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    Thread: Waking, Sleeping, dreaming, life, death, rebirth

    1. #51
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      Worked. I had to create an account to download it / read it.. but that only took like 5 seconds to create an account. Thanks!
      Yeah, no problem Motumz, that site is great. You can find plenty of books on lucid dreaming and just books in general. Briefly, it is the youtube of books. I think we should create a thread for the must read books list that we find on scribd.com, what do you think?

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      Quote Originally Posted by elucid View Post
      Yeah, no problem Motumz, that site is great. You can find plenty of books on lucid dreaming and just books in general. Briefly, it is the youtube of books. I think we should create a thread for the must read books list that we find on scribd.com, what do you think?
      Agreed. And it would also work great with sharing Trip Reports easily.
      Last edited by Motumz; 05-10-2010 at 04:32 PM.
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      Agreed. And it would also work great with sharing Trip Reports easily.
      Cool, didnt even know a trip report thread was out here.

      Anyway, to get back on topic of Bardo. I think that what makes the book so believable is that they describe death very similarly to the stages of sleep and dream. Scientifically, DMT or a DMT like substance gets released during sleep/dream and I heard that massive amount of DMT gets released the second someone dies, so it makes sense that death should resemble the stages of sleep.

      Also, I read in one of the earlier posts that there are people who have gone through the stages of death and by choice reincarnated in this realm to teach us. So I was wondering if anybody knows someone like that by name and if they have any information on their credibility?

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      The Dalai Lama, The Karmapas, Namkhai Norbu, to name a few off the top of my head. There are so many. I can post again with a huge list when I have more time.

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      Quote Originally Posted by elucid View Post
      Cool, didnt even know a trip report thread was out here.

      Anyway, to get back on topic of Bardo. I think that what makes the book so believable is that they describe death very similarly to the stages of sleep and dream. Scientifically, DMT or a DMT like substance gets released during sleep/dream and I heard that massive amount of DMT gets released the second someone dies, so it makes sense that death should resemble the stages of sleep.

      Also, I read in one of the earlier posts that there are people who have gone through the stages of death and by choice reincarnated in this realm to teach us. So I was wondering if anybody knows someone like that by name and if they have any information on their credibility?
      So you experience the DMT when you die, but what happens when your body is no longer function, at all?. Do you just leave your body and float around the universe? Or go into your own little dream world? How exactly do you choose to be reincarnated here / else where? Sorry for so many questions
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      Well, DMT is an interesting thing. Some people believe that it is the "Spirit" molecule. I think I may have posted about it in this thread already. But to summarize, the pineal gland and the brain with the receptors for DMT are the last to die in the human body, if I remember correctly. DMT also is released during ecstatic orgasms, during childbirth (for both mother and child), at the 49th day after conception in the fetus (or embryo, I am unclear on the difference) when the unborn child differentiates and becomes either male or female, and at death.

      According to Buddhist Tantra, this world already is your personal little dream world, in an ultimate reality sense. Any experience you have is going to be a part of your dream world, whether alive or dead. Pristine awareness is all that exists, all phenomena are dreams.
      So when you die your body leaves you and you have experiences depending on your karma (the law of cause and effect). Most beings are unaware of how they become reincarnated. It happens in unconsciousness, in a faint, or in a panic, or as a compulsion. This is the force of karma, which is the momentum of your unlucidness. Most beings are caught in an illusion that their experience is reality, not just a dream, so that either they think that the only safe thing to do is to hide in a womb, to find security in matter, or that they aren't aware of any alternative.
      Beings don't choose to be reincarnated, it is instinctual, it is automatic, it is evolution, it is nature. Only someone who is lucid of one's identity as universal pristine awareness can actually make a choice whether to be reincarnated or not. The only choice a normal being can have, at best, is to choose what to be reincarnated as. Or where to be reincarnated.
      You think that you are alive here on planet Earth as a human being. Did you have a choice? Was there anything you could have done to remain lucid of your true identity? Is there anything you can do NOW to remember your true identity?

      Buddhist Tantra has a very deep understanding of reincarnation. It is over most people's heads. In fact, they say that reincarnation is the wrong word. They say that YOU don't become reincarnated. It is quite paradoxical actually. On the one hand, you have been reincarnated trillions of times since the dawn of time, forever circling the wheel of life and death, evolving from a microbe to a complex multi-cellular organism with a highly developed brain. On the other hand, they say that this is an illusion, and that there is no continuity of consciousness or identity between lives. Your past life is not actually YOURS. It is the karma that becomes reincarnated, which is your unlucidness. Your very awareness that you have when it is empty of perceptions, objects, thoughts, is not incarnated. It is everywhere, not yours, not his, not hers, but a Universal consciousness that exists in every cubic inch of space. It is just that our brains reflect this consciousness that gives the illusion that it is in our brains and that it is individual. A thousand dewdrops all have a reflection of the rising sun in each one, but the sun really isn't in the dewdrop. The sunlight is everywhere. The dewdrop evaporates, the next morning another dewdrop forms with its own reflection of the sun. Is it the same dewdrop that has become reincarnated? No. It is the same sun though. But that sun is reflected in each dewdrop. No dewdrop is unique, and there is only one sun. But that new dewdrop can carry the leftover karma of the previous dewdrop and identify with it. For example: that dewdrop may appear on the same blade of grass as the previous dewdrop and therefore identify with it. Maybe that previous dewdrop left some unfinished business that the new dewdrop finishes. But the karma is not the self, the karma is the unlucidness that has to awaken. Once it awakens, it is liberated.

      So the incarnation of an enlightened being is quite a miracle. Because there is nothing that is being incarnated! When someone asked the Buddha if he was a god or a human he replied "I am just Universal Awarenesss..." This is what we all are, if only we would become lucid of that, and stop identifying with our dreams. That is the real mystery: how does an enlightened being become incarnated?

      In the ultimate reality, there is only pristine awareness. There is no real Universe, no real individuals, etc. There is just universal awareness that is the real "Our-self". But in the relative "reality" which we appear to live in there are obstacles to overcome.

      The way an enlightened being chooses to be reincarnated is beyond our conception. They say that he "emanates" either a "truth" body, an "illusion" body, or a "physical" body. Or many.

      I will clean up my house and make some dinner then I will come back and write about the three kinds of bodies in Buddhist Tantra!!!
      Last edited by Dannon Oneironaut; 05-12-2010 at 11:13 PM.

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      So how exactly do I get to the point where my consciousness is lucid enough, to when I die I'll know I'm dead? Just keep trying to expand my mind or? I know personally that I can do so, because about a year ago I swear my consciousness was about the same as a robot. Basically not very lucid. As of now I feel I am 1000% more lucid. But how exactly would I know I'm conscience enough? Will I have a personal breakthrough, or an epiphany of some sort? Sorry if this is a little jumbled, I'm having a hard time putting my thoughts in words.

      But also, is everything around me real? Or is it just a make up of what my spiritual being wants to see? (again, sorry if this doesn't make sense. I'm pretty new to all this) And am I really my own soul... Or am I just basically borrowed property, and "I" have been living different lives for as long as the cosmos? That also brings me to another question. Was consciousness born when the cosmos was born?

      So many questions..
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      Quote Originally Posted by Motumz View Post
      Sorry if this is....
      Quit apologizing!

      You will know when you are lucid. Yes, you'll have an "epiphany." You will laugh a real uproarious laughter.

      That is a good insight that you felt like a robot, because that is basically what we are: very sophisticated organic robots. Everything around you is as real as you. They are all shapes, colors, sounds, etc. They are manifestations of your mind. Other people's minds are manifestations of your mind. All minds are manifestations of the Universal Pristine Awareness that existed before the Big Bang. The Big Bang is the beginning of one dream. You are the Big Bang, the dream ends when you become lucid of what you really are and wake up. The Buddha means "the Awakened One" or "The Awakened Mind."

      The soul (an individual eternal self that exists independently of everything else) is an illusion. You are awareness, consciousness. Yes, it is borrowed property. There is no real estate of consciousness. A wave is part of the ocean. If you put a table tennis ball in the ocean you will see that the water only moves up and down while the wave flows by. It is not the water that flows by. You can say that your identification with a separate self creates a wave that flows through the consciousness that is everywhere. You are all lives that ever was and ever will be. You are life and consciousness.

      IT does no good for me to tell you this, I may be full of shit. I may be deceiving you, either knowingly or unknowingly. I myself may be deceived. You need to find out for yourself. How?
      Buddhist Tantra has many good methods. There are also many good methods outside of that tradition also, but that tradition is pretty all-inclusive with all the proper safeguards. The eightfold path in Buddhism is the basic way to become lucid, but it will take many lives and all of your devotion. You can add methods from Buddhist Mahayana and it can happen this life. You can practice methods of Tantra and it can happen instantaneously like a lightning bolt. You can practice the Dzogchen "Great Perfection" and realize that it is already the case. There are many many scriptures, scrolls, and books on this so what little I say in a post will be insufficient and confusing, but hopefully will arouse some curiosity.

      It all boils down to mindfullness. Cultivate mindfullness. Check out Juroara's "Let's Practice Lucid Waking" thread and someone else's "Stretch Your Thingy" thread if you haven't already. Practice meditation. Practice concentration, maybe on a candle flame. Notice when you lose mindfulness and gently bring yourself back. Be mindful of your breathing, every breath. That is how the Buddha became enlightened. Such a small thing, being mindful of the breath, between me and a Buddha? Yes, the Buddha was an ordinary guy like us. The good thing about using your breath as an object of mindfulness is that if you are alive, you are breathing. If you are awake, sleeping, angry, sad, happy, jealous, etc. you are breathing.

      The more mindful you are you will find that you may have to make adjustments to your lifestyle in order to become more mindful. You may find that it is not very mindful to have other animals die just because you like the taste of meat. You may find that you are not very mindful of your body, so you take up yoga in order to become more mindful of your body, etc... You may find that desires distract you from your mindfulness, and really what desire can satisfy you if you aren't lucid? And what can you beg, borrow, buy, or steal that you don't already have within you? You may find that if you smoke cigarettes, that is holding you back. Or if you smoke pot habitually.

      Habits are unmindful. Habits are unlucid. Habits take no awareness to operate. They are very efficient. But at a price. The price of your consciousness.

      I will be back soon to discuss the three bodies.
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      We are multidimensional creatures. We have awareness, we have intellects, and we have physical bodies. These are like the three bodies, but not enlightened, not lucid. The three bodies are lucid. They are:
      1: Dharmakaya (Truth body)
      2: Sambhogakaya (enjoyment body or illusion body)
      3. Nirmanakaya (Emanation body)

      It is interesting to note that the word "kaya" means both "body" and "universe" and in fact the Dharmakaya is both. The Dharmakaya is expressed metaphorically as space. Or as a naked dark blue buddha in meditation. Naked, because there are no properties you can say about it, it is naked truth. Dharma means truth, or the way. If you remain lucidly aware in deep sleep you will be and be in the Dharmakaya. Your Dharma body is the same thing as the whole Universe enlightened. But we don't have Dharma bodies until we realize that we do. The Dharmakaya is called the enlightened mind of the Buddha.

      The Sambhogakaya is the enjoyment body or the illusory body. This is the enlightened speech of the Buddha. It is the lucid dream body. This is the bliss body. This is the body that is capable of manifesting whatsoever it desires as an expression of abundant playfulness. It is also the whole universal lucid dream. It is expressed symbolically as any of the Buddhas that have lots of jewelry and robes etc. That is because it is rich. It manifests shapes and colors. Dream yoga is the way to manifest a illusion body.

      The Nirmanakaya is the emanation body. This is the enlightened physical body of the Buddha, or the whole Physical Universe that we know of. The historical Buddha is an example of a Nirmanakaya. The qualities of an enlightened physical body is that it is soft and flexible like a babies, with no tension, no tense jaws, no tense backs or shoulders, etc. There are other marks of a Buddha also but I don't remember what they are.

      YOu can become lucid in any of these "kayas" or realize any of these "kayas". You can become lucid in waking life (Nirmanakaya), you can become lucid in deep sleep or death (Dharmakaya), or you can become enlightened in dreams or in the bardo of becoming incarnated (Sambhogakaya).

      To use dream yoga to become enlightened into the sambhogakaya and rise up in an illusory body there are many things you can do. It all boils down to replacing your normal mental image of yourself as a separate normal "impure" body with the "pure" enlightened qualities of a Divine Lucid being, like a Buddha. The way to do this is to pick a Deity that you like that embodies the pure qualities that you have in an impure way. Since in Buddhism there are no such things as creator Gods, all Gods or Deities are actually psychological archetypes of the mind. It is very similar to Jungian psychology in this way. Since so many people preoccupied with lust in an unlucid or unmindful way, there are many Tantra deities that embody the "pure" enlightened qualities of sexuality. In this way you can use the power of this deity to become mindful of your lust and use your sexuality to become more lucid. Of you are an angry person and have a short temper and lose your lucidity that way, there are many deities who appear wrathful in a pure way that are mindful of their anger and use it compassionately to help others become enlightened. There are also many very blissful deities. You can use Jesus as a deity, Lucifer as a deity, Horus, Isis, Mother Mary, etc... Or a formless energy as a deity if you prefer the formless as opposed to an anthropomorphic energy. In Hindu tantra they worship Shiva's Lingham (penis) as a formless divine. It doesn't look like a penis really, it looks like an ovate orb, like an egg, but made of energy.
      But since you see yourself as a person it is easiest to visualize and identify yourself as a humanoid deity and your surroundings as the divine paradise of the Buddhas. This is the Mandala that surrounds pictures of the Buddha in Tibetan iconography. So your little world that you are dreaming up, complete with all its drama, desire, all your actions and relationships with others, is replaced with a divine mandala. Other people in your life (Dream Characters) are seen as enlightened expressions of your mind, or Buddhas of emptiness.
      So you visualise the Deity and its Mandala, then you merge with the deity and your world becomes the mandala, Then...
      this is an advanced practice... you visualize with all the detail the deity and the whole mandala in a small drop of solid nectar about the size of match head at your third eye. You awaken the fire in the abdomen (kundalini, tummo) and bring it into the central channel, where with practice you bring the flames up your spine until they melt the drop and it drips down and coats all of your merideans bringing bliss and you rise up in an illusory body in the form of the enlightened deity.
      Or.... you can do this in a dream. Much easier.

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      I'd like to add that there are two stages to all of these practices:
      1. Where you imagine that you are doing all this, called the "Generation" of the deity. And
      2. Where you actually do it, called the "Completion" of the deity.

      Some schools separate these two stages and other schools do generation and completion practices simultaneously.

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      Very interesting.. thanks for posting.

      I recently ordered the Tibetan Book of the Dead. I'm excited to read it even more so now. I wasn't aware it mentioned such things.
      In very many cases, the visionary quality, the quality of the vision so to say, spills over, into the external world, so that the experiencer, when he opens his eyes, sees the outer world transfigured...

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      Very interesting, I guess it's time to work on my lucid dreaming skills again. But I have a question, what exactly does it feel like to be completely lucid? What do memories feel like? Just wondering because when I noticed I was substantially more lucid, my memories felt like past-lives. They were very vivid and all, they just felt foreign yet so close? Ugh, another thing I can't comprehend in the English vocabulary.. Or my vocabulary at least haha.
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      Become completely lucid and see for yourself, I cannot tell you how it feels.

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      Cloud wrote an excellent post about lucidity which fits this topic imho. http://www.dreamviews.com/f12/so-you...cant-ld-83975/

      Complete lucidity is experiencing the formless.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Dannon Oneironaut View Post
      ... in the bardo experience you feel things like pressure, like too much energy being squeezed out of a toothpaste tube. Everything around you will be buzzing, and jackhammering. YOU will be buzzing and jackhammering! You can't find any peace or any ground to collect your thoughts to face the onslaught. It overtakes you like a wave crashing on you. It crushes your skull, breaks your back and smears your guts and licks it up. In the Bardo Thodol they say that the wrathful dieties will be crushing your bones, eating your brains and drinking your blood. There is a paradox here, because you have no body anymore, but you have a sense of "I" to defend, to protect. The wrathful dieties fill all space in all directions so there is no space for you to be unless they eat you.
      Another difference between dreams and the bardo experience is that you are not asleep. You are wide awake and trying to process and deal with your experience every moment. You can't wake up and have it just be a bad dream. You are fighting for your soul. And this is just the illusion here. The reason why it is so scary, the reason why it is so relentlous is because you are fighting for your soul. And they aren't going to give up unless they devour your soul or you find a womb to be reborn into...
      At Dannon Oneironaut:
      Hi i was reading that and the only thing coming to my mind was an experience of mine which i described here http://www.dreamviews.com/f19/deadly...-places-38794/. I think that was the most dangerous and scary and deadly place i have ever been in my life. But never managed to understand what it might have been. But in my case i did not have feeling about my body. It was just Me there and i was literally being squeezed out of my life force. After that i never had a similar experience. But compared to that place all other 'bad' dreams were nothing. Btw do you have any idea where i might have been in my dream?

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      You were in a bardo experience (which you are always in). If you had let yourself die you may have realized your Buddha nature. Like Lao Tzu says in the Tao Te Ching: "Cling to death with all your heart and live forever." You see how fear and desire made you "wake up" into waking life? This is reincarnation. Now, you have a preview of what waits for you in the near future. With Dream Yoga you can realize that your experience is just a dream and you can dissolve the dream back into the clear light of sleep, and at death into the clear light of death.

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      Hi, thanx for the info. Unfortunately when it happened i was only around 18y old. Young and stupid boy Didnt know a lot of thing i know now so i couldnt let go and continue the dream til death. I felt then i will die not only in my dream but and in 'real' life.
      Only one question. What do you mean by 'Now, you have a preview of what waits for you in the near future'?
      I had 3 dreams in my life which left big mark on my life:
      1.The bardo experience.
      2.A dream in which i was killed by a daemon and then i flew and met god(life) and death right on the same place.they are not easy to describe.only feelings and knowing what they are.they were forces too enormous to grasp visually even from very long distance.
      3.http://www.dreamviews.com/f19/being-...ight=made+fire
      After these 3 i was not the same person anymore.

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      Great thread. I felt i need to post something here.

      What do You think about lucidity and alcohol (or drugs)?
      Is it something that slows us in spiritual growth?
      Why do people do that then?

      Also, many people are bonded to someone in this world. I am in love. I have always wanted to make the relationship full of awareness, honesty, meditation etc. And we're doing that.
      But how to 'agree' love to someone with reincarnation and spiritual growth. I'll try hard to explain what's on my mind.

      You say there's one Universal Consciousness. Though people do bad things to others, what does that mean then?
      Lovers want to have themselves only to themselves, want to live together, die together, but the thought in next or previous lives while being humans we were not/will not be together is just sad.
      We promise each other 'love forever' but can we really do that? Can all the lovers be together forever? Or is it an illusion? Could You help me understand that?

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      Hi smily face! I'm not Dannon, but I wanted to offer my thoughts.

      What do You think about lucidity and alcohol (or drugs)?
      Is it something that slows us in spiritual growth?
      Why do people do that then?
      Every experience can enhance spiritual growth. Or, every experience can hinder it. There's an easy way of learning, there's a hard way of learning, but either way you learn and grow.

      Also, many people are bonded to someone in this world. I am in love. I have always wanted to make the relationship full of awareness, honesty, meditation etc. And we're doing that.
      But how to 'agree' love to someone with reincarnation and spiritual growth. I'll try hard to explain what's on my mind.

      You say there's one Universal Consciousness. Though people do bad things to others, what does that mean then?
      This is a long story! The short answer is we aren't aware. We aren't lucid. Dreams are great teachers. Most of us have fought in our dreams.

      Yet at the same time those dream characters that we fought and killed, were none other, then ourselves, or reflections of ourselves. Despite all the drama or fist-flying-action, there is only one mind. Yours.

      Lovers want to have themselves only to themselves, want to live together, die together, but the thought in next or previous lives while being humans we were not/will not be together is just sad.
      We promise each other 'love forever' but can we really do that? Can all the lovers be together forever? Or is it an illusion? Could You help me understand that?
      First I need to explain something to answer your question, because it's a really complicated question.

      I want to say that I completely disagree with the ancient teaching that we don't have an individuality that carries on after death. Modern day near death experiences, while they correlate with the Tibetan Book of the Dead in many aspects, offer a different insight.

      Through the experiences of people living today, it is believed that we have what's called an I AM presence. This I AM presence is a divine individuality. It's beyond duality, it's beyond ego. Yes, technically an indivudality is a creation of Mind, and does not have permanent existence. But in this case, the divine individualities will exist as long as the Universe does. Which is also a creation of Mind.

      First, the Universal Consciousness expresses itself as these many I AM presences/divine individualities (Love, Truth, Creator, etc). Then these divine individualities, who know they are the Universal Consciousness, express themselves as life forms. Eventually, expressing itself as a human being. Each expression is given another individuality/body. Adding another illusionary layer on top of an already illusionary layer.

      All for the purpose of self-expression of the Universal Consciousness.

      Our HUMAN individualities are like "bodies" that we put on and take off. And underneath that body is pure awareness. But nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING we do on Earth could ever damage our true I AM presence.

      Your I AM presence CHOSE to express itself as a human (illusionary ego). The goal of spirituality is not to destroy the ego - the illusion - but to evolve it to the point where the ego transforms into a NEW divine individuality that can purely allow the Universal Consciousness to flow through, while expressing it's individuality. (Jesus becoming the Christ Consciousness is an example)

      So that: one I AM presence may potentially create ten thousand more I AM presences!

      In other words, individuality and Universal Consciousness ARE NOT at odds with each other. This is a lie of the dualistic ego that they are. Individuality is a tool, a vessel, and instrument for Universal Consciousness to flow into, express from and experience from.

      So. . . . that's how I view YOU. Now what does all of this have to do with your question?

      Universal and Unconditional Love is a divine individuality, that as human beings, we are all an expression of. By walking the spiritual path you recognize this part of your divine individuality. But understand that this is not "human love".

      Attachments are the result of the ego. Through attachments we try to hold onto something for fear that we will lose it. Were so afraid of losing someone, we even want to keep them for ourselves, and only ourselves. We're not going to lose anyone. We are everyone. And our desire to get close to someone, is a desire to know our true self.

      While attachment is the result of the fear of losing something, relationships are not! Relationships, such as marriage or friendships, are divine. We as human beings are designed to awaken to our true divinity THROUGH our relationships. Because what are relationships in this divine dream of illusions? But mirrors?

      Every relationship is like a dream character, a reflection of yourself. Every friend, every lover, every family member, all an expression of you. And through relationships we can see in each other our egos, and our divinities.

      Does this mean that the two of you will always love each other, even after death, and through life times? Yes. But the goal is to recognize that the two of you are one and the same!

      Now in the Aquarian age, we have a greater desire to find our Twin Flame. And to experience an intimate relationship that will last indefinitely!

      When your I AM presence created your individuality - two were created. Masculine and Feminine. Because all creation is created in duality. Now your I AM presence could have created 10,000 male expressions, or 10,000 female expressions. Meaning you have 10,000 Twin Flames. A twin flame is simply someone who will literally bring you closer to your I AM presence, the divine individuality that you are.

      You may have a desire to be with this person forever. But that desire is less about this "individuality" that you're in love with, and more about reuniting with your I AM presence.

      This is where tantra comes in, the belief that the union of a man and women is divine and can give both an experience of their divinity.



      *********************

      Why does all of this divine individuality sound so different from eastern religions that teach to let go of the ego? Because it's western.

      There is a yin-yang to everything!

      In the east they were focused on SPACE! The infinite all encompassing space of consciousness. Buddha upholds the space with consciousness.

      In the west, the divine individuality that was so focused on was Creator. To consciously create in the space of consciousness.


      ***************

      anyways, who knows!

    20. #70
      Member ChaybaChayba's Avatar
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      Jurorar have you ever tried tantra? Believe it or not, but I reached a kind of enlightment through "wanking".. I can generate so much energy, that the world around me turns completely yellow, I start to see energy, and my body starts to heal and glow. I'm pretty convinced, when I get a girlfriend, something really really cool is going to happen. I can pretty much go on forever. Who knows, maybe you can really reach immortality through tantra?

      You can redirect the energy of orgasming to the third eye or other centers of the body. Instead of cumming, you energize and harmonize the centers. I don't know how this would work for women tho? How do women cum anyway? Don't they use their entire bodies? Maybe the girl would have to do nothing at all and would just receive? If any girl on here has experience with tantra, let me hear how you practise it?
      "Reject common sense to make the impossible possible." -Kamina

    21. #71
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      a great and very honest post chayba cheers. how do you go about directing the energy? ive definately got alot more sexual energy than before. its like full body orgasms rather than simply ejacs

    22. #72
      Member ChaybaChayba's Avatar
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      Its all about how you think about sex. If you think about a girls ass.. you direct your energy to the lower part. If you think about her eyes, you direct the energy to your third eye while having sex. So if you keep looking a girl in the eye, or if you keep kissing, then the energy should automatically be redirected to the upper centers. At first for me it was all about practise practise practise, but then I discovered, if you do it with the right intent, the right emotion, it all goes automatically.
      juroara likes this.
      "Reject common sense to make the impossible possible." -Kamina

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      With Tantra sex your consciousness mimics the same process that happens at death of the yogi. If, during sex you focus on your mind and your consciousness instead of the desire you feel, you will feel the sensations of Earth melting into water into fire into air into the quantum field and eventually the clear light. You will feel the energy of your body enter your central channel. This is when you can melt the drop at your third eye and feel it melt down the inside of your body enlightening each nerve to glow with fiery force. Then you will leave behind the conceptual mind and be free to meditate.

      Great thread. I felt i need to post something here.

      What do You think about lucidity and alcohol (or drugs)?
      Is it something that slows us in spiritual growth?
      Why do people do that then?

      Also, many people are bonded to someone in this world. I am in love. I have always wanted to make the relationship full of awareness, honesty, meditation etc. And we're doing that.
      But how to 'agree' love to someone with reincarnation and spiritual growth. I'll try hard to explain what's on my mind.

      You say there's one Universal Consciousness. Though people do bad things to others, what does that mean then?
      Lovers want to have themselves only to themselves, want to live together, die together, but the thought in next or previous lives while being humans we were not/will not be together is just sad.
      We promise each other 'love forever' but can we really do that? Can all the lovers be together forever? Or is it an illusion? Could You help me understand that?
      Whatever hinders your lucidity hinders your spiritual growth.
      I don't know if lovers can be together forever or not. I don't think so. We are alone and always will be. At the same time though we are all one and therefore connected to everyone who is also us, so therefore we are alone again. We need to learn to love everyone as ourselves. Then we will all be together.

      Whatever the Ultimate reality is; whether we are immortal individuals or whether we have no permanent individual beings; it is not helpful to our spiritual growth to believe that we are permanent individual souls. Because we need to be willing to be annihilated. We need to embrace nothingness. We cannot hold onto any part that we identify with. If we do have an eternal individual I-Amness, then it is so alien to us that we won't reconize it until we first die completely to who we think we are. Until then, it will appear as "other". We will call it "God" or something, but it is the real I-Amness that Juroara pointed out.
      ^_^ likes this.

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      The problem I have is that the more I meditate the less I remember my dreams. However, if I get caught up in samsara and forget to meditate for a day that night my dreams will be very vivid. Do you have any information on the actual techniques employed?

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      Hungry Dannon Oneironaut's Avatar
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      That is interesting. I never heard of that before. Maybe you should try a meditation that uses a lot of visualization. Try visualizing yourself in a Divine form and your surroundings being a mandala. Do you have lucid dreams? IF so, either meditate trying to cultivate the feeling and awareness of lucidity in your waking life, and/or meditate while you are dreaming.

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