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    1. #1
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      Post Structure/Organization Department

      This forum is for the organizers of the book to decide best how to structure, place and organize the chapters, appendices, and other content within the book. The organizing department more-so oversees the progress and organizes finished paragraphs/chapters so that things remain intact and befitting. Writers, should you have any questions on the proper placement of your paragraphs, chapters...consult the organizing department.
      Department Leader: Department leader's are supervisors of a certain department. They make sure work is being done and they have the authority to tweak, organize, call meetings etc. Staff may consult their department leader and department leader's may consult the Project Leader. Department leader's can hire additional staff members for their department at their discretion. Department leader's, if a staff member is not staying on task or doing what you are asking him/her for the benefit of the department (and ultimately the project) you can recommend them for termination to the Project Leader. Once again, I encourage Department leader's to hire more staff for their departments. To personally hire a new staff member, have them fill out an application and within that application in the additional comments section, have them say that you personally hired them.


      The author of this post wrote this cognizant of the fact that staff members work in more than one department.

      ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

      Organization Department Staff

      Department Leader: Sugarglider11

      Naiya, Jeff, mrdeano, Banana, Sugarglider11, Lunanitidus
      Last edited by Jeff777; 09-26-2009 at 11:19 AM.
      Things are not as they seem

    2. #2
      Legend Jeff777's Avatar
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      Originally posted by Naiya
      Working Outline:

      So far we already have the first four chapters and their names

      1. Introduction
      2. History of Lucid Dreaming
      3. Aspects of Dreaming
      4. Lucid dreaming

      What should come next, and in what order? Please post suggestions regarding chapters, chapter names, appendices, and so on. I'm making the following suggestions, but not necessarily in this order:

      -overcoming nightmares
      -dream control (tutorials on common things like flying should probably be added in this one.)
      -lucid experiments
      -general awareness (I'd very much like to do a chapter on this)
      -dream characters (types of characters can be discussed, we'll try to keep it general . For example the "cookie cutter" brainless ones, the "doppleganger" ones of friends and family, the monsters/antagonizers, the "aware" or wise ones)


      I think we can make separate chapters for the big techniques. It seems like this may have been the original plan so it would be nice to stick to that in respect to the people who started this.

      -DILD
      -MILD
      -WILD
      -VILD ect.

      The writers of each of these can be people who have a lot of success using that particular technique; if possible we can ask permission to use various tutorials that have already been posted on DV.


      Lastly there are some chapters that are hot topics on DV. Should we say something about them, or not? Personally I would like to avoid things that are purely opinion based such as astral projection, dream sharing, and premonitions from dreams. I think it would reflect well on DV if we just stick to lucid dreaming and what the accepted facts are. I want to avoid spreading myths, beliefs and opinions, because presenting those alongside with factual information can undercut our credibility.

      But if you guys want to include these or believe we can talk about them in an objective and professional way, speak up about it now so we can talk about it.


      -Ethics of dream control (is it OK to kill DCs? A few views should be presented. This should be done in a way that does not assume unproven theories about mutual dreaming and AP.)
      -Dream guides and wise DCs (learning to find wise DCs, asking them questions)



      Appendices

      1. TOTM List
      2. Other Task List
      3. Glossary (or glossary of terms, especially acronyms like MILD, WILD ect.)
      4. Endnotes (if we make reference to studies and other works, we can use endnotes to list our sources. We absolutely HAVE to list our sources, either in footnotes or endnotes. It will also be a really great reference.)
      5. Index (Pain in the ass to do, but may be easier if the entire book were copied into a decent word processor. Then searches could be done for certain words.)
      Things are not as they seem

    3. #3
      Legend Jeff777's Avatar
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      Originally posted by The Cusp
      Any of the sub forums on this board would make good chapters.

      Dreams in General

      LD Induction

      LD Control

      Nightmares

      Interpretation

      Dreaming myths
      Things are not as they seem

    4. #4
      Legend Jeff777's Avatar
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      Originally posted by dreamingofdreaming
      I think emphasizing research and experiements is a must, should definietly have its own chapter...

      Just a thought; a descriptive/creative prelude about a lucid dream could be neat. Incorparate waking in ones room, yet its different, clocks are off, flying, fantasy environment etc....
      Things are not as they seem

    5. #5
      Legend Jeff777's Avatar
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      Originally posted by mrdeano
      Quote Originally Posted by Naiya View Post
      Lastly there are some chapters that are hot topics on DV. Should we say something about them, or not? Personally I would like to avoid things that are purely opinion based such as astral projection, dream sharing, and premonitions from dreams. I think it would reflect well on DV if we just stick to lucid dreaming and what the accepted facts are. I want to avoid spreading myths, beliefs and opinions, because presenting those alongside with factual information can undercut our credibility
      I am in favor of this. We should stick to the facts rather than myths and rumors.

      This also makes me think there should be a chapter covering such rumors that are not true. For example, "Saying your own name in a LD will wake you up"
      The above rumor is not true at all. But a lot of people still belief it.
      Maybe a FAQ chapter or something?
      Things are not as they seem

    6. #6
      Legend Jeff777's Avatar
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      Originally posted by Naiya
      Yeah, a sort of mythbusting chapter would be fun.

      The old "you can't turn on lights in a dream" and "dreams are in black and white but you fill in the color later" are easily disproved and we can encourage the reader to disprove those things themselves with a few instructions. Or just list some of the rumors and explain why they are not true.
      Things are not as they seem

    7. #7
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      General awareness is a chapter that could definatly be accomplished.

      For example, people need to understand the different levels of awareness they will experience in a lucid dream, and the importance of their awareness that they are dreaming to keep the experience stable. One of the largest problems I have noticed is that PEOPLE CAN GET LUCID, however CANNOT STAY LUCID. There have been excellent improvements in the field of dream stability since Stephen LaBerge's book.
      In addition, people may need to understand the different levels of lucidity they may experience, and how they can improve this.

      There are also a number of small phenomena that occur occasionally that need to be covered, such as: 1). Being lucid but not aware you can bend the rules of physics, life and death, summoning and so forth, 2). False Awakenings and how they can manipulate these to their advantage.

      Additionally, I beleive that we should engineer a two to four week program people can follow to the best of their ability, following the most proven method(s) to experience a lucid dream, or ideally - many more. Just my two cents

      Also, I'd like to apologise if I posted this in the wrong thread. Hehehe.
      Last edited by detroitLions1970; 07-01-2009 at 06:38 AM. Reason: Clarifying some text.

    8. #8
      hm. . marcc's Avatar
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      Don't forget, we should have a relatively large section that contains anecdotes and stories from lucid dreamers, so that it's easy to become motivated
      The question is What is the question?
      Thanks, Jeff777, for adopting me.

      [Flavour of Night] 10:06 pm: Banana, DV is not a dating site.

    9. #9
      Motion Personified Alpha mrdeano's Avatar
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      Each technique should have a difficulty rating?

      Or a learning curve rating?

    10. #10
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      Imma post a scheme here that I thought through when reading this thread. I judge myself good with planning, so I think this would help.

      These are not meant as specific sections of the book, though they could be. They are more like the topics which will be covered in the book. The small captions are basically for brainstorming - there is no need to use them verbatim.



      --------------------------------------------------------------------------

      Introduction
      Covering what LDing is, isn't, the benefits of it, how it feels.

      Dream and Sleep Science
      The basic introduction to sleep physiology, needed to fully comprehend what (lucid) dreams are. Here go sleep cycle, purpose of sleep, physiological processes that occur when sleeping, the mind and body falling asleep at different rates, sleep atonia, insomnia, etc. Explain how many thoughts cross the mind during sleep, and that dreams are only the combination of a highly imaginative state with sleep atonia.

      Lucid Dreaming and Science
      The concept of lucid dreaming: what it is, how it happens, how different it is from a regular dream, how to tell if it's a lucid dream or not, how lucid dreams were scientifically discovered and studied.

      Lucid Dreaming History
      Lucid dreaming in various cultures, in medieval and ancient times, dream interpretation, dream yoga, scientific literature.

      ----

      Dream Recall
      First off, how important it is; how some people think they don't have dreams when they only don't remember them; different types of dreams (images, storyline, sensations, memory organisation, learning). Why some dreams are easier to remember, why it's easier to remember a dream when you just wake up from it. Dream journals and different ways to keep one. Methods to train and improve dream recall, routines and habits that increase or hinder recall.

      Dream-Initiated Techniques
      Techniques for having lucid dreams based on being already in a dream and realizing it. Dream signs, Reality Checking, etc.

      Wake-Initiated Techniques
      Techniques for having lucid dreams based on being awake when starting the technique. basically, WILD in its various form. Falling asleep consciously, visualization techniques, counting techniques, sensation techniques, dream re-entry and chaining, what times WILD is most likely to work (WBTB, afternoon naps, etc).

      Aid Techniques
      Techniques that may not work for themselves, but better if combined with others. MILD, hypnosis, waking in the middle of the night to write in the DJ.

      Pharmacology
      Foods and drugs which help with Recall or Lucid Dreams, how to obtain and proper ways to use them (concerning drug half-life, additional effects, etc).

      ----

      Dream Control
      What to do as soon as you become lucid, ways to improve clarity and length, stabilising the dream, prolonging the dream when it's about to end. How things in lucid dreams work, how to find what you want, avoiding activities that may make you wake up.

      Using Lucid Dreams to Understand Yourself
      What dreams are, how the brain works in dreams, why dreams and very emotive experiences. Interpreting dreams (the scientific way), using Lucid Dreams to deal with your subconscious.

      Using Lucid Dreams to Solve Issues
      How to approach the subconscious mind in dream, bringing up traumas and bad memories, associating new things to them. Self suggestion and self-hypnosis inside dreams. Using dreams to gain confidence, to plan the future, to prepare for a situation.

      Activity in Lucid Dreams
      Things which are interesting to explore in Lucid Dreams. Lucid tasks. Dream Guides. Funny things that happened to lucid dreamers.

      Lucid Dream Philosophy
      Things you learn from exploring lucid dreams. Consciousness, value of things, how ephemeral emotions and things are. Discussion about dream ethics.

      ----

      The Lucid Dreaming Community
      Lucid dreamers, where to find them, what traits they have in common. Introduction to Dreamviews and to other online communities.

      --------------------------------------------------------------------------


      -

      Another thing I suggest: technique descriptions may tend to be long. Let them be long, but add a small table with a summary of the technique afterwards.

      I hope I didn't forget anything.
      Last edited by Naiya; 07-10-2009 at 09:56 PM.
      ~Kromoh

      Saying quantum physics explains cognitive processes is just like saying geology explains jurisprudence.

    11. #11
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      Quote Originally Posted by mrdeano
      This also makes me think there should be a chapter covering such rumors that are not true. For example, "Saying your own name in a LD will wake you up"
      The above rumor is not true at all. But a lot of people still belief it.
      Maybe a FAQ chapter or something?
      Quote Originally Posted by Naiya
      Yeah, a sort of mythbusting chapter would be fun.

      and we can encourage the reader to disprove those things themselves with a few instructions.
      Quote Originally Posted by Shades View Post
      General awareness is a chapter that could definatly be accomplished.
      Quote Originally Posted by marcc View Post
      Don't forget, we should have a relatively large section that contains anecdotes and stories from lucid dreamers, so that it's easy to become motivated
      Quote Originally Posted by mrdeano View Post
      Each technique should have a difficulty rating?

      Or a learning curve rating?
      Quote Originally Posted by Kromoh View Post
      Another thing I suggest: technique descriptions may tend to be long. Let them be long, but add a small table with a summary of the technique afterwards.
      These are some ideas that I am quite fond of.

      I'll come out with a simple organization setup soon, I think it will be very similar to Kromoh's.
      Bollocks.

    12. #12
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      I wrote up an organization outline real quick.

      I know it's rough, so if you have any suggestions, please make them right away. I want to get the outline done before the writers start writing.

      Introduction~
      What is a Lucid Dream?
      *Brief description of techniques?*

      Dreams as Dreams~
      Sleep Science
      Cycles
      Health
      Recall
      Myths about dreams
      Pharmacy

      Dreams as Lucids~
      Science
      History
      Techniques
      DILD
      WILD
      Assisting Techniques

      Lucids as Lucids~
      Control
      Myths about lucids
      Issues solved
      Exploration of self

      *Communities?*
      Anecdotes

      Things with asterisks are things I could easily drop.

      Any suggestions?
      Last edited by Naiya; 07-10-2009 at 09:57 PM.
      Bollocks.

    13. #13
      of dreaming dreamingofdreaming's Avatar
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      Looks good pops...

      Just a few suggestions...

      I think tecniques should have thier own chapter, right? Also, I think having sleep science as a chapter on its own would be good, SP is a HUGE issue that oh so many don't quite understand (but that could be in the WILD chapter)

      Will there be an acronym list in the begining? Perhaps history of should go in the intro?

    14. #14
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      Very good suggestions. I put the DILD and WILD things in there as I was too lazy to type out all of them. I expected there to be a section on every kind.

      I didn't think of SP, but I agree that it should have its own chapter.

      I figured the editing section would replace all the acronyms in the writing, but I suppose we could leave them in, and put a list at the beginning or end.
      Bollocks.

    15. #15
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      i think we should copy/paste the Herb/Drug Repository somewhere in the book

    16. #16
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      I'm against that... I wanted ninja to update/change the repository... He never did.

      Anyway, I find it lacking and kind of unclear. If no one else is will, I'd write a replacement.
      Bollocks.

    17. #17
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      Quote Originally Posted by Delphinus View Post
      I'm against that... I wanted ninja to update/change the repository... He never did.

      Anyway, I find it lacking and kind of unclear. If no one else is will, I'd write a replacement.
      i could try to do that


      Ill keep you updated on my thread

      http://www.dreamviews.com/community/...ad.php?t=80229

    18. #18
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      A little meatier, what do you all think?


      Introduction

      LDs basics - What it is, what it isn't
      LD History - Experiments, science of.

      Lucid Dreaming
      Dreaming
      Sleep Science - Cycles, REM, NREM.
      Importance to lucid dreaming
      dream recall and vividness
      dreaming aids, supplements, etc...
      Lucid Dreaming
      Brief on Science
      Brief on History
      Reasons for lucid dreaming
      Techniques
      Dream ILD
      Dream signs, recall, and reality checks
      Mnemonic ILD
      Mantras, meditation, visualization, prospective memory
      Externally ILD
      Sample Devices (watches, ND, cellphones), self-training
      Wake Back To Bed
      suggestions, correct timing.
      Wake ILD
      HH, SP, everything WILD related.
      Visualization ILD
      (TILD, LVILD)
      Depends...
      Dream Control
      Dream Stability and Vividality.
      Sidenotes
      Myths about dreams and lucid dreaming
      Self Exploration and problem solution
      ~Dream guides~
      Last edited by panta-rei; 07-04-2009 at 03:36 AM.
      Bollocks.

    19. #19
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      my placebo article could go in the myths and rumors section somewhere

    20. #20
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      Delphinus, a few critiques:

      Dreaming supplements could also be involved with LD induction. My hint would be to move that to the Lucid Dreaming part.

      WBTB, VILD and WILD are not different techniques, they are variations of the same technique.

      Myths about lucid dreaming should come before the techniques.

      I don't think it would be nice to treat techniques based on their abbreviations. There are many variations of the same tech with different acronyms.


      I think that's it for now.
      ~Kromoh

      Saying quantum physics explains cognitive processes is just like saying geology explains jurisprudence.

    21. #21
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      I'll make a couple changes... But a WBTB and a WILD are very different...

      MILDs, EILDs, and WBTBs are subcatagories under DILD.

      VILD, and some other things are types of WILDs...

      EDIT: Dream supplements do nothing for lucid dreams... they only make dreams more vivid, or more realistic, or longer... Increases the chances of LDs, but doesn't directly cause them.
      Last edited by panta-rei; 07-04-2009 at 03:38 AM.
      Bollocks.

    22. #22
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      Quote Originally Posted by Delphinus View Post
      I'll make a couple changes... But a WBTB and a WILD are very different...

      MILDs, EILDs, and WBTBs are subcatagories under DILD.

      VILD, and some other things are types of WILDs...

      EDIT: Dream supplements do nothing for lucid dreams... they only make dreams more vivid, or more realistic, or longer... Increases the chances of LDs, but doesn't directly cause them.
      They could if you believed they would

      'Placebo'

      Need i say more?

      edit:

      find a place to put this

      Spoiler for -:
      Last edited by Banana; 07-04-2009 at 03:52 AM.

    23. #23
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      Right... I know you wrote that. I was thinking somewhere in the supplements, but also in dream myths. It would have to be broken up a little, but that is to be expected with most little things written.

      The dream world one could slip into the regular dreaming section.
      Bollocks.

    24. #24
      Motion Personified Alpha mrdeano's Avatar
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      The thing is, once you tell someone its a placebo, It doesn't work anymore.
      I thought placebos only work when the person is completely unaware that product doesn't actually work. So in their head they without a doubt think it will work.

    25. #25
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      Yea... That's why I'm a little reluctant to put it in, because you can't say something like "Now try a placebo on yourself."

      Plus, you can have the opposite effect... If you tell yourself (for sake of example) MILDs are just a placebo affect, they're not going to work...
      Bollocks.

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