Know you're dreaming/don't know you're dreaming. Wrong dichotomy?

**Bobblehat** · 12-12-2014 05:43 PM

So, we have dreams that are non-lucid and we hope to become lucid in them. It's a mental act, yes? You don't realise you're dreaming but you hope to suddenly make the switch to realising you're dreaming. Could it be better if we used a different mindset - where the dichotomy is a visual one instead of a mental one? Here's what I mean:

You would make a rule to yourself that your lucid dreams would only happen under water. So, over time, you begin to associate being lucid with being under water. When you see water in a non-lucid dream, there is a greater chance of you "twigging" when you see the water. Another plus is that swimming under water has a built-in RC because in a lucid dream you can breathe under water. So also, in a way, your lucid dream becomes one long reality check. Over time this would be reinforced - the idea that expanse of water = "aha! Lucid dream"

Another possible positive is that water can exist to some degree in dreams. The mental act of realising you're dreaming is somewhat abrupt and happens in a split second.

**mimihigurashi** · 12-12-2014 08:14 PM

I don't really see how this is much different than dream signs. You would try to make being under water into a dream sign. Which would take a long time for your mind to start associating under water with dreaming/becoming lucid, additionally, as dream signs usually are, it would be unreliable, because how often do most people get to be underwater during a dream. Just my two cents.

p.s. it's not guaranteed to be able to breathe underwater. It's happened to me plenty of times to dream that I'm underwater and drowning, could not breathe at all.

**Bobblehat** · 12-12-2014 08:40 PM

Did you read the post properly?

**mimihigurashi** · 12-12-2014 09:33 PM

Pretty sure I did, though I'm extremely tired. Please do explain how it's different from dream signs.

**Bobblehat** · 12-12-2014 10:59 PM

Sorry mimi, I posted in haste a bit there because I didn't want to miss the start of the Incredible Hulk. Hope my post didn't come across as rude. Also, extremely tired. Anyway, the point I wanted to ma ke is, I've found if I go under water in a non-lucid I'll have trouble breathing (and usually wake up), but if I go under water during an LD breathing won't be an issue at all.

**FryingMan** · 12-12-2014 11:09 PM

It's possible, of course, to set up something like this, and we have several existence proofs that it can be done (e.g., Hukif's gravity ADA/RC), but to be effective it shouldn't IMO be something so specialized as being underwater, unless you dream of being underwater a lot already. It should be something always with you: your breathing, the feeling of gravity, your location in general, and so forth.

It also seems a bit like the incubation approach: establish frequent visualization of a particular scene/situation, recognizing it as a dream, and then incubate that situation by thinking about it all the time. I had some luck with that when I was dreaming a lot about my childhood home (almost every night), but I think you need to be pretty good already at incubation in order for that to work.