Grey Foam-Nest Treefrogs

**nerve** · 02-04-2010 06:30 AM

[STAFF: feel free to move this to SB, which is where I was originally going to put it, but it seemed like it could spark more serious discussion...I don't know.]

I was looking through this huge animal book I got awhile ago, full of pics and info on all kinds of animals across the globe (and WOW there are some weird ass creatures out there o_o).

I came across the Grey Foam-Nest Treefrog, which has a very strange way of mating.

This species deposits fertilized eggs as a foam nest. The female may begin building the foam nest, stop, climb down from her perch, and rehydrate in the pool below. At this point the male usually releases her. She then climbs back up and continues building the foam nest. She may repeat this two to four times. The male that originally was on her back may not be the one that is on her back when she releases 500–1,200 eggs into the foam nest. The female may return to the nest the following night and add more foam but not more eggs to the nest to keep it from dehydrating. Communal nests result from up to 20 females and twice as many males building nests close enough together so that they coalesce. Sperm competition is thought to occur in this species (as in many foam-nesting treefrogs with multiple males spawning with one female). This is further confirmed by the presence of large testes in the males that allows them to produce and shed sperm multiple times throughout the breeding season. After four to six days the developing larvae drop from the nest into the water below.

[taken from http://www.answers.com/topic/gray-treefrog]

Spoiler for image:

this reminded me of some human behaviour...I mean, I've heard of crazy orgies in like, foam pits. I have no source, but I'm sure people have done/do this stuff. e_e;

anyway, at the same time it made me think of christians calling this and that "unnatural," as if we're supposed to do only that which is "natural." this whole argument holds absolutely no water.

for one example, (from what I understand) catholics are very anti-contraception. I read in a book (don't remember which), one catholic's argument was, seriously, "it's unnatural to use condoms, you don't see animals wearing them."

come on. really?

ok, setting aside the fact that homosexual behaviour is well documented in at least 500 species [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosex...ior_in_animals], are we supposed to do everything that animals do? you know, to be sure we aren't doing anything "unnatural?"

animals cannot read or write. so, I guess we should stop reading books, including the bible.

animals do not wear clothes. so, I guess we should all go around naked.

animals do not drive cars, watch television, dye their hair, wear makeup or jewelry, use the internet, go to church, talk on the phone, perform life saving surgeries with hi-tech equipment and medicines...guess we shouldn't do any of that stuff either.

oh, one last thing...animals have big sex orgies in foam pits :)

**SkA_DaRk_Che** · 02-04-2010 06:55 AM

Originally Posted by nerve

perform life saving surgeries with hi-tech equipment and medicines...guess we shouldn't do any of that stuff either.

Are you equating contemporary medecine and medical breakthroughs with ramming a cock up someone's ass?

Stay the hell away from my nephews and nieces.

**Xaqaria** · 02-04-2010 07:11 AM

Originally Posted by SkA_DaRk_Che

Are you equating contemporary medecine and medical breakthroughs with ramming a cock up someone's ass?

Stay the hell away from my nephews and nieces.

No, he isn't; because animals do the latter, but not the former. From what I gather, its a matter of doing the complete opposite of what you call it. If all we are allowed to do is what is natural and natural is defined by 'only that which animals are known to do" then we can partake in homosexual activity, but not contemporary medicine.

**nerve** · 02-04-2010 07:16 AM

Originally Posted by SkA_DaRk_Che

Are you equating contemporary medecine and medical breakthroughs with ramming a cock up someone's ass?

Stay the hell away from my nephews and nieces.

you know, you don't HAVE to reply to my posts. you and I already had this argument elsewhere (and in more than one thread), and I think if you'd do a little more reading and a little less hatin', you'd learn just how much of a fucking asshole you are.

oh, and don't you mean stay away from just your nephews? I'll do that, and be sure and keep my lesbian friends away from your nieces.

since, of course, we're all pedophiles.

**SkA_DaRk_Che** · 02-04-2010 07:31 AM

Originally Posted by nerve

since, of course, we're all pedophiles.

That's what my pastor says.

**evildoctor** · 02-04-2010 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by SkA_DaRk_Che

That's what my pastor says.

Then get a new pastor. Your pastor is obviously an ignorant and biggoted cretin. Are you sure this is someone you should be getting life advice from?

I am reminded of a dear freind of mine. She is very Catholic with two young girls. Her husband (and my freind) was shot and killed almost 2 years ago by a total nutcase, the nut has since been committed to an institution for the criminaly insane.

She does every thing her preist tells her. I have asked her often why she takes life advice from a 50 year old virgin who has sworn to never touch a woman. I have asked her why she doesnt find it insulting for her and her daughters to follow a religion that does not think women can holy enough to be preists and indeed whose scritpture makes it clear that women must be submissive and obident to their husbands/fathers.

Her preist of course has no answer for why her kind and gentle husband was slain by a random nut job.

Interestingly of course it is this celibate catholic preisthood which has shown itself to having a certain predeliction for children.....

Why do you xtians need someone in a black dress to tell you what to do and what to think? And if your pastor has hate issues (which would appear to be the case) then why would you not seek to find one who at least tries to follow the basic xtian teachings of love, tollerance and not judging others...????

Nerve - Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law. If you want orgies then go for it. The foam pit is optional.

**juroara** · 02-04-2010 05:54 PM

People in general, not just christians, have silly ideas of what is and what isn't natural. But looking at animal behavior to justify human behavior, you get into dangerous territory. Take for example the black widow - who thinks after sex a woman has the RIGHT to murder her man?

We're not frogs. We're not spiders. We're not even monkeys. And while apes are our closest cousins, not all apes represent human behavior. For example, for years gorillas were used to justify the dominance of man over a women. But we don't come from gorillas either.

If you really want to talk about what is natural FOR MAN we need to first know who our ancestors are. What we do know about our ancestors is revealing. It reveals that we are social and communal. But it also reveals that we were more than likely enjoying monogamous relationships. Anthropology speaking, it's polygamy that is 'unnatural' because there just isn't any evidence to support that our hominid ancestors were polygamous. (that I know of)

And when our hominid ancestors didn't have any culture or religion to tell a woman (or a man) to be submissive, I can hardly imagine why a hominid woman would willingly allow her man to flirt with another hominid woman. When jealousy is such a primal emotion, it seems more likely that the hominid woman would deal with her jealousy with tooth and nail. Not by saying "oh you have a right by God to have more than one wife". Please, spare me!

I'm not saying it isn't natural for a man to want more than one woman. Maybe evolutionary speaking our hominid males couldn't afford to be picky, I don't know. But I am saying, it isn't natural for a woman to stand by it

Polygamy in my opinion always needs a cultural context or religious belief to override our natural jealousy.

Our hominid ancestors reveal even more. Its now believed that we are who we are because smaller, less aggressive, males found a different way to get a female. Rather than fighting other males aggressively, they won the heart of a female by pleasing her by bringing her food. It's easy to see how this grew into modern day romance, where it's the male who's expected to buy the ring and not the other way around. And again, there is an evolutionary reason why so many people desire a man or a woman all to themselves. It's called children. Children need a mom and they need a dad. And child-rearing takes years, which means the ideal relationship is a committed one.

It's interesting that people tend to consider the romantic relationship the most true and the most loving relationship of all - when really - it's just an evolutionary instinct to ensure that children have committed parents. In my opinion it's friendship that is the most loving relationship of all.

Where does this leave homosexuality? I have no idea. But the whole homosexuality deal is blown out of proportion, and sexuality in general.

I think what's more important is that Christians need to remember that Adam and Even were never wed at a church. The church then has no real power to define what is marriage. The bible would even seem to support that what is bound in heaven can not be undone by man. Let's look at Adam and Eve - they were bound in heaven when they loved each other and had sex. No priest...no church was included. Just two young hearts.

**nina** · 02-04-2010 11:25 PM

Originally Posted by SkA_DaRk_Che

Are you equating contemporary medecine and medical breakthroughs with ramming a cock up someone's ass?

Stay the hell away from my nephews and nieces.

Originally Posted by SkA_DaRk_Che

That's what my pastor says.

Stop trolling.

edit: Moved to SB at OP's request

**nerve** · 02-05-2010 04:13 AM

well, I what I meant was, move it if it starts to GET senseless...evildoctor and juroara made great replies, which I appreciate.

I just said that, so that when someone starts making fun of christians or whatever (as it usually happens in R/S), instead of everyone getting their posts deleted, infractions, or banned, you could just move the thread here.

it was going good, putting it here is a death sentence

I would actually like to see if it could get any more serious replies...

**nerve** · 02-06-2010 05:31 AM

Thread: Grey Foam-Nest Treefrogs

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