Thread: "The US Does Not Torture"

Originally Posted by Oneironaught

The only other alternative is to require that we receive an answer for every question posed. I'm sorry but not everything has to be answered just because the question is raised.

Not every question raised has to be answered but, in being a representative of the people, it is an incumbent's obligation to treat us with some sort of intellectual respect, as a nation. Don't lie to us and tell us that you're doing something you're not, or not doing something that you are, because we're "too stupid" to handle the information as a nation and opine on it. Such a governmental position can be argued as "totalitariansim."

Originally Posted by Oneironaught

I agree that they should have just used the answer "it's classified information". But even then, there will be people who consider that the same thing as lying to us because they think they have a right to know the answer.

That is a part of living in a democratic society, I'm afraid. EVERYONE has a voice, even if it's not the voice you like. (and I use "you" in reference to the Administration)

Originally Posted by Oneironaught

Now, the media is utterly dominated by Liberal spin and rhetoric. Conservative, such as myself, get a few lonely voices and suddenly we're "shutting every one out". I don't see it that way at all.

Not prejudice: the other side of the story. Or, as I like to call it: "the truth".

Exactly, that's why we need the views of the likes of Fox, Sean Hannity, Rush Limbaugh, and Glenn Beck. By the way, Glenn Beck is on a network that's also dominated by the Liberal side of things (HNN).

So a few voices of balance are certainly not an overpowering, stifling of the left, as the left want us to believe.

Now that explains a lot. I am not a "left wing liberal" by any definition of the term, but I'm going to disagree with a lot of that. As someone that watches FOXNews, how often do you actually watch the other networks, as opposed to simply hearing about what they are doing from FOX? I, ritualistically, switch off between (mainly) FOX, MSNBC and CNN (by HNN, do you mean "HeadlineNewsNetwork?") and I can tell you that there are many more moderates (at least on CNN) than you give credit for. I had this same stance - though I may not have voiced it - when UM said that FOXNews is the "least biased" news network around. This was, simply, laughable to me.

I look at all media with the same sort of scrutiny, and see the stories raised much more than the views expressed on those stories. If you actually spend a day or two at a time watching each network, then you'll see many of them (like CNN which is the one I do spend the most time watching) are equally critical of both sides of the spectrum. They are hard on both sides, whereas FOX has puppet "advocates" of the left (Such as Alan Combs), set amongst a slew(sp) of hardline far-right-wingers. Most of the people on CNN (at least, I know MSNBC has a little more liberal bias) are equaly as hard on both sides, and they actually bring advocates that can competently argue both sides, to a debate. "Conservativism" is not exclusive to the likes of FOXNews. Many, now, would call much of the voices of FOXNews and the like "NeoCons," unlike Conservative representative Ron Paul, who has been equally just as shunned by FOXNews as any liberal, even though he seems to be a very grass-roots republican. FOX is the epitomy of right-wing, and the people that they bring on to argue the other side are so incompetent that even I, some average mofo that just sits back and watches, will often look at them like "WTF is wrong with you?? " In my eyes, the whole premise of FOXNews being "fair and balanced" is an absolute joke.

(And I'm sorry for the rant. This is neither here nor there, in relation to this discussion, but simply my response to your generalization that FOXNews represents not only the "opposite of left-wing" but "The Truth." I'm not here to argue which network is better, or even which political party is better, just on where we stand in regards to the Administration having the right to lie to the American people.)

On a side note, a lot of the people argueing against the government keeping secrets and torturing people are Conservatives.

Let me just state that I rarely watch Fox (FNN), mainly because I only have so much time in a day. Plus, I get so burnt out from hearing politics all day long. So I can't really vouch for all of their programming. But I'd choose them over, say, ABC or NBC, as they seem to have some level of balance. Honestly, they all seem to be reading the same Associated Press crap releases. In other words, ready-made Liberal talking points.

But most of my news is sourced from Conservative talk radio, CNN and BBC. I only really watch Glenn Beck on HNN (and sometimes Nancy Grace, but she's so forceful that I tire of her quickly). And on Fox (FNN), I watch Sean Hannity sometimes. Usually, I just catch Hannity's radio show because Alan Combs (or is it Colmbs? Not sure now.) make me want to kill babies.

Now, I used to listen to both Conservation AND Liberal talk radio. There just aren't any Liberal talk shows on that I have access to anymore. I certainly saw eye to eye much more with the Conservatives stance though. I was a regular listener of Alan Combs' show, Barry Farber and a local Liberal, Nick Ashton (though I forget now which side of the fence Barry Farber was on. It's been so long). My point is simply that I didn't just choose my side on a whim. I gave both sides a very fair shake for several years.

As far as my local Fox affiliate (Fox 13) goes: they're a bunch of ass-kissing puppets whom I can't stand to watch. They seem to be involved in a lot of the same pandering as the other mainstream media outlets.

Originally Posted by Oneironaut

(by HNN, do you mean "HeadlineNewsNetwork?")

Yes.

PS: My reference to "truth and balance" in my previous post is in reference to Conservative media in general because there isn't nearly as much right wing media as there is left-leaning.

Ok. Fair enough. And I think it is actually Alan Colmbs, I just wasn't sure on the spelling at the time, just the pronuncication. But to stay away from the network vs. network, I'll simply say that, if you listen to the media, continued to listen to both sides (whenever possible). I think it's dangerous to listen to only one side, and it's only when you listen, habitually, to both sides that you hear the faults of each.

And I can't stand Nancy Grace. Haha. She is (what they'd call in the movie industry as) an over-actor, and it gets on my nerves. Heh.

[Edit: I'm watching it now and it's actually Colmes. Go figure. Haha.]