Thread: BB316's workbook

You may know more than I on LD theory since you have been here a while. Perhaps we can learn from each other. I will take a stab at trying to help with your goal though. Two strong methods that don't require WBTB are MILD and DEILD but I'm sure that's not news to you. For the former, besides what you do already, you can try focusing on the back of your eyelids until it becomes just virtually viewing them while repeating a mantra when you go to bed. If you have trouble going to sleep, get up to "reset your sleepy/ready for bed mindset" and go to bed normally...change it up the next night.

I would definitely make the awareness work a daily thing and recommend finding a way to look at yourself in different situations. One great way I've heard it described is kind of looking over your own shoulder from above and pondering what you're doing in that moment, what you're thinking visualize yourself in your present position and state. Let me know if that sounds like something for you and if you want a link to thread about that. For awareness, I like Sageous' self-awareness work & RRC...there's a short explanation here:
http://www.dreamviews.com/wild/13181...prep-part.html

Thanks Fogelbise! I have been here a while, but have been inactive for about two years. I have just got back. Like I said, my LDs depend on a WBTB that lasts almost a full sleep cycle. You definitely have me beat on LDs, so you have some key to consistency that I do not. But if I can help you with anything that would be great.
I wrote out my own method for LDing: http://www.dreamviews.com/attaining-...technique.html
I am definitely going to be more dedicated to awareness.
Also think I'm going to quit the melatonin. It makes me way too sleepy.
In one of my dreams last night I did an RC that failed. My RC is always the nose-plug. So that's frustrating. But I had two very vivid dreams and actually wrote them down.
I think that when I actually do SAT(http://www.dreamviews.com/wiki/Puffins-DILD-Guide), I am going to not finish with an RC. This gets me into the pattern of believing/expecting RCs to fail, which is what happened last night.
My new SAT technique will include me starting with my mantra, "I notice details and become lucid(aware)" and then inspecting the world around me and seeing how I fit in. I will also use some of the stuff you suggested (thanks!) while repeating my mantra.

Last night I tried DILD again. Yesterday I was pretty good about being aware and using my mantra. I felt very confident I would LD. I set my phone to go off every 90 minutes adjusted to my sleep schedule. I meant for it to wake me up before my REM, but it woke me up just after -_-.
So I timed my WBTB completely wrong and only remembered 1 dream with some other fragments.

Thank you for the link on your combined techniques...you definitely covered so many keys to LDing in an easy to read, concise post! I also had an RC fail and made an adjustment to my WL RC's which you might also think about...let me know if you are interested. The fact that you RC'ed during your dream is a good sign if you look at the positive side of it. 2 or 3 different RC's might also help. I have no experience with taking melatonin, so I can't speak on that.

On last night's alarm WBTB, at least you figured out what time doesn't work, now you can adjust it if you like to use an alarm versus your previous water method which is what I prefer.

My mantra the last 2 nights has been "The next time is see, I am dreaming!" while looking at the back of my closed eyes (while knowing that I don't mean seeing HH visuals flashing by, but actually seeing). It seems great for WILDs and I am sure it can work for DILDs as well. I have had 2 of my best nights with the 1st night being the best so far I feel. I think it was partly due to the mantra which puts me in a relaxed, patient mindset but also my re-focus on daily awareness and Sageous' recent post about patience and enjoying the quiet time while waiting. Gab's reminder that sometimes rolling over to go to sleep is when it finally hits was also a key. I have my best success with WBTB like you and the weekend is my sweet spot for that...so that helped as well...but! I noticed I was not as tired for some reason as I had been after some WBTBs in the past...I think the patient/quiet attitude is the biggest factor there. Not trying too hard also seemed to be a key for me. Of course, everyone is different but you have proven that you can find that path and that means that you can make it regular. The experience of more LDs should provide more opportunities to DILD! Good luck!!

Yeah, I think it was daylight savings that messed up my alarms.

No dream recall last night. Had alarms set to wake me up 15 min before REM cycles. I didn't fall asleep right. I think I'm just off due to not taking the melatonin. That stuff sucks.

This can be a good place to track what is working and what is not...I will leave you to it since you seem well versed on the fundamentals and don't seem to have any questions at this point. I will continue to check the thread to see if you do post questions in the future though.

I experimented last night with how much water to drink. 20 oz woke me up after 6 hours which is when I normally wake up. So no WBTB last night I took a quick nap 2 hours after waking. It lasted only about 20 minutes. I tried SSILD as I fell asleep. I did not get lucid. I woke up but did not move. I was playing xbox in my dream and when I turned off the xbox, my dream ended. I woke up and tried DEILD. I began to think about my previous dream and a rush came over me. It was very peculiar. It is difficult to explain, but it felt like I could have been transitioning. I then was woken up by my roomate coming in the room.
Tonight I'll drink closer to 25 oz., see if that gets me the right time for my WBTB.

Had a WILD, but I'm not really sure. I knew I was dreaming, but didn't try to change anything nor did I do any RC's. The only reason I'm sure I was lucid is because I yelled at some dream characters that they were dreaming, as if it were a shared dream. Check my DJ for more info.

Congrats on your WILD!

Originally Posted by bb316

I tried SSILD as I fell asleep. I did not get lucid. I woke up but did not move. I was playing xbox in my dream and when I turned off the xbox, my dream ended. I woke up and tried DEILD. I began to think about my previous dream and a rush came over me. It was very peculiar. It is difficult to explain, but it felt like I could have been transitioning. I then was woken up by my roomate coming in the room.

SSILD can create a lot of false awakenings. You may have already been in the dream in the example above. Ask your roommate if they definitely came in the room around such and such time if you can't be sure. For example, if you did not immediately get up and go through your full day from the point that you remember the roommate coming in. I have had quite a few where I was sure my wife was moving around waking me up and found out that I was already dreaming!

I woke up today around 7:45 am, and got up and went to a meeting I had until 10:00. I went to sleep for a quick nap around 10:25. I heard some type of bell or alarm that got my attention as I was falling asleep. I quickly realized it was HH. I tried to remain focused, worried I might move or wake up too much. I then thought someone bumped my leg, so I had moved and was too awake. I then fell asleep.

Originally Posted by bb316

I woke up today around 7:45 am, and got up and went to a meeting I had until 10:00. I went to sleep for a quick nap around 10:25. I heard some type of bell or alarm that got my attention as I was falling asleep. I quickly realized it was HH. I tried to remain focused, worried I might move or wake up too much. I then thought someone bumped my leg, so I had moved and was too awake. I then fell asleep.

I know it's not easy to not worry, or to get excited, but best is really to be whatever happens just passively. As if you were watching a movie.

And the "bump" you felt, could have been tactile HH. Just let it be, don't expect anyting, will your mind with happy thoughts.

By the time you have HH, you are either very close to a LD, or you may be already in it. You may try some motionless RC. Like try to look at your hands. But don't move your muscles, just direct them to lift up with your thoughts. If you awake, they will not move. But if you asleep, your dream arms will move and you will recognize it. Then you just get up from your bed, or roll out and you are in a LD. But this, of course, goes for WILDs, as in DILDs, you don't experience any of this. Happy dreams

Thanks for replying.
I have been really discouraged lately. It seems LDing is taking much more energy and focus than I want to assign to it. Like the late college and lucid dreaming post, I'm pretty busy. I want to learn to LD w/o WBTB or any time consuming method, which may sound like a fairytale. I leave for a two-year mission for my church in five weeks and will not be able to actively practice LDing.

DILD does not require WBTB. If you happen to wake up at night for a trip to the restroom, you can say a few mantras and RC on your way, then repeat mantras as you falling asleep. But if not, then that's not a problem at all. That's why you do your daytime practice. As long as you practice and set your intent, you are all set.

I had all my DILDs without WBTB, and that's how it is meant to be practiced. Good luck.

I have practiced DILD extensively, but it only works when I WBTB

I am sorry to hear that you have been discouraged. May I ask why you feel that you will not be able to practice LDing to some degree while you are on the mission? Perhaps Gab, yourself & I can figure something out if you want to. Although most of my DILDs seem to have come from WBTB with SSILD, I definitely believe that you can do it without WBTB (and have) like Gab says and does. I hope you didn't think I was ignoring your posts. Since I wasn't getting the back and forth Q&A after the initial exchange I was thinking that you wanted your own space here to log your trials and I took a step back but kept checking the thread for any questions as I mentioned in post #8.

I took about a week off from my lucid training, I feel more determined and willing to make an effort.
Last night I tried something new - I set alarms on my phone (vibrate) to go off every 30-45 minutes.
I woke up remembering many dreams and fragments. When I went back for a 20 minute nap after having been up for 2 hours, I almost got lucid.
I 'woke up' from an FA and did an RC, it worked and I realized I was dreaming, but I let myself believe that I was slipping and lost my awareness.

Sorry bb316, I am still not sure if you want me to interact with you in your workbook. I had a question for you right above your last post and you definitely don't have to answer the question but I thought you would respond to it in some way. I am just trying to determine if you are looking for help in this workbook or if you just want to use it to self-track your results (the only "?" symbols found in the entire thread are in 2 posts by me, so I was thinking that you were just self tracking until I saw the "thank for replying" to Gab...which made me think that you are indeed looking for feedback. Anyway...either way works for me, just let me know please...? Edit: the other reason I am confused is that after our initial exchange in the first 4 posts(your posts #3 and 4 were just a few minutes apart) my next 4 posts (which I took a decent amount of time to attempt to customize to your goals) didn't seem to get any kind of response from you that was tied into my responses...you simply posted what you had done or were thinking that previous night...which again is fine...just looking for clarification if I should check in here or not. You may also wonder why I am even posting in here and may not have seen this: http://www.dreamviews.com/dild/14738...o-teacher.html

Hey Fogelbise, I understand that must be frustrating. Sorry about that. I would love your feedback. I am primarily using this for my own records, but any ideas you would contribute would be very appreciated. I also have just had no questions thus far. I understand your role as a teacher and I appreciate your ideas and input.

No worries...I appreciate the clarification.

Last night I tried my interspersed alarms again. I did it early in my sleep and my dream recall was great. I did not continue the alarms into my 6-7th hours of sleep and lost my focus and awareness. Going to try to space out my alarms in my latest hours of sleep.

bb316, thanks for clarifying : D

If you have a question, just ask. Happy dreams