if that's the case.

To lucidcastle99: Start your workbook here as a new thread: Intro Class
Just click on the "+ Post New Thread" button on the upper-left of that page, and you're on your way! As for reality checks, do them as often as you remember to do them. The key is getting your brain used to remembering to do them more often, regardless if what reality check you use. Awareness!! Finally, what to do once you get lucid, have a pre-memorized set of goals. Maybe one easy one, and one difficult one (example for easy: pick a flower; example for hard: fly). Point is, that once you become lucid, it's nice to get goal-oriented right away so you can get your personal goals accomplished. Or, you can just sit back and watch a dream world unfold in front of you. You can have as little or as much control in the lucid dream as you want, choice is yours. :)

I've noticed something while attempting the DEILD technique - whenever I try to re-enter the dream I just had by thinking about it, it doesn't always work. So I give up and lie in bed daydreaming about something else completely, and then the daydream itself turns into a dream that could very easily become lucid. Sometimes a character will appear and start acting independently despite my daydream, or I will end up somewhere completely different from where I was trying to dream about.

Is it possible that I am trying too hard to re-enter the dream when I think about it, keeping me awake? Am I the only person who has noticed that daydreaming in bed can be more effective than the standard DEILD technique? I would love to hear anyone's feedback on this.

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Originally Posted by OpheliaBlue

To dreambh: Something I've been hearing more and more about with folks who say "Once I'm up, I'M UP." My boss for example, can't go back to sleep once she wakes up in the morning, regardless of how early. I'm the opposite, and I can sleep in and/or nap forever. I'm not sure if that's your case or not, but if WBTB is depriving you of sleep, then I'd definitely go with DILDs. At least until you sort out your insomnia if that's the case.

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Thanks for your reply OB, I could not read it until today because of a trip I was doing, but actually, circumstances made me forget about WBTB and I had two lucids on a week (which is a lot for me) so you were totally right! I'm not the "Once I'm up, I'm up" kind, but obviously not working too hard on WBTB did help a lot. :thumbup:

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Originally Posted by Pickman

I've noticed something while attempting the DEILD technique - whenever I try to re-enter the dream I just had by thinking about it, it doesn't always work. So I give up and lie in bed daydreaming about something else completely, and then the daydream itself turns into a dream that could very easily become lucid. Sometimes a character will appear and start acting independently despite my daydream, or I will end up somewhere completely different from where I was trying to dream about.

Is it possible that I am trying too hard to re-enter the dream when I think about it, keeping me awake? Am I the only person who has noticed that daydreaming in bed can be more effective than the standard DEILD technique? I would love to hear anyone's feedback on this.

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Great question (and approach!) I'd say that very likely yes, by falling back to daydreaming, you just relax and let it happen. To DEILD or WILD, you have a) stay aware and b) fall asleep. If you get them both done, you are good to go. It sounds like you had a) nicely dialed in but being overly intentional with dreaming was messing up b).

Doing whatever you can to relax while still holding on to your awareness is the way to go. It sounds like you've found your sweet spot! Congratulations! :goodjob: Keep experimenting and practicing with DEILD. The more of it you do, the easier the relaxation piece becomes. It is challenging at first but you can get way better at it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dreambh

Thanks for your reply OB, I could not read it until today because of a trip I was doing, but actually, circumstances made me forget about WBTB and I had two lucids on a week (which is a lot for me) so you were totally right! I'm not the "Once I'm up, I'm up" kind, but obviously not working too hard on WBTB did help a lot. :thumbup:

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Yeah, everything Ophelia said's good, so let me just add in the things that I do to avoid insomnia from WBTB.

First, I avoid excessive exposure to light. If I am going to have any lights on at all, I actually wear these crazy orange safety glasses that block out blue wavelengths of light. Do I look cool in these, you ask? As if you even need to ask. :shadewink:

Second, I move slowly, try to keep my heart rate low, and not get too amped up about anything. Reading is good, particularly if it's about lucid dreaming.

Third, when I return to bed, I just try to blissfully fall back into my MILD (or SSILD if I am doing that.) Think about nothing but dreaming. No waking life worries/concerns allowed, period. If there's a little trouble settling down my mind, I'll perform backwards counting while casually enjoying my hypnagogic imagery.

Fourth, I've gotten used to WBTB. It's normal for me to wake up at least once per night unless I'm sleep deprived. I'm very used to the pattern and more naturally fall back asleep now.

Fifth, sleep masks are pretty awesome. They make it super dark and you get boosted hypnagogic imagery. The kind I've got even has these shaped eye sockets so I can blink/open my eyes without my eyelashes touching it.

Good luck!

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Originally Posted by CanisLucidus

Great question (and approach!) I'd say that very likely yes, by falling back to daydreaming, you just relax and let it happen. To DEILD or WILD, you have a) stay aware and b) fall asleep. If you get them both done, you are good to go. It sounds like you had a) nicely dialed in but being overly intentional with dreaming was messing up b).

Doing whatever you can to relax while still holding on to your awareness is the way to go. It sounds like you've found your sweet spot! Congratulations! :goodjob: Keep experimenting and practicing with DEILD. The more of it you do, the easier the relaxation piece becomes. It is challenging at first but you can get way better at it.

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Thanks for the reply, it's good to know that I'm on the right track. I guess I was so fixated on reentering the dream that I had just experienced, and I thought that having another dream completely would be making things too difficult.

Hello! I wonder, has anyone else experienced DC's who you feel are out of place or context in your dream, not only by how they look or act but also by the feeling you get when you meet them? /K

Hi guys!
Just had a somewhat weird experience: I was in a normal dream, went to bed, had a FA within that dream scenario which I turned into a lucid, then woke up from the lucid in still the same normal dream (where I went to bed and had the FA), and journaled the lucid. Then woke up for real and was like "A dream perfectly nested within a dream, and on top of that, lucid??" :shock:
Full dream: http://www.dreamviews.com/blogs/drea...n-dream-50953/
I've tagged it as lucid, but I'm not 100% sure. What do you thing, Is that just a weird lucid, or something like "a normal dream about getting lucid"? (if that is even possible) :uhm:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kactus

Hello! I wonder, has anyone else experienced DC's who you feel are out of place or context in your dream, not only by how they look or act but also by the feeling you get when you meet them? /K

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I've certainly gotten experiences where somewhat bizarre characters appear out of nowhere, but I get the sense that you're driving at more than that.

Were these perhaps especially intelligent-seeming/aware dream characters? I have a subset of DCs that appears to be incredibly smart, intelligent, and act like they're aware of me and what I am. I've taken to calling them "smart DCs". Was it anything like this?

I'd love to hear more about what you experienced! Tell us more. (If you're comfortable doing so.)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by dreambh

Hi guys!
Just had a somewhat weird experience: I was in a normal dream, went to bed, had a FA within that dream scenario which I turned into a lucid, then woke up from the lucid in still the same normal dream (where I went to bed and had the FA), and journaled the lucid. Then woke up for real and was like "A dream perfectly nested within a dream, and on top of that, lucid??" :shock:
Full dream: http://www.dreamviews.com/blogs/drea...n-dream-50953/
I've tagged it as lucid, but I'm not 100% sure. What do you thing, Is that just a weird lucid, or something like "a normal dream about getting lucid"? (if that is even possible) :uhm:

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So cool... an incredible experience, but don't feel weird about it! The exact same thing has happened to me before. In my case it was from performing an in-dream WILD from a non-lucid dream, which I find usually works immediately to make me lucid. But the act of "waking up" sometimes robs me of lucidity.

When you think about it, it's very normal to have lucidity fall away in any false awakening. What's interesting here is that the location chosen for the false awakening was the same one that you entered the dream from. It makes sense that your mind would build in that expectation, so you can see how this could happen.

Here's a DJ entry from me that's a lot like what you described: Fooled - Dream Journals - Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views

Very cool, man!

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Were these perhaps especially intelligent-seeming/aware dream characters? I have a subset of DCs that appears to be incredibly smart, intelligent, and act like they're aware of me and what I am. I've taken to calling them "smart DCs". Was it anything like this?

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I think you hit it when you wrote that.
I had the feeling that this particular DC was something more, an observer perhaps, 'she' knew, and was aware that I was there and what I was doing. What interests me was that, I'm Lucid, totally aware of this DC and yet absolutley knew her very well, even though she was a total stranger. There was no other interaction other than I could see 'her'

Perhaps I'm seeing part of myself or perhaps she 'exists' and Jedi mind tricked me :) It's a bit of a rabbit hole and really fascinating to think about.

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Originally Posted by Kactus

I think you hit it when you wrote that.
I had the feeling that this particular DC was something more, an observer perhaps, 'she' knew, and was aware that I was there and what I was doing. What interests me was that, I'm Lucid, totally aware of this DC and yet absolutley knew her very well, even though she was a total stranger. There was no other interaction other than I could see 'her'

Perhaps I'm seeing part of myself or perhaps she 'exists' and Jedi mind tricked me :) It's a bit of a rabbit hole and really fascinating to think about.

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I completely agree. These types of DCs are amazing. When you next get the opportunity, definitely take the time to talk with her/him and see where the conversation goes.

It's like the rest of the time you've been interacting with "extra" in your personal lucid movie and then suddenly you run into one of the A-list stars. I'm not sure when or why the dreaming mind calls up these kinds of DCs or what they represent, but the experience is great! One of my longer-term goals is to become good at consistently summoning this type of "smart DC".

Hey, if you have another such encounter, I'd definitely be interested in hearing about it!

Missed opportunity a few days back, very disappointed, found myself during a WILD attempt becoming conscious within a void of blackness, unable to move. Rather than turn this opportunity into something productive I succumb to fear and doubt, worried by the fact I couldn't move physically. It has happened before but this time it took me by surprise and so I wasn't mentally ready.

When it happens again I want to be ready, I have chosen to make a specific visualisation, maybe one object:
question 1. (if this is possible in the void?), or some words to say when this happens, the idea is that it stops me instantly going into anxiety mode and helps me view the situation as something positive and almost as a gift from which I can launch a LD.

It wasn't an unpleasant state until my Brain got in the way and this will be a good practice for me to face a fear if (when) it happens again.

I'm sure someone else has experienced this void many times and I have read the Dreamviews Wiki explanations of what it is, but I would like to ask: Question 2. If others have a specific strategy or routine, something they do in order to transition into a LD from the void, is it just a matter of visualisation and immersion? If there is a forum link to some useful info It would be much appreciated:) K

Hey Kactus! I work from the void very, very frequently so I'd be happy to tell you what I do. The main thing is to not worry. Seriously, the void is an awesome place to work from once you get used to it. You're subject to very few schemas that could limit you and your imagination so it can often be a shortcut to your goals.

The first thing I suggest is to take for granted that you have a dream body. Just immediately start rubbing your hands together. If some sense of doubt makes you believe that you are immobilized... rub your hands together anyway. :D

Don't even go to the trouble of denying that you're stuck. Just act. Believe you are already rubbing your hands together. Ignore anything and everything else that distracts you from what you want to do and you'll succeed.

So step 1 of my playbook is to begin rubbing my hands together. After that I keep verbally reminding myself that I'm having a lucid dream, keeping those hands rubbing together all the while. I'll often imagine myself walking forward as well. Sometimes I'll reach out, expecting to grab onto something.

Typically, a scene will eventually emerge from out of the void and I'll become part of it. Sometimes you can simply think about the scene that you want and it will appear.

Another fun technique I've used is to stick my hand out and call for a DC to pull me out of the void. Sometimes I'll ask for help from a friend, a DC from a recent scene, or just nobody in particular. Most of the time this results in a DC grabbing my hand and yanking me into a new scene. Very fun when this one works out. :)

If you'd be interested in a few concrete examples, I tag my dream journal as "void" any time I work from there. Here's a list of my own void experiences:
Lucid Dreaming - Dream Views - CanisLucidus - Dream Journals

Anyway, I hope some of that helps! Hey, would it be cool if we perhaps took on this question in a future podcast?

Thanks For the info CanisLucidus! That's absolutely what I was after. Something to focus on, now I have a strategy, I think this is going to really help. If I can get the whole rubbing hands and dream body thing going instead of that initial 'get me out of here reaction' I will be really pleased. Think I will postpone the hand out to DC until I'm a little more comfortable in there :)

It's also comforting to hear that you have experienced this void many times and turned it to your advantage, I look forward to getting stuck into your 'void' journal entries. On a side note I slipped into a DILD last night and tried out your rubbing hands together idea for the first time, Top Tip! Kept me Lucid for ages... Was a good one:)

thanks again and absolutely feel free to add the question in the podcast:) K

That's awesome, Kactus, I'm glad that the hand-rubbing worked out so well for keeping you in the dream! It's a great reminder for me as well to throw that in there every once in a while, even when I'm not in the void.

You've got exactly the right attitude. It took me ages to figure out that the void was no big deal and that the dream can in fact continue on just fine. This opens up so many possibilities for keeping dreams going. Took me so long to figure this out, so I hope I can save you guys some time on this one! It was a very hard-won lesson for me.

Good luck, Kactus, and congratulations on las tnight's DILD by the way! :goodjob2:

Is much appreciated CL thank you. I'm certainly not there yet though, I have a lot of experience to gain. I was in the void last night after an early morning baby feed. I bought on the hand rubbing (could feel but not see them) Imagined my dream body, good so far, was in there twice as long as before, so fear factor and anxiety level was down. Even tried to imagine a DC pulling me in but I felt it was too loose and effort and not really committal enough to work this time (mistake I think) For some reason I missed the self talk also ' you are in a LD'.

Overall though, a big improvement and I truly felt that I was so close this time. I was awoken by an adrenaline rush in the end:) I think a few more experiences to tune in will do it! Good advice, thanks again.

That all sounds perfect! Great improvement already!

The most important part is that you are seeing for yourself that the void is just another dream state, a transition point to the next part of your dream.

Love all this great experimentation and practice! Keep having fun! :content:

Hey I just started to practice lucid dreaming about 4 days ago. (I've been interested way before that) I've been remembering at least a dream a day for the past couple days which is definitely motivating me not to stop. I just wanted to know if it's normal to wake up in the morning, not remember a dream, then go to sleep for a few minutes and then remember one. Does it count? Btw this website it awesome :)

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Originally Posted by lucidstruggler

Hey I just started to practice lucid dreaming about 4 days ago. (I've been interested way before that) I've been remembering at least a dream a day for the past couple days which is definitely motivating me not to stop. I just wanted to know if it's normal to wake up in the morning, not remember a dream, then go to sleep for a few minutes and then remember one. Does it count? Btw this website it awesome :)

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Hey lucidstruggler! Congratulations on the steady, consistent recall. Totally agree about how motivating that is. It took a long time for lucid dreaming to click for me, but until it did, the increased dream recall kept me very entertained while I learned the ropes. I still get a lot of enjoyment out of my NLDs even on nights where I don't have a lucid.

As for your question, yes, waking up and then going back to bed can make a huge difference in dream recall. Waking up for a bit before returning to sleep increases your memory and critical thinking abilities, which is a great enhancer for dream recall as well as a huge boost to your chances for lucidity. In lucid dreaming circles, this is referred to as "Wake Back to Bed" or "WBTB".

The early morning time is when we have our longest, richest cycles of REM sleep, which is when we do the most dreaming. These cycles get longer and closer together later in the morning, so your timing sounds perfect. Your newly invigorated brain is a lot more likely to hold on to any dreams you have during this time and you're more likely to LD as well.

If you can, keep doing these WBTBs! If you settle into them with a strong intent of having a lucid dream, it will work for you one of these days! If any questions arise, hit us up right here and we'll help you out. :goodjob2:

Hi, I just wanted to know: can an adrenaline rush from the day before carry over into your night's sleep and have weird effects that induce lucidity? If you have any insight on this, I would like to know so that I can use this knowledge to instigate lucid dreams on my workout days.

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Originally Posted by Pickman

Hi, I just wanted to know: can an adrenaline rush from the day before carry over into your night's sleep and have weird effects that induce lucidity? If you have any insight on this, I would like to know so that I can use this knowledge to instigate lucid dreams on my workout days.

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Great question, very interesting. The thing with something like a workout is that there are so many effects on the body that could have some influence. We'll be speculating, but hey, speculating's good fun, right? :)

If I'm lucky, this'll be a little experiment for me that I can get back to you on. Just finished up a nice workout of deadlifts and dips about 30 minutes ago, so let's see if I can't manage to break this dry spell. :goodjob2:

I do have several ideas of what possible effects could be, though none are specifically related to adrenaline. Have you observed anything in particular on big workout days?

Hi CanisLucidus,

What I observed this weekend was more hypnogogic imagery while going off to sleep, and longer, clearer, more vivid dreams when I was asleep. As I mentioned in my thread, the content of my dreams was so bizarre that I knew I was dreaming twice.

Right now I'm convinced that it is some weird body chemistry thing, possibly down to an abrupt change. I had not gone to the gym in over a month, and I started crossfit on Saturday afternoon. Crossfit is a high intensity workout that involves olympic-style lifts, gymnastics and low rest periods. It was the most intense workout I've ever done - the trainers pushed me to my limits and then some. I seriously thought I was going to pass out unconscious, but after my limbs had finished trembling post-workout I spent the rest of the evening on a kind of high.

I'm trying to link the above experience to times in my life when I experienced similar dream states with high recall, crazy imagery and lucidity, or near-lucidity. First, there was the time when I woke up in the night after somehow getting an abrasion on my eyeball. I got back to sleep despite the pain and irritation. Second, there was the time that I went to bed after eating an energy bar (bad idea), and despite my racing pulse I fell asleep and went straight into a lucid dream that I was convinced was an OOBE (although it probably wasn't).

I know we can only speculate here, but if you have any ideas I would be interested to hear it.

Weird conisidences. I think CL got his ld after the workout as well. Well, exercising has lots of positive effects - increased circulation, flow of oxygen and nutrients, increased levels of neurotransmitters, neurogenesis. Here's an abstract that might explain things.

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Exercise has been touted to do everything from treat depression to improve memory, with the power to cure a host of problems while preventing even more. In particular, exercise leads to the release of certain neurotransmitters in the brain that alleviate pain, both physical and mental. Additionally, it is one of the few ways scientists have found to generate new neurons. Much of the research done in this area has focused on running, but all types of aerobic exercise provide benefits. Although the exact nature of these benefits is still being determined, enough research has been done to provide even skeptics with a motivation to take up exercise. Exercise exerts its effects on the brain through several mechanisms, including neurogenesis, mood enhancement, and endorphin release. This paper not only examines how these mechanisms improve cognitive functioning and elevate mood states, but also proposes potential directions for future research. Furthermore, it provides an explanation for exercise's generally non-habit forming nature, despite effects on the reward centers of the brain that mimic those of highly addictive drugs like morphine.

One of the most exciting changes that exercise causes is neurogenesis, or the creation of new neurons. The new neurons are created in the hippocampus, the center of learning and memory in the brain (1), however the exact mechanism behind this neurogenesis is still being explored. At a cellular level, it is possible that the mild stress generated by exercise stimulates an influx of calcium, which activates transcription factors in existing hippocampus neurons. The transcription factors initiate the expression of the BDNF (Brain-Derived Neurotrophic Factor) gene, creating BDNF proteins that act to promote neurogenesis (17). Thus the generation of BDNF is a protective response to stress, and BDNF acts not only to generate new neurons, but also to protect existing neurons and to promote synaptic plasticity (the efficiency of signal transmission across the synaptic cleft between neurons, generally considered the basis of learning and memory) (1, 3, 17). However, BDNF's effects are more than protective, they are reparative.

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So, yes, working out is really good for you and your brain and can help you with lds. It should be part of lucid living! :D

Thanks for that NyxCC. I thought the changes might have had something to do with changes to brain chemistry or something along those lines. It would probably explain why my recall is rubbish when my diet is rubbish and I haven't been working out.

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Originally Posted by NyxCC

Weird conisidences. I think CL got his ld after the workout as well. Well, exercising has lots of positive effects - increased circulation, flow of oxygen and nutrients, increased levels of neurotransmitters, neurogenesis. Here's an abstract that might explain things.

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Agreed... exercise is awesome. And you are indeed right, Nyx -- got my most recent LD right after a workout!

Like Nyx said, different types of exercise can have positive effects on your circulating levels of neurotransmitters like serotonin and dopamine. (This depends somewhat on the type of exercise, which I won't get into too much.)

Now, for something more speculative. :) In addition to all of this, physically fit people are more insulin sensitive. Their bodies react quickly and efficiently to insulin. It's like the opposite of type 2 diabetes.

Furthermore, you are at your most insulin sensitive right after a good training session. So what's this mean for your blood chemistry?

After hard training, your muscles pull in branched chain amino acids (BCAAs) from your bloodstream. That's how muscles repair from the workout and ultimately grow larger and stronger, and this whole process is mediated by insulin. This may have some interesting downstream effects on neurochemistry. BCAAs and tryptophan share the same transport protein (in particular CD98). As BCAA levels in the bloodstream drop (due to being pulled into your muscle tissue), it likely frees up these transport proteins to shuttle more tryptophan into the brain.

And it's well-established that tryptophan is converted to serotonin in the brain, which ultimately leads to REM rebound, and more intense bouts of morning dreaming.

So there's my speculation. :) If you get a good workout and be sure to get enough sleep to take advantage of that REM rebound, I think there's a good chance it would have positive effects on dreaming. So get strong as hell, get lots of sleep, and don't forget to question your reality. :D

Excellent explanation, CL! Thanks for sharing these insights! :)

Thanks CL, that sheds some light on what happens after a workout.

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Originally Posted by CanisLucidus

After hard training, your muscles pull in branched chain amino acids (BCAAs) from your bloodstream. That's how muscles repair from the workout and ultimately grow larger and stronger, and this whole process is mediated by insulin. This may have some interesting downstream effects on neurochemistry. BCAAs and tryptophan share the same transport protein (in particular CD98). As BCAA levels in the bloodstream drop (due to being pulled into your muscle tissue), it likely frees up these transport proteins to shuttle more tryptophan into the brain.

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That suggests that taking BCAA supplements post-workout might counteract the effects. But then if those supplements contain tryptophan it might not make any difference - it might even lead to a surplus of tryptophan to be transported to the brain. This is just me being very speculative. My dreams were the same for the next four nights. It is only since last night that my dreams have started to calm down. I haven't done any intense exercise since. Just seemed like an interesting correlation.

Thanks for citing NyxCC - this is such an important thing to know, that physical exercise boosts the brain - just as meditation does.
And - I like your speculations Canis - got to give this some deeper thought, later.
The blood-brain-barrier has it´s own breed of transporters over this barrier - but it would make sense, that more does pass, when more is on offer so to speak.
I try to read up on it!
Cheers for that!
:)

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Originally Posted by StephL

Thanks for citing NyxCC - this is such an important thing to know, that physical exercise boosts the brain - just as meditation does.
And - I like your speculations Canis - got to give this some deeper thought, later.
The blood-brain-barrier has it´s own breed of transporters over this barrier - but it would make sense, that more does pass, when more is on offer so to speak.
I try to read up on it!
Cheers for that!
:)

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Hey Steph! Thanks, and you are right on the money thinking about the BBB here. That's so important when considering how any supplement or activity might affect neurochemistry.

If you're interested in further reading, most of my speculation is based off of the effect that carbohydrates have on serotonin levels. This is generally agreed to be the cause for what in the United States we call "Thanksgiving sleepiness". Basically, after everyone pigs out on Thanksgiving day, they generally feel really sleepy and a lot of times wind up napping in the afternoon.

This is due to the effect that carbs have on transport protein availability, which is similar to the effect I'm speculating about. MIT did a great study on this: Effects of normal meals rich in carbohydrates or proteins on plasma tryptophan and tyrosine ratios

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Dietary carbohydrates produce major, insulin-mediated decreases in the branched-chain amino acids but lesser reductions in plasma tryptophan, thus raising the plasma tryptophan ratio (6, 9, 10) and facilitating tryptophan’s entry into the brain (13).

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Anyway, if this is something you're interested in, this paper does a good job of covering some of the issues around how transport proteins can affect serotonin levels in the brain.

How much sleep would be a good amount per night to maximize dream recall. Also Are there any simple foods, drinks or exercises that could improve recall, and, or lucidity?

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Originally Posted by FreeUnity

How much sleep would be a good amount per night to maximize dream recall. Also Are there any simple foods, drinks or exercises that could improve recall, and, or lucidity?

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Hey! I meant to reply to your PM, but I'll just answer here in case other's are interested in the same Q&A.

The amount of sleep is really different for everyone. Of course too little sleep (less than 6 hours) and you might not be able to recall but a few fragments, if that. Too much can hurt too. If you sleep more than 8-10 hours or so, and don't write down your dreams each time you wake up from a cycle, then by the time you finally get up for the day, it's possible to have forgotten them all. Which is extra frustrating when you remember you HAD dreams, just not what they were. So my best advice is to figure out what your magic number of hours is through experimentation, probably anywhere between 6-8 hours total. But also to keep a journal right by your bed. That way, if you're practicing WBTB within this time frame, you can right down your dreams along the way. Journaling your dreams at all is another great way to improve recall.

On supplements, I don't really indulge. But the most common all-natural help for dream recall and vividness that I read about on this site is B6 or foods high in B6 like fish or bananas. There's a subforum devoted to this that you might find helpful: Lucid Aids Check it out, and please report back if you stumble across anything that works for you!

I heard WILD'ing is in a raw form entering REM or a dream immediately after falling asleep, so it's not technically necessary to wake up and then go back to sleep. Have you heard this as well? Or is it just a corrupted source on my part? And then all the other amazing basic knowledge you have of WILD's.

Hey RB,

I haven't personally heard it phrased like that "WILDing is in a raw form entering REM." I'm wondering if what they were saying was, maybe you don't wake up completely 100% between cycles, prior to a WILD, even though you may be aware that you're lying down, and in bed, and trying to go back to sleep and dream. I can see that being a possibility, because 99% of the time when I WILD, it starts out in my bed, and I'm in the same position I was just in when going through my usual WILD transitions (I get the buzzing vibrations thing). Even pillows and blankets are the same, maybe a few odd differences that help me know the dream has for sure started (like suddenly my comforter is the wrong color, or the doors and windows are in the wrong place). Anyway, the point I'm making is, maybe I'm not even fully awake when I'm lying in bed, thinking I have awoken, and am trying to transition into the WILD. That would be really hard to say for sure, unless I did some major RC which could disrupt the transitions altogether. Would be an interesting experiment sometime for sure!

And if those thoughts aren't weird enough, CanisLucidus just had an experience, hope he doesn't mind, where he thought he had awoken, had a convo with his wife, then proceeded to go back to sleep and transition into a WILD. Come to find out, he never actually woke up and spoke to his wife. He had a false awakening (FA), then proceeded to WILD. In essence: inducing a WILD while in a nonlucid dream hah! Crazy.

So maybe it doesn't really matter if you're truly awake or not, as long as you're AWARE, and can go through the steps of entering the lucid dream without losing awareness. Which is what a WILD is. Whether the "W" in WILD stands for "Wake" or "Well, I thought I was awake," doesn't matter if it leads to a lucid dream anyway.

Not sure if that answered your question, but it really did get me thinking. I'd be interested in CL chiming in on this one as well.

Newbie Question, :D

Is their a way to prohibit or "block" something from happening in a dream?

And one more, :D

I am going to try FILD tonight, and I was wondering, would that be good for a starter? It seems easy without side effects, and I know its not one of the official ways of LDing, but it seems so great. :)

Also, when I try to have WILD I just sleep without my body paralysing before. odd.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by RebarGold

I heard WILD'ing is in a raw form entering REM or a dream immediately after falling asleep, so it's not technically necessary to wake up and then go back to sleep. Have you heard this as well? Or is it just a corrupted source on my part? And then all the other amazing basic knowledge you have of WILD's.

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Yeah, a WILD is transitioning from a waking state to a sleeping state without losing your awareness. It is possible to do this when first laying down to sleep at the beginning of the night, but it's generally regarded as a much more difficult maneuver than WILD w/ WBTB (Wake Back to Bed).

WILD w/ WBTB means waking up after 5-6 hours of sleep, staying up for a bit, and then laying back down to attempt a WILD. This strategy makes awareness easier to attain and makes periods of REM and heavy dreaming much more likely to occur quickly. The more quickly the dreams hit, the less time you have to maintain your awareness after falling asleep. That's why WILD works so much better with WBTB.

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Originally Posted by OpheliaBlue

And if those thoughts aren't weird enough, CanisLucidus just had an experience, hope he doesn't mind, where he thought he had awoken, had a convo with his wife, then proceeded to go back to sleep and transition into a WILD. Come to find out, he never actually woke up and spoke to his wife. He had a false awakening (FA), then proceeded to WILD. In essence: inducing a WILD while in a nonlucid dream hah! Crazy.

So maybe it doesn't really matter if you're truly awake or not, as long as you're AWARE, and can go through the steps of entering the lucid dream without losing awareness. Which is what a WILD is. Whether the "W" in WILD stands for "Wake" or "Well, I thought I was awake," doesn't matter if it leads to a lucid dream anyway.

---

True story! I want to give Daniel Love credit for summing it up like this: to lucid dream, we just need two things: awareness and a dream. With a WILD, we hold onto our awareness and try to add the dream onto that awareness.

The DILD is the other way around -- it's all about becoming aware while already in a dream. In my case, I had a DILD by going through an in-dream ritual of a WILD. It felt like an instantaneous version of the real thing. Pretty crazy stuff, and worked amazingly well!

Hey Twitch!

I'll answer the last question first, because it's quite possibly the most important in the land of WILDing. It's actually not necessary to seek out or even notice any kind of sleep paralysis or REM atonia (<< PC term, since SP is actually a separate medical condition), when WILD transitioning. In all the WILDs I've ever had, I experience all kinds of weird stuff, but anything even remotely related to paralysis has only happened maybe 3-4 times tops. I got some great threads for you to check out on all that:

http://www.dreamviews.com/wake-initi...explained.html
http://www.dreamviews.com/wake-initi...ntry-wild.html

Next question from bottom to top, yes I think FILD is not a bad method at all. I personally haven't researched it a lot, but I have heard of several members having luck with it. And because, like you said, there are no side effects, there's nothing wrong with experimenting with it and seeing where it goes. It's all just about retaining as much awareness as possible while falling asleep, in hopes that you'll enter a lucid seamlessly (WILD), or if somehow the finger movements will carry over into a nonlucid and spark your awareness (DILD).

Finally your last question about blocking something from happening in a dream. Are you talking about dream control in a lucid, or preventing nightmares in nonlucids?

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Originally Posted by TwitchLucidity

Is their a way to prohibit or "block" something from happening in a dream?

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Hi TwitchLucidity! Not a newbie question at all!

I find that the only truly effective way to block something is to never try fighting it. Instead, simply deny it any of your energy.

If a negative thought occurs to you, turn your attention away, brush it off, minimize it any way you can. Distract yourself and overwhelm yourself with positive thoughts. If you refuse to focus on the negative thing you fear, it has no energy to feed on and will simply die off. This takes some discipline and practice (I often fail at it myself!) but it is very effective.

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Originally Posted by TwitchLucidity

I am going to try FILD tonight, and I was wondering, would that be good for a starter? It seems easy without side effects, and I know its not one of the official ways of LDing, but it seems so great. :)

Also, when I try to have WILD I just sleep without my body paralysing before. odd.

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I'm afraid that I don't have any experience with FILD, so I can't comment specifically on it!

As for WILD, it is totally normal not to notice any sensations of body paralysis. In fact, in every time that I have performed a WILD, I have never once experienced sleep paralysis or body freezing of any kind. I wouldn't spend any time worrying about this because a) many, if not most people don't notice anything like this b) it can distract you from the important thing -- staying aware while you enter a dream.

If you are into WILDs, Sageous has some excellent material in his class: WILD The lessons are highly recommended reading!

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Originally Posted by OpheliaBlue

Hey Twitch!

I'll answer the last question first, because it's quite possibly the most important in the land of WILDing. It's actually not necessary to seek out or even notice any kind of sleep paralysis or REM atonia (<< PC term, since SP is actually a separate medical condition), when WILD transitioning. In all the WILDs I've ever had, I experience all kinds of weird stuff, but anything even remotely related to paralysis has only happened maybe 3-4 times tops. I got some great threads for you to check out on all that:

Next question from bottom to top, yes I think FILD is not a bad method at all. I personally haven't researched it a lot, but I have heard of several members having luck with it. And because, like you said, there are no side effects, there's nothing wrong with experimenting with it and seeing where it goes. It's all just about retaining as much awareness as possible while falling asleep, in hopes that you'll enter a lucid seamlessly (WILD), or if somehow the finger movements will carry over into a nonlucid and spark your awareness (DILD).

Finally your last question about blocking something from happening in a dream. Are you talking about dream control in a lucid, or preventing nightmares in nonlucids?

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Dont need to answer the last one now, but thank you. :D

And also thank you Canis, cant figure out how to quote two posts. .-. Anyways, I am sorry I asked all these questions. These are all just the things that being new to Lucid Dreaming can do to you, :P

No it's great that you ask! Not just for yourself, but other new members or students may want to see them answered as well.

And yes to what CL said about energy. For some reason, brute force or fighting fire with fire in a lucid dream doesn't always defeat the beast. That's because, and I preach this all the time, emotions drive dreams. So the more positive thought and energy you can put out in a dream, the less likely negative characters or negative elements will be able to distract your dream from where you want it to go. Also simply ignoring negative things and walking them off proves helpful.

Example of a true story: I was having a lucid where I was walking down a hall, and a big bear showed up and bit my hand. Instead of fighting it and wasting dream time and energy with all that, I just thought to myself "ew, annoying bear," as if it were an annoying fly, and turned right into a bathroom and shut the door. Bear gone.

Okay, so I am going be trying FILD tonight and I have a feeling it will work.

So when I do a reality check after FILD, and it works, do I just step out of my bed and completely start my dream or will I spawn somewhere when I open my eyes or something. Just curious, so I dont freak out and think I have a False Awakening.

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Originally Posted by TwitchLucidity

So when I do a reality check after FILD, and it works, do I just step out of my bed and completely start my dream or will I spawn somewhere when I open my eyes or something. Just curious, so I dont freak out and think I have a False Awakening.

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Well you know, either is possible. When I WILD for example, I usually start out in my bed. With more practice, I bet I could imagine a scene someplace else. I will say that while it is common to start the dream in your bed in your room, don't let that fact trap you into a FA. What I do is just assume that I've started a dream everytime I wake up. That way I don't get tricked by FA's as much. It makes a big difference doing it that way, because I've missed a lot of chances at becoming lucid in the past when I got caught up in a FA. Now I don't neeeearly as much.

Hope you met with success last night!

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Originally Posted by OpheliaBlue

Well you know, either is possible. When I WILD for example, I usually start out in my bed. With more practice, I bet I could imagine a scene someplace else. I will say that while it is common to start the dream in your bed in your room, don't let that fact trap you into a FA. What I do is just assume that I've started a dream everytime I wake up. That way I don't get tricked by FA's as much. It makes a big difference doing it that way, because I've missed a lot of chances at becoming lucid in the past when I got caught up in a FA. Now I don't neeeearly as much.

Hope you met with success last night!

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Ah, thank you. I would really like to start my dream off from scratch, would love it. :)

Nope, 0% success with FILD so at the end of my REM sleep (WBTB Way, I also figured out when my REM sleep happens) I just dream-chained using MILD. See what happened on my Workshop, :)

I seem to be a participating student, :)

Okay, so I have this Binural Beat track on my MP3, but it loops the song no matter what I hit.

It has two stages, the song, one: take me into deep REM sleep
Two: Waking up the mind while sleeping for LDing.
Now, like I said, my MP3 loops that song. So is their a track that would be fine to loop or is this track fine to loop all night?
I dont want it to loop and bring me deeper into sleep and keep waking up the mind, I would be messed up. :P

Yes you are!

I have never experimented with binaural beats. The intro class doesn't really get into lucid aids all that much, so I don't have much advice for you there, sorry :)

Statistic questions! We get to see how many people are as crazy as I am!
Plodding onwards:

I've never had a dream, lucid or not, in which I wake up in a bed. Or wake up at all. Is even close to normal?"
I have rarely, if ever, became lucid with a reality check. I just understand the situation at what seems to be an unprecedented occasion at the start of my dreaming. Is that normal?
I never dream in a straightforward, pseudo-awake way: No plot-line is standard. Hoodies always have monsters hiding in the seams that I must battle with a quintuple-edged razor in each hand. This is probably the closest to normal.

I am just the opposite. I have never had a lucid dream that did not start with me waking up in bed. The only thing that varies so far is whether or not I leave a body in the bed behind me when I get up. I have read that your dreams are greatly influenced by what you expect to happen. Perhaps I just have become acustomed to a monotonous life that always starts with climbing out of bed in the morning. Maybe I will become more adventurous as I progress.

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Originally Posted by TwitchLucidity

I seem to be a participating student, :)

Okay, so I have this Binural Beat track on my MP3, but it loops the song no matter what I hit.

It has two stages, the song, one: take me into deep REM sleep
Two: Waking up the mind while sleeping for LDing.
Now, like I said, my MP3 loops that song. So is their a track that would be fine to loop or is this track fine to loop all night?
I dont want it to loop and bring me deeper into sleep and keep waking up the mind, I would be messed up. :P

---

I have a HemiSync track that is 8 hours in length, and is expected to be listened to all night, but the binaural beats are hidden in the sound of the ocean so it is relaxing. I have a binaural beats app on my phone, and have to say, I think my head would explode if I listened to that thing for 8 hours straight. Do you find that they help you? I have tried them on and off, and haven't really noticed much of a difference.

My WILDs always start out in my bed, but my DILDs happen within the context of the dream scene that's already been established. And when I WILD, I don't leave a body in the bed. This is one of the reasons I used to get tangled up in false awakenings so much.

Hey everyone!

Ok I have a couple of questions.

WILD - I have been close I think maybe even achieved it for a second but not really sure about wilds. The other night I was falling asleep and I was very very relaxed and still realized that I was awake. I had the floaty feeling and didn't really feel my body. I decided to try to wild from this point since I could be there. Now this buzzing people are talking about, I think this started but I am not sure. It seemed quite a bit more violent than I had anticipated and I could feel my breaths getting stronger and almost harder to breathe. Is this normal? I have been finding it very difficult to keep that little seed of awareness while letting your mind drift. I will get it one day.

Supps - I am a fan of trying supplements. A few of my dreams have been supp induced and my longest one yet was supp induced. I do have them naturally as well but I think I am I guess stupider in my non supp induced dreams. I never remember to do what I want to do. Anyways I was wondering if anyone knew about some of these supplements or has tried them. I have done some research and read here and there that this works and that works but nothing concrete. GABA - im interested in this but not sure if it will inhibit REM. Thought about taking this during WBTB to relax myself again.
GPC - This seems similar or an alternate to choline to me.
Yohimbine - not much about this except it is good for noepenipheran (sp?)
Passion flower and kava root for relaxation.
St Johns Wort - Similar to 5htp?
L-dopa - neurotransmitter

I have been experimenting here and there but it takes quite awhile and there are so many different combinations and methods that its quite overwhelming. I try some new combo once or twice a week, but usually they mess my sleep up a bit and I NEED my sleep. Any info is great.

Thanks

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 501

WILD - I have been close I think maybe even achieved it for a second but not really sure about wilds. The other night I was falling asleep and I was very very relaxed and still realized that I was awake. I had the floaty feeling and didn't really feel my body. I decided to try to wild from this point since I could be there. Now this buzzing people are talking about, I think this started but I am not sure. It seemed quite a bit more violent than I had anticipated and I could feel my breaths getting stronger and almost harder to breathe. Is this normal? I have been finding it very difficult to keep that little seed of awareness while letting your mind drift. I will get it one day.

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Hey 501! Yes, it definitely sounds like you were experiencing the transition sensations people will sometimes experience during a WILD. This sounds perfectly normal and nothing to worry about. In 90% of my WILDs, I experience no transition sensations at all. But on occasion they'll be a rough, exciting ride with lots of sensations of motion/weird sounds, etc.

You can certainly have a WILD without any of this stuff, of course. (Most of mine don't feature this kind of thing.) So my advice would be to just not focus too much on that stuff, stay relaxed, and stick to the (often tricky) task of keeping your awareness alive while you drift off to sleep.) Sounds like you were doing a great job! If you're really into WILD, Sageous' course materials are superb... check them out if you haven't!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 501

Supps - I am a fan of trying supplements. A few of my dreams have been supp induced and my longest one yet was supp induced. I do have them naturally as well but I think I am I guess stupider in my non supp induced dreams. I never remember to do what I want to do. Anyways I was wondering if anyone knew about some of these supplements or has tried them. I have done some research and read here and there that this works and that works but nothing concrete. GABA - im interested in this but not sure if it will inhibit REM. Thought about taking this during WBTB to relax myself again.
GPC - This seems similar or an alternate to choline to me.
Yohimbine - not much about this except it is good for noepenipheran (sp?)
Passion flower and kava root for relaxation.
St Johns Wort - Similar to 5htp?
L-dopa - neurotransmitter

I have been experimenting here and there but it takes quite awhile and there are so many different combinations and methods that its quite overwhelming. I try some new combo once or twice a week, but usually they mess my sleep up a bit and I NEED my sleep. Any info is great.

---

I have used a number of different supplements, and my general advice is to keep really good records, always start with low doses, and favor caution over aggressiveness. Not only is this better for your health, but it presents much less risk of tolerance and desensitization.

If you're using supps, you will definitely want to check out Thomas Yuschak's book Advanced Lucid Dreaming: The Power of Supplements. It's filled with great info on how to make the most of this approach and he does a good job covering strategies for health and safety. And it especially covers galantamine, the king of lucid dreaming supplements.

None of the following is an endorsement of these supplements, but a list of what I know about the ones you mentioned.
GPC - Yes, similar to the choline salts but with a longer, gentler concentration curve.
Yohimbine - I've never tried this one, but it's pretty nasty stuff overall. Yuschak got results with it in micro-doses (like 1/20th of a cap!) This just has too many side effects IMO. I'd recommend sticking with safer stuff.
St Johns Wort - The effects of this one are complex, but it definitely affects serotonin. You always want to be cautious with anything that affects serotonin, so you'd never ever mix this with 5-htp, SSRIs, MAOIs, or anything like that.
L-DOPA - You'd only ever want to use the L-DOPA present in mucuna pruriens extract. (The synthetic stuff like Levodopa has been found to have far more side effects than the natural stuff in mucuna pruriens.) L-DOPA tends to raise dream confidence and dream control ability but can also make dreams less stable.

Again, always exercise caution first and foremost. Your core practices are what will really bring you lucid dreams, so use caution, stick with low doses, and don't get in a hurry.

Thanks CanisLucidus,

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CanisLucidus

In 90% of my WILDs, I experience no transition sensations at all. But on occasion they'll be a rough, exciting ride with lots of sensations of motion/weird sounds, etc.

If you're really into WILD, Sageous' course materials are superb... check them out if you haven't!

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The other one I guess you could say I had (probably 3 to 5 seconds long) was a very smooth transition. I was just relaxing and drifting in and out and pow I was in it, then pow I was out of it since the dream hadn't formed completely and the excitement jerked me out.

I don't know if I am really into it or not since I haven't really don't it yet and had a good experience. WILD is a hard one for me to do unless I am very tired, I usually only try if I am home alone (on that rare occasion) and I can lay down for at least an hour.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CanisLucidus

If you're using supps, you will definitely want to check out Thomas Yuschak's book Advanced Lucid Dreaming: The Power of Supplements.

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I have read the PDF file from Thomas Yuschak and that is where I got the little cocktail for my longest lucid. It was a good read and I really got a lot out of him talking about the transitions into WILD, what they feel like and what to expect.

For some reason I embedded one of the supplements I was most curious into the paragraph above the list of supps.
GABA - to me this looks to be similar to maybe valerian root? with a major calming effect. I am curious however if it suppresses REM and if it can be taken with G or the two work against each other.

I don't know if it is out there but I am looking for my magic formula, and no rushing for me. seems like every other time I do try supplements I am up half the night.

I am able to have maybe one lucid a week without the supps usually. I am really just getting into the game and am continuing on honing my skills.

Thanks again for the info.

I have had two dreams where I have realized I'm dreaming, and while I know this counts as a level of lucidity, this isn't the level that I had when I first lucid dreamed. In these dreams, I know I'm dreaming, but it’s like there is still this fuzzy wall between me and the rest of the dream world. Like, you know how you might be watching a movie and it’s so exciting you forget you're watching a movie until the credits role? That's what would be a non-lucid dream for me. These semi-lucid dreams are more like what it feels like to watch a rather boring movie and be acutely aware of every second that's passing as the movie happens. What I'm trying for is the feeling you would get if you were actually starring in the movie. That's the level of lucidity I had when I first lucid dreamed.

Are these semi-lucid dreams an indicator that I am doing things right?

Hrmm, in these semi-lucids, are you able to engage with other dream characters at all? Or does the thought never even cross your mind while still in the dream?

Um, I guess I really didn't think to. I figured I had to be more lucid before I could engage in lucid dream-like activities so instead of trying to fly or talking to DCs, I was trying to figure out ways to increase my lucidity.

Actually you can begin engaging in activities as soon as you're aware you're dreaming. Even if it's a bit blurry or you feel somewhat disconnected from the dream, as long as you can remember what task or goal you want to complete in the dream, just go for it. I find that being goal-oriented in itself acts as a stabilizer for the lucid dream, because it gets my mind off of "omg I have to stabilize or increase lucidity now".

Good to know. Thanks. Next time I will be sure to try that. :]

I had an experience that peaked my interest the other day and it made me think about the way we remember our dreams and the reasons behind the need to write them in a journal in order to achieve that.
as I was walking down the street absent-minded I suddenly remembered a scene from a dream I had the night before in which I was gazing at a beautiful night sky that was almost completely filled with twinkling stars. I felt a surge of strange emotions that I can't find the correct way to describe, although I'm pretty sure they were in the -Awe and Wonder- section of my brain :P.
Even though I remembered just this tiny bit, I'm sure that the dream was amazing. I'm quite fascinated by the fact that I can get emotional from a dream that I don't even have recollection of!
Maybe our brains handle dreams differently because a myriad of sections in our brains are turned on and others off during sleep. It also seems that emotions play a rather important role in recalling our dreams. I found out that, for me at least, the more emotional the dream, the more memorable.
What are your thoughts on the subject?

Being someone who doesn't feel emotions very deeply in my dreams, this is not the case for me. I have found that whether or not I am able to recall a dream depends more on the amount of sleep I've received. For example, I woke up at 4:30 this morning (after having gone to sleep at 1) with no recollection of any dreams. However, after going back to sleep and re-awaking around around 9AM, I was able to recall 2 fairly elaborate dreams. I am under the impression that whether or not I remember a dream depends mainly on how tired I am. But I imagine its a little different for everyone.

It probably is a little different for everyone, but it does seem that I hear more reports of folks getting swept up in their emotions during dreams more often. And for me, that's one of the reasons I sometimes lose focus and therefore lose lucidity or the dream altogether. Some of this is because of a lack of proper awareness (a discussion for another time), but I do believe you're right Kaenthem, that certain brain centers are more active during sleep, and others less so compared to the waking state. So it's just a matter of being aware of this, and training yourself to handle those states more efficiently to maximize you lucid experiences. This is something that for me, takes practice. Lots of it. But it's worth it. :)

When writing in your dream journals..do any of you guys remember snippets of previous dreams?? While I'm writing my dreams down I always remember super random parts of another dreams that I feel like I had a long time ago! :?

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Originally Posted by ldreamer77

When writing in your dream journals..do any of you guys remember snippets of previous dreams?? While I'm writing my dreams down I always remember super random parts of another dreams that I feel like I had a long time ago! :?

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For me, definitely yes! A huge part of dream recall is this skill of one memory leading to another memory, which leads to an emotional residue, which leads to a dream fragment, which leads to a phrase, etc.

So much of dream recall is about chasing all these pieces down and spooling them back up into your waking memory.

So yeah, not only does that sound normal, I think it's a sign of good dream recall skills. :goodjob2:

What CL said.

I feel downright naughty when I don't keep up with my DJ, for this very reason. All the fragments or dreamlets (or face it, even some lucids) that get forgotten when we don't practice good dream recall...

Hey Guys!

I have a quick questions regarding WBTB.
Is it necessary to actually get out of bed? If so, is there a particular reason why it is necessary?

Also I've been trying FILD for a week or so, but I always lose concentration to do it very quickly. Is there any way to keep moving the fingers slightly while not focusing on it? :S

Thanks! :D

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Originally Posted by Riseofashes

I have a quick questions regarding WBTB.
Is it necessary to actually get out of bed? If so, is there a particular reason why it is necessary?

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I think that the most important element of WBTB is spending the right amount of time (whatever that is for you personally) truly awake and not dozing. For me (and probably for most people), this is easiest to do when you actually get out of bed and allow your mind to move just a bit into waking life mode.

WBTB seems to benefit from the brain being actively engaged in some task, particularly one tuned toward lucid dreaming. I'd imagine that if someone sat up in bed and read about lucid dreaming for 30 minutes, this would work just as well as physically getting up and moving around.

And truthfully, when it's WBTB time, I find that I almost always can stand to pee, which makes getting out of bed pretty natural. :)

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Originally Posted by Riseofashes

Also I've been trying FILD for a week or so, but I always lose concentration to do it very quickly. Is there any way to keep moving the fingers slightly while not focusing on it? :S

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Unfortunately, I just don't have any experience with FILD. Wish I could help you there, but good luck!

So I've been going for about three weeks, my dream recall is way up. I've been doing WBTB pretty religiously, but simply. Any tips or readings on how to get WBTB to work better for me? Check out my workbook if it helps.

me: teacher!! how do i make a workbook?? do i just make a thread that is called workbook??

Hey, goldenphoniex. Yep, you make a workbook thread! More info here: http://www.dreamviews.com/intro-clas...sons-i-iv.html You can also have a look at other workbooks as examples if you're stuck on what to put in yours. :)

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Originally Posted by ColdRusalka

So I've been going for about three weeks, my dream recall is way up. I've been doing WBTB pretty religiously, but simply. Any tips or readings on how to get WBTB to work better for me? Check out my workbook if it helps.

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Hi ColdRusalka! Congratulations on the increased dream recall. That's a very important step on the way toward regular lucid dreaming, so you're doing important work there. I'd say that it's one of the most important foundation skills for LD.

The direction of my advice would depend on what kind of trouble you're having. If you're having trouble falling back asleep, I'd push things more in the direction of keeping WBTB shorter and working to really relax your mind as you drift back to sleep. For situations like this, clearing your mind and employing tricks like backward counting should be helpful.

Now if the issue is more that the results just don't come like you'd hope/expect, the most important thing would be to focus on the idea of lucid dreaming while you're up and during the time you're falling asleep. Spend that time thinking about lucid dreaming or reading about it, and as you fall back asleep, let yourself marinate in the idea that the very next thing you experience is going to be a lucid dream.

The idea is to really saturate your mind with the idea of lucid dreaming as you prepare to go back to sleep so that it becomes more and more likely for the idea of lucid dreaming to occur to you at the right time. When this notion strikes you at a moment of high awareness / high recall, you are very likely to become lucid at that point.

The second thing you can do in this situation is play with a longer WBTB period. Stephen LaBerge's experiments at the Lucidity Institute showed that longer periods of wakefulness led to an increased likelihood of lucidity in general. In some cases, the difference was dramatic! Here's the study:
Wakefulness Makes Lucidity More Likely

Ophelia showed me this one a while back and it was eye-opening. A lot of people do well with short WBTBs, of course, but this shows that a longer period could be well worth experimenting with, particularly if the results haven't been what you'd hoped.

So overall: play with WBTB length, and spend that time carpet-bombing your brain with the concept of lucidity. That makes it so much more likely for your brain to remember, however vaguely, that you were about to have a lucid dream. Good luck!

no one has posted anything on my workbook. :( have i done anything wrong with my workbook?? :confused:

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Originally Posted by goldenphoniex

no one has posted anything on my workbook. :( have i done anything wrong with my workbook?? :confused:

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No of course not.

I replied in there, and so did Fuzzman, if you want to go check it out.

I have a question. If someone with (hypothetically) no natural way of gaining lucid dreams or even vivid dreams, so basically someone who has to learn A LOT before getting any results, would consistently use and practice all the guides and rules and tips from others on this site. Do you think that he/she would be able to come to a point where he/she gets an LD daily?

So TL;DR: Can ANYONE get an LD daily?

From what I have seen, what I have read and from experiences what I can tell you is it really depends on the person. If a person is very focused on being an LDer, practices ADA (all day awareness), does constant RCs (reality checks) and always gets plenty of sleep then maybe, MAYBE he or she could have an LD every day.

For the most part I would think the normal amount for someone who practices LDing and is decent at it is a few to several a month. I think just about every on this site wishes they could have an LD every day but usually it is the select few natural LDers on here that even have a chance.

When I first started my research in this area I was hopeful that I would be able to have one every night but to this point I think I have had two nights in a row as my maximum.

I do remember reading someones journal who was practicing a lot and really really trying to have an LD every day and it seemed they were making good progress. I believe their screen name started with dolphin.

Good luck on your quest!

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I have a question. If someone with (hypothetically) no natural way of gaining lucid dreams or even vivid dreams, so basically someone who has to learn A LOT before getting any results, would consistently use and practice all the guides and rules and tips from others on this site. Do you think that he/she would be able to come to a point where he/she gets an LD daily?

So TL;DR: Can ANYONE get an LD daily?

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It is possible but it does require work and persistence. We have some very frequent lders here that have started from close to zero lds to lots of lds, some on a daily basis. We hold competitions from time to time (DVA, General Lucid dreaming) that give a glimpse of what's possible.

I think the key to more lds is never give up on lding and slowly work your way up. It may take a while to get there but it's totally worth it! :)

A lucid every day is something that for most people takes a lot of work, but it can be done. (Not by me yet, though! :P)

A good example of a super-frequent lucid dreamer is hukif, who typically experiences multiple lucid dreams every night. He was not a natural lucid dreamer but spent several weeks obsessively trying to come up with a technique that made him constantly aware of his state. (Whether he was dreaming or not.)

His personal technique was to in the back of his mind be constantly aware of how gravity felt. His dream gravity had a slightly different feel that he could reliably discern from waking life, and he took advantage of that by making it a rather constant background process in his brain to see how gravity felt.

This may almost sound easy when you read the description, but from what I gather he was extremely obsessive and focused during this time, also trying and rejecting several other ideas that just didn't have a high enough success rate. It takes serious work and dedication (more than I think I can personally afford), but it can be done!

Thanks for the replies.
Awareness is also the thing I am going for. I've yet to have my first LD though. But once I get it I plan to work on my dream awareness so that I can find out what the differences are for me personally. And what I should be focusing on. It's good to know that it is possible:) And don't worry I am in no rush. I'm still working on my recall as of now, and I have some other things I probably have to work on, like stabilization. I'm just taking things steps at a time. At this point I'd be thrilled with 1 LD a month. :D

Since this is the Q&A I'll just be dropping another question I have here if you guys don't mind. Basically I have started my DJ 4 days ago. And I can recall about 3 dreams, on average, a night. Though this seems to get higher and higher. Two days ago I knew I had 5, though I forgot 1 or 2 of them, because I didn't write them down immediately:doh:.
Google says the average Joe has 3-5 dreams a night. With 7 being really high. So does this mean I somehow already remember every single dream? I also seem to wake up after each one automatically. Could that have anything to do with it?

I guess it's a good thing. But knowing why seems important to me, so that I can possibly abuse it :D

Thanks!

Again everyone is different and this totally depends on your sleep cycles and how much sleep you are getting. Sleep cycles are usually about 90 minutes and your REM periods get longer during each sleep cycle. It is possible to have dreams in non REM but REM is where a majority of your dreams occur. If you get 6 hours of sleep a night that is about 4 sleep cycles and its a good chance you will have some sort of dream during each of those. If you get 9 hours of sleep then you should get around 6 dreams. A lot of my dreams chain together very strangely so what may seem like 4 separate dreams is actually just a chain of dreams with a strange type of transition between them. Sometimes I lay very still after I wake up and just think what I was just doing, then I work through my dream backwards and try to remember key points and then build the details off of those key points.

While it is good to remember a lot of dreams a night try to think about details in your dreams, colors, smell, touch, taste, really describe what you see around you, absolutely everything you can remember. I have slipped in this a bit but the more you try to remember about your dreams the more likely you will spot something that isn't quite right and maybe become lucid. I can sometimes get a good 6 or 7 pages of detail from a single dream.

Great job keeping up the journal, try not to let it slip even when it gets time consuming. Start looking for dream signs in your journal as well, so if you see that in real life you do a RC every time and there is another good way to get lucid.

It is good that you wake after each cycle, just remember to either write down your dream or jot some notes at least.

Well there is my two cents!

I'm at 9hours of sleep most of the time. So I guess I have some room for improvement:)

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Originally Posted by 501

Great job keeping up the journal, try not to let it slip even when it gets time consuming. Start looking for dream signs in your journal as well, so if you see that in real life you do a RC every time and there is another good way to get lucid.

It is good that you wake after each cycle, just remember to either write down your dream or jot some notes at least.

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It's good that you mention that. I was just thinking today that the Journalling was getting quite tiresome. I had about 2 pages 2 nights ago. Mostly 2 dreams. I can easily imagine it getting to a point where it is 5+ pages every morning. I'ts quite hard to start writing down a dream in the morning when you know you will be writing for while.(I am quite lazy in the mornings :cheeky:) Then again, I know I regret it when I don't write them down, because I really wanna know what it was about:P Also I love reading them again. That's enough motivation for now.
I hope it get's easier when it's more routine though. Or that I find other ways to make it more enjoyable.

Anyways, thanks for your 2 cents!

In the first lesson, it says to list the times you naturally go to sleep and wake up. I wake up to an alarm every day, so how would I list that? Also, it says to do an RC when you notice something weird in the day. I don't really know what would be considered weird, and can't you just do an RC whenever? Also how and where would I list the RC's in my workbook as well? For each, would I just make a new post in my workbook each day and list all my RC's and the weird thing I noticed and then the times I went to bed and woke up?

Also, it says to establish a night time routine, how would I go about doing that?

Finally, I read that Hukif created his own RC that works for him. I think it was the Gravity RC or something like that. In this course, are we encouraged to do and create new things that work specifically for us? And would we get help with that?

Thank you for the help.

EDIT: Also, in the dream journal, do we have to list every single detail and write it like a story? Because I remember multiple dreams a night in detail and once it took me 3 hours to write all my dreams out, and I don't have time for that everyday. So is there a different way to do it?

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Originally Posted by Sharpshoey

In the first lesson, it says to list the times you naturally go to sleep and wake up. I wake up to an alarm every day, so how would I list that?

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If you always use an alarm, then don't worry about it. I'm the same way.

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Also, it says to do an RC when you notice something weird in the day. I don't really know what would be considered weird, and can't you just do an RC whenever?

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Personally I do both! But it's nice to practice RC when something really freaky happens, or when you notice a dream sign, as well as just randomly throughout the day.

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Also how and where would I list the RC's in my workbook as well? For each, would I just make a new post in my workbook each day and list all my RC's and the weird thing I noticed and then the times I went to bed and woke up?

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Yes, that's how I would do it. The workbook can be anything that helps you, so you can customize it how you want.

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Also, it says to establish a night time routine, how would I go about doing that?

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Here's an excellent guide: http://www.dreamviews.com/attaining-...-lucidity.html

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Finally, I read that Hukif created his own RC that works for him. I think it was the Gravity RC or something like that. In this course, are we encouraged to do and create new things that work specifically for us? And would we get help with that?

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Oh yeah, the gravity RC is a great one. But basically, an RC is just anything that increases your awareness in a particular moment, including sensory and thought.

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Thank you for the help.

EDIT: Also, in the dream journal, do we have to list every single detail and write it like a story? Because I remember multiple dreams a night in detail and once it took me 3 hours to write all my dreams out, and I don't have time for that everyday. So is there a different way to do it?

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I know what you mean, I have long ones too alot haha. I would say, write every detail down if you have problems with dream recall. Since you don't have that problem it seems, then you have the option of recording your dreams if that's faster, or what I do sometimes is just bullet point a bunch of important bits.

Thank you for the reply. You helped me out a lot.

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Originally Posted by Sharpshoey

Also, it says to do an RC when you notice something weird in the day. I don't really know what would be considered weird, and can't you just do an RC whenever? Also how and where would I list the RC's in my workbook as well?

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Everything Ophelia said!

To add though, the anything weird part is pretty important since dreams are often very weird. If you find yourself during the day asking "why is that like that?", "why is that person doing that?" or even "hmmmm. thats weird." just do a good RC to make sure its real. Believe me the first time you do this in a dream and realize its a dream is quite an exhilarating moment and you will be in utter amazement that this is actually a dream. I was so excited for my first 15 or more that I would usually wake myself up almost right away.

I do random RC throughout the day, usually asking myself questions about the environment or checking my hands (has been my favorite). If you notice that sometimes you get very angry or emotional very easy or you cant find stuff. If I am really mad or stressed all of a sudden I always do an RC and when I cant find something I do an RC.

This is another reason that dream journals and dream signs are so important so that when you see them you will do an RC. For instance one of my dream signs is water. So when I am by a pool, in a pool, or by any water I do an RC.

Good luck to ya!

Firstly, I'd like to say that this is my first post on Dream Views and that it has been a wonderful resource thus far. Anyway, last night I had what I'm fairly certain was a lucid dream, because I was completely in control of my actions in the dream world. I kept checking my hands and telling myself that I was dreaming so that I didn't wake up, but maybe 5 minutes into the dream, I could feel myself in my physical body. It was as though if I did anything in the dream, I would do it in real life, like I woke up but could still see the dream as a foggy image. My question is whether or not this was due to me not properly stabilizing the dream, and also I was wondering if this has happened to anyone else?

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Originally Posted by morrilet

Firstly, I'd like to say that this is my first post on Dream Views and that it has been a wonderful resource thus far. Anyway, last night I had what I'm fairly certain was a lucid dream, because I was completely in control of my actions in the dream world. I kept checking my hands and telling myself that I was dreaming so that I didn't wake up, but maybe 5 minutes into the dream, I could feel myself in my physical body. It was as though if I did anything in the dream, I would do it in real life, like I woke up but could still see the dream as a foggy image. My question is whether or not this was due to me not properly stabilizing the dream, and also I was wondering if this has happened to anyone else?

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Welcome, morrilet! Congratulations on the lucid dream! :goodjob: This is a huge milestone. If you stick with your practices, that was just a taste of all the cool stuff that's ahead for you!

I've had this sensation of losing my connection with the dream and becoming more aware of the physical body. In general, the best advice is to just remain focused on the dream. Think only of the fact that it is a dream and do something intense and sensory, like touching some part of the dream scenery. Really take in the detail of the experience and draw yourself into the dream world. Something as simple as rubbing your hands together can be a good way to stay locked in.

If you still see the dream as a foggy image, this may also be a good time to perform what's known as a "DEILD" (or dream exit-initiated lucid dream). Sometimes upon waking from a dream it's easy to slip back into dreaming. You can try just holding on to your awareness and focusing only on the scene that you were just in. If all goes well, a new dream will begin with your awareness still intact. From there, just go have more fun! :goodjob2:

Congratulations again and let us know how you do! Keep up the good work and enjoy the journey. :)

Hi everybody! Long time no see, hope everyone's doing fine.
Anyways, I have noticed lately that I can't shake the feeling of being pulled down by gravity, not even when I day dream let alone when it's an actual dream and, because of that, I can't fly in my lucid dreams. So what's the trick here?

Hey Haithem! Always great to see you around here! :content:

I've actually never tried shaking the feeling of gravity in day dreams, interesting. That is probably a difficult thing to manage because in a day dream, physical reality is there acting upon you and would be very hard to ignore. In dreams, though, the only gravity that matters is what we do or do not allow to influence us.

If I have a little flying glitch, I find that the most effective thing is to just pretend the problem isn't happening. Seriously. :) I'll think, "Nah, I'm flying just fine..." and things will start heading in the right direction.

Focus all of your thoughts on success. Keep yourself so busy thinking about what IS working that it crowds out doubt. You simply won't have space in your brain to accommodate the fears that might hold you back! The whole dream experience is created by you, and if all you can think about is success, success is the only possible result! :goodjob2:

Another fun trick is to point at what you're flying toward to really focus yourself on your goal and destination. Concentrate your mind on that, your goal, and again leave no room for the other things that are distracting you. Don't worry about avoiding thoughts of failure. Just bombard yourself with thoughts of success and it will all happen naturally.

If you find yourself really getting hung up, other wonderful modes of transportation like the "Hulk Jump" are extremely viable too. (This is a super high amplitude jump in the style employed by The Incredible Hulk!) :D

Good luck! I assure you that you can fly like a bird in your lucid dreams. If you believe that, too, you'll soon get to see it for yourself! :superman:

A little while ago, I laid down on the couch and closed my eyes. When I did, my eyes began spazzing out and moving automatically. And it moves faster and faster every few seconds. And what is weird is I can feel something on the sides of my head when my eyes are closed for too long. Sorry if this is a stupid question, but is this normal? Is it anything related to sleep or anything? Or is it just my imagination? And the feeling begins to press against my cheek if I close my eyes for a very long time.

Hey nexus, welcome to intro class! :)

I have heard from a few members that they have noticed that their eyes begin to move before entering a dream. Personally, I don't notice my own eye movements. This seems to be something natural, especially if you think that one of the sleep phases is called REM (Rapid eye movement).

How long should I keep a DJ before actually LDing or trying to do the methods such as DILD and WILD?

Hi Edward! Personally, I don't see any reason to wait on trying out the basic techniques like DILD! I think that it's great to keep lucid dreaming on your mind as well as to go to bed with the intent of having a lucid dream.

Both of these practices should make DILDs more likely as well as help you to pay more attention to your dreams, a likely boost to recall.

If something like WBTB fits into your life and sleep schedule, this is another technique that dramatically increases the chances of having a DILD as well as improving your morning dream recall.

So I'd say don't be afraid to perform some of these basic practices alongside your journaling! They're quite complementary. Good luck, looking forward to seeing how you do! :goodjob2:

Alrighty, As I stated in my workbook - it's been 4 years since I've visited this site and lots has changed it seems. And all good changes.

Blah blah blah. On to the question already....

Is it harder for older folk to LD than youngsters? 49 years young.

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Originally Posted by scottiesdreamin

Is it harder for older folk to LD than youngsters? 49 years young.

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Welcome, scottiesdreamin! It's great to have you in the class.

I've heard concerns that this might grow difficult with advanced age, but I wouldn't worry much about this at only 49! IMO the tougher issue for lucid dreamers of working age is dealing with the demands of family life, lack of sleep, stress management, etc.

I can think of a few very frequent lucid dreamers your age or older. I recall a member who was 48 lucid dreaming several times per night, every night. I don't know Sageous' age range but I think he's older than you and is one of the most advanced lucid dreamers on the site.

With plenty of sleep, plenty of desire, and plenty of consistency, you will succeed! :goodjob2:

hi everyone i have a quick question. i haven't started with my LD practice yet since I'm still working on my dream recall.
I'm on day 7 and I woke up not remembering if i had a dream or if i just forgot my dream.

so what do i do then? it seems i skipped a day with no dream recall progress. do i start over?
and another thing, i don't know if i should start the awareness exercises yet since I'm still working on my dream recall
and i don't know when is a good time to start with that. so how should i get this started?

thanks for any feedback, much obliged teachers. :)

Hi LucidMateus! No worries on having a no- or low-recall night! It happens to absolutely everybody from time to time. You've got many nights ahead of you, so no big deal.

Let's also take a moment to acknowledged how great it is that you had 6 nights in a row with dream recall! This is great! :goodjob:

I recommend just picking up from where you left off. Feel free to start a little awareness training as you go while continuing to focus on your dream recall. Keep it positive and low pressure, since this awareness training takes some time to get used to.

Don't feel like you have to be too rigid with any of this or be disappointed when things don't work out quite as you planned. Just enjoy those dreams as they come!

My general recommendation is to move on to adding a little bit more whenever you feel ready and excited to do so. Just avoid ever stressing yourself out -- keep it fun, always!

Good luck and I'm looking forward to watching your continued progress! :goodjob2:

If I was going to sleep in the afternoon to try and get a LD, approximately what time would be the best? Should it be a certain amount of hours after you wake up? Or a specific time of day? And if you were going to do this, would they best way be to go straight in with a WILD?

Hey Mysticaldipshit! Ideally it should be closer to your wake time rather than your bed time, but there are no strict timing rules. I'd suggest to experiment with napping 2-6 hours after wake to find your optimal time. You can use any induction method for your naps. Good luck! :goodjob2:

thanks a lot sir canis. :) will enjoy every bit of this journey. thanks for the response. :rockon:

Hello dream-professors!
My question is: I've read here and there about semi-lucidity in some dreams (well, I read it in some DJ entries to be more specific), which I didn't really understand. I've searched a bit through the forum and I haven't found anything related to it.
Last night, I had a "LD", where I forgot to stabilize the dream and I went just to the first task that came into my mind. It was all kind of blurry, too, and I would say I wasn't really thinking completely straight, like maybe being a little drunk. I could, however, try to perform the task (with not-so good results as you can see on my DJ entry xD).

Would you guys call that a semi-lucid dream? And, if not, what would be for you a "semi-lucid" dream?

Thanks in advance!

Hi Tuckson, I think people refer to semi-lucids as having both characteristics of nlds as well as lds. The basic premise of lds and those semi-lds (if you decide to call them such) is to have awareness that you are in a dream. In an average lucid dream you would have more of this awareness and it would be easier to detach yourself from the dream scenario and determine your actions without being too much influenced by what is happening in the dream. Say, if you dream you are in school and know you are dreaming, you can do whatever you want and you also don't worry about dream scenarios such as being late or without homework. The lucid dream you described above sounds like a normal lucid dream to me.

With a semi-lucid dream or some peole may call it a low level ld, you would still know you are dreaming, but will be more engaged in a dream scenario. If someone chases you, you continue running away as if in danger even though you know it's a dream. Or you know it's a dream but decide to go to class anyways. There are no strict rules for classification though and these are just examples of what a low level ld or semi-lucid might be for a particular person.

If you find yourself having more of these semi-lucids, the thing to do is to try to detach from the dream scenario so that one doesn't lose lucidity altogether. Having a task to perform when becoming lucid is an excellent way to do this, so with your ld from last night you were on the right track. :goodjob2:

Awesome explanation, NyxCC.
Ok, I know now what people mean by semi-lucidity and I can better figure out what happened to me during that dream. As you say, it wasn't a semi-lucid dream, but a LD with low general awareness (the blurry sensation, the not-so-clear mind, ...) probably due to the weird day and bizarre evening I had just before going to bed.

Thank you very much! ;)

I want to add a dream snippet; do I "reply to thread"? I feel like that would be replying on the last person's snippet? Thanks!

Yes, you can scroll below the last post in the thread and post your snippet in the quick reply field, just like you would in your workbook. :)

Thank you.

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Originally Posted by OpheliaBlue

Hello Intro Students & Staff!!

If any of you students have a question regarding this class, your workbooks, or anything dream related, this thread is basically a place where you can "raise your hand if you have a question." Important questions, issues, and concerns can sometimes get lost in pages and pages of workbooks, and we don't want anything to get missed.

So if any of you feel like you had a question but it either wasn't answered, or not answered well enough, direct us to it here! I or one of the staff will make sure that you get the answers and attention you need.

Thanks for participating in the DreamViews Academy :)

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I can't work out how/where to start my work book. :alien:

Hi Patience108!

Just scroll down the page in the main intro class forum and click on Post New thread. Give your workbook a title and the relevant info below and you're set. :)

Actually here's the direct link for starting a workbook:

http://www.dreamviews.com/newthread....ewthread&f=151

Thank you :) have started work book now. Umm will it be just for me to write in or do you Dream guides look in it to help us newbies? I am working with the dild tutorial by Puffin and one by Naiya but not a 100% happy with practice yet - it's realy hard to stick to one visualisation or even critical question:ninja:

Good! You can post your progress there. We periodically check the workbooks, can give tips or answer any questions you have there (or here if you decide to post your question here). :)

How long does it take for reality checks to seep into your dreams once you start practicing them? I tried quite a bit doing them yesterday. Would it take like a week or something?

Hey oneiroer! It's different for everyone. It could take anything from a day to a month or even more. It would also depend on how often you do those and how mindful you are. The greater the quantity and quality, the higher the chances that these will show up in dreams. Keep up the good work and let us know when then do show up. I think this is pretty cool experiment in itself to see how and when our thoughts and actions are incorporated in dreams. :)

I already posted this question in my workbook. Sorry if that is a no no..

Question for the teachers here. Or anyone else knowledgeable on the subject. So I want to become good at MILD, and become good at being aware all day. I think that this would build the foundation for me to be a skilled LD'er. Am I wrong?

Also, as recommended by Exploring the World of Lucid Dreaming, I am practicing my prospective memory. Should I scrap that, and go for MILD techniques linked to in Lesson 2?

I have good recall. Would it be a lot to ask for someone to give me a checklist or guide to building the foundations for great MILD/DILDing? I'm already meditating. Should I start with dream yoga? DDA? Should I only do the dream yoga visualization techniques. I just feel kind of clustered.

Any help is appreciated. Thank you guys!

Hey Jacko! I would suggest especially in the beginning to pick one tech and not do too many techniques that are very different from each other. If you feel especially drawn to MILD, then try some MILD exercises for at least two weeks. After this time, you should be able to tell if there is any difference to your awareness and also evaluate how you feel about the technique overall. Ideally, try sticking to a tech for about a month to see results. As you get more adept, you can add other techs or just slowly incorporate additional elements in your routine.

Let us know how it goes! :)

Thank you very much for your response! I am going to stick with MILD for at least a month. I believe a big part of MILD is being aware. In Lesson 3 it says for more info on meditation, feel free to look at the dream yoga class. I guess I just was a little clustered.

Anyway here's my plan:
-Do sporadic awareness each day with increasing frequency, working towards ADA
-Work on the dream yoga visualization training(I don't feel I am good with visualization)
-Do DDA/Dream incubation. I will set my intent on becoming lucid, and do visualization and mantras
-daily meditation

I have high hopes! Well I'm off to start getting ready for bed, but I am going to update my workbook tomorrow to match the outline I just laid down here. Let me know if you have any tips! Once again, thank you very much.

Hey there. I'm assuming a yes to my question.

Question: do I have to write my dreams on this site for you to be able to give me personalized advice?
Reason: making a DJ habit is hard so I write it in Swedish-English and in my own words. One of those words are "three-layered cake stair." So I can't copypaste my DJ, I'd have to rewrite it.
Clarification: I still write down all the details I remember and look for patterns in the dreams.

Hey there Ebtn,

To get some personalized advice, I would suggest staring a workbook in one of our classes. You don't need to put up and translate all of your DJ entries but if you like to share a specific dream then you can use our journal functions and also put a link to the dream journal entry in your workbook. You can also ask us some questions here or in your workbook. :)

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Originally Posted by NyxCC

Hey there Ebtn,

To get some personalized advice, I would suggest staring a workbook in one of our classes. You don't need to put up and translate all of your DJ entries but if you like to share a specific dream then you can use our journal functions and also put a link to the dream journal entry in your workbook. You can also ask us some questions here or in your workbook. :)

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Thank you, Nyx. That answered my question :)

So last night I had my first LD! I'm wondering, when I complete things, or my info changes, should I update my original workbook post? Is there an accepted or recommended way of doing this?

Also, as I said above I had my first LD last night. No teachers have posted anything in my workbook thread so I feel kind of left out. :embarrassed: If one of you guys has time to swing by and just look at my recent LD and see if you guys have any tips, that would be greatly appreciated. Also post #6 would maybe be kind of interesting to you!

Thank you guys for doing what you do!

Congrats on the ld jacko! :)

About the workbook updates, you can edit your original workbook post or just post a new post in the workbook - it's completely up to you. A new post may make it easier to track changes in your goals though.

I will also leave you a comment in the workbook with regards to your ld. :)

Hey guys,

As relative masters of the practice, how long have your LD's become over time? When you started, how long were they? How long is the longest one you've had?

Personally, my LD's typically last for 2 in-dream minutes or so; nothing major. I would love to be able to spend hours lucid, but that'll take quite a lot of time.

Thank you!
Jelly

Hey Jellyd0nut! I can say that there has been an improvement over time and with practice. It's really difficult to give a precise duration for all my lds because they really vary. But yeah, the super short lds are less frequent, some are in the 5-15 min range which is actually enough to complete a ton of things and run out of ideas, while others can last much longer, say 30 min to an hour. Personally I am quite of a wakeful person so it's hard for me to keep it going for longer than that.

If I have to give any advice regarding how to get longer lds - keep up the overall practices so that you can get more lds and in those lds give yourself fully to the dream. Interact with the dream environment as much as possible, don't let any thoughts and worries ever distract you and follow through with any goals you have set. :)

Ok, good to know!

I always wondered what kind of time I would have once I got good at the whole thing.

I thought of another question that's been bothering me for a little while now regarding my method. So when I'm trying to LD, I usually go to sleep thinking dreamy thoughts, try to catch a natural awakening, and if I do I think about my goals for a few seconds and then go back to sleep. This method worked for me several times last month, but this month there's been no results.

I personally find myself cautious about physically getting up and doing the entire WBTB routine of getting up and grabbing a snack and everything. I just worry I'll screw up my brain and end up not being able to sleep or something. I try to move as little as possible while thinking about dreams and stuff, but I'm wondering if I need to do something differently.

When you're WBTBing, what do you usually do?

Thanks,
Jelly

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jellyd0nut

Ok, good to know!

I always wondered what kind of time I would have once I got good at the whole thing.

I thought of another question that's been bothering me for a little while now regarding my method. So when I'm trying to LD, I usually go to sleep thinking dreamy thoughts, try to catch a natural awakening, and if I do I think about my goals for a few seconds and then go back to sleep. This method worked for me several times last month, but this month there's been no results.

I personally find myself cautious about physically getting up and doing the entire WBTB routine of getting up and grabbing a snack and everything. I just worry I'll screw up my brain and end up not being able to sleep or something. I try to move as little as possible while thinking about dreams and stuff, but I'm wondering if I need to do something differently.

When you're WBTBing, what do you usually do?

Thanks,
Jelly

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Hey Jelly!

One cool thing about lucid dreaming is that when you WBTB, you are actually helping yourself set up for the lucid dream. For example, my best lucids are when I wake up after 6 hours of sleeping, and then get up and do stuff (get some water, let the dogs out, take a peepee, etc..). Maybe 30 min total. Then I go back to sleep. I might wake up 1 or 2 more times, but that awake time puts me in the right state of mind to grab a lucid.

Try this and see what happens.

I agree with what Ophelia has said. Wbtbs can be very helpful for ld induction and can help you get in the right ld mindset.

Everyone does them differently, so feel free to experiment with both lenght and activity to see how these work for you. I do both micro 1-5 mins to long 20-30 mins wbtbs depending on the amount of time I have and the overall motivation. On the whole, for me the longer the better but within insomnia constraints. Activity-wise I usually concentrate on lucidity-related mantras and the goals I wish to accomplish in the coming ld. :)

Thanks guys!

I'll be sure to try it when I can catch a good natural awakening. Maybe I'll try reading some EWLD or something and incubating. I've found that "dream binging" really works well for my recall and increases my chances of lucids tremendously.

I'll let you know what happens in my workbook!

Thanks again,
Jelly

I managed to try the WBTB technique last night, and although I didn't get a lucid, I certainly had vivid dreams afterwards and great recall!

However, part of the reason I didn't have a lucid was because I kept on getting lucid and waking up during HI. I'd get all sorts of little dreamlets, remember that I'm trying to have a lucid, and then become aware and wake up suddenly. Is this how WILD is usually done? Riding a dreamlet into a bigger lucid? Is this a matter of stabilization?

Thank you!
Jelly

Good to hear Jelly! Yes, wild is done in a similar manner as you retain your awareness while falling asleep. I think with more practice you will learn not to startle yourself and you should always gently try to focus on the dream/visuals you are having and allow yourself to fall asleep.

Hey guys,

Sorry I've been raiding the Q&A lately, should I PM you guys instead?

Last night I managed to have a lucid dream (DILD) for the first time in about a month. However, while I'm greatful for it, it was pretty mediocre for two specific reasons. Here's basically what happened while lucid:

Quote:

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I realized I was lucid when the exact same event happened twice in a row (this girl looked at me). I immediately realized I was dreaming, and decided to do a reality check (to no avail; my hands were actually normal), but I still remained lucid. I tried to do some dream control by growing an object, but it didn't work. I tried walking over to the other side of the room, but it felt stupid. Then the dream changed and I was no longer lucid.

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Here's why this felt like a crummy dream:
1: I really couldn't do much. I had to think really hard about something in order to make it happen, like when I tried walking around. When I tried to walk around, it wasn't like I just walked. I had to mentally think of myself walking, but instead I ended up kinda stupidly floating to my destination like a bad glitch in a game. I'd much rather have a dream where I feel like I ACTUALLY walk and ACTUALLY do stuff, and not feel like I'm watching a movie of myself through my own eyes.

2: I felt tired throughout the dream. I just felt straight up fatigued the whole time, like I just wanted to go to sleep (although that seems very ironic). This helped to make the rest of the dream out of focus and my motivation kinda weak.

Is there anything specific I can do to prevent these things? I realize that some of this might just come with practice, but is there any remedy to the fatigue issue? Is there some psychological thing I can do to make myself more present in the dream to prevent the lack of control?

Thank you,
Jelly

Hey Jelly,

feel free to post here as much as you like, that's why we have this Q&A thread. :)

First of all, congrats on your ld! It's a bit difficult to correctly diagnose why things weren't working exactly as planned on this particular occasion. It may be that the fatigue issue also was affecting your ability to move around freely. I think, in some cases, it would just happen that we feel very tired in a lucid dream and may have difficulty performing physical actions. I wouldn't expect this to be the case every time, rather a sort of unfrequent glitch that you can't really do much about. So, don't set the expectation that this will be the case in your next ld.

At any rate, with any sort of dream glitch, if something is not working, then just direct your attention to doing something else. There's still plenty of things we can practice in the dream as long as we are there.

So, I'm wondering: I have a bit of experience lucid dreaming, but my lucid dreams are always pretty random and always DILD. For Lesson II we are picking a dream technique to try out for a couple weeks. I definitely want to work on performing genuine RCs during the day and increasing my awareness in general to up my chanced of experiencing a DILD, but would you suggest combining that with trying WILD at night, too? Or should I simply focus on increased awareness for a while before I try the WILD?

Hi Lucidity333, welcome to the class! :)

Yes, you can definitely combine two or more techniques like RCs and awareness exercises and tring for a wild at night. However, I have to emphasize that the daily awareness work isn't just for getting DILDs. It will help raise your overall awareness which is at the end also necessary for a wild. So, in the long run you should be focusing on building strong fundamentals which include day work.

Hi everyone, nice to meet you all! I'm just starting the intro class.

I've been studying lucid dreaming for about 3 weeks, and I had good results since then.
I had some lucid dreams, but they're mostly too short or very unstable. What bothers me is that somehow I always forget too fully stabilize, and I never remember to RC in a dream, even when I'm lucid.

Is there a way to remember stabilizing?

Hello Timespace and welcome to the class! If you would like to do stabilization first thing in the ld, then you have to indeed be able to recall this. You can remind yourself about this goal for your next ld throughout the day. It may be a good idea to use a mantra like, for example, "I become lucid, I stabilize". You can also do this at bedtime or if you have natural wakes during the night. This way you are boosting your chances for an ld as well as you recalling to stabilize.

Thanks Nix!

I'm currently just starting with dream incubation mantras. Can I use different mantras simultaneously, or should I just use one at the time?

Hi Timespace. Yes, you can definitely use more than one mantra. However, I would recommend not to use too many, say, more than five, as not to confuse your mind when switching back and forth between these.

Awesome! Thanks again, Nix.

In this case I'm gonna use some waking-life mantras as well, since I have some empty slots and life's not only about lucidity. =)

I don't have a question right now but I just want to say thanks to everyone who puts work into this site.

Is it possible to WILD with insomnia
I don't think I have true insomnia but I have bouts where i can't sleep. No stress and my mind is calm and quiet. It's like my I'm ready to sleep but my brain won't make the switch. I usually try a montra or SSILD to fall asleep but it doesn't work. But My body will twitch, like it's trying to go to sleep but It cant. I was wondering if in these instances of no sleep ,Would WILD work, since my mind is awake and it's seems like my body wants to sleep?
Sorry to post this here. I posted in the WILD section and have gotten no replies

Hello! For wild to work, your body still does need to be asleep, so having insomnia is not really a way to achieve wild. Although, one might argue that being insomnia prone may allow you to be more alert in general and not miss the transition to sleep compared to others. That, however, is quite speculative. The best way to find out if there might be a correlation is by experimenting.

For optimal results with wild, always attempt it after a few hours of sleep. Again, your body needs to be asleep, otherwise there's no dreams.

I would like some input on dream induction. I think I heard on the podcast there was some good dream induction t4ext somewhere but I cant seem to find it.

Have you checked the lessons page

http://www.dreamviews.com/intro-clas...sons-i-iv.html

Also the tutorials

http://www.dreamviews.com/intro-clas...mpilation.html

My last three DILD's I have snapped out of immediately after realizing that I'm dreaming. I haven't had the chance to stabilize. I know this will improve with experience but it's definitely frustrating. Any tips for addressing this?

is there a certain number of dream signs that are optimum? I have 4 and I wonder if that's too many to be of value.

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Originally Posted by Turbo

My last three DILD's I have snapped out of immediately after realizing that I'm dreaming. I haven't had the chance to stabilize. I know this will improve with experience but it's definitely frustrating. Any tips for addressing this?

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Hey Turbo, it definitely will improve with more practice. What you can do to facilitate this process is to try to immerse yourself as much as possible in the dream upon becoming lucid. Engage your senses, especially sight and touch. For example, find a nearby object and spend some time examining it. This way, your attention will be focused on the inner dream world, rather than surfacing back. Another way would be to pick a dream goal, such as our task of the month and immediately start working on it. I have found this to be pretty effective to keep the focus on the dream. Finally, I would also recommend to give the DEILD practice a try. Learning how to get back into a dream is a useful skill at any level. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thinkfirst

is there a certain number of dream signs that are optimum? I have 4 and I wonder if that's too many to be of value.

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Hello Thinkfirst! There is no optimum number of dream signs, there can be as many as you are able to find out. To start with, I would suggest putting emphasis on the most common ones until you know them really well. As you keep journalling, you will be able to find more dream signs and perhaps even put them into categories. For example, animals in general would be a dream sign for me. The most important part is that you know your dream signs and are reasonably able to expect them to cue you about it being a dream.

I'm sure this question has been asked, but I'm not terrific at the search bar, so I'll ask again.......

I've been listening to the podcast and find it a great help. Episode 5 on WILDS and DEILDS sparked this question. Its part of my regular yoga and meditation practice to be really present in the physical body and connect with subtle sensations of the body. But from the description of these inductions, it sounded like all focus should be in the mental field and forgetting about anything happening in the body. I'd love more info on this, or point me to the post that discusses this.

Thanks.

Hey thinkfirst! I would say there might be different approaches to wild. The common denominator in all, however, is falling asleep with a mind that is awake. To do achieve that, we often use the so-called anchors. This is a point of focus for the mind, which one would hold on to, in order to help us stay mentally awake during the bodily process of falling asleep. These anchors can be external or internal. You can focus on anything from your environment, be it the sound of the air conditioner, cars, crickets, your own breathing, your pulse, the way your physical body feels, etc.

Alternatively, you can focus on items that only exist in your own mind, images, sounds, mantras. As long as you keep your focus on your desired object and are able to fall asleep, both approaches can help you transition with your consciousness awake.

However, if you would like to enter the dream and arrive at a specific location or scenery straight away, it would be more advisable to use focusing on internal images as an anchor. With practice, you may be able to enter precicely the scene you have been visualizing, or help your mind generate a similar scene after the transition (as this was the object of your focus).

If there has been a discussion about this before, just give me the link.

On my 1st LD, I flew around easily.
On my 2nd LD, I wanted to look around mindfully to see my surroundings and immediately woke up.

I would enjoy learning more about that difference being active doing in a LD, and things that are more mindful and less physical.
I see colors, hear sounds, feel dream body sensations, but not yet mindful about them.
But then its only my 2nd LD.

Congrats on your recent successes, thinkfirst!

I am not sure whether your question relates to any perceptional differences between doing physical acts in dream state vs mental ones or the differences btw these two regarding dream stability/lenght. Either way, let's examine what these actions are in general to answer both aspects of the question.

First of all, I would like to stress that while engaging in a physical action may by itself look physical, such as grasping an object, while observing the surroundings may seem purely mental, in the dream world they both are for a lack of a better word - "made from the matter of your thoughts". Both actions involve the internal activation of your senses, whether this is touch or sight or hearing. And the focus of your senses on the dream is what makes its existence possible. So, as long as your attention is flowing to an object in the dream world, that dream will be sustained.

When it comes to mindfulness, the practice of being present in the moment and enjoying whatever the dream offers you, you can still continue engaging all your senses and this shouldn't really result in dream instability or reduction in length by itself. However, what may cause some disturbance is the focus on the thought of being mindful stealing away attention from fully engaging the senses. That way, instead of seeing an object, we may be thinking of being mindful of seeing it.

This may all seem a bit confusing at first, but with more practice, you will be able to test for yourself whether these explanations make sense. My best advice is to enjoy every aspect of your lucid dream as it presents itself to you - that way you will be implementing mindfulness practices seamlessly as well as be able to do other things you have planned.

If I get to a point where I am working on a task that is illegal - like stealing a car (Mar task), how much does a person's daily moral compass come into the mix? I guess if you are LD, you know its not illegal, right? And no reason to feel guilty. A new concept for a beginner LDreamer.

Great question, thinkfirst! Let's think for a second why stealing a car is illegal - because irl the car belongs to someone else. In the dream, all that surrounds you belongs to you and is there for you to dispose of as you wish.

Dreams provide us with the opportunity to try out scenarious that may not be possible in real life. We can also have reactions to outcomes that are different than real life. Dreams give us with the freedom to shape our own mind. And what we do with that freedom is up to each one of us.

To take that idea a little farther then - in the LD I had this morning, I was consciously flying around with the mission of sabotaging some teens from trouble and mayhem around my neighborhood. But if I had stopped to be even more mindful during the LD, I would have realized that all those people are just projections of myself, and there is no harm being done. No one is chasing me, my child does not need to be found because its all a dream, and I have no baby in the dream.

There's becoming lucid in a dream and that seems to be one level, and then there is the another deeper level in both waking and dreaming life of slowing down and realizing there in nothing that needs to be done here. There is no rush, no emergency, no solid reality. After today's LD, I also and wondering what it means to have control either in waking or dreaming life. I chose to fly, but then it felt like the mission I was on and the people and places that showed up were out of my control entirely.

Congrats on the ld thinkfirst! :) Those are all good points you made. Indeed, there are different levels of awareness both in dreams and in waking life. And as you pointed out, the deeper (and slower) we go, the more we are able to understand things from a much different and all-encompassing perspective.

Hey, not sure if this is even still active, but I hope so.

Should one do one lesson every day or everything at once? Sorry if this was mentioned somewhere. My dream recall is okay as far as I can tell, but otherwise, my abilities to recall aren't reliable, to say the least.

I think this is a sticky thread so, I think you may be fine. I think it may be more effective if you do one lesson every day instead of all at once so you won't be overwhelmed? Do what is really comfortable for you. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Lang

I think this is a sticky thread so, I think you may be fine. I think it may be more effective if you do one lesson every day instead of all at once so you won't be overwhelmed? Do what is really comfortable for you. :)

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Ah, alright. Thank you. :)