The Solution to All of Lifes Problems

[O'nus]

Suicide. What do you think...? ~

[Scatterbrain]

You're right, but that solution also deprives you from all of life's potential.

[Sandform]

Wrong it is sex.

[ClassyElf]

Terrible proposal. Suicide is a problem all in it's own.

[Amethyst Star]

I disagree. It only "solves" the problems of the person who commits suicide (not including if they go to Hell, but that's a different argument), yet causes problems with those he/she left behind. Unless you've lived your whole life away from people, thus forming no relationships at all, someone will miss you. Also, there most likely will be hospital/funeral/burial/travel (for those attending the funeral/memorial service)/etc. costs. I find suicide to be a very selfish decision. It affects everyone and only shows that that person gave up. I understand how bad people have it and how dark and sad and lonely and painful their lives can be, but there is always a way out.

[drewmandan]

Selfishness is irrelevant. You're dead. I agree with the OP in that it is technically a solution, but it's sort of the trivial solution, to use a math term.

[Brainchild]

Suicide. What do you think...? ~ It is a "solution", although not a very advantageous one (take it from someone who's been there and done that.)

[Sandform]

A solution in the same way that mass genocide is a solution... Is there a such thing as non-mass genocide?

[O'nus]

I disagree. It only "solves" the problems of the person who commits suicide (not including if they go to Hell, but that's a different argument), yet causes problems with those he/she left behind. Unless you've lived your whole life away from people, thus forming no relationships at all, someone will miss you. Also, there most likely will be hospital/funeral/burial/travel (for those attending the funeral/memorial service)/etc. costs. I find suicide to be a very selfish decision. It affects everyone and only shows that that person gave up. I understand how bad people have it and how dark and sad and lonely and painful their lives can be, but there is always a way out. A solution in the same way that mass genocide is a solution... Is there a such thing as non-mass genocide? You guys are not quite grasping the full extent. If your suicide is causing emotional harm to others, then what would solve those problems for them? Suicide. The end result is that death solves all problems. Literally. I am also just being a philosophical smart-ass. Any humanistic existentialist would slap me and I think you guys agree that taking advantage of this spark of consciousness is what we ought to do rather than focus on how to remove problems. I simply want to see peoples reactions. ~

[Brainchild]

You guys are not quite grasping the full extent. If your suicide is causing emotional harm to others, then what would solve those problems for them? Suicide. The end result is that death solves all problems. Literally. I am also just being a philosophical smart-ass. Any humanistic existentialist would slap me and I think you guys agree that taking advantage of this spark of consciousness is what we ought to do rather than focus on how to remove problems. I simply want to see peoples reactions. ~ I wouldn't slap you. Actually, no existential humanist would slap you for this line of thought. Think about it, humanism is about the sanctity of humanity and existentialism is essentially about making life what you want it to be. If you feel the need to kill yourself, no existential humanist will stop you. We will tell you whatever opinion we have of suicide but we won't "drive it home". Why? Because it's your choice (existentialism).

[Xei]

It's not an answer, it's giving up on the question.

[O'nus]

It's not an answer, it's giving up on the question. What question? I wouldn't slap you. Actually, no existential humanist would slap you for this line of thought. Think about it, humanism is about the sanctity of humanity and existentialism is essentially about making life what you want it to be. If you feel the need to kill yourself, no existential humanist will stop you. We will tell you whatever opinion we have of suicide but we won't "drive it home". Why? Because it's your choice (existentialism). Well said. Although, being a humanistic existentialist myself, I feel like slapping myself for playing with these ideas. It does expose peoples views of life and brings to exposure the idea of death. ~

[Zera]

It's not an answer, it's giving up on the question. Second that. I don't see it as a solution...

[Sandform]

You guys are not quite grasping the full extent. Actually I was making the point that it is a non-solution. A solution implies fixing something...however suicide fixes nothing. For example your hand is burned so you cut off your arm. You've removed the "problem" but it has not fixed anything. Removing problems is not the same thing as solving a problem. If (for you) the solution to a problem is removing it, instead of fixing the problem, then sure, suicide is a solution. For some people suicide really is the only solution. But I'm sure that you would logically agree that someone with social anxiety hasn't "solved" his/her problem by avoiding people. Or if you were building a machine and something isn't going right...so you through the whole machine away.

[GestaltAlteration]

Suicide is a permanent solution for a temporary problem.

[Sandform]

Suicide is a permanent solution for a temporary problem. It isn't always temporary...and I find that line B.S. anyway...most people who commit suicide do it after years of battling with depression and other issues. It is only "temporary" in other peoples eyes because they think that one individual issue at the time of suicide was the cause. They fail to see that it was probably just a re-occuring event in someones life that happened under different circumstances.

[O'nus]

I don't see it as a solution... What's the question? After death, you will no longer have to worry about anything nor suffer anything ever again. Actually I was making the point that it is a non-solution. A solution implies fixing something...however suicide fixes nothing. For example your hand is burned so you cut off your arm. You've removed the "problem" but it has not fixed anything. Removing problems is not the same thing as solving a problem. For practicality, it does prevent any other future problems and rids any current issues. If I cut off my arm to solve my burnt hand, that creates the other problem that I do not have an arm now. This is, then, an inappropriate analogy. The truth is, if I burnt my hand and killed myself, I would no longer have a burnt hand nor any other problems. If (for you) the solution to a problem is removing it, instead of fixing the problem, then sure, suicide is a solution. For some people suicide really is the only solution. Fixing is a way as to be saying to modify circumstances in order to happily adapt to it. If I live in a condition X and cannot stand it, there are solutions I can consider: I can try to change my conditions to satisfy myself or I can kill myself and rid all problems I have had and ever could have. I think the question you might want to consider is; is death a bad thing? But I'm sure that you would logically agree that someone with social anxiety hasn't "solved" his/her problem by avoiding people. Or if you were building a machine and something isn't going right...so you through the whole machine away. Still not appropriate analogies. Nothing can encapsulate the perfection of death. A social phobic will still suffer anxiety and panic attacks even when avoiding social settings. If I throw away a broken machine, I still need a machine. However, in both circumstances, I can kill myself and have no more problems. Suicide is a permanent solution for a temporary problem. This is important; what is the temporary problem? I would say that the temporary problem is living. You are going to die. So, the truth is that you are solving or jumping the inevitable. You will die and before you die you will suffer and have pain along with many other things. There may be good and exuberant things, but death offers an infinity of peace. ~

[Brainchild]

What question? Well said. Although, being a humanistic existentialist myself, I feel like slapping myself for playing with these ideas. It does expose peoples views of life and brings to exposure the idea of death. ~ Ah. I think I'm starting to grasp your logic. I've been doing some deep and dark soul searching here recently and death is still, of course, big on my list. I've even begun to watch some extremely dark arthouse/indie foreign films (since they depict and discuss death more realistically than Hollywood) and I honestly feel refreshed by being able to recognize death as not some evil partaking of fringe cults or even simply the unfortunate thing that befalls us all. I think that coming to understand death fully will help Westernized society greatly. Religious zealots would no longer be able to wrangle a nation by exploiting the citizenry's fear of God (which is really a fear of death). Coming to understand the true neutrality (not good, not evil) of suicide, IMO, will help those that hold warped ideas about death to see that it's just one of many things happening in the world. Although potentially dark, nihilism can be SO enlightening and is always philosophically delicious.

[O'nus]

Ah. I think I'm starting to grasp your logic. I've been doing some deep and dark soul searching here recently and death is still, of course, big on my list. I've even begun to watch some extremely dark arthouse/indie foreign films (since they depict and discuss death more realistically than Hollywood) and I honestly feel refreshed by being able to recognize death as not some evil partaking of fringe cults or even simply the unfortunate thing that befalls us all. I think that coming to understand death fully will help Westernized society greatly. Religious zealots would no longer be able to wrangle a nation by exploiting the citizenry's fear of God (which is really a fear of death). Coming to understand the true neutrality (not good, not evil) of suicide, IMO, will help those that hold warped ideas about death to see that it's just one of many things happening in the world. Exactly! ~

[Sandform]

What is sad is that I understand what Onus is saying, I just completely disagree... It's like saying an equation is solved if you erase the equation... When a person kills themselves it isn't because they want to die, it is because they don't want to live the way they are living. Becoming nothing isn't a solution, it is a non-solution. If a child is born with a defect are you fixing the problem by killing him? (genocide analogy again blah blah). In a solution the thought process goes like this, what can I do to get what I want? Unless you're desire is to die, then suicide isn't the solution. And no one wants to die except people who want to visit the after life...Most people just don't want to feel pain anymore, and instead be normal (or happy).

[O'nus]

What is sad is that I understand what Onus is saying, I just completely disagree... It's like saying an equation is solved if you erase the equation... That is a false analogy. You cannot analguously represent the beauty of death. You do not have to do anything if you are dead. Nothing at all. When a person kills themselves it isn't because they want to die, it is because they don't want to live the way they are living. Perhaps you are focusing too much on "a solution" rather than the benefits. I am perfectly happy right now. If I kill myself, then my life will end on a very happy note and that I controlled it and experienced it all on my own. There is no fact that I do not like the way I am living, I simply can kill myself and also prevent anything from ruining my current life. Becoming nothing isn't a solution, it is a non-solution. If a child is born with a defect are you fixing the problem by killing him? (genocide analogy again blah blah). Fixing would be fixing the defect and the child still living. However, if you kill the child, neither the child nor you have to worry about the defect anymore. Yes, genocide analogy is close but someone has to do the killing. Mass suicide leaves no one left after. ~

[Sandform]

That is a false analogy. You cannot analguously represent the beauty of death. You do not have to do anything if you are dead. Nothing at all. Perhaps you are focusing too much on "a solution" rather than the benefits. I am perfectly happy right now. If I kill myself, then my life will end on a very happy note and that I controlled it and experienced it all on my own. There is no fact that I do not like the way I am living, I simply can kill myself and also prevent anything from ruining my current life. Fixing would be fixing the defect and the child still living. However, if you kill the child, neither the child nor you have to worry about the defect anymore. Yes, genocide analogy is close but someone has to do the killing. Mass suicide leaves no one left after. ~ I added this... ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~` In a solution the thought process goes like this, what can I do to get what I want? Unless you're desire is to die, then suicide isn't the solution. And no one wants to die except people who want to visit the after life...Most people just don't want to feel pain anymore, and instead be normal (or happy). ~~~~~~~~~ Your example of wanting to end your life before feeling pain is an example of when suicide is actually a solution (since it gives you what you want).

[Zera]

This is important; what is the temporary problem? I would say that the temporary problem is living. ~ You're not exactly a half-full glass kinda guy, I'd guess.

[suttsman]

I always thought the solution to all life's problems was this: And honestly, it may sound weird and laugh at me all you want, but I don't want to die.

[O'nus]

I always thought the solution to all life's problems was this: And honestly, it may sound weird and laugh at me all you want, but I don't want to die. lol I love Jon Lajoie. I have to concede - not giving a fuck rules out suicide. ~