Thread: Ron Paul 2012

What events would you propose I show you?

Ron Paul wants to get rid of the department of education, and get the federal government out of education. Instead he wants education to be ran on the state level. Big government bureaucracy doesn't really help education and we seen this in recent years. As the federal government has spent more and more money trying to fix education, and there hasn't been any results. They are just wasting the money. Which is why Paul wants to make it a state level issue. At the state level people are directly accountable to people living in their state, and things work a lot better.

As for Ron Paul appeasing radical religion people, what are you talking about? He doesn't talk about anything religious and doesn't believe religion should get tied up in government. He basically believes people should believe whatever they want. I don't know any radical people he 'appeases'. Unless you mean the fact he doesn't want to bomb Iran because the US government has stated there is no evidence of Iran is trying to develop nuclear weapons. Though that doesn't really have anything to do with religion.

To find out Obama is a liar on the other hand is easy. All you have to do is look at his foreign policy. He promised he would end the war, and he hasn't and is now starting a new war with Iran. He said he would stop the practice of torture, and he hasn't. Instead he now made it legal for the government to torture US citizens, and even murder them without trail.

Don't, vote for who you want to vote for. I'll research it more to make my decision, I'm obviously getting nothing but "Suck Ron Paul's d**k or your stupid" here. However, I do not know how much consideration I will take to such an argument when researching.

You might want to read a little Ayn Rand to better understand Ron Paul. He named his son Rand. His son is a Tea Party favorite. His son is campaigning with him.

Originally Posted by Wayfaerer

Don't, vote for who you want to vote for. I'll research it more to make my decision, I'm obviously getting nothing but "Suck Ron Paul's d**k or your stupid" here. However, I do not know how much consideration I will take to such an argument when researching.

But have you received that sort of response from me? I am interested in informing you, not demonizing your current political attitude.

Originally Posted by Alric

As for Ron Paul appeasing radical religion people, what are you talking about?

I was talking about how much he emphasizes his belief in the Christian God, which makes me doubt his reasoning skills and values all together. It doesn't even seem very possible that he states his belief for the minimal required show to avoid an "atheist president" controversy, it actually sounds like he believes it. He also claims to be "an unshakable foe of abortion".

The difference is Ron Paul's personal views have never affected his policy, while every other politician's policy is directly affected by their personal beliefs and agendas and not on what they believe is the purpose of the law.

Originally Posted by roswell

You might want to read a little Ayn Rand to better understand Ron Paul. He named his son Rand. His son is a Tea Party favorite. His son is campaigning with him.

He didn't name his son after Ayn Rand. His full name is Randal; Rand is a nickname his wife gave him that isn't associated with Ayn. And Paul is closer to Rothbard and Mises than he is [Ayn] Rand and the Objectivists.

Ron Paul doesn't actually talk about religion at all. When asked a direct question about his religion, he does answer and say that yes he is a Christian. Other than that however, he doesn't talk about his religion and doesn't bring it up. I don't know why you think he tries to emphasizes it since it is basically a non issue as far as he is concerned, and he doesn't feel it has any place in government.

On the abortion issue, he takes it from a legal stance. Since babies are legally considered people, and doctors can be sued for injury done to babies in the womb, then clearly they are people and so shouldn't be aborted. Which makes sense. Its hard to say a baby isn't alive but if you harm it you can be sued, unless in this one specific instance. Also Paul was an OBGYN, and as they say he delivered over 4000 babies in his career. Even if you support abortion you got to respect that a person who seen abortions first hand(back when they did it to nearly full term babies too), and deals with babies all the time, is obviously not going to be comfortable with the issue.

Originally Posted by Omnis Dei

The difference is Ron Paul's personal views have never affected his policy

What does this mean..? Everybody is defined by their views, how can a politician exist without them?

Originally Posted by Xei

What does this mean..? Everybody is defined by their views, how can a politician exist without them?

Perhaps that he isn't completely interested in imposing them on others.

Originally Posted by Xei

What does this mean..? Everybody is defined by their views, how can a politician exist without them?

Ron Paul does not promote a Christian Agenda just because he's Christian. When a politician says they want to protect the sanctity of marriage, they're just dishing out a load of crap to disguise what they're really saying which is "I want support from Christian Voters even if it means promoting ideas that are contrary to the Constitution."

The difference is other politicians would do anything as long as they had the mob behind them, including murder. No matter what corrupt direction the US gets twisted into, it doesn't matter to them as long as they have popular support.

Ron Paul, on the other hand, understands that just because it's popular does not mean it's the highest good for the country.

Originally Posted by BLUELINE976

Perhaps that he isn't completely interested in imposing them on others.

So it's his view that the state is too broad.

I've seen him unnecessarily bring up God. Anyway, I'm done with this for now, specific comparisons on specific issues to read about would be greatly appreciated.

I've never seen him invoke God...

Originally Posted by Xei

So it's his view that the state is too broad.

Are you asking me if that's his view?

There are so many issues that we expect our representatives to fix or have a position for. How can one person please any other person completely? I love Ron Paul's political views on proper place for the federal government. I love his views on the constituion, and I trust that he is a man of his word, unlike Obama. Obama duped us. However, I do have a feeling that if Ron Paul is president we will see lots of offshore oil drilling, oil spills, clearcutting the last of our forests out west, etc. Our environment will suffer. He believes in limiting the power of the federal government which is good news considering our civil rights and liberties, but it is bad news for the environment. The reason that the Tea Party and Radical Christians like him is because they are most centered in Dixie, in the South. If you look at history you find that the South seceded from the Union because of the issue of State rights and the federal government infringing on State's rights. Unfortunately we are taught that it was only because of the issue of slavery. Now unfortunately historically this issue is entwined with racial issues and the ugly specter of slavery. But just because some racist christians nostalgic for the old days support Ron Paul doesn't mean that Ron Paul has those views. But I have heard that he is racist also, I will have to research that more. Now so I have to consider which is more important to me: the freedom of our overpopulated human species AND the multinational corporations, or the freedom and health of the environment and our nonhuman brothers.

Originally Posted by Wayfaerer

I've seen him unnecessarily bring up God. Anyway, I'm done with this for now, specific comparisons on specific issues to read about would be greatly appreciated.

Obama: Hypocrite, liar, elitist, smarmy politician

Paul: Not those things

I'm a pretty liberal guy, I'd like to see school completely socialized (on the state level) and think Social Security cannot be backed out of because people deserve to receive the funding they invested in during their working life. But I am laying this aside because I find there's one, specific issue that trumps all others right now. The Federal Government is a a run-away complex and a private corporation that does not hold the interests of the people in its highest good and is currently having all of its funds extracted to off-shore accounts, enabled by rats like Obama.

Originally Posted by Wayfaerer

Well that was pointlessly out of context...

You say you'll vote for Obama because he's the safer choice, whatever that means. Ron Paul is the only libertarian candidate with any kind of chance. I don't really see how it's out of context.

My primary reason for supporting Ron Paul is that he will shut down military bases. Obama is going to set up more, he's in the process of setting one up in Australia. This to me is completely unacceptable. We are trillions of dollars in dept, how the hell can you justify spending as much money as we do on the military when that's the case?

Obama will continue to waste about $15,000,000,000 per year on the war on drugs. Ron Paul will not. Obama just signed a defense bill that allows the government to indefinitely detain american citizens accused of terrorism. Obama also supported the bailouts which in my opinion were basically criminal activity.

But I dunno, Ron Paul may have just lost my support, I think I'm voting for this guy........

Originally Posted by Wayfaerer

Can someone specifically list the horrible things Obama has done? List some specific events that I should be concerned about or be a hypocrite.

He promised to close Guantanamo but of course he made it bigger. He gave, what?, $14 trillion to the banks who ripped us off. He borrowed it from the federal reserve, thus causing way more inflation and making every human poorer and the banks richer. He signed some food safety bill that has been in effect for a year making it illegal to save seeds to grow your own food in a garden. He has redefined the definition of terrorist so now if you are "hording" food you can now be considered a terrorist. He has allowed genetically modified organisms to be labeled organic by the FDA. He has authorized that anybody, even americans, can be assassinated and/or arrested with no charge, no right to a lawyer, no trial, no trace. He has done nothing for making alternative sources of energy available. He has consistently sided with centralized power, corruption, making power even more centralized and corrupt. Ron Paul is for decentralization of power, which is our hope for freedom.

Here is something I will post in the spirit of humor, yet the centrla message behind all the conspiracy theory talk is a good point that I think we should all keep in mind before jumping on the Ron Paul bandwagon: Ron Paul will not Fix anything (He is Illuminati) – You are the Savior « LEGITAMYSTIC.COM

Dannon, do you think that we should just not vote then? I'm on the fence but I usually end up voting. I'm voting for Paul mainly because the more support he gets the more people hear about libertarian ideas. Also less people will die if he wins, though that seems pretty much impossible. The republicans won't endorse someone who goes against the military industrial complex so I don't see how he can get their nomination. Without a nomination you can't win...

Originally Posted by Dannon Oneironaut

He promised to close Guantanamo but of course he made it bigger. He gave, what?, $14 trillion to the banks who ripped us off. He borrowed it from the federal reserve, thus causing way more inflation and making every human poorer and the banks richer. He signed some food safety bill that has been in effect for a year making it illegal to save seeds to grow your own food in a garden. He has redefined the definition of terrorist so now if you are "hording" food you can now be considered a terrorist. He has allowed genetically modified organisms to be labeled organic by the FDA. He has authorized that anybody, even americans, can be assassinated and/or arrested with no charge, no right to a lawyer, no trial, no trace. He has done nothing for making alternative sources of energy available. He has consistently sided with centralized power, corruption, making power even more centralized and corrupt. Ron Paul is for decentralization of power, which is our hope for freedom.

Here is something I will post in the spirit of humor, yet the centrla message behind all the conspiracy theory talk is a good point that I think we should all keep in mind before jumping on the Ron Paul bandwagon: Ron Paul will not Fix anything (He is Illuminati) – You are the Savior « LEGITAMYSTIC.COM

I liked your post until I saw your link. Now I dislike it. What did I just read? Obama really cared before the Illuminati got to him? If Ron Paul posed a real threat they'd do brain surgery on him like Paul McCartney? Wikileaks and Anonymous are CIA infiltrated Inside Jobs?

Originally Posted by Xei

What does this mean..? Everybody is defined by their views, how can a politician exist without them?

He reads the constitution and votes on bills based on whether the constitution allows that type of bill. His personal feelings don't come into it.

Needless to say, he usually votes "no".

That's not really how he acts. The constitution didn't descend from the heavens as some kind of objective standard. He votes with the constitution because his philosophical views are in line with the constitution. If the constitution prohibited free speech presumably his view would be to oppose it.