Think you can do anything in a lucid dream? Participate in an empirical study!

[nothin7]

Hey everyone, I am writing my senior thesis on lucid dreaming, and I would love your input. All that is required is that you rate the difficulty of performing certain activities in the lucid dream state. Relatively few people are able to control their dreams, so if you are one of those gifted individuals, please consider taking part, as your responses are crucial to my finding any significant results. I will be collecting data until the end of this month (March 31, 2008). I have listed six activities below, but I understand that not everyone will be able to try every single one, so focus on the first two before moving on to the others. Please note that I'm only looking for ratings from lucid dreams that occur after you've read the experiment, not past experiences or guesses. Also, don’t forget to answer the two questions at the end. If you have any concerns, or would like me to send you the results, feel free to email me at robert[dot]piller[at]pomona[dot]edu. Again, your participation is deeply appreciated. Activities: Please rate the difficulty of performing each activity in a lucid dream, on a scale from 1 (extremely easy) to 7 (extremely difficult/impossible). If you do not try an activity, please answer n/a (not applicable). 1. Read and understand a sentence. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 2. Observe and understand a painting. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 3. Write a sentence with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 4. Draw an outline of a cube with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 5. Speak a sentence you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 6. Hum a song you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): Two more quick questions: –How many lucid dreams do you have in the average month: –With which hand do you write: Additional comments (optional):

[Luminous]

I've sent you an email.

[Howie]

It is great to see people putting science behind something that many seem to perceive as mysticism. I would be glad to offer information I have.

[ninja9578]

I sent you a PM with my answers.

[Umbrasquall]

Hey I'll be glad to help you. One word of caution though, there might be spiders crawling around Dreamviews that pick up email addresses. So you may not want to post your actual school email directly and risk being spammed to oblivion.

[The Tao]

Hey I'll be glad to help you. One word of caution though, there might be spiders crawling around Dreamviews that pick up email addresses. So you may not want to post your actual school email directly and risk being spammed to oblivion. I've found a good way to post your E-mail, is to just make it a picture, and post a picture of the address. Really helps cut down spam.

[Twoshadows]

This sounds interesting. I will give these a try in my next lucid dreams. And I'll let you know how it goes.

[Placebo]

I'd love to participate, although I have preconceived ideas of what will happen. But I'm doing polyphasic sleep at the moment (working my way into uberman - 2 hours sleep a day in 20 minute naps) In that time, my dreams are a bit screwed as you can imagine. Even when I'm adapted to it, I'll have WILDs fairly easily but my WILDs always feel weak and shallow ... eg. I can feel my physical body and it distracts me

[seeker28]

A question: are we simply supposed to rate the difficulty of each task based on PREVIOUS EXPERIENCES, or are we supposed to attempt all 6 tasks, then report back how difficult each was?

[Howie]

I did want to invest too much effort until I see a new member come back. I have seen very zealous new members propose great ideas and never come back. Earth to nothin7 are you there?

[nothin7]

Indeed, I'm still here! I'm just not used to posting on a forum so often. I'll definitely be checking back frequently. Thanks for your advice on the email address, I changed it to something more hidden. My advisor tells me that I need to get people's reports of new lucid dream experiences, because old experiences are subject to all sorts of memory and reliability problems. So, if it's not too much trouble, please try to get fresh ratings. Thanks again for all of your help, and let me know if you have any other questions.

[LucidDreamGod]

Hey everyone, I am writing my senior thesis on lucid dreaming, and I would love your input. All that is required is that you rate the difficulty of performing certain activities in the lucid dream state. Relatively few people are able to control their dreams, so if you are one of those gifted individuals, please consider taking part, as your responses are crucial to my finding any significant results. I will be collecting data until the end of this month (March 31, 2008). I have listed six activities below, but I understand that not everyone will be able to try every single one, so please focus on the first two before moving on to the others. Also, don’t forget to answer the two questions at the end. If you have any concerns, or would like me to send you the results, feel free to email me at robert[dot]piller[at]pomona[dot]edu. Again, your participation is deeply appreciated. Activities: Please rate the difficulty of performing each activity in a lucid dream, on a scale from 1 (extremely easy) to 7 (extremely difficult/impossible). If you do not try an activity, please answer n/a (not applicable). 1. Read and understand a sentence. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 2. Observe and understand a painting. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 3. Write a sentence with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 4. Draw an outline of a cube with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 5. Speak a sentence you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 6. Hum a song you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): Two more quick questions: –How many lucid dreams do you have in the average month: –With which hand do you write: Additional comments (optional): Well I could estimate the difficulty but I havn't done many of them, but I'd know what to expect. 1. you could do it fairly easy, the sentence might sound strange though, like "I eat bacon on tuesdays" and might change any given amount the next time you look at it. 2. You could certainly look at a painting, the problem though is that it might change breifly or drasticly from any given period of time to the next. 3.It can be done but if you look back to the begining of the sentence it may change slightly. 4. It can be done, but the shape may morph a small amount there might be small complications, but it does sound fairly easy. 5. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't, sometimes your voice sounds strange or far away, it usualy sounds similer to your own voice, it may feel like your voice is paralysed. As far as saying something you've never heard, not sure what you mean, but I think it would be fairly easy because I can be pretty random sometimes. 6. It's actually really easy, I've had songs pop up in sp that I've never heard before, the song will change any given amount in any period of time though. Let me know if you want me to rate these, I'm not very good at that.

[Kromoh]

I'll work on that for you. The only thing that might be a problem is remembering the to-do list in a lucid dream. Based on previous experiences, I've realised it's incredibly hard to do that kind of task similar to "speak something you're never spoken before". I find it that nothing ever comes to mind, and if I do manage to do it, I wake myself up during the process, only to later realise I might have already spoken that sentence before. And as LDG said, things are not quite steady in a lucid dream. You might look at a picture and be able to analyse it, but then you move your eyes to see another part of it, and it changes completely. Sometiems I've just walked through a door, and when I look back the door is no more. Will email you once I get any chance to try the tasks. If only I had known about this earlier.. I had two lucids this night xD

[Oneironaught]

I haven't had the energy to dedicate to LDing lately but, as you've PMed e and have specifically asked for input I'll do so. Just know that I'm basing my answers on my experiences with 100 or more LDs throughout the past 7 years. 1. Read and understand a sentence. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 3.5. I say this because it varies from dream to dream and dream moment to dream moment. 2. Observe and understand a painting. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 1. Generally an easy task. Of course, that "understanding" may only apply to dream logic and is often completely independent from the way you'd understand it in waking life. 3. Write a sentence with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 6. This can be one of the most difficult tasks for dreamers. Then again, it's sometimes a snap. 4. Draw an outline of a cube with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 2. Drawing simple shapes is a basic task. 5. Speak a sentence you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): n/a. We all speak "new" sentences each and every day. And the same applies to dreams so I'm unsure exactly what you're asking here. 6. Hum a song you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 1. This is generally very easy - as easy as it is to make up a tune in real life. The difficult part is to recall the melody after waking. Of course, it's possible that sometimes we only think the tune is new while in the dream state. When in reality it may be a tune we're rather familiar with in waking life. Two more quick questions: –How many lucid dreams do you have in the average month: When I'm actively engaged in the art my frequency is generally in the range of 3-5 a month. –With which hand do you write: Left. But I do almost every other activity the way a right-handed person does. Additional comments (optional): A good rule of thumb is that if it's possible to do in real life it's relatively easy to do in a lucid dream. If it's not possible to do in real life then it takes greater control and skill to perform in a lucid dream. This is because of the "knowledge of difficulty" imposed by the lucid dreamer's mind. That's why any LDer needs to understand that NOTHING is impossible in an LD. What increases difficulty is the belief that something is difficult or impossible. EDIT: However, it should be noted that written text and meanful characters can be distorted beyond comprehension in an LD. That's fairly universal among lucid dreamers from all cultures. So stabillity is an issue when it comes to written material, reading or writing.

[~Erin~]

I just responded to your PM. Good luck

[slayer]

I've replied to your PM. And I hope you don't mind me posting this here so others can read it... Quote: 1. Read and understand a sentence. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): Reading a sentance wouldn't be too hard. But in a dream if you look away from writing or a clock and look back at it then it will change. People use these as Reality Checks to see if they are dreaming. You could probably read the sentance once, look away, look back, and it would be a different sentance. So don't try to write something down in a dream like a list of things you want to do. Because they'll change. 6/7 Quote: 2. Observe and understand a painting. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): This wouldn't be hard at all. I've seen pictures and things in my dream all the time. I haven't ever stopped to look at them and understand what they mean, but I'm sure that I could come up with some kind of answer. But I'm going to give this a 5/7 because some people have hard times understanding things like paintings. Quote: 3. Write a sentence with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): Like I said above, writing a sentance wouldn't be hard at all. But you shouldn't try to write out a list of things you want to do or need in a dream because you would be constantly looking at it and it would be changing, unless you can memorize it all. So if you are just writing a sentance that's unimportant then it would be a 7/7 but if you tried to write down a list of things then it would probably drop to a 5/7 Quote: 4. Draw an outline of a cube with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): Again, wouldn't be hard. I don't think the cube would change shape, of course I wouldn't know but I'm assuming that, since it's a picture, it wouldn't change because I've seen pictures in my dreams and they've never changed. 7/7 Quote: 5. Speak a sentence you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 6. Hum a song you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): I'm quoting these both because it makes it easier for me...I'm going to give both of these a 3/7 because people can make something up on the spot. But if you mean like saying something in a different language then it would be impossible. It's impossible because everything you hear, see, ect., get locked up inside your brain. Just because you can't remember doesn't mean it's not there. Like, if you watch Anime alot then you've probably seen a few Japanese speaking episodes. Your brain will remember those and store them inside your head. Then when your dreaming you can recite them. But it would be harder to do. Quote: Two more quick questions: –How many lucid dreams do you have in the average month: I maybe have one or two a month, but that's just without me trying...if I tried every night then I could probably have them like atleast 5 times a week. Quote: –With which hand do you write: My right hand. Quote: Additional comments (optional): I really hope this helps you out. If you have any questions about this then feel free to ask anything. But remember this, in a dream, there are no rules. You can defy anything you want. You can get away with anything inside a dream, like murder, or running around naked outside. You can grow wings if you want. You can visit the bottom of the ocean. There are no limits to a dream. Happy Lucid Dreaming! ~slayer That's what I said...

[Burned up]

Robert here is my response: Activities: Please rate the difficulty of performing each activity in a lucid dream, on a scale from 1 (extremely easy) to 7 (extremely difficult/impossible). If you do not try an activity, please answer n/a (not applicable). 1. Read and understand a sentence. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 5 - sentences tend to be rather random and the words keep changing in my experience. 2. Observe and understand a painting. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): n/a I don't think I've ever encountered a painting 3. Write a sentence with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 7 - Not sure I've done this ever, which leads me to assume it's hard. 4. Draw an outline of a cube with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 7 - I doubt my concentration would last that long 5. Speak a sentence you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 1 - happens all the time 6. Hum a song you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 2 - I've even composed songs in my dreams. One of them sounded OK in real life too! Can be hard to stay on message with the tune, though. I mean, it happens once and once only usually. Two more quick questions: –How many lucid dreams do you have in the average month: 1 –With which hand do you write: Right Additional comments (optional): I'm not a frequent lucid dreamer. You'd get better answers from those who do the lucid tasks.

[DeadDollKitty]

I have done a few of these already to my own curiosities. I'll try and do the others during my next few lucid dreams. I'll edit here when it happens. 1 (extremely easy) to 7 (extremely difficult/impossible). If you do not try an activity, please answer n/a (not applicable). 1. Read and understand a sentence. :id say a 5, mostly because I can read and understand it.. but whenever i look back to read it again, it changes. 2. Observe and understand a painting. :n/a 3. Write a sentence with a pencil. :rather easy.. 3. mostly because i just put my thoughts onto the paper and my hand goes on autopilot as i think it 4. Draw an outline of a cube with a pencil. :n/a 5. Speak a sentence you have never heard before. :n/a 6. Hum a song you have never heard before. :n/a Two more quick questions: –How many lucid dreams do you have in the average month: :10+ never write them down on here though, theyre written in my DJ in my room –With which hand do you write: : right hand

[Wildman]

Hello and in response to your PM, I'll be glad to help out if I can, though I'm not sure how many lucids I'll have in this time / remember to do these things. I have not tried most of these, except for #1, which I can essentially already answer. I would rate it as a 3.5 (taking 1 as the least difficult), but it might be important to note that even in regular dreams, text is often legible for me. Reading the time on a digital watch, however, is sometimes less stable. Also, I'm not sure I fully understand the last two questions: 5. Speak a sentence you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 6. Hum a song you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): Do you want us to make up a song/sentence on the spot? And for the sentence, is it supposed to be random gibberish we invent or composed of actual words? Hopefully I'll be able to add some input this month.

[YULAW]

Read and understands a sentence. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 1. This is fairly easy; there is no amount of difficulty here. Words that I focus on becomes stable if I don’t look away. Observe and understand a painting. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 1. If I create the painting mentally then the chances of it becoming distorted decreases to a minimal if any at all. If it’s a painting that’s already created by the subconscious effects of the lucid dream then I would rate the stability at a 3 or 4 as it becomes a little more difficult to keep it’s original look. Write a sentence with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 1. This one is also fairly easy I’m good on stabilizing things I create consciously in the dream. Draw an outline of a cube with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 3. If I randomly decided to do this in the dream. This one is not a difficult one but however I would have to cheat, as shapes are a little more difficult. I can stabilize shapes better by increasing the clarity of the dream while in the dream or I would have to prepare for this one prior to sleep and if that’s the case then I would rate it as 1. Speak a sentence you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 2. If it’s a sentence consisting of an alternate language than my native tongue, then this one is not all that difficult. Hum a song you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 1. I’ve created some of the best songs within a lucid dream and actually written them down once I’ve awaken. –How many lucid dreams do you have in the average month: It depends on what I’m doing in my waking world. I could have from one every other day to waves of lucid dreams everyday for an entire month straight. –With which hand do you write: I’m ambidextrous but prefer to use my left as when using my right I have a strong urge to write backwards (mirror writing).

[mark]

I had tried this out last night so I will answer this for ya but its only the first 2 questions sorry 1. Read and understand a sentence. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): I read 2 sentences and understood them, I cant remember what the first one said though DIFFICULTY - 1 it was easy to understand the sentences. RESULTS I approach on of the hot dog stands which has some posters up on the windows. I read a poster in blue writing but I cant remember what it says. I fly up to another window which was to high up to see from the ground and it says "For free mail visit: www.freemail.co.uk" 2. Observe and understand a painting. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): DIFFICULTY: 1, it was easy to see but it changed every time I looked away from it RESULTS: I look at the side of a white Lorrie which has a large poster on it. It is orange round the edge and fades to yellow in the center, in the center is a cartoon desert island with a few palm trees on it. It almost looks like a sunset picture. I look away and look back and now it changed!! its a ship sailing on a bright blue ocean and I look away again and when I look back its changed again!! (this was incredible! its the first time I have ever really noticed that) Now it is a painting of a Savannah area with a zebra who's body is far to long in the middle. Two more quick questions: –How many lucid dreams do you have in the average month: in a average month its usually 6 or 7 but this ranges from 2 to 16 –With which hand do you write: I am right handed Additional comments (optional): The tasks themselves would be fairly easy I think but its hard to keep them fixed, they change constantly and I am sure Iif I had re read the writing it would have been something different

[AmazeO XD]

Got your PM, here's my opinion... 1. Read and understand a sentence. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 3- At a single look it may not be too hard, but when you look at something and look away, it has a tendency to change or be distorted. 2. Observe and understand a painting. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 3- Just like the sentence. "understand" is probablly not the word to use... "comprehend" sounds more like it. Anyways, it all really depends on the vividness and clarity of your dream. 3. Write a sentence with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 2- Once again, depends on the vividness of the lucid dream. 4. Draw an outline of a cube with a pencil. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 4- Depends on the vividness, and how often you draw cubes in real life (heh...) 5. Speak a sentence you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): Undecided "a sentence you have never heard before" is too general. A differnet language? What exactly are you talking about? 6. Hum a song you have never heard before. Difficulty (1-7 or n/a): 1- Simple. Just start to hum. Your mind will make up a song, no problem. Two more quick questions: –How many lucid dreams do you have in the average month- This has increased quite a bit, currently this month I have had 4. –With which hand do you write: Right.

[Conquer]

1. Read and understand a sentence. Difficulty (6) I've never been able to do this, I just can't see the text. Very hard to explain. No, it doesn't change, I just can't, for the life of me, read it. 2. Observe and understand a painting. Difficulty (n/a) Never seen a painting, then again I've never had a lengthy lucid :/ 3. Write a sentence with a pencil. Difficulty (n/a) Why write when you can fly 4. Draw an outline of a cube with a pencil. Difficulty (n/a) Never tried 5. Speak a sentence you have never heard before. Difficulty (2) Easy, did it in last nights extremely short lucid. 6. Hum a song you have never heard before. Difficulty (2) I find it easier in a dream. lol

[Conquer]

(Turns out I'm not allowed to edit my first post?) Oh, I'm also Right Handed, and have only about 1-3 lucids a month right now, but I just started. Ps, Sorry for double post mods!

[nothin7]

Hey everyone, Thanks for all of your contributions. A couple of points: I understand that a lot of you have experienced reading, writing, singing, etc. in a lucid dream, but it is important that you don't rate past lucid dreams. The point is to know what the task is and consciously try to do it. I'm sure plenty of you have said some random sentences in your lucid dreams, but that's not the same as saying to yourself "I'm going to speak a sentence that's never been spoken" and then doing it. Same goes for the other activities. So, please try to get ratings from lucid dreams that you've had after reading the experiment. I suppose I can allow one exception: if you've specifically set out to do one of the tasks in a previous lucid dream, that's fine, as long as the specific intent was there, and it didn't just happen. For those that have already or are planning to respond, it will be helpful to know know that you've read this. Can you put a note in the additional comments section mentioning that you did, in fact, use new lucid dreams? Thanks! Some of you had questions about the last two activities. For task 5, the idea is to generate a novel sentence (in English, if that's what you speak). In other words, you're not allowed to just repeat a sentence you've said or heard before. But it should still be grammatical, and it should makes sense. If it's easier to speak gibberish, for example, that's an interesting fact, and make note of it in your comments. Same goes for task 6, I'm testing how difficult it is to generate a novel tune. As for the melody, I suppose it's difficult to impose any constraints. Just make sure you're not just replaying something you've heard before. Please let me know if you have any other questions, and good luck!