Thread: So simple you will cry.

Originally Posted by tommo

Hehe ok. Keep deluding yourself.

How am I deluding myself?

Energy isn't matter. It is energy. It is indivisble. This is a basic fact of physics.

No it's not. You keep saying the same thing over and over. It's not convincing anybody, especially yourself.

Universes are not made up of universes within universes, so in order for you to man up about a cube you would have to see it and tell someone that it was real and be the better person and shut up about it becuase there's really no such thing as "cubes" within the 'semi-atmosphere' within Earth bound territory.

Originally Posted by What??Me??

If everything in the universe is made of energy , why can't I power the t.v. with my fingers?

You can if you have a device that can overcome the coulomb barrier and fuse the atoms in your finger, and have a way to convert the liberated energy into useful work.

As for the energy issue, it's pretty fucking simple. Things are made of atoms. Einstein showed us that mass is energy, so instead of saying atoms have mass, we can say that atoms have "energy". So hydrogen has X joules of energy. Now, if you break an atom up into smaller parts like protons and electrons, then they each have energies. And if you break those up, the smaller particles also have energies, and so on. So you see, to ask what energy is made of is quite literally as stupid as asking what the "meter" is made of. It's a unit of measure. What does it measure? Distance from thermal equilibrium, ability to do work, and any number of other equivalent definitions.

Well at least someone can explain it.
I realise what you all mean by energy now. However my point still stands that energy is, more probably than not, made of something else.

petersonad - no idea what you just said.

Thomas Alva Edison: "I have not failed. I've just found 10000 ways that won't work."

Haha yeh Delphi just told me that I asked in the proverb a day thread. Oh well it's confirmed now thanx timothy

I was talking about the semi-atmosphere within Earth bound territory, supposedly. Basically a gay satanic fagot by the name of Adrian Hall who couldn't man up about his sexuality because no one cared to love him. Semi-atmospheres are soft satanic personalities instantly confused by nothing at all. Cubes are semi-circles within semi-circle which have no conclusion to them at all. That's why cubes in music aren't physical on Earth bound territory because there's no such thing at all. You skip b sharp and e sharp because it's only C natural and F . Sharps are not natural on earth bound territory because they are not physical to your eyelids, just only your etheric protein.

I only mention Adrian Hall becuase he's a good person and everyone should know who he is, Adrian Peterson which is me.

Originally Posted by tommo

Well at least someone can explain it.
I realise what you all mean by energy now. However my point still stands that energy is, more probably than not, made of something else.

petersonad - no idea what you just said.

Originally Posted by Timothy Paradox

Thomas Alva Edison: "I have not failed. I've just found 10000 ways that won't work."

Originally Posted by tommo

Haha yeh Delphi just told me that I asked in the proverb a day thread. Oh well it's confirmed now thanx timothy

Oh wait, what the hell!?

I totally thought I was replying to another thread about a certain LD technique, my bad. I mentioned that quote but I didn't no exactly what it was then you said it in here. hm

Originally Posted by tommo

Well at least someone can explain it.
I realise what you all mean by energy now. However my point still stands that energy is, more probably than not, made of something else.

No, you still don't get it. What are meters made of? What are degrees made of? What are liters made of? What are seconds made of? What are joules made of? Get it yet?

I get it perfectly. No reason that energy is the same.
It's obviously not just a way to measure something, since it's real.
Metres are just imaginary, you guys are saying energy is not.

Originally Posted by tommo

I get it perfectly. No reason that energy is the same.
It's obviously not just a way to measure something, since it's real.

No, it's not "real" in the sense you mean. It's a unit of measure.

Upon reading this whole thread, my head feels like its about to explode.

Brb in two years when ive finished my basic physics course

It's obviously not just a way to measure something, since it's real.
...
Metres are just imaginary, you guys are saying energy is not.

Metres aren't imaginary. They are units of measure to define length, a physical quality, an attribute to objects. We defined the metre. That's different from saying they are 'imaginary'.

Just like length, energy is an attribute to objects. It is 'the ability to do work'. What do we mean by that? When we pull an elastic band, we add energy to it: it has the ability to do work, namely, to snap back to its original length when we let it go.
It is a measurable ATTRIBUTE to things. It can't be broken down. Just like 'length' can't be broken down... What's smaller than 'length'... 'Breadth'?

I don't now what you mean with 'energy is real', though. Length is real. Energy is real. Of course it is real. The measure with which we measure it might be defined by us humans, but that doesn't change the fact that physical things have 'the long dimension', just like they have 'the ability to do work'

How do you define 'energy'? What do you see in your mind when I say 'energy'?

Originally Posted by CryoDragoon

How do you define 'energy'? What do you see in your mind when I say 'energy'?

I have a sneaking suspicion he sees balls of plasma ala Dragonball Z.

Well I thought you were using the other 'real'. As in, not just a word put to something as a way to measure things.

I wouldn't say measurements are real. I mean, you don't find inches lying around. That's just stupid.

It's in our heads that something is a meter, or a kilometer. So I guess you're saying energy is a way of measuring the force something has, right?
Then none of you are on the same page. Some are saying it's the smallest and some are saying it's just a measurement. Because what is that measurement based on?
The meter is based on the length of path traveled by light in a vacuum over whatever millionths of a second.
So what is energy based on?

What I was seeing was akin to an acid trip where you would see the infamous "everything is made of energy". Somehow I don't think you're talking about that same thing though.

I have a sneaking suspicion he sees balls of plasma ala Dragonball Z.

I was thinking the exact same thing . Oh well...

It's in our heads that something is a meter, or a kilometer. So I guess you're saying energy is a way of measuring the force something has, right?
Then none of you are on the same page. Some are saying it's the smallest and some are saying it's just a measurement. Because what is that measurement based on?
The meter is based on the length of path traveled by light in a vacuum over whatever millionths of a second.
So what is energy based on?

Nope... Energy isn't the measure. It is the measured. It is the quality that we measure, remember? Just like length. You can't say 'this chair is five lengths long'. You say 'the length of this chair is two metres'. Likewise, you can't say 'this system contains five energies'. In stead, you should say 'the energy this system contains is fifty thousand joules.'

So, you can't say we use 'energy' to measure the force something has. In fact: the two are unrelated in this context. It is true that energy is needed to exert a force, but apart from that, they're unrelated.
The amount of force is measured in Newtons. We have joules and calories to act as a measure for energy. We use those to define how much energy a system has, how much it can 'act', so to say.

What I was seeing was akin to an acid trip where you would see the infamous "everything is made of energy".

I thought so.

Somehow I don't think you're talking about that same thing though.

I guess... In any case, the definition of energy, of today's physics, is 'the ability to do work'. It doesn't matter what kind of work, heat, electric, kinetic, chemical, even the potential work it could do, it doesn't matter. That's what energy is.
The. Ability. To. Do. Work.
And the measure in which it is measured is the joule.


Lightning, fire, and all the stuff people usually see when they think of 'energy' is simply energy which matter contains working and interacting with the matter in a very complicated way.

For example: a halogen lightbulb.
When we add (electric) energy to the lightbulb, electrons in the gas atoms move faster, and are able to temporarily 'escape' into another orbital. However, they are quickly pulled back in. We are left with the energy that we used to 'excite' the electron with. And where does the energy then go to? It is released as a photon. A light-particle.
See picture: (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...r-atom-PAR.svg)
The electron (green dot) is 'accelerated' and moves up to orbital n=3. But it is pulled back in to n=2. The energy used to initially move the electron from n=2 to n=3 is released (it has to go somewhere, right?), as a photon (the green wavy line).


I actually tried to look up exactly how that happens, why the energy is released as a photon and not as something else, how the photon is created from the energy, indeed, why the electron is pulled back to n=2 in the first place, but my brain exploded... I mean, seriously: "photons are absorbed in the time-reversed processes which correspond to those mentioned above"? Who the hell comes up with that? Major respect to all those geeks who figured that out.



Anyways... The reason people say 'energy is matter', is because matter is made out of subatomic particles, and because these subatomic particles are created through energy.
http://www.hep.princeton.edu/~mcdona...4/nytimes.html
Again, I tried to figure out myself how this exactly worked, but I gave up when I saw this:
"In physics, a quantum (plural: quanta) is an indivisible entity of a quantity that has the same units as the Planck constant and is related to both energy and momentum of elementary particles of matter (called fermions) and of photons and other bosons."

Originally Posted by Iminaluciddream

Another secret? There are no cubes in this universe,( not even in music skip bsharp esharp) but that is all we perceive, that's why it is un-percivable with out DRUGS

WHY DO YOU DENY TIME CUBE?!???

Originally Posted by tommo

Ahhhh no. I'm saying what is energy made of?

energy is like a property of a system. saying what is energy made of is like saying what is length made of or something.

Thats why that equilibrium idea made sense. Consciousness and universe go together like a positive and negative charge. You can't have one without the other.

What if you have consciousness and no universe. Then you just have empty space. And vice-versa. Why? Because "nothing" can't perceive "something" and something can't perceive "nothing"

Originally Posted by drewmandan

I have a sneaking suspicion he sees balls of plasma ala Dragonball Z.

lol

Ok so you're taling about the energy like Einstein talked about. Paraphrased "Everything has energy, a (whatever) could power the Earth forever if we can figure out how to release it's energy".
Anyway, I'm kinda done talking about this now. lol. Nothing coming out of it and the OP had nothing to do with it anyway.

Originally Posted by drewmandan

I have a sneaking suspicion he sees balls of plasma ala Dragonball Z.

KA ME HA ME HA!!!!!

Originally Posted by HaRd_WiReD

Thats why that equilibrium idea made sense. Consciousness and universe go together like a positive and negative charge. You can't have one without the other.

What if you have consciousness and no universe. Then you just have empty space. And vice-versa. Why? Because "nothing" can't perceive "something" and something can't perceive "nothing"

Don't you think it's a little arrogant to suggest that the "universe" needs "conciousness" to exist? So if the human race goes extinct every ceases to exist, or what?

No way.

Originally Posted by A Roxxor

Entropy is the movement of heat across a system. How does this make diorder favorable? If anything, it would indicate that heat works like a fluid-- Actively moving from areas of high concentration to low concentration.

I think you're confusing entropy with enthalpy. Entropy is a measure of disorder in a system. And at best any process can be reversible, meaning that no entropy is generated. But this is an ideal case, as energy is nearly always lost due to friction and other things, causing entropy (the disorder) to increase as the process happens. When something producing entropy happens, it cannot be run backwards (how do you reverse the effects of friction? You can't.) Heat does work like a fluid, and the measure of how much heat per mass something contains is called enthalpy.

Some say that entropy is the thermodynamic arrow of time, meaning that if as entropy increases, time also increases, so if you follow the path of increasing entropy, you are going forwards in time.

As time goes on, more disorder and chaos is created in the universe. This does seem a little weird, as systems tend to change from unstable configurations to stable ones. However the process by which all things change is what causes the disorder and chaos. If everything is assumed to at one time be in perfect order, yet has been constantly changing since then, it must be in a state of disorder.

Because things are created in unstable configurations all the time (through processes causing disorder), and everything that is created physically will eventually deteriorate (gradually lose energy and become more stable), each of which causing disorder, disorder is energetically favorable. The processes that occur all around us, all generate disorder, and occur all the time.

With a higher amount of energy, more structure, form, and order can be achieved. To lose any of this energy that is holding the system in such a complex, orderly form, will bring with it, a loss of order, in other words, increasing disorder.

Edit: I just realized there were 2 other pages of replies I hadn't yet read.

As for

Originally Posted by tommo

Ok so you're taling about the energy like Einstein talked about. Paraphrased "Everything has energy, a (whatever) could power the Earth forever if we can figure out how to release it's energy".

Everything does have energy, but everything does not have infinite energy. Mass is related to energy by the well known equation e=mc^2, implying a finite amount of energy associated with mass. So even if we could figure out how to release all the energy something has, it would not power the earth forever. Unless you're considering things such as stars, which clearly have enough energy to power the earth for a very long time, but still, even the energy in a star, if completely used up, will not last forever.

There seems to be some confusion over what energy is, or how we perceive it, or something along those lines. I think people have these defined pretty well already however, so I have nothing to add.

A student of Zen once asked his master what the great secret is. The master put his shoe on his head.