Roller said:
Hmm ok here's my thought on conscience... I'd tend to agree with a more scientific view of conscience and guilt, and the role these tow things might play in survival.
I think that despite its merits, conscience is actually has a selfish side to it. It is a way of ensuring that you stick to a certain belief or moral code of the society around you, because of the benefits this might give you.
Say we have a poor person. They get up from a park bech without realising that they have left their wallet behind. You, as a human are faced with this choice: you can either pick it up, run after the person and return the purse, or you can pick up the purse and take the money for your own benefit. Now surely the best thing for you, when thinking in terms of 'survival of the fittest' would be to take that money for yourself so that you will have extra food? Well this is where conscience comes in...
You see the wallet, and the poor person and most people (I hope) would run after the person and give them their wallet back. Why would you do this? You don't know the person at all, and you have little connection with them, in fact in evolutionary terms you are competing with each other for rescources. I think that the reason most people would return the wallet is because they can picture themselves in the poor person's shoes and ask themselves \"what if I was in that position?\" By retruning the wallet and showing kindness you (in a way) are trying to assure yourself that should you be in such circumstances the same would happen to you.
Guilt, in my opinion, works in much the same way. It's not so much a case of you feeling bad that you've taken the money of a person, but it is you subconcsiously thinking that you wouldn't want someone to do the same to you one day.
I also think that this can be translated into other things as well. For another example - most people wouldn't think twice about squashing a spider that has crawled into their bedroom. Most normal people would not kill a stray dog that has walked into their backyard. Why not? Well I think it's because the more you see yourself in something (a dog, a cat, a chimpanzee) the more your conscience tells you not to harm it, because you can subconsciously see that it might be you in that situation one day. Is the dog any more alive than the spider? Well I'm not into the business of weighing life, but it's something to ponder.
While conscience and kindnes are undoubtably beautiful, precious things, they also are born out of a small selfishness. In my opinion anyway.[/b]
Ok, before offering my opinion, I just wanna say I just had a massive bowl of Shrimp Diablo and I'm full as a tick, so I hope everything I say comes out making sense. (@_@)!
I'd have to say that I can see why you would think this to be true...to an extent. Though I think to base your understanding of conscience itself off of this, would be to not fully dig into the concept of conscience as a whole. 'Self' is merely one of the Reasons for attuning to your conscience. It is simply one of the many "Whys" for listening to your conscience at all. And although it may be a very Common and fundamentally Basic reason for awareness of conscience, (and quite possibily the most universal, all around) it is not the only one.
It's undeniable that a large reason behind conscience and guilt is placing oneself in another person's shoes. But this in itself cannot always be broken down into a Selfish M.O. Placing yourself in another's shoes is basically turning knowledge of self into knowledge of Others, which, by definition, is not a selfish trait at all. Like I said before, the Reasons for perceiving the situation is subject to many different variables. Sure one of those could be "Well I just wouldn't want this to happen to me, so..." But another frame of mind could be, "well, as a human being, and having an understanding of human nature, I sympathize with this person's position, and am aware of the strain my actions could place on this person, physically/mentally/emotionally, whichever."
Both of these are examples of conscience, however while one is reflection of self, placed into the shoes of another, the other is acknowledgement of Oneness, consciousness that we are All Human and share similar vulnerabilities to physical and mental anguish. This, in itself, can produce a sense of contentment in oneself while simply exercising their good-will toward other people.
The "placing yourself in another's shoe's" example is the more common of the two, if you ask me, and while I don't consider it Selfish, as you seem to, I can definitely understand your feelings for calling it so. The latter is a little less common, at least in my experience. Its because of this, though, that I think alot of people (especially today's youths) are forced into feeling that there is no true benevolency in the world; that 'survival of the fittest' is the only real truth when it comes to socialization.
It is from this perspective, that I think your concept of "Conscience and Kindness" root into "Selfishness" came to be, and while I think your concept is a little tainted, I think I can see your logic behind it. But you have to take into account that there are many many truely 'giving' souls out there, who think of 'self' as no different from 'another' in terms of due respect. The conscience that forms behind this frame of mind extends beyond 'self' and enters the realm of 'We are all the same on so many levels' and it brings to light a natural want to ease the pain of others whenever possible...With, or without mentally putting yourself in their position.
Like I said, reasoning is unique to the person, conscience itself if something we All share. It simply depends on what factors motivate us to listen to it or not, and 'selfishness' just doesn't explain them all.
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