Thread: Was Sandy Hook a Hoax?

Originally Posted by Alric

We been over this so many times. I have already posted several examples of people crying. You, yourself have posted videos of people crying! Scroll back through the thread and look at them. In every single instance it has been shown a person was crying, you stated they weren't really crying even though it was obvious they were. You are really starting to annoy me, because you keep telling me to post examples of people crying and every time I do you just say they are not crying. You are utterly incapable to recognizing when a person is crying or not. There is no point in posting new examples, because you are incapable of recognizing crying on video, or you are just lying.

You are engaging in Category 5 dishonesty. You have posted ZERO videos of any supposed Sandy Hook victim's family member crying tears in a live interview. That is the challenge, and you have not met it. The challenge still stands. I bet you don't meet it in your next post either. No such interview footage exists!

Originally Posted by Alric

Also you are just wrong about musicians. Musicians are not actors. You are full of shit. Your claim isn't even logical even in your own wrapped reality. Even if you assume all musicians are capable actors , why would you hire a musician for an acting job instead of an actor? Also you claim all musicians are great actors, but then you claim all the people are obviously bad actors? So which is it? Even if you were right, you would be wrong because your claim is that they all suck at acting and you can easily see through them. So shouldn't you be arguing that musicians are hacks and can't act at all, and because they were cheap and hired musicians instead of real actors they got sub par acting from them? That is still stupid but at least it is logically consistent.

I said that all famous STAGE musicians are good actors. All average STAGE musicians are average actors or better. Compared to a high level acting job, an average acting job is bad. I can spot such acting jobs. A lot of people can.

Name one famous stage musician who has done a bad acting job in a movie. Just one.

Originally Posted by Alric

The premise of your argument goes like this. 1. There are a lot of musicians. 2. Musicians are all good actors. 3. The sandy hook parents suck at acting. Then your conclusion is, It is clearly a hoax and the musicians were hired as actors. That is an illogical line of thought. Based off your own arguments, if musicians are such good actors it wouldn't be so easy to see through them.

False. See my last paragraph. Stop being dishonest.

My reasoning on the acting, which is one area among many involved in my knowledge that Sandy Hook was a hoax, is that stage musicians and actors are actors, many of the Sandy Hook parents who have been interviewed are actors, and I can tell that the actors were acting in their interviews. Thus, the Sandy Hook saga was an act, like professional wrestling.

Originally Posted by Alric

As for wrestling being fake, it isn't faked but choreographed. The way you know it is choreographed is because they beat each other up the entire match and no one ever gets hurt aside from the occasional accident here and there. Also it is obvious because often one person will stand around while letting the other set up their special moves and stuff, moves that are often not at all realistic. None of the videos you have posted are the equivalent of a professional athlete hitting someone in the head with a metal chair, and then that person getting up and walking away 20 seconds later. In wrestling that happens. If some 350 pound guy made of pure muscles hits you in the head with a chair, you are not getting up after. In fact, there is a good chance such a blow could kill you. So obviously it is fake.

Professional wrestling is a fake sport. It does not involve real competition. It's an act, just like Sandy Hook. You talked about how wrestlers would really act in certain situations, and I talked about how family members would really act in certain situations. However, my evidence goes a whole lot deeper than that. Also, can you tell that the wrestlers are acting when they talk?

Originally Posted by Tiresias

What? The video I posted was from 1984, and they had kids there, interviewed in the video, saying it was fake and they clearly saw the wrestlers not hitting each other. John Stossel even declared this as a fact. This wasn't even controversial. You aren't special. I remember having the same argument when I was a kid in the 90s.

Oh, so some kids said they thought the wrestling looked fake and a journalist said wrestling is fake, and that proves it? Well, I have posted witnesses saying that Sandy Hook looked fake. I have posted dozens of journalists' documentaries on the fakeness of Sandy Hook. Are you sold yet?

Can you tell with your own observations that professional wrestling is fake?

Originally Posted by Tiresias

And 11 million people have watched one of the most popular hoax films, with 50% positive votes. Giving you the benefit of rounding, let's say 7 million people saw that one and thought favorably of it. We currently have 318 million, but let's subtract to 250 million to account for people without Internet, that's less than one percent of the US supporting this nonsense. That isn't a lot of people.

The opinions of other people seem to have everything to do with what you believe. Have you ever considered thinking for yourself? Also, not everybody who thinks Sandy Hoax was a hoax has +1'ed every YouTube documentary on it. I know people who have said they haven't watched any of the documentaries but could tell by watching the interviews on television that the actors were full of shit. People have watched documentaries with me and said Sandy Hoax was clearly a staged act but did not +1 the documentaries. Some of them don't even have YouTube accounts.

More importantly, popular opinion is not the measure of truth. Most rednecks in the 80's thought professional wrestling was real. If you had lived in a redneck community, would you have thought professional wrestling was real?

Originally Posted by Tiresias

I really have no idea what your point is here.

Uh, that my arguments that Sandy Hook was fake parallel the major arguments that professional wrestling is fake. Did you honestly not get that?

Originally Posted by Tiresias

It does when your lynch pin is "A lot of these people are actors!" First, the one guy who was on Spin City was an extra. I can get an extra job this week and be in a ton of movies and TV shows. That does mean I am a life long actor who will commit to a hoax. A hoax most people believe.

Nick Phelps, one of the many actors who played a Sandy Hoax parent, was not a mere extra on Spin City, a prime time ABC sitcom starring Michael J. Fox. He played a character who had a conversation with the main character. Do you think you could have landed that job?

Originally Posted by Tiresias

Every person is different. Every single person will grieve in some way, and the way is totally accessible. I'm sorry but this isn't even a point. It has been disproven by professionals with credentials better than people watching YouTube.

Yes, not everybody grieves the same way! I keep saying that. Thank you for supporting my point. People grieve in different ways. So why can none of you find me a video of a live interview with a tear coming out of an eye? Why can none of you find me a video with a Sandy Hook alleged victim's family member expressing anger? Why can none of you find me a video of somebody blaming something other than the gun? Where is this diversity you official story gulpers keep bringing up?

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Oh, so some kids said they thought the wrestling looked fake and a journalist said wrestling is fake, and that proves it? Well, I have posted witnesses saying that Sandy Hook looked fake. I have posted dozens of journalists' documentaries on the fakeness of Sandy Hook. Are you sold yet?

Can you tell with your own observations that professional wrestling is fake?

On the first point: you are literally twisting the post just because it disproves one of your points to support another point. You proclaim "I knew prowrestling was fake in 1987!!!" I respond, "well, duh, most people knew that including people who paid to see events. See? A child of about 7 to 10 said he could see them not punching each other." And you you use that logical to extend to the Sandy Hook hoax. Notice, no one of any valid credentials has ever testified under oath that Sandy Hook was faked. Notice, no one has brought a lawsuit of any sort that Sandy Hook was faked. It's just Internet users with no credentials whatsoever other than what they purport through anecdotal evidence of video clips.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

The opinions of other people seem to have everything to do with what you believe. Have you ever considered thinking for yourself? Also, not everybody who thinks Sandy Hoax was a hoax has +1'ed every YouTube documentary on it. I know people who have said they haven't watched any of the documentaries but could tell by watching the interviews on television that the actors were full of shit. People have watched documentaries with me and said Sandy Hoax was clearly a staged act but did not +1 the documentaries. Some of them don't even have YouTube accounts.

More importantly, popular opinion is not the measure of truth. Most rednecks in the 80's thought professional wrestling was real. If you had lived in a redneck community, would you have thought professional wrestling was real?

Ahh, the conspiracy theorist paradox "Think for yourself!" you yell at me after I assert my opinion. This is a logical fallacy because there's no end. If I am thinking for myself, then I cannot use ANY corroborating evidence that opposes your viewpoint, which has been declared de facto correct in this conversation, somehow. If I, through my own investigation, agree with the official story at all, then I am "trusting mainstream media blindly." It's a silly and stupid argument that I am not engaging in. The rest of your paragraph is the definition of conjecture. I am going by the actual numbers. The numbers are barely a sliver of the population. Anything else is hearsay, and you are just pulling it out of your ass.

I lived in south Louisiana, not far from where Swamp People was filmed. They have shows dedicated to how redneck people down there were. No, I didn't believe prowrestling was real, and I asked my dad, who was a fan since the 50's with my grandmother, and neither of them thought it was real.

Do you want to know why?

LOGIC. You cannot drop someone on their head or face or even back without doing serious damage. You cannot bare handed slap a person, repeatedly, without causing significant bruising. You cannot contort a person into positions, that though they look a bit easy to get out of if they were really fighting, that they have to give up or pass out, only for them to hop up after.

This part may shock you... these people also understand that movies are fiction. See, entertainment is, simply put, divided into fiction and non-fiction. A lot of the time, the fiction tries to show itself as non-fiction, but it isn't. This is how people in sitcoms can just not go to work but have multimillion dollar lifestyles. I make this point because you seem incapable of shaking the notion that prowrestling was a widely accepted "not fake" thing, when it was jokingly considered a fix since it started. That doesn't really stop the die hard fans, who will play along with the deception because it's fun. This argument is another null. It means nothing related to a conspiracy involving faking the deaths of a bunch of kids.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Nick Phelps, one of the many actors who played a Sandy Hoax parent, was not a mere extra on Spin City, a prime time ABC sitcom starring Michael J. Fox. He played a character who had a conversation with the main character. Do you think you could have landed that job?

This is laughably amazing to me. If anyone still is reading this, here is the clip you are referring:



He has 3 lines. Alson, you mention it is a primetime show on ABC, which is true. Except this is the first season and it was in 1997. That really devalues his role as an actor. He has no other television acting credits, and he did a profoundly poor job here. But, in the world of conspiracy, that was just him preparing for Sandy Hook by being a terrible actor almost 20 years before the role of his (literal) lifetime would happen. To answer your question, yeah, I could get this role because it is a role of talking extra. Have you ever seen Criminal Minds? They have so many people that have more lines than this guy did every week from non-established actors. It's the role they just have to fill.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Yes, not everybody grieves the same way! I keep saying that. Thank you for supporting my point. People grieve in different ways. So why can none of you find me a video of a live interview with a tear coming out of an eye? Why can none of you find me a video with a Sandy Hook alleged victim's family member expressing anger? Why can none of you find me a video of somebody blaming something other than the gun? Where is this diversity you official story gulpers keep bringing up?

"Official story gulpers" is literally the most telling comment in this entire place. So disconnected from reality...

Anyway, here's a video Sandy Hookers like to use as proof that this guy was acting:



SAW HIM LAUGHING? OMFG! I RECANT.

Nah, every funeral I have been to where someone may age or slightly younger or older that has died has had the parents joking with friends and family. I remember when my best friend's brother died, and we were cracking jokes with his mom, some about the dead son, then we'd go see the body and she'd breakdown and be unable to stand.

At my own aunt's funeral, I made jokes, that were really inappropriate but made a lot of people laugh.

The point is we have no context for why he was smiling and laughing. Maybe he was have a good conversation. He's allowed to do that. Then, he started talking about his however old daughter and it was like a dagger to the chest.

Originally Posted by Tiresias

On the first point: you are literally twisting the post just because it disproves one of your points to support another point. You proclaim "I knew prowrestling was fake in 1987!!!" I respond, "well, duh, most people knew that including people who paid to see events. See? A child of about 7 to 10 said he could see them not punching each other." And you you use that logical to extend to the Sandy Hook hoax. Notice, no one of any valid credentials has ever testified under oath that Sandy Hook was faked. Notice, no one has brought a lawsuit of any sort that Sandy Hook was faked. It's just Internet users with no credentials whatsoever other than what they purport through anecdotal evidence of video clips.

What does "most people" have to do with anything? I asked why YOU would have believed professional wrestling was fake in 1987.

Originally Posted by Tiresias

Ahh, the conspiracy theorist paradox "Think for yourself!" you yell at me after I assert my opinion. This is a logical fallacy because there's no end. If I am thinking for myself, then I cannot use ANY corroborating evidence that opposes your viewpoint, which has been declared de facto correct in this conversation, somehow. If I, through my own investigation, agree with the official story at all, then I am "trusting mainstream media blindly." It's a silly and stupid argument that I am not engaging in. The rest of your paragraph is the definition of conjecture. I am going by the actual numbers. The numbers are barely a sliver of the population. Anything else is hearsay, and you are just pulling it out of your ass.

I didn't say you had to blindly trust the mainstream media to believe Sandy Hook was real. I just said that you are doing it. You have nothing convincing to say. You just stick to the official story because it's the official story and because most other people believe it.

Originally Posted by Tiresias

I lived in south Louisiana, not far from where Swamp People was filmed. They have shows dedicated to how redneck people down there were. No, I didn't believe prowrestling was real, and I asked my dad, who was a fan since the 50's with my grandmother, and neither of them thought it was real.

Do you want to know why?

LOGIC. You cannot drop someone on their head or face or even back without doing serious damage. You cannot bare handed slap a person, repeatedly, without causing significant bruising. You cannot contort a person into positions, that though they look a bit easy to get out of if they were really fighting, that they have to give up or pass out, only for them to hop up after.

This part may shock you... these people also understand that movies are fiction. See, entertainment is, simply put, divided into fiction and non-fiction. A lot of the time, the fiction tries to show itself as non-fiction, but it isn't. This is how people in sitcoms can just not go to work but have multimillion dollar lifestyles. I make this point because you seem incapable of shaking the notion that prowrestling was a widely accepted "not fake" thing, when it was jokingly considered a fix since it started. That doesn't really stop the die hard fans, who will play along with the deception because it's fun. This argument is another null. It means nothing related to a conspiracy involving faking the deaths of a bunch of kids.

There we go! You can tell by watching professional wrestling that it is fake, and you know that events in the stories defy reality and common sense. You can tell that movies are fake the same way. Now snap out of your mainstream media and popular opinion hypnosis and notice how absurd Sandy Hook is for the same kinds of reasons.

Originally Posted by Tiresias

He has 3 lines. Alson, you mention it is a primetime show on ABC, which is true. Except this is the first season and it was in 1997. That really devalues his role as an actor. He has no other television acting credits, and he did a profoundly poor job here. But, in the world of conspiracy, that was just him preparing for Sandy Hook by being a terrible actor almost 20 years before the role of his (literal) lifetime would happen. To answer your question, yeah, I could get this role because it is a role of talking extra. Have you ever seen Criminal Minds? They have so many people that have more lines than this guy did every week from non-established actors. It's the role they just have to fill.

Do you have any idea how hard it is to get a speaking role on a prime time network sitcom? Nick Phelps is an actor.

Originally Posted by Tiresias

"Official story gulpers" is literally the most telling comment in this entire place. So disconnected from reality...

You gulped the official story. It was way too easy for the hoaxers to fool you.

Originally Posted by Tiresias

SAW HIM LAUGHING? OMFG! I RECANT.

Uh, yeah. He is very plainly laughing as he walks up to the microphone.

Originally Posted by Tiresias

Nah, every funeral I have been to where someone may age or slightly younger or older that has died has had the parents joking with friends and family. I remember when my best friend's brother died, and we were cracking jokes with his mom, some about the dead son, then we'd go see the body and she'd breakdown and be unable to stand.

At my own aunt's funeral, I made jokes, that were really inappropriate but made a lot of people laugh.

The point is we have no context for why he was smiling and laughing. Maybe he was have a good conversation. He's allowed to do that. Then, he started talking about his however old daughter and it was like a dagger to the chest.

He was walking to the microphone to give a speech about his supposed daughter who supposedly was killed in a massacre the previous day. The previous day!!







Pause this at 7:16.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

There we go! You can tell by watching professional wrestling that it is fake, and you know that events in the stories defy reality and common sense. You can tell that movies are fake the same way. Now snap out of your mainstream media and popular opinion hypnosis and notice how absurd Sandy Hook is for the same kinds of reasons.

There really is nothing outrageous about the official story. Quick: Did you see the bodies from Columbine? Did you see pictures or video of parents crying? What about Virginia Tech? What about Aurora Cineplex? What about the mass shooting in Australia they left them with the strictest gun control in the world?

You haven't seen any of these things.

This is where conspiracy theorists will lose people. As someone who has logic facilities and sound reasoning abilities, I cannot start looking for a conspiracy when there is no answer to why. The official story barely has a why, which makes it very uncomfortable to accept as fact. Not unrealistic; uncomfortable. A teenager or whatever had an event that caused him to lose all control of his restraint facilities, and her murdered his mother then a bunch of children in a school. That's a crazy world to live in, and that is the world we live. A world where shit just happens.

In your world, there are massive conspiracies to, and I am quoting, "I am not sure what the purpose of Sandy Hook was." This is defines any scientific inquiry. You are LOOKING for a conspiracy. You have yet to entertain my notion that there wasn't anyone beyond Adam Lanza acting alone. Take off your world against you glasses for a second and look at it from that perspective.

Also, you said the conspiracy was "possibly intentionally bad so some people would see that." Do you have ANY idea how egotistical that sounds on top of how utterly insane that is? If Sandy Hook is proven to be a hoax, they have broken a myriad of federal laws that would likely imprison them for several lifetimes. It's like saying 9/11 was perpetrated by the government, but they left clues for the smarter ones. If the US Government was revealed to be behind 9/11, other countries would go to war with us without hesitating.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Do you have any idea how hard it is to get a speaking role on a prime time network sitcom? Nick Phelps is an actor.

About as easy as auditioning: Extras Casting | Jobs for Movies, Television, & More | Backstage

All extras need to do is look a certain part. If they have a speaking role, they will have to audition, but for the love of science, this is Spin City in the first season; it's not Shindler's List.