If You Want To Start Having Lucid Dreams ASAP and More Frequently, START MEDITATING

[NeverOnce]

Hello everyone, after reading this thread I assure you that will gain insightful information towards your path to lucid dreaming, both scientifically and from my own personal experience. Here are just a few of the benefits you'll get: Dream recall will improve; dreams will become more vivid. Falling asleep will become easier; helps with insomnia. Lucid Living will come easily and naturally WILD will become easier. Overall amount of LD's will greatly increase. Results in feeling healthier and revived during the day. Let me begin by saying that when I had my first lucid dream couple of months of ago I had never knew such a thing existed. The reason (which now I am sure of) that I started having lucid dreams is because I was regularly meditating. Now I will start explaining what this does and I’ll include the science later. As we all know, in order to become lucid you have to become conscious during your dream. As little as 15 minutes a day of meditation can help naturally raise your awareness. In other words you will naturally start becoming self-aware. After a while you will start to naturally become aware in your dreams that you are dreaming without any reality checks and then because of that become lucid. This is how I started experiencing lucid dreaming. I started becoming naturally aware in my dreams that I am dreaming and then suddenly with no effort I become conscious and therefore it is now a lucid dream. And it makes perfect sense doesn't it? Meditation helps you become more self-aware and raises your awareness level and therefore in the dream you are also more self-aware. Why does this happen? When you meditate, you activate the functions of your pineal gland (spiritual people call it the third eye because it physically looks like a little eye in your brain.) The pineal gland is located around the middle of the forehead, slightly above the junction of the eyebrows, but deep in the brain. So what does the pineal gland do? It produces an important hormone called melatonin. Melatonin affects the quality of dreams. High levels of melatonin lead to vivid dreams and high quality sleep. The more vivid the dream, the easier it is to obtain lucidity. As children we have high levels of melatonin hormone, however as we grow up our pineal gland does not produce as much. Meditation helps you become more aware and helps you produce more melatonin. Progress and Results: After regular practice of meditation of at least 15 minutes a day (the more the better) in 2-4 weeks you will notice that your normal dreams are becoming more and more vivid. You will notice that you are becoming more self-aware (both in dreams and real life). So what should you do? Keep doing all the practices you are currently doing to achieve LD and add this essential practice to your list, I assure you it will help you get to your goal of lucid dreaming much faster and you will start having lucid dreams more frequently. How To Meditate Properly: 1. Position: Honestly you can meditate in any position you want, but the best one (in my opinion) is the "classic" meditation position) where you sit straight up with legs crossed (you can put something behind your back to lean on). 2. What To Do: Simply close your eyes and focus in the center of the "darkness" that you see. The goal is to be able to focus without letting any thoughts enter your mind and when they do let them pass by without interacting with them. Do not dwell on them or think about them. (you WILL find this very difficult at first) but with practice it will become easier and easier so do not get discouraged) I personally repeat a mantra because it helps one focus more and it helps control the flow of your thoughts, it doesn't matter what the mantra is as long as it is not distracting. 3. The Goal: to enter a meditative state where no thoughts are entering your mind (you WILL know when you get there) you will start feeling very peaceful and relaxed and you will get tingling sensations all over your body. You might start seeing colors and patterns, don't let them distract you, just let them pass by and enjoy them. Sometimes you will feel like there's an energy entering your back ( I personally experience that many times and spiritual people believe that this is cosmic energy entering your body which is very good for your mental and physical health) All In One: Basically what you are doing is quieting your outer senses and turning your attention inwards. This is what meditation actually is. Sitting down and closing your eyes and letting your thoughts do the rest is NOT meditation. You will not achieve self awareness unless you are able to control your thoughts and keep them from distracting you and be able to focus your attention inwards. This basically (with practice) gives your conscious superiority over your mind (thoughts and other things that you do not consciously control) which is very essential in lucid dreaming. [To help clear the goal for some people, think of meditation like looking into your higher consciousness and becoming aware of it. Now I will use the metaphor of looking at water. You cannot see your reflection in the water unless the water is completely still. Imagine thoughts as small rocks dropping in the water, they will not allow you to see your reflection anymore. Same thing with meditation, only when the mind is completely still you can become aware of your higher conscious.] Why is it important to have little to no thoughts? Because if your meditation became your thoughts taking over, it will turn into daydreaming. If you consider that meditation that's fine but that's not the type I'm talking about here. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- EDIT: (Mostly because of people on reddit, but I wanted to include it here) I honesty don't understand the big deal that people have about the concept of meditation without having thoughts. If you get deep into spirituality, it emphasizes the importance of not having any thoughts in deep meditation. Check out the first 20 minutes of the video below to see the effect of not having thoughts during meditation on your meditation experience. (From a spiritual perspective) just so you know that it is not some weird idea of mine. Quotes from spiritual people about this "no thought" that you are so confused about: "One of the most important limitations is not knowing that a state of "no thoughts" is possible, desirable, or useful. Having few thoughts is not something described cryptically in obscure texts of one small sect. The state of "no thoughts" has been described by many leading spiritual figures in many different traditions." -Gary Weber, author of 'Happiness Beyond Thought' Nisargadatta Maharaj: "To be free from thoughts is itself meditation." Ramana Maharshi: "When these thoughts are dispelled, you remain in the state of meditation, free from thoughts." Bhante Gunaratana: "Once your mind is free from thought, it becomes clearly wakeful and at rest in an utterly simple awareness. This awareness cannot be described adequately." Dzogchen Master Chokyi Nyima Rinpoche: "Meditation training...is a way of being free from clinging and the conceptual attitude of forming thoughts...Thought is samsara. Being free of thought is liberation." ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Research the state of meditation with no thoughts to learn more about it. NOTE: I just wanted to emphasize that this it not my personal idea of meditation. This is a practice of meditation that exists and practiced by many people. Its goal lies more in the side of high spiritual and conscious realization but it does bring about the effect of high self-awareness which we need for lucid dreaming, so before you judge the approach, realize its goal and existence. For more information on what happens to your body when you meditate (in a spiritual perspective) this video is very insightful: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZpCjZEikUGs I just wanted to share my knowledge and experience with everyone else to help them attain lucid dreams easily and more frequently. P.S. Meditation has more benefits than meets the eyes. Here are some more benefits that you should be aware of: (all scientifically tested) Better focus, less anxiety, more creativity, more compassion, better memory, less stress, and more gray matter (which means more positive emotions, longer-lasting emotional stability, and heightened focus during daily life) AND MUCH MORE (See last source below) The Science Behind My Claims: “The scientific connection between melatonin and meditation was first explored in 1995 by researchers at the University of Massachusetts Medical Center's Stress Reduction and Relaxation Program. Since melatonin is produced mainly at night, overnight urine samples were collected and tested for 6-sulphatoxymelatonin, a melatonin breakdown product thought to be an accurate reflection of blood melatonin levels. Researchers found that women who meditated had significantly higher levels compared with women who did not. Another study found that meditation before bedtime increased melatonin levels for that night. No increases in blood melatonin levels were noted on nights where participants didn't meditate. This suggests that regular practice of meditation is necessary.” Sources: Benson H. The Relaxation Response. Mind/Body Medicine, eds. Goleman D, Gurin J. New York 1993. Consumer Reports Books, 233-257. Domar AD, Dreher H. Healing Mind, Healthy Woman. New York 1996. Henry Holt and Company, 55-65. Kabat-Zinn J. Mindfulness Meditation:Health benefits of an ancient Buddhist practice. Mind/Body Medicine, eds. Goleman D, Gurin J. New York 1993. Consumer Reports Books, 259-275. Leskowitz E, Seasonal Affective Disorder and the Yoga Paradigm: A reconsideration of the role of the pineal gland. Medical Hypotheses 33;1990;155-158. Massion AO, Teas J, Hebert JR, Wertheimer MD, Kabat-Zinn J. Meditation, melatonin and breast/prostate cancer: Hypothesis and Preliminary Data. Medical Hypotheses 44 (1995) 39-46 Tooley GA, Armstrong SM, Norman TR, Sali A. Acute increases in night-time plasma melatonin levels following a period of meditation. Biological Psychology 53 (2000) 69-78. Meditation Science: (has links to scientific studies about meditation) http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/...ditating-today IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO KNOW MORE ABOUT MELATONIN AND ITS EFFECT ON SLEEP AND LUCID DREAMING READ THIS: http://www.social-consciousness.com/...idnt-know.html

[Laurelindo]

Great thread, I will probably practice this when I go to sleep in five minutes. :bravo:

[Fuz]

This is an amazing thread and also makes a lot of sense I will practice this and let you know the results, a few quick questions: 1. Would this be more effective to do just before bed or during any time of the day? 2. How long did it take you to see the results?

[NeverOnce]

This is an amazing thread and also makes a lot of sense I will practice this and let you know the results, a few quick questions: 1. Would this be more effective to do just before bed or during any time of the day? 2. How long did it take you to see the results? Answer for number 1: It should be effective either way. But in terms of lucid dreaming there would be a little more effect if you meditate before you go to sleep Answer for number 2: With regular meditation (at least 15-30 minutes every day) I start experiencing very vivid dreams within 2-4 weeks. When I stop the process the vivid dreams stop and when I start again it takes another 2-4 weeks. So I'm starting now to keep it consist and try to not stop the consistency. Then you'll notice you have become more aware in dreams and they are much easier to recall. And yes please let me know your results!

[Memm]

I'm not an expert in meditation but are you trying to describe mindfulness meditation or just single-pointed concentration? From what I know mindfulness builds awareness (like mindfulness of breathing) and is something you eventually do all the time (like KingYoshi's ADA except from what I've read you can't and shouldn't try to "force" mindfulness, it's just something that comes naturally after some meditation practice and if you take some time throughout the day to remember your breath) and is a long-term change in the brain, or at least that's the goal. While if you just sit with a quiet mind and concentrate on something you're not actually making any "changes" to your mental state / brain so the effects are short term (so like you said it goes away quickly). So I'm assuming because you seem to be talking about just a calm state of concentration (on the 3rd eye / pineal gland) without any other added benefits (and short term effect) that it's probably a good idea to just take those 10-20 minutes and do it right before sleep (so the effect is still active as you're falling asleep).

[Zoth]

Some constructive criticism: And it makes perfect sense doesn't it? Meditation helps you become more self-aware and raises your awareness level and therefore in the dream you are also more self-aware. I'm sorry, but in this particular sense it doesn't The meditation you mention focus on the "blockage" of thoughts. But that's contrary to self-awareness. Self-awareness includes attention to your thought processes, along with other components of self-monitoring. Sitting down and closing your eyes and letting your thoughts do the rest is NOT meditation. You will not achieve self awareness unless you are able to block your thoughts and be able to focus your attention inwards. - Like Memm said, it's relevant that you explain what type of meditation you're referring too. Being in a contemplative state, letting your thoughts flow without interfering is also a type of meditation. That said, meditation doesn't induce lucid dreams. Instead, certain types of meditation help with lucid dreaming induction. Several techniques don't require focus at all, like MILD, which can help you achieve lucidity through a mixture of spontaneous recall or use of pre-determined cues. Benson H. The Relaxation Response. Mind/Body Medicine, eds. Goleman D, Gurin J. New York 1993. Consumer Reports Books, 233-257. Domar AD, Dreher H. Healing Mind, Healthy Woman. New York 1996. Henry Holt and Company, 55-65. As the relaxation response was invalidated by modern research, where does this reference fit into your perspective? The more vivid the dream, the easier it is to obtain lucidity. This makes all the sense in the world, but where is the reference for this claim? Personal experience? Why does this happen? When you meditate, you focus on your pineal gland But below when you actually explain how to meditate, you make no mention to the pineal gland focusing. How can we even focus on our pineal gland when we don't even have a body map of it? Have any of your references done a control study comparing meditators that focused on the pineal gland vs meditators that didn't? I agree with the many advantages meditation brings, but you're still not making a clear link between it and lucid dreaming, as your references show. What you need to make your post more credible (imo) is references that show links between melatonin levels and lucid dreaming, meditation and lucid dreaming, and that sort of things. The spiritual references also tend to divert a bit from the post. Regardless, interesting topic

[Bobblehat]

Zoth, I am not sure what you mean when you say "As the relaxation response was invalidated by modern research...".

[Zoth]

Zoth, I am not sure what you mean when you say "As the relaxation response was invalidated by modern research...". True, should had made that clearer. I am referring to the idea that you can achieve the same effects with so-called "relaxation response" (and by using an array of relaxation and meditation techniques) that you get from the famous Transcendental Meditation. There are some problems in the data provided by the author Herbert Benson, along with the specific data that indicates very different effects derived from several types of exercises/techniques. A review of literature on the subject can be read here. Still, it's not clear whether the OP advocates for the theory of the relaxation response, because some messages in the post support it and others reject it. That's why I'm trying to understand how does that particular reference fit into his perspective: is he including it for the sake of physiological effects of meditation, or associating relaxation response to TM? Because unlike it's claimed, they do not provoke the same effects. Oh, and of course, we have to wonder where is the link between TM (some language used by the OP makes me believe is he indeed referring to TM) and lucidity.

[NeverOnce]

I realized that I wasn't very clear about what I was talking about, so I edited a lot of things from my post, especially since I received a high response from reddit/r/luciddreaming and I brought what I edited back here. But to answer some of your questions: "I'm sorry, but in this particular sense it doesn't The meditation you mention focus on the "blockage" of thoughts. But that's contrary to self-awareness. Self-awareness includes attention to your thought processes, along with other components of self-monitoring." Blockage of thought wasn't the best way to describe it, what I intended is reaching a state with no thoughts. "Like Memm said, it's relevant that you explain what type of meditation you're referring too." I did that with my edit. I guess it is different from what most people know, but that is the one that I always used. "This makes all the sense in the world, but where is the reference for this claim? Personal experience?" Yes it is from my experience, but I also thought it makes logical since. I didn't try to look for something to support the claim. "But below when you actually explain how to meditate, you make no mention to the pineal gland focusing. How can we even focus on our pineal gland when we don't even have a body map of it? Have any of your references done a control study comparing meditators that focused on the pineal gland vs meditators that didn't?" I also wasn't clear about this point. It seems that when you normally meditate, your penal gland functions is activated. In the summary of study I mentioned they didn't list a specific type of meditation that the subject used. However I know that spiritually the type of meditation I provided has to do with the pineal gland. "melatonin levels and lucid dreaming" the last link I provided talks about that from a scientific perspective

[Bobblehat]

Thanks.

[nisset1]

Great thread! I have always been interested in meditation, and i think this is a good starting point for me. i was wondering if you could recommend some books or maybe some websites about meditation?

[NeverOnce]

Great thread! I have always been interested in meditation, and i think this is a good starting point for me. i was wondering if you could recommend some books or maybe some websites about meditation? The books I own about meditation follow a specific spiritual path that I would like to follow. Those practices just happened to help with lucid dreaming although that is not their goal. So unfortunately I cannot recommend any books or websites. But, if you do your own research about meditation in general and/or meditation in connection to lucid dreaming you definitely you will find useful information that can help you start. I also recommend watching the first 18 minutes of the link about meditation I posted. It will sum up pretty much why you should meditate and what kind of effect it will have on your body. Good luck!

[Mirai]

A great place to look is the teachings of Maharishi Mahesh Yogi. A quick Google search should give you a couple places to do some research, I also believe he has quite a few books. Give em' a try! -Mirai

[WhiteWind]

In the video you posted, it talks about entering a no breath state. When you enter the meditative state, are you still aware that you are breathing? I've been in this state several times, but I don't know how to continue. I am aware that I haven't been breathing for several minutes, and there is an immense struggle to break out of the state and take a breath. I was wondering if you've encountered that issue, and what to do about it?

[NeverOnce]

In the video you posted, it talks about entering a no breath state. When you enter the meditative state, are you still aware that you are breathing? I've been in this state several times, but I don't know how to continue. I am aware that I haven't been breathing for several minutes, and there is an immense struggle to break out of the state and take a breath. I was wondering if you've encountered that issue, and what to do about it? The state is "no thought state" not "no breath state" Obviously you will still be breathing, how else will you live, you just get to the point of all external things are now disconnected from your conscious. So when you get to the "no thought" state, you are now only aware of your inner self and nothing else. So you forget about breathing and even about the body your meditating with. your breathing becomes very light and not noticeable. You forget about all the external things. Now you are only focused inwards, on your inner higher conscious, which is a really powerful and cool state to be in. We have to guide our mind inwards so it can not be distracted by the outer things.

[Sibyline]

I once got so stoned that I thought I wasn't breathing for a long time. Fascinating feeling. I guess time seems to stretch in the same way during meditation.

[kilham]

It's a great post NeverOnce... I also became interested in LD because of meditation. When I began practising meditation I had some past idea of LD, but I noticed that LDing increased a lot, so I began to look backwards and got the conclusion that meditation along with increased awareness during the day stimulated it. Unfortunately at that time I had to stop it because I was having a hard time at night with uncontrolled astral projections and other heavy and even painful things, so when I stopped meditating (but continued with living in the present moment during the day) LD began more clearly and it was way more easy to control I began meditating again this week, and I'm getting again astral projection sensations instead of LD! I don't want to push it because -I confess- I'm kind of afraid of the overwhelming sensations that happen to me because of meditation, it's like an accumulative effect.

[parkmeats]

It's a great post NeverOnce... I also became interested in LD because of meditation. When I began practising meditation I had some past idea of LD, but I noticed that LDing increased a lot, so I began to look backwards and got the conclusion that meditation along with increased awareness during the day stimulated it. Unfortunately at that time I had to stop it because I was having a hard time at night with uncontrolled astral projections and other heavy and even painful things, so when I stopped meditating (but continued with living in the present moment during the day) LD began more clearly and it was way more easy to control I began meditating again this week, and I'm getting again astral projection sensations instead of LD! I don't want to push it because -I confess- I'm kind of afraid of the overwhelming sensations that happen to me because of meditation, it's like an accumulative effect. What type of meditation are you using? Or if you don't know the name, could you describe it? With results like that, who wouldn't want to try!

[elucidator]

Yeah I defiantly can verify that Meditation helps. I started practicing Qigong 7 and half years ago and to be honest wasn't all that interested in dreams or meditating, but as time went on things began to change. It started with subtle differences in my dreams, I began to remember more and more of my dreams. The first year I started to become more aware in my dreams, eventually you just knew that dreams would become more frequent so slowly you just become more aware that your dreaming. In the spiritual cultivation community to gain more clarity you need less attachments in your everyday life, then meditating becomes easier. Most peoples noise comes from having hectic daily lives where many issues aren't resolved, so eliminating that stuff first is the quickest way to achieve a meditative state. In Chinese the term is wuwei, from Taoism it means "no intention", it is the ideal goal while meditating. So every time I explain this to people I try to let them know that you should be aware that your meditating, but your not thinking. It sounds kinda opposite of not thinking to be aware that your meditating, but a big mistake is falling asleep while trying to meditate. Sleeping and meditating have been proven to have very different wave lengths, so the effects are different. In the end I would say there are probably many great routines out there, from Yoga to Tai Chi. I practice qigong and have found a many great benefits. But it just isn't that either its also daily habits, like smoking or drinking. Certain dietary things we do, I noticed eating bad foods yielded less dreams. If you drink alcohol I noticed for me at least it effects my dreams. Basically what I noticed is the less polluting things psychologically and physiologically the more your experience will be enhanced. Once again every ones mental states are different so what works for me might not for you. My practice is called Falun Dafa, you can look it up all the reading materials and lectures are free online at the .org website. I always suggest it people who are interested in meditating because I feel the teacher covers a great deal of subjects. I know of other practices and other books I have read, if your interested I can find them.

[kilham]

What type of meditation are you using? Or if you don't know the name, could you describe it? With results like that, who wouldn't want to try! Hmmm I don't know if it has a name, what I basically do/did was concentrate on breathing, the thoughts would appear and occasionally I wander again but it doesn't matter, I start again and again from the begining, then I imagined I was breathing not from the lungs, but from the top of my head. I don't know why I decided to do that or if there's an actual technique about that, but the first time I did it, I noticed some time later that I had stopped breathing or I don't know how to call it because I had no feeling of being actually breathing in and out from the lungs. I guess that's the one, I've never tried that again because what followed wasn't very nice, I can't even describe the overwhelming sensations, it was very painful and then it took me about an hour to get back to my body.

[mimihigurashi]

What type of meditation are you using? Or if you don't know the name, could you describe it? With results like that, who wouldn't want to try! I don't want to burst your bubble or anything, but chances are, even if you did exactly what kilham did, you probably won't get the same result. This sort of stuff greatly varies on the individual person. Also, does anyone know if breath meditation is any useful? Does it increase self-awareness? My thinking is that it does, because you're bringing your attention inside/to your own body, but I could be wrong.

[Memm]

Also, does anyone know if breath meditation is any useful? Does it increase self-awareness? My thinking is that it does, because you're bringing your attention inside/to your own body, but I could be wrong. In my experience the breath is basically just a stabilisation technique, if you find your mind wandering away from awareness it's just something that snaps you back. You can also use visualisations instead of the breath, for example visualising an object and keeping your mind calm enough that it doesn't fade away or do something strange. So it's basically an anchor, you concentrate on your breathing, then if something takes your mind away you eventually remember that you were concentrating on your breathing and you go back to that. I've noticed what really helps me become "aware" is really calming my mind and trying not to think of anything except the breath or visualisation. After 20 minutes of this you get up and do whatever you need to do, but you realise that everything just seems a lot more crisp and you notice everything around you whether you like it not because your mind has no other distractions, you're fully in the "now". It's definitely a very pleasant and peaceful state to be in and everything you do has your full attention, it's very useful to do this before, say, exams. =] But I have to admit that while I think of myself as quite aware, it hasn't really helped me with DILD. It helps with vividness but there's a difference between being "aware" and being "aware that you're dreaming".

[elucidator]

My teacher talks about this... the Taoist monks used breathing techniques. I know Buddhist or some sects chant a mantra to replace all thoughts with just the Buddha's name. So I could see the breathing techniques to be similar. I actually know some material on this if your interested I'll find it.

[parkmeats]

Hmmm I don't know if it has a name, what I basically do/did was concentrate on breathing, the thoughts would appear and occasionally I wander again but it doesn't matter, I start again and again from the begining, then I imagined I was breathing not from the lungs, but from the top of my head. I don't know why I decided to do that or if there's an actual technique about that, but the first time I did it, I noticed some time later that I had stopped breathing or I don't know how to call it because I had no feeling of being actually breathing in and out from the lungs. I guess that's the one, I've never tried that again because what followed wasn't very nice, I can't even describe the overwhelming sensations, it was very painful and then it took me about an hour to get back to my body. So basically just a breathing technique? That's pretty cool I think. I see that as a very effective form of meditation. Whatever it takes to reach that meditative state of mind! My teacher talks about this... the Taoist monks used breathing techniques. I know Buddhist or some sects chant a mantra to replace all thoughts with just the Buddha's name. So I could see the breathing techniques to be similar. I actually know some material on this if your interested I'll find it. Sure man! I am interested to see. Thanks.

[LucidNightmares]

Are we able to medidate while listening to a meditative music, such as blisscode? Or is it better to do them silently without noise?