Thread: The Way to End Suffering

Everyone should read the book Escape from Evil by Ernest Becker. He says that without love there can be no evil, and without evil there can be no love--the paradox of human nature. The most deplorable actions are perpetrated on the behalf of heroic and altruistic motives, through which the victorious party can foster love and social harmony amongst it's respective community members. Slaughtering the enemy is therefore not evil, it is heroic. Sacrificing a child isn't evil, it is contributing to humanity's triumph over nature. Persecuting Jews isn't evil, it is affirming our favor in God's eyes. There is more at stake than the mere personal love and acceptance of the community, it is a matter of transcending nature and securing your place in eternity. Evil will always be inextricably linked to human nature when it is organized into societies. Suffering can't be completely ended, then.

Originally Posted by acatalephobic

Reading your signature as it follows your post is a little startling...

That is pretty funny, lol

Originally Posted by Caprisun

Everyone should read the book Escape from Evil by Ernest Becker. He says that without love there can be no evil, and without evil there can be no love--the paradox of human nature. The most deplorable actions are perpetrated on the behalf of heroic and altruistic motives, through which the victorious party can foster love and social harmony amongst it's respective community members. Slaughtering the enemy is therefore not evil, it is heroic. Sacrificing a child isn't evil, it is contributing to humanity's triumph over nature. There is more at stake than the mere personal love and acceptance of the community. Evil will always be inextricably linked to human nature when it is organized into societies. Suffering can't be completely ended, then.

Blah blah blah blah, that's just more dualistic bull

Haven't you ever heard of bliss? Have you ever experienced BLISS?

When a person experiences BLISS, they don't compare it to anything. They don't think "Oh jeez, this bliss thing sure feels better than suffering!". No, when you experience bliss: suffering, evil, bad, wrong, these things cease to exist in your mind.

I mean, look at what you said? You just basically portrayed good as the need to be accepted by society. There is a different kind of good - a good that benefits the whole. You, and everyone and everything. You can't however understand this good, what this good means, if you continue to define good by a dualistic extreme such as evil.


Oh yeah, and the way to end your suffering is to surrender

Originally Posted by juroara

Haven't you ever heard of bliss? Have you ever experienced BLISS?

I have heard that ignorance is bliss.

Originally Posted by juroara

I mean, look at what you said?

I didn't say anything. That was my extremely short summary of the aforementioned book. You on the other hand, just referred to a well established scientific theory as "blah blah blah blah." Please elaborate.

We aren't necessarily talking about the personal aspect of evil, we are talking about social evil on a large scale. Evil things done by normal people when they know there are no consequences. So any measure of bliss you experience in your life is irrelevant. (And surely your mood isn't in a constant state of bliss, 24/7, 365 days a year.)

Originally Posted by acatalephobic

Reading your signature as it follows your post is a little startling...

Just to clear things up, I am not the author of any of those quotes. (I swear I'm not a violent individual.)

Originally Posted by Caprisun

I didn't say anything. That was my extremely short summary of the aforementioned book. You on the other hand, just referred to a well established scientific theory as "blah blah blah blah." Please elaborate.

What "well established" scientific theory deals with issues like good and evil?

Originally Posted by PhilosopherStoned

What "well established" scientific theory deals with issues like good and evil?

I guess you could call it a "science of man" if you wanted, but there isn't necessarily a coherent theory since such a theory would entail the collaboration of a pretty wide scope of expertise, something which is hard when everyone specializes on a small facet of their chosen field. A lot of credible scientists and philosophers have written on the subject though, and some have attempted to piece together some fundamental truths based on existing theories and anthropological evidence, which is why I called it "well established." So naturally I am more inclined to defer to their expertise on the subject rather than juroara's new age shit about bliss and love and the goodness of the soul. The book mentioned above by Ernest Becker is a good starting point. He draws on work from Sigmund Freud, Otto Rank, Norman Brown, Whilhelm Reich, Erich Fromm, and a number of others who I can't remember off the top of my head. I don't know if you're really interested or if you are testing me, but if you are interested, I would recommend reading Ernest Becker.