Thread: The Day We Fight Back Against Mass Surveillance

Originally Posted by u/somekindofmutant

Right idea; wrong methods. Let me explain.

An email to your legislators may result in a form letter response and a phone call to the office may amount to a tally mark on an administrative assistant's notepad.

But, if you want to get their attention, a letter to the editor published in one of your state's 5-10 biggest newspapers that mentions them specifically BY NAME is the way to go.

That is the crucial thing to know--the rest of this comment is an explanation of why I know this is true.

I know this because, when I interned in the D.C. office of a senator one summer, one of the duties I shared was preparing a document that was distributed internally both online and in paper format. This document was made every day and comprised world news articles, national news, state news, and any letters to the editor in the 5-10 largest newspapers within the senator's home state that mentioned him by name. I was often the person who put that document on his desk, and it was the first thing he read every morning after arriving to the office.

I began to suspect that this was standard operating procedure because several other senators' offices share the same printer in the basement of the Russell Senate Office building, and I saw other interns doing the exact same procedures that I was involved in.

Since the internship, I've conferred with other Senate and House employees past and present and determined that most--if not all--offices use essentially the same procedure.

Obviously calling is still a good idea but I think this is a nice addition. I also think that a continued onslaught will be necessary. A single push for a single day might raise an eyebrow but if these phone calls, emails and letters to the editor persist over time we'll have the best odds.

here is a link to make it easy.
https://thedaywefightback.org/?r=eff

try visiting the site from your cell and it will link you directly to the call center and you just enter your zip code, it will pull up your senator and representative and you dont have to dial a thing. so easy!

This time in history is beginning to look eerily similar to those days pre-Revolution era. Government continually putting laws in effect that the citizens do not agree to, citizens trying to stand up using non-violent means, non-violent means prove useless, radicals start to rise up suggesting violent revolution because it is the only thing that will work, you know the rest. We waited too long for the government to get out of line, I mean we practically asked for most of this shit to happen. Won't surprise me a bit of things escalate beyond peaceful protest in the future, the powers at be in the government have no intention of backing down, especially when its people are such a soft and easy target now that violence and masculinism have been demonized, along with our damn near only protective measure, guns. I used to shove most of this shit off as hyperbolic nonsense, I've never been one for conspiracy theories. However, enough evidence is mounting now that, even though the government may not be guilty of a lot of the bullshit theories out there, it's too much to ignore. Not to mention society taking this kind of turn was so easily foreseeable that multiple books have been written, even up to and over a century ago, playing with our ever progressing situation as a future scenario.

Originally Posted by snoop

This time in history is beginning to look eerily similar to those days pre-Revolution era. Government continually putting laws in effect that the citizens do not agree to, citizens trying to stand up using non-violent means, non-violent means prove useless, radicals start to rise up suggesting violent revolution because it is the only thing that will work, you know the rest. We waited too long for the government to get out of line, I mean we practically asked for most of this shit to happen. Won't surprise me a bit of things escalate beyond peaceful protest in the future, the powers at be in the government have no intention of backing down, especially when its people are such a soft and easy target now that violence and masculinism have been demonized, along with our damn near only protective measure, guns. I used to shove most of this shit off as hyperbolic nonsense, I've never been one for conspiracy theories. However, enough evidence is mounting now that, even though the government may not be guilty of a lot of the bullshit theories out there, it's too much to ignore. Not to mention society taking this kind of turn was so easily foreseeable that multiple books have been written, even up to and over a century ago, playing with our ever progressing situation as a future scenario.

I still think we can handle the outrageous situation with votes, but a lot of waking up is going to have to happen for us to get there. I think we have a good system but a bunch of bad laws and bad politicians. We need to drastically rearrange Congress for the better and elect a president who honors the Bill of Rights. I think everything would be all right if we would do that. We just have two political parties that work like cults, and dedication to those cults has allowed the cult leaders to get away with way too much.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

I still think we can handle the outrageous situation with votes, but a lot of waking up is going to have to happen for us to get there. I think we have a good system but a bunch of bad laws and bad politicians. We need to drastically rearrange Congress for the better and elect a president who honors the Bill of Rights. I think everything would be all right if we would do that. We just have two political parties that work like cults, and dedication to those cults has allowed the cult leaders to get away with way too much.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it can't be handled peacefully, I was saying that the radicals say that it can't be. That was my fault, I probably should have worded it better.

Originally Posted by snoop

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it can't be handled peacefully, I was saying that the radicals say that it can't be. That was my fault, I probably should have worded it better.

Oh, no problem. I was just saying what I think about it. There are definitely lots of people out there who think we are past the point of being able to handle the problem peacefully.

Our forefathers knew that a time would come that "the people" may rise up again, and they thought it may be healthy. Who knows what the future holds for this country, but I made those phone calls yesterday. I'm glad I did because it is just one little step I made for the better, not just for myself, but for others as well.

Well - good luck with this people!!
But I am afraid, this surveillance everywhere scenario looks inevitable - also in Europe and basically where ever the money for such a thing can be mobilized by the powers that are in control - almost no matter, who these powers are.
It's technically so easily possible - this sort of control is irresistible to those talking themselves into only being concerned about the security of those innocent ones, who after all have noo reason to object to it, if they don't do wrong...
But do what you can by all peaceful means!
To the windmills!!

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

I still think we can handle the outrageous situation with votes, but a lot of waking up is going to have to happen for us to get there. I think we have a good system but a bunch of bad laws and bad politicians.

The time for voting has come and gone. You're about 30 years behind the times, if not longer.

It's a repeat of the 50's - where the masses are distracted by their own decadence - and we're transitioning into a repeat of the radical 1960's - where a small segment of society begins to take action and causes a ripple effect. Radicalism (not armed militancy, but a conscious shift in the socio-political paradigm) is on the rise, and all the nation needs now are it's MLK's and Malcolm X's, it's Huey Newton's and Bobby Seale's - leaders that will galvanize the public and kick-start a new cultural movement.

Even my local library's "Political" section has books full of second-hand notes penciled in by clear-cut radicals. The autobiography of Malcolm X, books on the Black Panthers, Nelson Mandela, activism, etc are becoming increasingly hard to get a hold of because they're suddenly being checked out much more frequently than they were a few years ago.

Hopefully the "hell's angels" and "hippies" of today can strike a deal and work together. We're still vulnerable to divide and conquer and blaming those in the fight with us for our failures.

Originally Posted by GavinGill

It's a repeat of the 50's - where the masses are distracted by their own decadence - and we're transitioning into a repeat of the radical 1960's - where a small segment of society begins to take action and causes a ripple effect. Radicalism (not armed militancy, but a conscious shift in the socio-political paradigm) is on the rise, and all the nation needs now are it's MLK's and Malcolm X's, it's Huey Newton's and Bobby Seale's - leaders that will galvanize the public and kick-start a new cultural movement.

Even my local library's "Political" section has books full of second-hand notes penciled in by clear-cut radicals. The autobiography of Malcolm X, books on the Black Panthers, Nelson Mandela, activism, etc are becoming increasingly hard to get a hold of because they're suddenly being checked out much more frequently than they were a few years ago.

I hope you're right, except for the Malcolm X part. He was a racist pig until his final days.

Originally Posted by Original Poster

Hopefully the "hell's angels" and "hippies" of today can strike a deal and work together. We're still vulnerable to divide and conquer and blaming those in the fight with us for our failures.

I think things might get so insane that we have a backlash many times bigger than the hippy movement ever got. The gun rights threats we are dealing with in addition to everything else are going to get the rednecks on the same team with the hippies.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

I hope you're right, except for the Malcolm X part. He was a racist pig until his final days.

I suggest you read up some more on the man, because that's pretty far from the truth.





He had no problem whatsoever with white folks (he was voted as class president despite being the only black kid in his classes, stayed in a foster home with white folks, had a white girlfriend, countless white friends, etc. It wasn't until he landed in prison for robbery (which was only supposed to get him 2-3 years... but because he was with a white woman, he was hit with multiple 8-10 year sentences running concurrently), that his views on white people changed. In prison, he was convinced to join the Nation of Islam - a Black supremacy group. Since the members of this group managed to reform him from a violent criminal to an upright man of unflinching moral fortitude, he accepted anything they said. He worshiped the leader of the group, Elijah Mohamed, as if he was his own father and hung on his every word.

And since that man taught Malcolm hateful rhetoric, Malcolm repeated it without question (which is why he would constantly say "The Honorable Elijah Mohamed teaches us..." every few sentences). After members of the Nation Of Islam turned on Malcolm out of jealousy, and Malcolm found out that Elijah wasn't following the moral teachings he was preaching, he was silenced for 90 days. Malcolm realized he was being set up and left the Nation, and promptly went on a pilgrimage to Mecca.

Upon arriving there, he reshaped his entire worldview once he realized that the brand of "Islam" that the Nation Of Islam was teaching had almost nothing to do with authentic Islamic teachings. He dined and prayed with people of all colors while in Mecca, making special note of the White people with him, and returned to America with an fresh new perspective on race relations.

Post-Mecca Malcolm was not a racist. Not by any means. Post-Mecca Malcolm was the prime example of what we should all aspire to be - a self-sacrificing individual willing to question and re-examine his own stance on any given issue, learn from his mistakes, and make a commitment to rectify those mistakes and past failures. This idea that Malcolm was some sort of fire-breathing Black supremacist was the result of the American media's constant slandering and manipulation. Very little emphasis is placed on post-Mecca Malcolm whenever his name is mentioned in classrooms, and too much emphasis is place on the Malcolm from the Nation Of Islam. It's nothing more than character assassination (similar to what goes on with the Black Panthers of the 1960's - covering up all the positives by burying them with negative falsehoods).

Malcolm X was the spark of resistance that gave rise to American revolutionaries like Huey Newton, Bobby Seale, H. Rap Brown, Stokely Carmichael, Angela Davis, Eldridge Cleaver, the Black Panthers, the White Panthers, and countless student radicals on college and university campuses all across America during the 60's and 70's.
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Originally Posted by Universal Mind

I think things might get so insane that we have a backlash many times bigger than the hippy movement ever got. The gun rights threats we are dealing with in addition to everything else are going to get the rednecks on the same team with the hippies.

I don't think the problem is whether or not people will band together and push for change - it's almost inevitable that they will. The main problem right now, is that most folks are ignorant of the politics of revolution. They don't understand the process. You have liberals that think the best way to deal with it is with picket signs and marches, and conservatives that are gearing up for armed combat.

Not even Gandhi or MLK were in favor of this pacifist hippie shit that passes for "activism" these days, but liberals constantly cite "non-violence" as the answer. Even Nelson Mandela's legacy was tainted by this nonsense - people claiming that he sparked change through wholly peaceful means and that that's the only way to bring about positive change. People don't know how to organize efficiently and effectively, what MLK and Gandhi meant by "non-violence," what Malcolm X meant by self-defense, etc. I think the biggest threat to this potential North American uprising, is the likelihood of it being hijacked but the largely ignorant masses (just like what happened in Egypt).

The whole process of dissent in America needs to be reworked and reformed, the people need to be educated with intelligent means of resistance.

Malcolm X did recant on his racist ideology near the end of his life, but he is famous for what he did when he was a racist. He did some good things, but I still can't think too highly of who he was when he did. I don't think there is ever a good excuse for hating an entire race.

I think our current political crisis can be solved nonviolently, and I think it has to start with mass information. We can't do anything until enough people are aware of what is going on. We have a pretty apathetic country right now. I think the truth will become obvious to the masses in time. If you speak the truth on the internet, at a protest march, or even by just talking to your friends, you are doing your part.

I think it's important not to call it a day just for participating in one push. Rather than growing cynical from the fact that so many are apathetic or ignorant, grow optimistic that so many are so dedicated to the cause, comrade!

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Malcolm X did recant on his racist ideology near the end of his life, but he is famous for what he did when he was a racist. He did some good things, but I still can't think too highly of who he was when he did. I don't think there is ever a good excuse for hating an entire race.

Conversely, I would suggest that having the rationality and the bravery to recognise your moral code was deeply flawed, and then changing it, is the epitome of goodness.

Everybody makes mistakes. What's important is that you rectify them. What would you suggest instead? Blindly sticking to your guns?

Originally Posted by Xei

Conversely, I would suggest that having the rationality and the bravery to recognise your moral code was deeply flawed, and then changing it, is the epitome of goodness.

Everybody makes mistakes. What's important is that you rectify them. What would you suggest instead? Blindly sticking to your guns?

Did I say that I think recanting was a bad thing?

George Wallace was the white racist governor of Alabama for four terms. Have you seen Forrest Gump? Do you remember the Alabama governor who tried to stand in the way of the first black student going to the University of Alabama? That governor was George Wallace. He opposed the civil rights movement at every turn. However, he ended up changing his tune.

George Wallace - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"In the late 1970s, Wallace announced that he was a born-again Christian and apologized to black civil rights leaders for his past actions as a segregationist. He said that while he had once sought power and glory, he realized he needed to seek love and forgiveness. In 1979, Wallace said of his stand in the schoolhouse door: "I was wrong. Those days are over, and they ought to be over."

Forgiving him is one thing, and praising him is another. Do you think George Wallace should be remembered as a hero? He ended up doing the right thing, but he is famous for being a racist.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Malcolm X did recant on his racist ideology near the end of his life, but he is famous for what he did when he was a racist. He did some good things, but I still can't think too highly of who he was when he did. I don't think there is ever a good excuse for hating an entire race.

Genocide and systematic dehumanization perpetrated by the majority against the minority may not be a "good reason" but, realistically speaking, that is going to be the end result. And it was arguably necessary; it wasn't until Malcolm X started speaking that ethnic minorities lost their inferiority complex and stopped idolizing and worshiping White folks, and White folks let go of their superiority complex. The only reason we have racial harmony (for the most part) today, is because of that paradigm shift that he sparked. Not even MLK was able to spark that kind change.

I see where you're coming from, but regardless of the negativity behind his reactionary rhetoric (I won't call it racist, given the socio-political climate of the times), it was his words that set off the ideological eruption that America needed at the time. Even MLK respected Malcolm's stance, and had agreed to join forces with him (MLK taking the South, with Malcolm taking the North). But again, I understand your position.
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As for non-violent resistance, I think it can work... but only if people take it to the next level. Protest marches and talking to your friends is a good place to start, but to really get the ball rolling, I think we have to start studying the organizational practices across the globe. Take the Occupy protests for example - many of the tactics used by American news media and politicians were a repeat of what happened in China during the Tienanmen Square protests, even the newspaper coverage was similar (eg. false accusations of protesters hurling shit at police officers, a ploy used to paint the activist in a negative light).

Colleges and universities need to get involved too, they played a pivotal part in the 60's. People need to be made aware of the surveillance that occurs on the campuses of post-secondary institutions (FBI on American campuses and RCMP on Canadian campuses); once folks recognize how far our governments are willing to go to police the political thoughts of the public, it could spark a righteous outrage.

There's a documentary called "Terms and Conditions May Apply" which explains in greater depth how you're essentially followed across the web. One story mentioned a Father complaining to Target for flooding his monthly brochure with birth control advertisements and potentially influencing his daughter to have sex. In reality the advertisers already knew she was pregnant due to her web browsing history.