Thread: Convince me?

Buy a book of OBE that shows you how to achieve them, and then try to do it yourself and from the results chose the interpretation you believe is best.

For instance "Journeys Out of the Body", by Robert Monroe.

This is probably a joke thread, this is Carousoul we are talking about. Besides, there is no way to convince you anyway. Everything related to this is backed up by science, even the things people cannot explain is backed up by "couincidence". You gotta wanna try to understand to be convinced, nobody can convince you but yourself.

But anyway.

http://www.horizonresearch.org/index.html
http://www.near-death.com/evidence.html
http://www.iands.org/
http://www.youtube.com/


Stay skeptical of god, that will be more harder to prove then the afterlife itself. OBE there are proven OBE's, as in explaining real things that cannot happen because they are not in the room. I don't mean couincidences, i mean like going on rooftops of rooftops you have never been to and getting it 100% right by description, or out of the room and downstairs or w/e and hear and get 100% accuracy of the conversation, family they visit only to find out when they wake up the family they just saw died like a uncle or something. Also around the world people visit when they are at the hospital and they get it 100% right. All this means is sometimes OBE's are real, not an afterlife.

Try some mescaline or DMT, and then see how skeptical you feel.

You already admit you are skeptical of these things, which means you hold a personal self bias towards these things "not" working,

Which means if you did follow instructions to try them out, you would not be putting a strong enough belief into them,

To truly be open to the miracles of life and the greater energies,

You need to truly open yourself to them,

You cant just follow instructions and expect them to happen...

Anyways, I pray that you will experience a great miracle in your life that will help change your concrete views of life

Namaste

Originally Posted by The Cusp

Try some mescaline or DMT, and then see how skeptical you feel.

The fact we create DMT for sleep is not exactly a logical approach.
Drugs are just that...drugs. As real as DMT is, it's not real what you see, you just trip out.

Originally Posted by The Cusp

Try some mescaline or DMT, and then see how skeptical you feel.

Perception altering drugs do just that; alter your perception; they don't show you anything new about the external world.

read Thomas Campbell's book my big TOE this is really the only way to go for every thing else needs skills that take about a year to master

I cannot convince you of anything 'paranormal', as I have had no such experiences myself, and as a human being am confessedly ignorant. However, two things perpetuate my constant awe and fascination for life: 1) The fact that this universe seems to exist to precariously, so delicately, that it is a wonder that it exists at all. (A commonly cited example is that the chances of our universe being formed in its present condition is about as likely as a truck being assembled in perfect working order by a hurricane in a junkjard), and 2) The fact that I have a difficult time seeing the dualistic idea of our 'science' being any less miraculous or divine as a god. Our world is so shockingly extensive in its scope that I find it irrelevant as to whether or not the Divine exists- or rather, I find the existence of the world of be divine in and of itself. We live in a world where lucid dreaming allows us to explore the deepest contours of our own mind, and where altered states of conciousness have inspired the human psyche for millennia. What more does one need?


Benjameno

Originally Posted by Carôusoul

Perception altering drugs do just that; alter your perception; they don't show you anything new about the external world.

Altered perception by definition shows you something new.

In 100 years we will all be laughing at what was said 100 years ago.

Originally Posted by The Cusp

Altered perception by definition shows you something new.

Still altered, still not real.

Originally Posted by LucidFlanders

Still altered, still not real.

That all depends on how you define "real". Are lucid dreams "real"? Lucid dreams are just altered states of mind, where instead of experiencing outwardly, you experience inwardly. Similarly, drugs alter your perceptions, and you experience things differently. It depends on how you look at it.

I agree with NewDreamer in that you are already biased so it's difficult to convince you, even if you experience it firsthand. Instead of dismissing everything "paranormal" as fanciful, actually think about it and think of the possibilities. That might be the best way to start.

Originally Posted by 13redfan

That all depends on how you define "real". Are lucid dreams "real"? Lucid dreams are just altered states of mind, where instead of experiencing outwardly, you experience inwardly. Similarly, drugs alter your perceptions, and you experience things differently. It depends on how you look at it.

Ah c'mon, stop discussing semantics. You know what he meant by "real".

Originally Posted by 13redfan

That all depends on how you define "real". Are lucid dreams "real"? Lucid dreams are just altered states of mind, where instead of experiencing outwardly, you experience inwardly. Similarly, drugs alter your perceptions, and you experience things differently. It depends on how you look at it.

When i'm dreaming i think it's real, then i wake up and know it was not real, and what i am seeing/feeling etc is real. Then guess what? it starts all over again...dreaming, to waking life as we call it. Only way to know dreaming is not real is lucid dreaming, but there is no way to know i'm dreaming in waking life so i just think "ok that's real i suppose". I guess we need a way to know waking life is not real, only to further confuse people and their "this is reality".

I agree with NewDreamer in that you are already biased so it's difficult to convince you, even if you experience it firsthand. Instead of dismissing everything "paranormal" as fanciful, actually think about it and think of the possibilities. That might be the best way to start.

Yes, nobody but himself can be convinced. BTW people call paranormal "mythical", not 'fancifull" around here. Just a FYI, from the LF, in the DWF.

dreams are real while they last...what more can be said about life??

carousoul..me trying to convince you of anything, is like you trying to convinceme there is no god
shit just happens sometimes for no reason
its lie lucid dreaming...i cant make myself have one they just do.......and i know some people can make then happen whenever but its just a metaphor

Science only believes what it can measure, replicate, and understand the physical mechanism of (if it cannot do all of these, it simply dismisses the data).

If we truly wish to follow science, then emotions do not exist because there is no way of physically measuring them (measuring something like seratonin levels in the brain does not do this as we cannot differentiate what it actually indicates - it's levels are influenced by various factors other than emotions). So according to science, love, hate, and jealousy do not exist. Science has it's limitations but somehow this fact seems to be going over the heads of some of the narrow-minded (but otherwise intelligent) scientists. It requires faith in it to believe it has all the answers just like it requires faith to be a truly devout Christian, Hindu, Muslim, Jew, etc.. Without realizing it, science becomes a religion for some.

lol space

There's no way to "measure" how much you love someone, but there is a way to measure and analyse what causes love and how it affects you. Science doesn't have all the answer, nobody says it does. But it may some day. Science doesn't require "measuring" (e.g. in political science, you cannot measure hwo influential a country is), but it requires valid laws that are able to predict the behaviour of a set of events - which psychology does.

I agree with science being a religion for some (actually in a non-literal way, science the definition of religion is much different), but just don't generalise it. Science can take the part of religion when it determines what an individual believes, but that is not what religion is all about - it involves dogma, a set of beliefs, and much more. Science is not one thing as a whole - it has many parts, some parts of it more accepted than others. When you say you believe science, you say you trust the scientifical method, nothing else - believing the scientific laws and theories is the result of it.

Check out the book "Memories, Dreams, Reflections" by Carl Jung. It is his autobiography, and I found it to be fascinating. He speaks of his many paranormal experiences throughout the book.

The truth is, science does not know if we have a a soul?
i say we do. whether we like it or not

Originally Posted by space-cadet

The truth is, science does not know if we have a a soul?
i say we do. whether we like it or not

Aren't you the one who bashed science???

Originally Posted by Carôusoul

play ouija

Don't bother.

i think i bashed science again. hey they can't begin to explain who i am or what am i doing here. they're still in the dark ages

Originally Posted by space-cadet

they can't begin to explain who i am or what am i doing here

I bet that not only could they explain who you are, but they could also prescribe you something to fix it, too.