Thread: Dream Control Mastery Tutorial

Originally Posted by Electrode

What techniques?

The ones.

These aren't techniques its just pointless rambling that has nothing to do with lucid dreaming. I looked into his posts/threads a bit more and its all utter nonsense.

yes

Lemme just show you some things which are plain lies/made up :

ok

1)


Like what is this?
stuff

Is this supposed to be serious because judging from this guys posts and threads it looks very much so.

Is this a question?

He created 100s of persistant worlds and can inhibit the insides of any beast he wants.
This is plain impossible.

Oh.

Dreams are a reflection of ourselves and are governed by our subconcience,

Really?

how is it possible to experience a sense in a Dream which you never experienced in real life.

Is this a question?

Some of the stuff hes saying is possible to some degree by highly skilled people and even then its an exaggeration. Like splitting personalities?
Is this a question?

How exactly does that work? Its unrealistic and fake.

If you think it's fake, why do you want to know how to do it?

2)



So now this is beginning to look seem more and more sci-fi.

I kno rite

I mean using maths and accessing your files trough a HUD stored by a brain computer?
Hey, that's not a question!

He uses all of these terms as the dream world is anything similar to waking life. It is extremely different, covered with emotions and volatile but he somehow has neat organized folders and solves math in them. Aight..

Alright!

3)



So this one is my favorite. He claims to split into hundreds of clones each doing its own thing while he puts 1 clone of himself into a time chamber from DBZ?
Yes, he does claim to do that.

Can it get more ridiculous and obvious than this?
Probably

Do I need to say anything?
No.

4)



Even tho I'm pretty much repeating myself here, why does a master of lucid dreaming need combat moves except that it looks cool,

Is this a question?

oh yeah I forgot you gotta fight and protect yourself from the real people trying to hijack your dreams -.-''
Oh. Okay. Thanks for the tip.

I don't like calling out people and being a dick but there is nothing more I hate than liars over-exaggerating this stuff to a ludicrous degree.. Don't be that guy.

Oh.

Originally Posted by WakingNomad

Oh.

Is this supposed to be a coherent response?

Originally Posted by Electrode

What techniques? These aren't techniques its just pointless rambling that has nothing to do with lucid dreaming. I looked into his posts/threads a bit more and its all utter nonsense.

Lemme just show you some things which are plain lies/made up :

1)


Like what is this? Is this supposed to be serious because judging from this guys posts and threads it looks very much so. He created 100s of persistant worlds and can inhibit the insides of any beast he wants.

Maybe he meant that he memorizes these worlds(parts of them at least), then teleports to them. Inhibit the inside of any beast: might be something like transformation, but like changing his character to the beast(like in battlefield 2 for ps2)

This is plain impossible. Dreams are a reflection of ourselves and are governed by our subconcience, how is it possible to experience a sense in a Dream which you never experienced in real life. Some of the stuff hes saying is possible to some degree by highly skilled people and even then its an exaggeration. Like splitting personalities? How exactly does that work? Its unrealistic and fake.

Maybe a sense he can imagine. of course nobody can have a sense the brain can't create.

2)



So now this is beginning to look seem more and more sci-fi. I mean using maths and accessing your files trough a HUD stored by a brain computer? He uses all of these terms as the dream world is anything similar to waking life. It is extremely different, covered with emotions and volatile but he somehow has neat organized folders and solves math in them. Aight..

It seems similar to the television teleportation tech. He sees a list of places, and picks one to teleport to. A dream control tech, not an actual HUD for his sub(or does he mean an actual HUD for his sub?).

3)



So this one is my favorite. He claims to split into hundreds of clones each doing its own thing while he puts 1 clone of himself into a time chamber from DBZ? Can it get more ridiculous and obvious than this? Do I need to say anything?

Having multiple awareness? I doubt that
4)



Even tho I'm pretty much repeating myself here, why does a master of lucid dreaming need combat moves except that it looks cool, oh yeah I forgot you gotta fight and protect yourself from the real people trying to hijack your dreams -.-''

Maybe, if you believe in shared dreaming(I don't)

I don't like calling out people and being a dick but there is nothing more I hate than liars over-exaggerating this stuff to a ludicrous degree.. Don't be that guy.

Something like that is definitely bad for DV, especially newbies that don't know enough

Answers in quote

So this one is my favorite. He claims to split into hundreds of clones each doing its own thing while he puts 1 clone of himself into a time chamber from DBZ? Can it get more ridiculous and obvious than this? Do I need to say anything?

Having multiple awareness? I doubt that

Yea I just want to defend the sleeping guy and say that I've actually had dreams where I've split my awareness between two people, I wouldn't scoff at the idea that you can control more than just two awareness'.

It didn't really feel like it was a strain to do so either, it just happened.

Originally Posted by Electrode

Is this supposed to be a coherent response?

Maybe.

Originally Posted by PKJacker

Yea I just want to defend the sleeping guy and say that I've actually had dreams where I've split my awareness between two people, I wouldn't scoff at the idea that you can control more than just two awareness'.

It didn't really feel like it was a strain to do so either, it just happened.

Yes. I've had five dreams simultaneously. That feels bizarre. I think my most favorite of the five was dreaming I was in a hoverboard graffitti gang in future Tokyo.

Yes. I've had five dreams simultaneously. That feels bizarre. I think my most favorite of the five was dreaming I was in a hoverboard graffitti gang in future Tokyo.

For me I was a bug monster fighting a guy who I also saw through as well, but I couldn't control either. It was weird, bug monster won by eating the head of the other guy, which was even more weird since I was eating the head I was seeing through.

Look, dreams are indeed weird. Alot of stuff is possible and I am all up for exploring the dream world but it is quite pointless when you have people making stuff up to make them feel/look better. Its not helping anyone, especially since there is no way anyone can confirm any of it.

I called the guy out for being blatantly outrageous and decieving. I have been Lucid Dreaming for 5 years now and had a little over 100 of them, I was also a part of the Lucipedia forum for years before it kinda died out and I never heard anything similar to this nonsense.

I am here to learn and take tips from people that are more experienced in order to expand my knowledge on the subject and get better at it but thats only going to be possible if everyone is honest about it and shares actual advice rather than made up stories. Its an online forum, nobody knows you here, no need to pretend and make stuff up.

Originally Posted by PKJacker

Yea I just want to defend the sleeping guy and say that I've actually had dreams where I've split my awareness between two people, I wouldn't scoff at the idea that you can control more than just two awareness'.

It didn't really feel like it was a strain to do so either, it just happened.

Splitting awareness and having a bizzare dream is much different than someone clamining he has 100s of worlds saved, having hundrends of clones of himself doing random stuff, a clone sitting in a DBZ chamber as well as playing a MMO vs other Lucid Dreamers that are out to get his secrets.

If we take Mylenes serious, his history explains his insane dream control. Apparently when lucid at will you can become very creative. What he says in this thread doesn't seem impossible to me?

I would be skeptic like you if i didn't know better. The things you say are impossible are things that other people can relate to. Like split awareness, for me i was an alien insect flying from outer space to earth in order to learn more about human beings and split my awareness on the way and landed into multiple free-roaming points on earth.

It is a dream for god's sake, and a lucid one at that! I don't see why you woulden't create 100's of standalone worlds. Memory can keep those worlds alive. I don't see how that is impossible. I'm sure that's all Mylenes means. I mean.. U are calling him a liar but you are reading things from his post which i don't!

Looks to me like you are saying things he says which he actually doesn't That is the core issue at hand here. Although i agree with you and i would not appreciate being lied to about dream skills either.

Originally Posted by Dthoughts

If we take Mylenes serious, his history explains his insane dream control. Apparently when lucid at will you can become very creative. What he says in this thread doesn't seem impossible to me?

I would be skeptic like you if i didn't know better. The things you say are impossible are things that other people can relate to. Like split awareness, for me i was an alien insect flying from outer space to earth in order to learn more about human beings and split my awareness on the way and landed into multiple free-roaming points on earth.

It is a dream for god's sake, and a lucid one at that! I don't see why you woulden't create 100's of standalone worlds. Memory can keep those worlds alive. I don't see how that is impossible. I'm sure that's all Mylenes means. I mean.. U are calling him a liar but you are reading things from his post which i don't!

Looks to me like you are saying things he says which he actually doesn't That is the core issue at hand here. Although i agree with you and i would not appreciate being lied to about dream skills either.

How am I saying things he said which he actually didn't. I took the time to quote everything he said and placed my thoughts there. And yes as I said dreams are still a big unknown to us and these things theoretically could be possible but the way he says it and the things he says are flat out obviously not true. Saying he was in dreams for years and keeping notes for real life so he can remember stuff is complete and utter bull****. Combined with rest of the stuff hes saying gives him 0 credibility in any sense.

I don't know much about what is truly possible when LD-ing and I wanna hear about peoples awesome and weird experiences like the one you described but its is nearly impossible if most of it is lies. I mean come on? Split awareness/complete dream control/shared dreaming (pretty common it seems since he has all of these strategies)/100s of saved worlds that never change/staying in a dream for years -> I mean can this really be debated or taken seriously in a least bit?

Its one thing saying I had a dream about split awareness or It felt as it was a strange dream or I had this experience where I was a lion opposed to saying I am master of everything and can do everything I want in a dream almost perfectly. Its flat out ridiculous.

I see no reason why you can't have godlike control. But i see that is not what you mean. And yea, i also wary claims of time dilation. It just seems too overpowered an ability. I can think of ways to prove time dilation happens though, but it requires some complex methods and really 100% lucidity.

So, I guess Mylynes was serious, or at least has clearly been perceived as such by his readers, fans, and compatriots.

As sort of an aside, here's a question about splitting your self into just a couple of other selves:

If you have split yourself into multiple, independent entities, how do you know it is happening?

After all, if your "entire" awareness is in your current DC (as it would have to be to fit the descriptions provided above), how do you know that there are a bunch of other DC's which also, simultaneously, contain your entire awareness? Do they come and tell you? Is there some sort of split-screen thing going on in your head? Is it just an overall feeling that you are doing things elsewhere? Do you hop back and forth among them?

If it is the latter (hopping among them), then how do you know you're not simply shifting among DC's one at a time, with your awareness encased in only one DC at a time? And, if your answer is "I just knew it," that really doesn't fly for me, and probably shouldn't for you.

[Also, I just realized: if it is like a split screen event, where you are seeing all your selves go about their business at once, then who is watching the screens? There is a difference, I think, between watching multiple DC's doing their things, each as you, and actually being those multiple DC's.]

I'm more than willing to accept that someone split his identity among several DC's in a dream, but I think there are a lot of things that can happen in a dream that can give you the impression that you are having multiple dreams at once, or have become several different DC's at once, while throughout it all you are simply one entity filling his dreamworld with a particularly complex schema.

And yes, I do not think it is possible, psychologically or philosophically, to divide your self into 100 different, independent entities, all of whom are truly you. Two, three, or even five could be feasible, I suppose, but 100 is just silly, eclipses even insanity, and smacks a bit too much of the Naruto anime. It seems that Electrode's "calling out" of Mylynes might be necessary, because it might give us a chance tho think about the idea that much of what we read on these forums arrives in the form of a tall tale. Aside over...

I could go on about the flaws I noticed in Mylynes stories on his assorted threads (i.e., why would someone who's been LD'ing "naturally" since he was 4 even know what a technique is, much less need them or start threads about them?), but I won't, because, if he was serious and actually believes this stuff, well, that is something that must be left to him to inspect. Which got me thinking:

Lucid dreaming is an incredibly liberating conscious activity, and it can certainly feel like anything is possible in them -- the infinite seems to be at your very fingertips. And I know that it certainly can be dreaming-forum heresy to suggest that there may be limits to what a dreamer can do in his own head ... Indeed, I personally feel that LD'ing is only the first rung of a ladder that can carry a willing consciousness to incredible heights (and out of the dream realm altogether), but I do so with the knowledge that -- if I want to maintain my own identity and self-awareness, and while my brain is still in charge of projecting the dreams -- there are things that simply cannot be done in a dream.

Heresy maybe, but I've been doing this stuff for a very long time, and have found that the one true limit -- and true threat -- to LD'ing is to succumb to the fantasies, to lie to yourself about what just happened, and then to believe and defend that lie as truth. Sharing that lie with others as if it were true is only collateral damage.

I really like what you said Sageous, but I also feel as though there are benefits to people lying about amazing things they can do in dreams. Even if Mylynes couldn't actually do half of the incredible things he talked about, it inspired me to try to do them.

Back in the day, I played this game called Gunz. There was one guy that played who called himself Monk and he caused some controversy. The vast majority hated the guy because he claimed that he could do a special move without outside programs and they simply thought that was impossible and called him a liar. There was also a minority that believed him and they formed a kind of gaming cult around this guy in which he was their dictator (I was part of that cult). I tried and tried and eventually I was able to do this special move. I found out later that Monk and his top followers never actually could do it and that they all used a macro designed by him just to trawl the community. But even though he was lying, it inspired me to try to break past the believed limitations and I became one of the very first people that could legitimately do these 'impossible moves'.

Mylynes similarly inspired me to try to break past my own limitations of what I thought was possible in dreams, even if they may seem ridiculous like splitting consciousness into 100 different points of awareness or playing more than 30 games of chess at once while remembering where each piece was. People like Mylynes help me to keep climbing this ladder of consciousness to find out for myself whether the limitations or real or imagined.

SPIRAL.jpg

^^ That's an interesting, constructive way to look at this, Anotherdreamer. However, you would need a pretty healthy attitude about all this stuff, so that when you come to the point where you realize the wonders Mylynes describes are likely exaggerations and can't be done, you know to simply shrug and move on to something else, rather than throw in the towel on LD'ing altogether because you just could never come close to dividing your self into, say, 3 (much less 100) unique individuals like Mylynes said he could do.

Now, by what I've read from you, including that last post, you do seem to have that healthy attitude, and the fantastic claims of folks like Mylynes could effect you positively. That's a good thing, sure, but what about the many who can't find that attitude, and instead start thinking that claims like this are what LD'ing is supposed to be? Or, worse, what about medium-to-advanced LD'ers who waste so much of their precious time in lucidity trying and inevitably failing to do this stuff, while at the same time not doing the exploring, growing, and having fun that they could have been doing?

I think if all posts were based on truth, these forums would be a much better and more useful place. After all, there are plenty of people who share with us some amazing things which they have actually done in their dreams, and with their lucidity, from which we can draw some inspiration, right?

I think I might have helped veer us a bit off-topic here, so I'll leave it at that.

Originally Posted by anotherdreamer

I really like what you said Sageous, but I also feel as though there are benefits to people lying about amazing things they can do in dreams. Even if Mylynes couldn't actually do half of the incredible things he talked about, it inspired me to try to do them.

Back in the day, I played this game called Gunz. There was one guy that played who called himself Monk and he caused some controversy. The vast majority hated the guy because he claimed that he could do a special move without outside programs and they simply thought that was impossible and called him a liar. There was also a minority that believed him and they formed a kind of gaming cult around this guy in which he was their dictator (I was part of that cult). I tried and tried and eventually I was able to do this special move. I found out later that Monk and his top followers never actually could do it and that they all used a macro designed by him just to trawl the community. But even though he was lying, it inspired me to try to break past the believed limitations and I became one of the very first people that could legitimately do these 'impossible moves'.

Mylynes similarly inspired me to try to break past my own limitations of what I thought was possible in dreams, even if they may seem ridiculous like splitting consciousness into 100 different points of awareness or playing more than 30 games of chess at once while remembering where each piece was. People like Mylynes help me to keep climbing this ladder of consciousness to find out for myself whether the limitations or real or imagined.

SPIRAL.jpg

Yes some of the posts may seem a bit challenging making you feel like you need to dig deeper to try to get to that level inspiring you to do better etc.. but imagine how counterproductive it seems to anyone trying to really get into it, I mean you see people here struggling for weeks/months to just have one LD and there are people claiming to have such abilities which are clearly unrealistic to say the least.

It actually insulted me and I feel alot of others who actually spend time thinking about this, trying to get better at is and master it. Like my achivement of being able to maintain a dream for more than 3 minutes after years of being able to stay in a LD for 30 seconds/1 minute tops, was a big step that took me years to be able to achieve. I can compare it to WoW. Its like you spend weeks trying to take down a boss in WoW with your guild (I dont actually play it but for sake of comparison), and then some guy comes along saying he soloed it. Its just utter nonsense,clearly impossible and helps no one.

I find genuine threads of people explaining things and their ACTUAL TRUE experiences that make me want to be better. Posts about people actually finding unique things to do. I remember someone on Lucipedia posted that he asked a DC to write some kind of a advice on a piece of paper and asked others about doing the same. It led to some nice discussions and various findings/responses. Things like that make Lucid Dreaming so inspiring and make me want to master it not some random outrageous claims of supreme control.

Feel free, anybody, to doubt and to express your doubt. But please do it in a nice and respectful manner. Without calling others liars. Thank you.

I've been practicing Time Dilation in dreams. I had a ten year dream, and a three hundred year dream.

What this means is that I perceived dreaming ten years in one dream. It's like reading a book that takes you a total of ten hours, and in the book ten years went by, and after you get done with the book, you feel like you lived ten years in that other world.

Why I "believe" Mylynes is because I've tried out his techniques, and learned a lot from him. For example, creating an HUD, Time Dilation, Self-Induced Waking Hallucinations, et cetera. This is going off into the BD zone a little, and I don't want to get this thread moved, but I did battle him on the Dream Plane about three years ago, and he basically won, so I knew that at the time he was a more powerful Dreamer than I was. His Omnilucidity technique has helped extend my lucid time also.

Originally Posted by gab

Feel free, anybody, to doubt and to express your doubt. But please do it in a nice and respectful manner. Without calling others liars. Thank you.

I didn't see it that way at the time, but I guess that is what we're doing, isn't it? I (at least) meant no harm, and was trying to be generally cautionary, but I see your point. All apologies!

@Electrode:
Look dude, I don't really see what your problem is. Mylynes went out of his way to try and help other people who were attempting to become as skilled at lucid dreaming as he is. Is there really anything to dispute about? If you don't want to try his techniques, so be it. But unless you actually experiment with anything that Mylynes wrote about with a good hearted attitude then please don't say anything negative or unjust. It is simply not your place.

Originally Posted by Sageous

I didn't see it that way at the time, but I guess that is what we're doing, isn't it? I (at least) meant no harm, and was trying to be generally cautionary, but I see your point. All apologies!

Thank you Sageous, classy guy as always.

Didn't wanna name names, still don't, but you were not the one that prompted me to make my plea.

Ok. Time dilation and split awareness seem to be understood wrong.

Time dilation: Either what WakingNomad said(the book example), or you can actually count to a billion in a dream.

Split Awareness: Either what Sageous said(screens), or you can play 100 matches of chess simultaneously(nice example AnotherDreamer).

Shared dreaming: That is something a little different(a lot of controversy about it)

Please don't move this thread to Beyond Dreaming. Credibility is so hard to find in that subforum it is viewed as a playground for silly ideas. Besides, there's so much traffic on this forum. I see that as fresh meat ready to be trained into lucid dreaming pros. I'm tired of being muffled away at the BD!

Cut the crap, stop bickering and just try these techniques if you are being skeptical.

Lets raise the standard guys,

I want to set up an experiment we can all do together.

Here's a hypothesis about splitting awareness; Splitting consciousness is a form of energy manipulation. You can only split your consciousness as many times as that energy allows you to (we'll call it energy in this experiment, we do not know what energy actually consists of, atleast not yet).

I suspect splitting consciousness actually will feel like you are cutting into an organic body. In my experience which was brief and wasn't very lucid, having multiple awareness is like playing a video in split-screen but weirder because there is no actual screen. And no players.. that is the weirdest thing. Who is doing all the playing?

I advice you to try this for yourself and notice how incredibly difficult it is to accurately translate these sensations in words.. It is astounding, no wonder Mylenes is not taken seriously. It is not that he is lying. It is just that words fail to accurately convey the truth.

To test this hypothesis of mine we could simply have different lucid dreamers of this forum perform the task of splitting consciousness into as much sides as they can and report to us any sensations and detail for further analysis.

^ It is that easy.

WN: How exactly do you begin dilating time in a lucid dream? ]

Like i said, i can think of ways to prove time dilation in a scientific fashion. Just takes a little creativity, what we need now is lucidity. Together we can move mountains in terms of lucid dreaming research. I really hope someone besides me is going to try splitting awareness in a lucid dream ;

Originally Posted by Dthoughts

I believe it might be so. I suspect splitting consciousness actually will feel like you are cutting into an organic self. IME, which was brief and i wasn't very lucid. Having multiple awareness is like playing a video in split-screen but weirder because there is no actual screen. And no players.. that is the weirdest thing. Who is doing all the playing?

It can feel weird, but splitting awareness wouldn't be defined like that. This is close, but not it,sorry. If you try it, then you can play multiple chess games simultaneously. A match for every consciousness.

Originally Posted by LouaiB

It can feel weird, but splitting awareness wouldn't be defined like that. This is close, but not it,sorry. If you try it, then you can play multiple chess games simultaneously. A match for every consciousness.

IME means "In my Experience" .. I actually am trying to convey a memory of an actual experience here i'm not sure if you are aware of that

Otherwise, what do you mean ? Have you tried splitting awareness yet?

PS: Note how important it is to differ the words Consciousness and Awareness here. Both have different implications that reach pretty far out.

Originally Posted by Dthoughts

IME means "In my Experience" .. I actually am trying to convey a memory of an actual experience here i'm not sure if you are aware of that

Otherwise, what do you mean ?

Splitting awareness is impossible psychologically. Period.