Astral wildlife questions

[Tasca]

So I've been reading about astral projection for a while now and have started doing the exercises (but I haven't had any yet) and I'm really interested in the entities. I know some people believe less or more about the plane than others so I want to here lots of answers. Also I have no idea what I'm expecting to see when I finally do achieve one, so some of these questions will probably be stupid. Here they are: Has anyone seen the same entity twice? Are some of the inhabitants believed to be creatures from another world that are astral projecting, and the dimension is sort of a hub? The entities that do live in the astral plane, do they need to eat? How common are entities? Have people documented the way some wildlife live? Like what they look like, what they do etc Are there any certain places in the world (or universe) that are more densely populated? If I get any more questions I'll say them. So thanks for reading this and possibly replying

[shadowofwind]

Has anyone seen the same entity twice? No, but I tend not to have redundant dream experiences. I'm sure its possible. Are some of the inhabitants believed to be creatures from another world that are astral projecting, and the dimension is sort of a hub? I don't think the sci-fi use of the word 'dimension' makes much sense if you think about it. A dimension is a spatial degree of freedom. Physically we move in three dimensions, while experiencing a mental representation of those in our mind. This mental representation of our surroundings isn't really a "place", and it can be moved out of correspondence with your physical surroundings. In a typical lucid dream, you project an almost wholly independent imaginative environment. In an 'astral projection' experience, you project a representation of your physical surroundings, but without incorporating current visual information about your physical surroundings. By visual information I mean what comes through your eyes. You could get information some other way though, through sound or extra-sensory means, and represent that to yourself visually. So I think the creatures are literally astral projecting, in a sense, but you're the one who's projecting them, when you dream. I think they have a physical basis outside this dream though, in this world, either externally or in our brains, or possibly in other worlds which we are in contact with in our minds. The entities that do live in the astral plane, do they need to eat? To the extent that they live in our imagination, they need our minds, subconsciously or consciously. Also, the 'food for thought' that you ingest through movies, video games, books, and other experience can make your mind more or less hospitable for them. So that amounts to a kind of eating. I don't know the extent to which they have an existence independent of us, or eat in other ways. How common are entities? As common as other animals I suppose, but I think this is a bit misleading, because the same entity can be reflected in slightly different ways through the minds of many people. How many are there then, one or many? Maybe counting makes more sense when applied to animals that have definite bodies. Have people documented the way some wildlife live? Like what they look like, what they do etc I think their nature is more personal and subjective than this might imply. Any such documentation would be to some extent 'made up' by the person doing it. I had a dream once where I was a minor entity. I could affect the physical world in small ways, but was not stronger than the mind of a person, and had to hide for safety. I was stronger than animals like small dogs however, which were qualitatively different from humans. How real this experience was I don't know. I've also dreamed of stronger entities, more like gods or personal ancestral spirits than animal spirits. These don't really have discrete individual identities as I experience them, they're more like branches on a big tree. Are there any certain places in the world (or universe) that are more densely populated? Inside neutron stars? I made that up, but I've wondered about it. If I get any more questions I'll say them. So thanks for reading this and possibly replying No problem. Its my second to last week at work, so I can't start new projects and have some time to burn.

[Tasca]

No, but I tend not to have redundant dream experiences. I'm sure its possible. I don't think the sci-fi use of the word 'dimension' makes much sense if you think about it. A dimension is a spatial degree of freedom. Physically we move in three dimensions, while experiencing a mental representation of those in our mind. This mental representation of our surroundings isn't really a "place", and it can be moved out of correspondence with your physical surroundings. In a typical lucid dream, you project an almost wholly independent imaginative environment. In an 'astral projection' experience, you project a representation of your physical surroundings, but without incorporating current visual information about your physical surroundings. By visual information I mean what comes through your eyes. You could get information some other way though, through sound or extra-sensory means, and represent that to yourself visually. So I think the creatures are literally astral projecting, in a sense, but you're the one who's projecting them, when you dream. I think they have a physical basis outside this dream though, in this world, either externally or in our brains, or possibly in other worlds which we are in contact with in our minds. To the extent that they live in our imagination, they need our minds, subconsciously or consciously. Also, the 'food for thought' that you ingest through movies, video games, books, and other experience can make your mind more or less hospitable for them. So that amounts to a kind of eating. I don't know the extent to which they have an existence independent of us, or eat in other ways. As common as other animals I suppose, but I think this is a bit misleading, because the same entity can be reflected in slightly different ways through the minds of many people. How many are there then, one or many? Maybe counting makes more sense when applied to animals that have definite bodies. I think their nature is more personal and subjective than this might imply. Any such documentation would be to some extent 'made up' by the person doing it. I had a dream once where I was a minor entity. I could affect the physical world in small ways, but was not stronger than the mind of a person, and had to hide for safety. I was stronger than animals like small dogs however, which were qualitatively different from humans. How real this experience was I don't know. I've also dreamed of stronger entities, more like gods or personal ancestral spirits than animal spirits. These don't really have discrete individual identities as I experience them, they're more like branches on a big tree. Inside neutron stars? I made that up, but I've wondered about it. No problem. Its my second to last week at work, so I can't start new projects and have some time to burn. Oh, so the most or all of the entities are thought forms? (Also thanks for answering all my questions)

[shadowofwind]

Oh, so the most or all of the entities are thought forms? (Also thanks for answering all my questions) I only speak from my own experience, since I know that what I read isn't trustworthy. There is a lot that I'm not aware of though, so I can't make generalizations like 'most' or 'all'. For what I'm aware of, I think the idea of a "thought form" doesn't do them justice, because of the relatively superficial nature of what we most commonly call thoughts. Some entities are quite a bit more powerful and intelligent than people, with strong identities, even if those identities are more fluid than ours are. They aren't subsidiary to human thought. Our identities change slowly over the span of our lives, but remain the same to a large extent because what we think of as 'oneself' is defined by a specific body with its memory. I don't think we're "tied" to those bodies, we're just not what we think of as "us" when away from those bodies. An entity on the other hand can evolve independent of any particular body, since it is in a lot of bodies at once. This is part of why I think astral projection makes no sense as a 'spiritual path' that leads to liberation from the physical body. The whole experience is defined in terms of one's tactile and visual mental model of one's body, and I doubt the astral body exists apart from that. Maybe the practice is a useful mental exercise anyway though, at least for a while, I don't know. I'm guessing no, but everyone has to take a slightly different way through life. There are a lot of people who disagree with me on this subject, just as there are a lot of people who disagree with me about drug experimentation, which I'm against. I'm inclined to think that a little bit of experimentation with astral projection isn't unhealthy though, even though I'm skeptical about what it accomplishes as a persistent practice.

[Mylynes]

I've personally had many encounters with entities I believed to be external and not merely DCs, though sometimes the line can be blurry because I had very limited experience with AP while awake so decided to move my practice to within my dreams. Often though I can sort of sense whether a being is something apart from myself, like another human, or something else. I believe that people can create external entities, breathe life into them, give them intelligence along with the ability to learn, and then set them free. Creating external entities is a fairly common practice in modern psionics, though usually people tend to place a kill-switch in the smarter ones in case things get out of hand. I hypothesize that people have been doing this both knowingly and unknowingly since ancient times. I have met beings which have claimed to be created by humans thousands of years ago. I also have this feeling that most if not all of the god's from old and even newer pantheons may be real (external beings and not merely DCs) as I have met some of them. Perhaps they were all created by shared human belief. In a way, reading up on mythology it seems a bit like they are the superheroes and supervillains of the past. For these reasons I think it is possible that even characters such as superman and Goku have taken on a life of their own since their initial creation. Also, as far as food goes, they usually do not require actual food unless they are specifically programmed to be that way or the laws of whatever place they reside in requires it. For example, I could create a being that will be destroyed by its kill-switch if it does not eat a turkey leg at least once per day. Sustenance is required, however there are many ways for entities to get the fuel or energy they need in order to continue to exist. Some simply take it from other beings, while some are independent and can create an infinite amount of energy from their own energy. While this may be impossible IRL, I personally have created devices through psionics which can produce an infinite amount of energy by taking a small amount of energy and cloning/amplifying it over and over (Which is usually how I power my own creations) for as long as needed. This is all based on my own experience, and I'm sure there is so much out there that there is no way to know anything close to everything about these creatures. Life is so diverse out there that it makes all life on earth look similar and dull by comparison. If you, or anyone, can imagine something, then you might also could make it real, on purpose or by accident. I also think that there is plenty of life or consciousness out there which is completely foreign and not the product or byproduct of human thought. Some worlds I have been to work by completely different sets of rules than our own tiny chunk of the omniverse. This would result in vastly different forms of life, or consciousness.

[gab]

I don't have any personal experience. First I have read an article (google "astral wildlife", then click on link to Rober Bruce's Astral Dynamics site). This kinda freaked me out a bit. It's talking about all kinds of entities we may encounter. Then, I have read either Buhlman or Monroe. They are describing their first OBEs/AP, and how they came to realize, that creatures they have encountered were mostly their own thoughtforms. This had certainly changed my perspective. Thank you all in this thread for your great info Good luck on your travels.

[shadowofwind]

I don't have any personal experience. First I have read an article (google "astral wildlife", then click on link to Rober Bruce's Astral Dynamics site). This kinda freaked me out a bit. It's talking about all kinds of entities we may encounter. I didn't follow the link, but I take a dim view of Castaneda for this reason, among other reasons. Then, I have read either Buhlman or Monroe. They are describing their first OBEs/AP, and how they came to realize, that creatures they have encountered were mostly their own thoughtforms. This had certainly changed my perspective. I agree, though I also think its not as simple as something being or not being one's own personal thoughtform. The entities I have experienced are more than my own thoughts. In fact, for the most part it seems I would not have experienced them at all were it not for the involvement of other people's thoughts, my own usually being insufficient by itself to create the experience. However, the way that I experience it has a lot to do with my own thoughts, so I have a lot of control also. These 'animals' don't have as objective an existence as waking life animals, apparently, what they are has a lot to do with what people think of them to be. And what they are has a lot to do with not only what we think, but what we are. But that doesn't mean they're pretend either, or merely parts of ourselves, because they often exhibit something like independent will and intelligence, and sometimes have clear objective effects in waking life. And they're greater than we are in some ways, I think that regarding them as a product of our own thoughts often amounts to a kind of human-centric bigotry. As well as being a result of fear I guess. Almost as a rule I don't have bad dreams, and I don't buy into all the ideas about astral fighting. But I do feel a bit scared of the power I perceive sometimes. And from a practical standpoint, psychic influences do have an effect on people's beliefs and appetites, with people often indulging behavior that is destructive in the long term, such as using strong narcotics. Its not something to be paranoid about, just another symptom of the fact that we're interconnected with each other and can actually touch each other. So I think some caution is justified in this regard, even though we don't have to worry about things like getting killed while astral projecting. In his book Thinking and Destiny, H.W. Percival, who was a Theosophist, treats gods as collective thoughts, and other thoughts as individual thoughts. He has people entertaining and modifying other people's thoughts, but these are still discrete, atomic thoughts. His perspective on this influenced my thinking a lot, and seems to agree with a lot of my observation and experience. But for me the gods as well as all the other thoughts don't seem to be separate individual forms or beings, they seem to me to be more like individual expressions of a larger fractal-like, god-like spirit. Also, it seems to me to be as true to say that those gods determine our thinking as it is to say that our thoughts create those gods. And I don't think this is merely because we have 'lost control' of our minds and are letting the cart push the horse. Our thinking seems to me to be part of the process, but not more important than other parts. Percival had a negative view on the pursuit of astral experience in general, because he thought that astral appearances tell a person almost nothing about the thoughts behind the forms. He thought that a person should disregard the astral stuff, and focus more directly on the 'conscious self'. This mirrors the attitude in many Vedic dogmas, where everything else besides the core question of identity is viewed as a distraction. For a while I bought into that perspective, but now I'm thinking that the astral stuff matters too, that a person has to put one foot in front of the other and deal with whatever their experience is. For a lot of us that means dealing with astral experiences, and as a practical matter I think that's what we would wind up doing anyway. Even those people who think that astral things are below them still deal with them, they just don't deal with them as well as they would if they had a more tolerant attitude. I agree though that the appearance of something in an astral projection or any other kind of lucid dream experience often doesn't show very truly what something is. And a person's feelings about the nature of an entity can be mislead also. As with people, we all have different blind spots. So we just have to think and feel about what we experience and make as much sense of it as we can.

[Psionik]

So I've been reading about astral projection for a while now and have started doing the exercises (but I haven't had any yet) and I'm really interested in the entities. I know some people believe less or more about the plane than others so I want to here lots of answers. Also I have no idea what I'm expecting to see when I finally do achieve one, so some of these questions will probably be stupid. Here they are: 1 Has anyone seen the same entity twice? 2 Are some of the inhabitants believed to be creatures from another world that are astral projecting, and the dimension is sort of a hub? 3 The entities that do live in the astral plane, do they need to eat? 4 How common are entities? 5 Have people documented the way some wildlife live? Like what they look like, what they do etc 6 Are there any certain places in the world (or universe) that are more densely populated? If I get any more questions I'll say them. So thanks for reading this and possibly replying It is possible to meet one entity more then one time? Maybe. I can only tell that I met some people more times, but my travels are quite barren of animal life(if I take thinking entities as animals then it is true too. I don't remember finding unthinking creature there for looong time). There are plants... Second question- it is possible. I think there are at least three parallel physical realities similar to our own(from my experience) But it seems like astral dimension has many levels, the tuning between them is something very hard for me. Third question- I don't think so. Fourth question- In my travels- either very uncommon or astral is so vast that I don't have chance to see entities often. Most populated place I found was deep hell. I met an horde of devils there... Fifth question- I don't know. Never felt need. Sixth question- I'm not sure there is most populated place. It could be that places I'm mainly going are simply much less populated.