Thread: Salvia divinorum banned in Illinois... Why????

Happy new year! New Year's Day 2008 marks the beginning of Schedule 1 classification of salvia divinorum, a hallucinogenic plant that is nonlethal and nonaddictive, in the U.S. state of Illinois. It is now a FELONY to possess this menace that the proponents of the bill have not been able to tell any serious stories about. The people of Illinois are safe at last! Just check out the intensely backed up rationale of the genius ban loving sheriff in this article...

http://www.14wfie.com/global/story.asp?s=7544430

Here is a Wikipedia article about salvia divinorum, and down the page it talks about Illinois politicians who supported the ban. Notice the brilliant logic they use, or would use if they actually gave a solid reason for the ban based on examples and not bizarre speculations based on flat out ignorance.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salvia_divinorum

Since those politicians are apparently incapable of making solid arguments for why they made it a FELONY to possess something that has been legal all these centuries and has not been causing problems, maybe somebody else can make the argument for them. I would love to know what it is. Just pop open a beer, smoke some cigarettes, get heart disease from your daily Big Macs, and explain why people should go to prison for possession of salvia divinorum.

WHAT? SALVIA?

Too freaking bad just like you said, it's perfectly SAFE. And what they're saying is bullshit. Salvia does not have the properties of LSD; it's much more distinct and far less intense. It's also not addictive.

This just shows people are willing to ban ANYTHING that gives freedom of expression and thought. And that granda saying she'd be upset her daughter had access to it? Yes, because all she's been told is "it's a drug that causes a high." You know, just like caffeine, sugar, tea, etc.

It's funny how something that can do no harm to you (Salvia) is as illegal as Heroin. I'm very upset with Illinois.

Originally Posted by Last paragraph of the article

In November after 14 News first reported salvia's effects, Indiana representative Dennis Avery said he would research the substance to possibly take action against it

Another example of how the media influences law in this country, holding our freedom and liberties in their control. Just a matter of time before this spreads to other states.

Defiantly safe. I have tryed is and eveything was alright except that the bonfire turned into an aquarium with fish in it, but thats about it. If it wasn't safe they probally wouldn't sell it at my local convenice store.

It's also somewhat unpleasant--fascinating, but not something you want to do every day.

Hmmm. An argument for why Salvia should be illegal. Well, the notion of the brain having electrical activity consitent with a wakeful state BUT being cut-off from sensory input does indeed sound dangerous to me. Why ... that would cause hallucinations.

Wait, holy crap - isn't that basically what happens when you're dreaming.

I need to contact Gov Rod immediately. We need to outlaw dreaming ASAP.

Originally Posted by b12

WHAT? SALVIA?

Too freaking bad just like you said, it's perfectly SAFE. And what they're saying is bullshit. Salvia does not have the properties of LSD; it's much more distinct and far less intense. It's also not addictive.

This just shows people are willing to ban ANYTHING that gives freedom of expression and thought. And that granda saying she'd be upset her daughter had access to it? Yes, because all she's been told is "it's a drug that causes a high." You know, just like caffeine, sugar, tea, etc.

It's funny how something that can do no harm to you (Salvia) is as illegal as Heroin. I'm very upset with Illinois.

I'd never argue salvia is less intense than LSD, although that is subjective. I'd say it has a greater relative harm potential than LSD. I've done both many times, and only on salvia have I actually lost all conception of reality, and acted in an erratic way, and not out of fear.
Neither is particularly harmful either way, when used properly.

Originally Posted by MrBeelzy

I'd never argue salvia is less intense than LSD, although that is subjective. I'd say it has a greater relative harm potential than LSD. I've done both many times, and only on salvia have I actually lost all conception of reality, and acted in an erratic way, and not out of fear.
Neither is particularly harmful either way, when used properly.

For me, salvia is about the most intense substance out there, but that is because I have not done DMT. It usually makes me see muppets trying to manipulate the fabric of reality in order to destroy reality. That might make it sound really freaky to some people, but it makes me realize that there is no way I would even think of driving a car on it. I don't even think I could find my car while on that stuff. I probably don't really even understand what a car is while on salvia. I lose all sense of up, down, left, right, here, there, forward, and backward. All I can do is just sit there and be still until the trip ends after ten minutes. Very basic knowledge of what that stuff does makes it very safe for virtually anybody. It just creates a crazy ten minute lucid dream.

Why don't we all get together (all like everyone not banning these things) and throw these people off a bridge and change the law? Free hallusinations for everyone! the world trips on Salvia, and DMT and the world is sane again. Seriously, ban booze while you're at it, hell ban fatty foods, and actually ban food all together and anything drinkable so we die of thirst and hunger so they can play amung themselves with free everything. This is all because they want us dead and they want tax free ferrarri's, and tons and tons of money, and stuff. It's all about them, they are thinking of their own needs when we all die from their a few thousand year old plan to slowly wipe us out from hunger, and thirst. Who's left to make them work for a living, or tell them it costs this much? Strike now while you can still eat and drink, for that will change in a few thousand years.

Probably because the high potency extracts can cause a more intense trip than LSD. Since LSD is illegal, they thought it would be good to make salvia illegal.... I dunno, that's my guess. I still haven't heard of any injuries or deaths from it, but I don't research salvia much. I hate that shit with a passion. Don't get me wrong though, it should be legal. I just don't enjoy the trips or get anything positive from them + They are usually physically painful for me...

Shrooms, LSD, and DMT FTW!!!

salvia can be more intense than lsd but it only lasts 5 mins

People don't like the idea of having a society in which people can (excuse my words) abuse substance. Savlia is harmless, but not in the eyes of a worried mother.

Originally Posted by AmazeO XD

People don't like the idea of having a society in which people can (excuse my words) abuse substance. Savlia is harmless, but not in the eyes of a worried mother.

Mothers should worry about their sons and daughers going to prison for undeserved reasons.

I agree. But, you know how it is

I'd rather get high and answer.

Haven't you heard the number 1 rule in parenting/ governing? Always control the things that your children/people might enjoy doing that have no practical application to society as a whole. With your children, this generally applies to limiting what T.V. your child watches and how much. With governing, this means putting restrictions on certain things; like drug use and certifications for dangerous, yet exhilarating sports.

What people don't realize is; one of the reasons why the government feels the need to do this, is because the parents push them to limit the things they are incapable or unwilling to limit themselves.

California has a hearing on January 15th I believe. If it goes illegal in California I'd say the rest of the states will just quickly follow suit and by the end of 2008 it'll be banned from the entire US.

It failed 3 to 2 (3 no, 2 yes) in March 2007 - I'm not sure how the voting system is setup, whether it's majority wins, or unanimous only...

Originally Posted by blade5x

California has a hearing on January 15th I believe. If it goes illegal in California I'd say the rest of the states will just quickly follow suit and by the end of 2008 it'll be banned from the entire US.

It failed 3 to 2 (3 no, 2 yes) in March 2007 - I'm not sure how the voting system is setup, whether it's majority wins, or unanimous only...

I hope this outrageous hysteria will be used by war on drugs activists a lot in the future to illustrate the kind of mind set behind such laws. This one guy committed suicide and was on alcohol, acne medication with negative psychological side effects, and salvia divinorum, and he had a messed up childhood and suffered from depression. So the legislators from a lot of states look at that big picture and pick out just salvia divinorum, say nothing bad about the horribly deadly substance alcohol, the screwed up acne medicine, or the guy's depression, and decide to make it a FELONY to possess something nonlethal and nonaddictive. In Delaware, they even named the new law after the guy. That is so insane. I have been saying for years that it is that type of thinking behind the illegality of a lot of other drugs. This situation can be used as a great example when arguing against the prohibition of those other drugs.

If it goes illegal in California I'd say the rest of the states will just quickly follow suit and by the end of 2008 it'll be banned from the entire US.

God damnit, I just bought a bong water pipe! <sigh>, I'm sure someone will find some other sage to take it's place, no?


It's just so messed up how something I saw being sold in a record store today is actually a felony to posses in a nearby state!

http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_vi...ml?id=3294888n

Aside from what you me or anyone else thinks we can get out of salvia, Have you witnessed this type of behavior?
If you have:
Do you care if someone exhibited this behavior while taking a hit behind the wheel?
If you have or some day, have a child, would you particiapate in taking salvia with them?

Just curious.
Trying to get more perspective.

Would you want to keep the drug legal, then through proper advice and education teach your children about this and other drugs?

Thanks.

Originally Posted by Howie

http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_vi...ml?id=3294888n

Aside from what you me or anyone else thinks we can get out of salvia, Have you witnessed this type of behavior?
If you have:
Do you care if someone exhibited this behavior while taking a hit behind the wheel?
If you have or some day, have a child, would you particiapate in taking salvia with them?

Just curious.
Trying to get more perspective.

Would you want to keep the drug legal, then through proper advice and education teach your children about this and other drugs?

Thanks.

Anybody with very basic knowledge of what salvia does, especially people who have experienced it before, would never dream of driving a car while on it. Also, people who are within minutes of having just smoked salvia are not going to be able to find their cars and would know that they are not in any condition to drive. But alcohol on the other hand... What did you say about bringing back alcohol prohibition?

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

Anybody with very basic knowledge of what salvia does, especially people who have experienced it before, would never dream of driving a car while on it. Also, people who are within minutes of having just smoked salvia are not going to be able to find their cars and would know that they are not in any condition to drive.

So we all have this basic knowledge? And none of us would dream of it.
They can't even find their car but are capable of realizing they cannot drive.
Ok.

But alcohol on the other hand... What did you say about bringing back alcohol prohibition?

I said nothing of bringing back alcohol prohibition!
I said it should be illegal. Hind site is always 20/20 isn't it? We saw that prohibition did not work.
What I said is, making an illegal drug legal is a lot different than making a legal drug illegal. But now that saliva is legal in some states this much better suites your argument. The drug still demonstrates the same effects.

http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_vi...ml?id=3294888n

Aside from what you me or anyone else thinks we can get out of salvia, Have you witnessed this type of behavior?
If you have:
Do you care if someone exhibited this behavior while taking a hit behind the wheel?
If you have or some day, have a child, would you particiapate in taking salvia with them?

Just curious.
Trying to get more perspective.

Would you want to keep the drug legal, then through proper advice and education teach your children about this and other drugs?

Thanks

Edit:
I could find posts like I did above all day long. Blogs, own experiences and the like, all for you to more than likely say they are not credible. You yourself said "they don't know jack shit about salvia & morning glory." They do know a lot about aspirin. Can you connect the dots? You want "real life" example. Man, I don't know what you call real life, I'm in it Sir. With that in mind, I have put forth the basis, a very concise compilation of realistic, comprehensive and Logic premise to this argument.

We can still use our ability to reason in the face of the ever present danger of our dwindling liberties.
Reason: using sound judgment; good sense, normal or sound powers of mind; sanity.

Good day.

Originally Posted by Howie

http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_vi...ml?id=3294888n

Aside from what you me or anyone else thinks we can get out of salvia, Have you witnessed this type of behavior?
If you have:
Do you care if someone exhibited this behavior while taking a hit behind the wheel?
If you have or some day, have a child, would you particiapate in taking salvia with them?

Just curious.
Trying to get more perspective.

Would you want to keep the drug legal, then through proper advice and education teach your children about this and other drugs?

Thanks.

Witnessing that horrifically misinformed report, I'm pretty sure salvia is going the way of cannabis and LSD, because it's a freebie crusade for politicians. Classifying salvia as having "high potential for abuse" is nonsensical--few people who try it will ever repeat the experience, and I've never heard of anyone using it often. I'd be interested to know how often the suicide kid actually used salvia. The only way I could see salvia getting truly popular is in response to a prohibition.

Most of the points in the video seemed like almost deliberate misinformation. Does it correlate with depression? There's no evidence, and if it gets classified Schedule One, we'll never know. Are teenagers using it? All they showed us were Youtube videos, most if not all of which showed adults in their own dorms/apartments. Do we want people driving around on this stuff? Wtf? Given the duration and effects of this substance, as well as the techniques required to get an effective dose, you would have to be a suicidal acrobat to even try it.

If they're able to access Youtube, they could at least have taken two minute to look over the single most read document on salvia.

Originally Posted by Howie

So we all have this basic knowledge? And none of us would dream of it.
They can't even find their car but are capable of realizing they cannot drive.
Ok.

Anyone who knows enough about salvia to go out and buy it does have this knowledge, yes. And as for your second sentence, just read it again, man. I understand you don't know how this substance operates, but we're telling you, they will not be capable of forming the notion of driving their car until well after the effects have passed.

As for doing it with your kids, again it's not a party drug, it's not "fun." You can't really share the trip. But I would advise my hypothetical kids or my actual nephew about the same on any hallucinogen: I'd give them all the information I could, recommend they wait until they're an adult to avoid developmental complications, and recommend they take up meditation instead.

Anyone who knows enough about salvia to go out and buy it does have this knowledge, yes. And as for your second sentence, just read it again, man. I understand you don't know how this substance operates, but we're telling you, they will not be capable of forming the notion of driving their car until well after the effects have passed.

As for doing it with your kids, again it's not a party drug, it's not "fun." You can't really share the trip. But I would advise my hypothetical kids or my actual nephew about the same on any hallucinogen: I'd give them all the information I could, recommend they wait until they're an adult to avoid developmental complications, and recommend they take up meditation instead.

Ok then.
To the contrary I DO know... Thanks for the assumption. There is another thread you should check out. Why are drugs illegal? A lot of information towards both sides of this argument.
So anyone and everyone who uses salvia is the one who buys it?
You can't share a trip? Unique to each individual yes, but I do not agree.
Why mediation, if saliva is harmless?

Yes, about developmental complications. Thanks for bringing that up.
This is from psychology class. It was years ago, it may not be in verbatum to what I had learned.
LSD and PCP for an example. Individuals who took some psychedelic drugs first come to the conclusion that they are widening or expanding their mind. In short, Becoming smarter. The drugs make up activates dendrites (small firing - communicating neurons) to branch out. This results in a biological and physical change of the brain. As these branch out, we witness abstract and developing new thoughts. When studies further the dendrites become mutated, this giving them the inability to grow and effectively communicate as they once did. Again, this information may not be right on the money. There is also information from the Harvard school of medication with regards to experiential studies in psychedelics.
This just came to my mind. How did all the "hippies" become burnouts?
Oh yes, flashbacks too.
Strict nine shivers. Do you know about those?

I am an Illinois resident. Sadly, I just experienced salvia divinorum for the first time in December, loved it, and now can no longer continue use. BLEH!

SALVIA is ILLEGAL for the SAME REASON PSILOCYBIN and its COMPONENTS are ILLEGAL.

Bill Hicks Explains it All... Skip to 1:00

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OeIv-i7aVwE



The Government does not want you to have this knowledge.