Thread: Have you ever seen motion picture footage of the 1800's?

haha thats so cute :3

I turned up my speaker and was like...oh yeah...no sound.

Originally Posted by Snooze

haha thats so cute :3

Holy shit it's Snooze...

Originally Posted by Snooze

haha thats so cute :3

How the hell is that, cute?

Interesting, but... cute?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amknQ09TqzI&NR=1

I love victorian prudishness.

Wow. I never knew film was around that early. I thought it came about in the early 1900s

I've seen old footage like that before...I think it's awesome

Love that beach footage

Originally Posted by AmazeO XD

How the hell is that, cute?

Interesting, but... cute?

Snooze thinks Chicken Sex is appropriate porn.

So yeah.

I love silent films. Ever seen Nosferatu? Or the origional Alice/ Wounderland?

Another good one is Metropolis.

And for a sad/really cute/funny Charlie Chaplin movie, check out The Kid.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

http://youtube.com/watch?v=zVsVM3mg_...eature=related

Wtf @ Comment #1

Well that is one of the stranger youtube comments I've ever seen

edit: I laughed so hard at this! http://youtube.com/watch?v=uqLTzZvKdOU&feature=related mostly it's just people walking but near the end...it's really funny

Originally Posted by Kael Seoras

Well that is one of the stranger youtube comments I've ever seen

edit: I laughed so hard at this! http://youtube.com/watch?v=uqLTzZvKdOU&feature=related mostly it's just people walking but near the end...it's really funny

Lol. It looks like almost immideatly after video cameras become practical, someone recorded someone showing off their stockings!

Originally Posted by Kael Seoras

Well that is one of the stranger youtube comments I've ever seen

edit: I laughed so hard at this! http://youtube.com/watch?v=uqLTzZvKdOU&feature=related mostly it's just people walking but near the end...it's really funny

That is the most scandalous video I have ever seen. They were kinky back in those 1800's.

Yeah, I've seen tons of those old movies.

Some of them are fairly disturbing, and some are odd if not also disturbing.

There's one of an elephant being electrocuted, and a bunch of naked people doing jumps, walking etc, (odd how the women do most of the jumping - "for science"). And contortionists and all sorts of crazy stuff.

They had some pretty kinky desires back then, but most older movies are "cute" since they're so extremely simple and cliche, although of course back then they weren't.

Originally Posted by DNK

Yeah, I've seen tons of those old movies.

Some of them are fairly disturbing, and some are odd if not also disturbing.

There's one of an elephant being electrocuted, and a bunch of naked people doing jumps, walking etc, (odd how the women do most of the jumping - "for science"). And contortionists and all sorts of crazy stuff.

They had some pretty kinky desires back then, but most older movies are "cute" since they're so extremely simple and cliche, although of course back then they weren't.

I think you are talking about films from the early 1900's, some as late as the 1920's. The films from the 1800's were the first ones, and I don't think most people know they even exist. I think it is mindblowing to see video footage of the days when the Old/Wild West still existed. That is going pretty far back in time.

Originally Posted by Reality_is_a_Dream

I love silent films. Ever seen Nosferatu? Or the origional Alice/ Wounderland?

Omg the original Alice in Wonderland was WEIRD!! Kind of creepy! But I liked it..

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

I think you are talking about films from the early 1900's, some as late as the 1920's. The films from the 1800's were the first ones, and I don't think most people know they even exist. I think it is mindblowing to see video footage of the days when the Old/Wild West still existed. That is going pretty far back in time.

I was talking about the Muybridges (forgot the name), which were pretty early stuff - maybe 30 frames at most and well inside the 19th century. Here's a video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVc68ucgT2o (WARNING: nudity) of a compilation. Starts with the infamous horse video (before film people didn't realize horses' feet all left the ground at a point in their stride), and is scientific in nature for much of the material. Muybridge is one of the pioneers of film, and his works are among the earliest. You can even see he came up with the 'Matrix camera' before it was reinvented numerous times in the latter part of the 20th century.

The elephant, I believe, was Edison's, but after Black Maria. But I was also referencing earlier Black Maria kinetoscope works (also forgot the name of that). An Edison link: http://www.kino.com/edison/video.html# Some videos and pictures. Here's the link of the elephant: http://www.wired.com/science/discove...dayintech_0104 That link is actually very related to this forum, as the story should explain. WARNING: elephant is electrocuted in the video.

Very early 20th century film should be included, too. Most of what was made before 1910 (really, 1920s) was before any real narrative and editing structures common today were seen beyond the most rudimentary, most were very short by modern standards, most were documentary in nature, although there were plenty of fiction films also, and of course most were silent and black and white (save Edison's, I think). Yes there actually were films with audio and color back in the 1890s. The problem was they were single-person films, as you had to look into a box with "speakers" to see them (the kinetoscope). They were more of a pay-per-view carnival-esque attraction, rather than a theater attraction. Thank Edison for that.

But still many early films, more specifically in Japan, had live actors and music to go along with them, sometimes having an event with half film and half live theater. The Japanese have historically been one of the centers of film, and one of its founders, which is odd considering 40 years before it was invented they were an isolated, backwards country that barely knew anything of the world. The Japanese employed live actors and narrators known as benshi to add to the experience, who would speak the parts on screen, many times simply making up stories and lines themselves. They were as much a part of the film as the producers themselves, and could be more of an attraction than the film. Unfortunately, this aspect of early Japanese cinema has been lost due to the quite perishable nature of the spoken word.

Point being, a lot of people see these old movies and think they're just silent and drab, but in reality early cinema was in many cases dynamic and exciting, not only because it was a new technology (and yet precisely because it was a new technology).

I LOVE old film because of how silly it can be, because of how you can see the earliest forms of common devices, etc, and simply because of the history. I'm not sure how much of the Wild West was still in existence around the 1890s when film really started off, but the perspective is still quite amazing.

"The Gay Shoe Clerk" is just hilarious: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2X_BZpnWFc

Generally, I like the Lumiere films the most of the early works. Very "slice of life" type films. Here's a compilation of some of their work http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBQ9wAAW_zs As you can see, mostly documentary in nature, although some narrative elements. I probably like them most as they are the beginning in the chain of similar directors like Vertov and Reggio (who needs words?).

http://video.google.com/videosearch?...en&sitesearch= Check out "The Man with a Movie Camera" (66 min). There are a few version of the audio track around, but I can't find the others. I like the non-standard interpretations more than the "official" one. Obviously the one in the link isn't the official one, but I like it much more from what I've heard. The original is fast-paced for the most part. Think "driving on the bus" music from that Family Guy ep where Peter wished for narrative background music.

There are other Vertovs, but that's by far the most influential and well-known. While I'm suggesting Vertov, I might as well suggest Reggio and "Koyaanisqatsi". It's the first in a documentary trilogy along the same lines as Vertov's work. It was done in the 70s, though, but it's just as amazing a historical piece as any other. Probably my favorite movie, at least fav documentary. Now I'm getting OT, but I can't resist a Qatsi digression...

If you want historical immersion, definitely check out Vertov. All the pre-audio communist Russia footage you could ask for.

I was a film major in college, if you couldn't guess from the post (it has done wonders for my non-career!). Needless to say, I've seen a lot of that early footage, although my memory of names is not so great

Field any questions you have. I'm no expert (I didn't take that much on really early film), but I could give them a shot. I'm almost more interested in really early photography, as that goes back ever further. I absolutely LOVE calotypes. If you've ever seen one in person, you'd understand why. They are gorgeous, and pretty much the first stills ever made.



Sidenote on the 23rd St video: that actually was a somewhat famous street in NYC for precisely that reason. A case of filming something of renown, although it appears to be just a silly short. I'm not sure of how famous it was, but they didn't just make it up for that shot. They were quite scandalous back in the day...

Another point about early cinema that I alluded to in the other post (too long to edit):

When watching old narrative films, remember that the current editing and shot techniques today weren't used then. Simply put, people did not understand them. For instance, today you can watch a movie and see the camera cut around from one character to the next or follow one character around at different angles, and you understand what's going on. Back then, people could be completely confused by a single, simple cut. This is why many older films are long, single shots for an entire scene (that and cameras were bulky and heavy).

Sometimes you don't realize how much actually had to be invented. It isn't actually just common sense to watch a movie, but we all grew up with them (I assume) so we "get it" seemingly naturally. Many of these techniques had to be developed, discovered, and adopted over decades. In the end, we can analyze them and they make sense, but a lot of the discovery was rather haphazard and slow. Basically, early cinema was the slow creation of a new language, with some help from literature and very light help from photography.

Originally Posted by Alex D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=amknQ09TqzI&NR=1

I love victorian prudishness.

If they rotated the camera to the left you would see my flat

Originally Posted by DNK

I was a film major in college, if you couldn't guess from the post (it has done wonders for my non-career!).

Believe me... I guessed it. Thanks for the intersting info. I didn't know there were films from the 1800's that were actually interesting beyond being films from the 1800's. To be honest, I didn't even know there were films from that century until a few minutes before I started this thread. It was something I stumbled upon on You Tube. I thought Edison made the first film in like the 1910's or something. I came across a Thomas Edison film of a storm in like 1900. When I saw that, I wondered if there are any motion pictures from the 19th century, and I was amazed to learn that there are.

The Wild/Old West era is considered to have ended with the end of the 1800's. It looks like that era and the film era pretty much did a relay handoff. It blows my mind that the two overlap at all. Are there any videos of like a Dodge City saloon in 1897 or anything? That would be one of the most interesting things I have ever seen.

Is it true that the first spoken words on screen were, "You ain't seen nothin' yet?" I heard that on a documentary about film quite a long time ago..

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Believe me... I guessed it. Thanks for the intersting info. I didn't know there were films from the 1800's that were actually interesting beyond being films from the 1800's. To be honest, I didn't even know there were films from that century until a few minutes before I started this thread. It was something I stumbled upon on You Tube. I thought Edison made the first film in like the 1910's or something. I came across a Thomas Edison film of a storm in like 1900. When I saw that, I wondered if there are any motion pictures from the 19th century, and I was amazed to learn that there are.

The Wild/Old West era is considered to have ended with the end of the 1800's. It looks like that era and the film era pretty much did a relay handoff. It blows my mind that the two overlap at all. Are there any videos of like a Dodge City saloon in 1897 or anything? That would be one of the most interesting things I have ever seen.

I'd also like to see that, but I'm personally not aware of any films of the Wild West. I imagine if it was really "wild", a massive, bulky, expensive, state-of-the-art camera wouldn't be a good thing to be bringing around.

There IS one film of "A Phantom Ride on the Canadian Pacific" railroad that goes across the Canadian Rockies (the term "phantom ride" refers to mounting a camera on a moving object, not dancing next to a car moving in idle), but that's as close as I can get you, and I can't find the actual video anywhere. There are plenty of actual photographs of the place, at least. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdSM789rlJk is fiction, and clearly not much in terms of documentary, but it's the first Western I'm aware of. 1903, three parts. The ending is probably the most famous ending in cinematic history, as silly as that may seem after you see it.




Another early pioneer I forgot about along the lines of Muybridge, who I usually get confused with him: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U9Gb0...eature=related (nudity)

Dickson, who I'm less aware of, although I know I've seen a few of his besides this, which I randomly stumbled across looking up Melies': http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQBuSFL7Kkg

That link is, as far as I know, the first recording of film and sound in history.

The famous "A Trip to the Moon" by Melies, the fiction leader in early cinema: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbGd_240ynk (apologies for the soundtrack) This was a bit of an oddity for its time - a relatively long fictional narrative film with lots of work put into setting and plot and special effects. The first real "blockbuster" I'm aware of, although I don't know what its actual revenue was. The Smashing Pumpkins alluded to it in the "Tonight, Tonight" music video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EsZYqaSc4cU

And, lastly, a couple favorites: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDUn-...eature=related Still trippy today.



Now, if you think early cinema was lame... just compare to today's budding amateur artists: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ktf2U6wkII

It's funny that cinema has sort of come full circle with the rise of YouTube. There are a lot of similarities between the two eras: both are comprised solely of amateurs, are generally short in nature, poor in quality (video/sound), and tend to record basic aspects of life and individual talents. Early contortionists are just yesterday's 'guy swallowing twenty hotdogs', and early phantom rides have turned into modern ghost rides. So, if it helps, just think of early cinema as b&w YouTube. Most of the comedy films are about as silly as modern internet humor.

Some of the shorts are very hard for modern people to appreciate (myself included sometimes), because they are rather "dull" landscape shots. Remember that back then movement was completely new. Never before had people seen in reproduced in a medium. Up until then, only photos and paintings. It took maybe a decade for the novelty to really wear off in that respect. Plus, no one really knew what to do with cinema.

Also, another note about Japanese cinema: most of the early footage was destroyed in the fire bombings of WWII. A lot of classics were destroyed due to that and the fact no one took care of them (film can degrade quickly in poor conditions). What few we have today are a matter of luck and a few individuals who went to great lengths to preserve them. They were pounding out hundreds of films a week in Japan, I think, before the war (maybe not, but it was a ridiculously large number).

Originally Posted by Mes Tarrant

Is it true that the first spoken words on screen were, "You ain't seen nothin' yet?" I heard that on a documentary about film quite a long time ago..

Well, aside from the afore-mentioned benshi, narrators, etc, it might have been. It is from "The Jazz Singer", which is considered the first "talkie". After looking it up, as I suspected, the actual line was "you ain't heard nothin' yet."

"Wait a minute, wait a minute, you ain't heard nothin' yet! Wait a minute, I tell ya! You ain't heard nothin'! You wanna hear "Toot, Toot, Tootsie"? All right, hold on, hold on..."

I'm not sure that's the first actual words heard by audiences, but, good enough! I never actually saw the film myself.

On to later cinema!

Favorites: The Last Laugh. The ending you see was actually added on at the end when they realized the original was too depressing. Perhaps the beginning of the "Hollywood ending", granted it's German.

The Cabinet of Dr Caligari. Famous, famous, more German expressionism. Made famous to the young-uns (not so much anymore, I guess) in Rob Zombie's "Living Dead Girl" music video.

Metropolis - famous scifi. Precursor to, well, a lot of films. This one with NiN fun. The sound is pretty bad, though. I highly suggest just dubbing them with your own music. I suppose "Wish You Were Here" would go well with Metropolis, or just about any electronic album. Remade into a bad kid's anime in 2000 or so, although arguably "Blade Runner" was a remake of sorts.

I would also highly suggest "M" by Fritz Lang. One of the best movies I've ever seen, and one of the earliest sound films. I can't find a good copy online, but I guarantee it's in Blockbuster (most of the famous early films are). It's a German film, made in response to rising fascism, about a serial pedophile rapist-killer who is hunted by angry mobs. The ending act is one of the best. Oddly enough, no one in Hollywood has wanted to remake it...

Also check out the first "All Quiet on the Western Front". It's about WWI, silent. They remade it in the 70s with some guy and Ernest Borgnine. I prefer the original.

And, as I mentioned, Vertov. While we're on Vertov, I am obligated to mention Eisenstein. Unlike a lot of film people, I'm not a huge fan. His work is definitely good, and some of the most famous and alluded to work in film history, but I guess I just never liked his style (and got sick of rereading his writing in every single theory class). Still, he has some pretty sweet shots.
http://video.google.com/videosearch?...1&sa=N&tab=wv#
Battleship Potemkin and October are his most famous works. I like October a lot more, personally - it's about the October revolution in Russia that brought Lenin to power. The Odessa steps sequence from Potemkin was redone in "The Untouchables" in the train station with the baby carriage. Just about everyone is aware of the scene, as homages have appeared everywhere in television and film since, even if they haven't seen the actual movie. Both Eisenstein and Vertov were Russian filmmakers, if you couldn't tell.

The 20s and 30s are my weak spot in film history. Things get kind of crazy, then they get less so, and then everyone starts talking, and the old silent stars can't adapt for the most part, save Chaplin and few others.

Oh, and Mizoguchi and Ozu in Japan had a lot of really good movies in that period. Ozu, in my opinion, was one of the best directors before 1950, period. His films are some of the most poignant and moving I've ever seen. Kurosawa, probably the most famous Japanese director, came onto the scene in the 40s, but I'm moving well outside the range of the thread now.

I'm not sure if anyone will actually bother reading all this and watching any of the movies, but at least it was a good review session for me Gotta keep that knowledge somehow, God knows it hasn't been of much use lately...