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    1. #1
      Member sheogorath's Avatar
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      Thinking

      Recently, i have noticed that people do not think that much. I never really payed much attention before, not until a conversation with a friend. It came up that i dont talk much. I dont, for many reasons. I have Kind of a mild Social Anxiety problem. not much, but i have trouble starting conversations and talking to people who change subjects a lot. In a way this is bad, because it leads to poor social skills, but it also leaves me time to just sit and think alot.

      My friend asked what i do when everyone is talking but me, and i was surprised. I just think. I asked him dont you ever just sit and think, and question the world, and what makes you human, and what are our thoughts and if they are really others implanted into us. he just kind of looked at me like i was crazy and said that i need talk more.

      But nobody ever just thinks. they always have to have something to do. Always everyone is playing video games (i love video games, but still) or watching TV.

      a different friend tells me i think too much about stuff. Is that possible? I would like to familiarize myself with as many possibility as possible, wouldn't you? before you talk to someone, should you not think of lasting consequences over the the words that you choose. Is not manipulation done by small and weak strikes that eventually shift the direction of the future?

      In that case, is "Social anxiety" REALLY a disadvantage, or is not having it a disadvantage. Am i over thinking, or are others under thinking?

      I dont mean to rant, but this has been on my mind for a while. It is easy to tell people who think alot. they have a certain appeal about them to me. It seems so shallow when people talk to simply entertain themselves and not for any information or thought or feeling.

      As a side note, dont you hate girls that act stupid( or maybe they really are stupid?) so that they seem attractive to guys. Just as bad are the guys that like this kind of behavior. I would rather have an intelligent conversation of philosophy than chat about how last night on WOW I did VOA 10m for the 100th time. ( i dont mean to offend, this just irks me) you would think that there would be and evolutionary trait to prevent this... but my theory of humanity screwing with our evolution is a whole different story, with the people with low IQs having more kids that those with high IQs and with no death rate due to humanity feeling the responsibility to feed the cancer...

      any way, tell me what you think, and like i said, i dont mean to offend anyone.

    2. #2
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      I think social anxiety is definitely a disadvantage..and it's unhealthy, and if left untreated can lead to things like depression, paranoid schizophrenia, stress, drug/alcohol abuse and other mental illnesses.

      You probably do think to much, I used to be the same way, actually I still am a bit introverted. I consider myself ambiverted now. You won't notice it, but thinking too much DOES cause you to pay less attention to the outside world.

      It is good to not think too much like your friends do. Living in the here and now is the best way to go about life. That's why Tibetan Monks do drema yoga, it makes you pay more attention to detail and the outside world. The point is to stop all thoughts and just be aware.

      When you are aware with no thoughts, socialiing wil be a snap because anything you say will be "how you feel" and it will come automatic....you won't have enough time to analyze it.

      There's a meditation exercise with a mandala I posted in the Beyond Dreaming section called "Sacred Geometry art: Opening the window to the soul". Take a look. Trust me, this is the best way to get women and bring the creative, imaginative, positive qualities out in you.

      http://dreamviews.com/community/showthread.php?t=87216
      Last edited by Majestic; 11-29-2009 at 12:00 AM.
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    3. #3
      Here, now Rainman's Avatar
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      I think both posters made good points. I think there should be a balance. Sheogorath, I agree with you that everyone seems to always be busy. Always with a need to do things, and fill up time. And there isn't anything wrong with that necessarily. Those people simply are what they are, which brings my next point.

      Hard_Wired is right too. To be socially anxious may indeed put you at a disadvantage, though not necessarily for the resulting behavior, but for the mindset behind the resulting behavior or lacktherof. Does that make sense?

      Someone who is perfectly at peace with his or herself who acts in a similar fashion as you, may simply just enjoy life enough to be able to fully appreciate it without having to "fill" up all of their time with "things" and actions.

      I think that's the point (correct me if I'm wrong) that Hard_Wired may have been trying to make. To make those same actions with a mindset of awkwardness or social anxiety will be percieved by other people.

      I must say that there should be balance. Overthinking things can lead to overanalyzing and making a situation or even a "thing" (object, person, etc) much more complex and confusing than it really is. Sometimes you can just allow yourself to take a step back from the reality you know, and just let things be. If in the present moment you feel like speaking, then you will. Make every action with the intent of just letting things be. That's my opinion.

    4. #4
      Member sheogorath's Avatar
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      I dont understand how you can not think of consequences. Maybe it is because of my father being a Cop, always telling me to think about everything before i act, or prehaps from an incident in 7th grade were something i said was greatly exaggerated and spread as a rumor that I stalked a girl. Still, Every time i start to do something, i think of possible consequences.

      here are some of the things i worry about, they may sound rediculous, but they HAVE happened to me before

      -What if i just go blank and cant think of anything to say
      -What if someone joins in the conversation and assumes the wrong thing
      -what if I say that I will do something that i really cant do.

      most of all, what if I say something that offends them, and they dislike me. At least in my group of friends, if one person dislikes someone, it eventually spreads.


      what about the philosophy part? do you think people ever think about all of that? or is that just me? Most people certainly dont talk about it

    5. #5
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      to put it bluntly, social anxiety is a state of mind: fear.

      Release the fear.

      So what if they don't like what you say, fuck it say it anyway if that's how you feel. Don't fight your feelings.

      What you say is what you feel, who has the right to tell you how you feel?
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    6. #6
      Here, now Rainman's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by HaRd WiReD
      to put it bluntly, social anxiety is a state of mind: fear.
      Hard Wired, there are a lot of areas in which you are very very wise. I really do recognize that.

      One of those areas is NOT psychology. Leave that to the people who've studied it in college and independantly for years.

      <--------

      I only say that because you're always so quick to decide for people that their conditions aren't valid. For all you know, sheogorath could have a pretty bad chemical imbalance in his brain that causes him to experience anxiety. Other people reach these points through social conditioning that have been anchored to them to cause them to feel a certain way as an automatic trigger acted out by the subconscious as a result of a past experience. On top of that, some of things you say to people if you don't know where they are coming from can actually be MORE damaging than having not said anything.

      I don't think that's the case here, but you never know. I know you've got good intentions, you've just really got to be careful how you phrase things. Sometimes it comes off as you devaluing other people's experiences, which makes them feel WORSE.

      Quote Originally Posted by HaRd_WiReD
      So what if they don't like what you say, fuck it say it anyway if that's how you feel. Don't fight your feelings.

      What you say is what you feel, who has the right to tell you how you feel?
      This I agree with entirely.

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      thanks Rainman, my intentions are always good.

      But what I'm saying is holistic..the big picture...you can analyze it anyway you want and the small details will lead you right to that big picture.

      Stop being scared? I don't really know a way to put it.....nicer?

      I say all this because i used to be socially anxious also, and it's best to get straight to the point. IMHO, I think when your feeling socially anxious, you need to breathe...I can't stress this enough, deep breathing relaxes you. You socialize best when your relaxed.

      Deep breathing is actually a therapy for hyperventilation and anxiety disorders.

      It's scary because most people naturally breathe shallow, and it causes you to stress, be anxious, get diseases, all kinds of shit, etc.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diaphragmatic_breathing

      Gorath, practice deep breathing....like breathe from your stomach, DEEP. It really does relax you, anyone who has ever WILDed can verify this.

      A perfect example, when i was younger i was at a "clubhouse" with some friends and the music playing. I didn't know how to dance that good and the music was playing..

      No ONE was dancing, everyone was just sitting down chilling, I just started dancing the way i knew best, they laughed at me for like 10 seconds and it was over, i was naturally more relaxed ever that and I dance all the time now.

      Nike says it best...just do it.

      Having someone laugh at you is actually a win-win situation: after they laugh, you feel better..more relaxed, and at the same time you're lifting everyone's else mood. They could be depressives, and you dancing is what makes them laugh and have a good time.
      Last edited by Majestic; 11-29-2009 at 01:37 AM.
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    8. #8
      Here, now Rainman's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by HaRd WiReD
      Stop being scared? I don't really know a way to put it.....nicer?
      Yeah, good point, lol.

      But you're a law of attraction guy! How about "start being... brave?" Idunno. Haha.

      I really agree about the breathing as well. Breathing specifically through your nose is a great way, in my opinion, to calm nerves quickly.

      Sheogorath, one of the things I noticed was that in your questions in your second post, you started them all with "what if."

      "What if" has lead a lot of people down a lot of bad roads. You cannot live in the future. Unless you've developed a method of traveling through time, you will always exist here and NOW in this progressively present moment. So take things from that perspective.

      As someone who posted a thread about how people don't think enough, you might consider this- You being someone who makes a lot of time to think, think hard enough to not think.

      Did I lose you?

      Think about everything in it's essence. Things are not what we make them. Whether we choose to make them into something or not, they simply are what they are. Choosing to label something as "good" or "bad" is just that- a choice.

      Your social situations in which you sit and think appear to me to be a biproduct of your anxiety. And that's a biproduct of thinking in the wrong ways. Just allow things to be. Again, things are not what we call them. That's just how we percieve them. That's like if I put on a pair of green-lensed glasses, and then declared that the entire world was green, I would be wrong, because the world to you may not be all green, and probably isn't.

      In that same way, saying something potentially embarassing is already putting on those green glasses. It's only embarassing if you choose to label it as such, and if you do, that's how you'll feel.

      Take some deep breathes, like Hard said, and just allow things to pass. If you choose to speak up, great! And if not, that's great too! Just as long as when you don't speak, it's not because you're afraid, but rather because you're simply enjoying things around you, and existing peacefully. Does that make sense?

    9. #9
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      But you're a law of attraction guy! How about "start being... brave?" Idunno. Haha.
      The law of attraction isn't about being brave..it's about being happy. If your happy you attract what you think about.

      Your social situations in which you sit and think appear to me to be a biproduct of your anxiety. And that's a biproduct of thinking in the wrong ways. Just allow things to be. Again, things are not what we call them. That's just how we percieve them. That's like if I put on a pair of green-lensed glasses, and then declared that the entire world was green, I would be wrong, because the world to you may not be all green, and probably isn't.

      In that same way, saying something potentially embarassing is already putting on those green glasses. It's only embarassing if you choose to label it as such, and if you do, that's how you'll feel.
      Wise words.
      Last edited by Majestic; 11-29-2009 at 02:01 AM.
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    10. #10
      Here, now Rainman's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by HaRd WiReD
      Quote Originally Posted by Rainman
      But you're a law of attraction guy! How about "start being... brave?" Idunno. Haha.
      The law of attraction isn't about being brave..it's about being happy. If your happy you attract what you think about.
      Right, but what I meant was that in the law of attraction, you must state goals in the positive, so to replace "stop being scared" I wrote "START being (insert positive word here)." Sorry, I worded it badly.

    11. #11
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      ok, so:

      "Start being happy"

      That's the solution to all problems.
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      Thinking is pointless.

      It's all about being a verb, not a noun.

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      If you can't stop and think about something, for 10 minutes or so. Then you go a problem. Thinking a lot generally isn't a bad thing, unless you do it so much that you never do anything. Though that is more being lazy than thinking to much. You can think a lot and be active or you can think a lot and be lazy. Goes either way.

      There are obvious problems with talking to much. The first one, is a lot of people come across as idiots for talking to much. Then a lot of people do get into a lot of trouble for gossiping and stuff. Don't gossip, and don't blurt things out. Its a good thing if you stop long enough to catch yourself from saying something stupid. Once it leaves your mouth, there is no taking it back.

      It is actually pretty common for people to be scared though. Normally its not for the reasosn you listed, but there are a lot of people who are scared or atleast nervous of talking to strangers. Its a common attitude that people are bad, so until you know them its best to avoid them. As opposed to most people are good, so you should talk freely with anyone you meet. The positive outlook, is probably closer to reality, while most people take the negative.

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      Member sheogorath's Avatar
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      Ok thanks for this, even though i didn't plan for the thread to go in this direction

      I will try to follow the advice, it is still just hard though. I dont know, It doesn't make any sense (my own behavior when it comes to Social Anxiety stuff) but when It comes down to it, i feel it, even though everyone for the past year or so has told me otherwise. It is pretty stupid, maybe It will just take some time. I am going to the dermatologist after Christmas, so maybe that will solve the acne. I think that might have some effects on self esteem and stuff.

      Anyway, thanks for the advice. I will try to fight my insanity

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      Quote Originally Posted by HaRd_WiReD View Post
      to put it bluntly, social anxiety is a state of mind: fear.

      Release the fear.

      So what if they don't like what you say, fuck it say it anyway if that's how you feel. Don't fight your feelings.

      What you say is what you feel, who has the right to tell you how you feel?
      Ahh yes I agree with this. If only it was that simple though. Fear's more like a prison than a simple feeling. All the rationalizing and logic in the world never helped me with my own fears, the mind's far too complex for that. What does seem to work is simply looking inward, watching yourself in action. Only an ongoing process of creative self-understanding will result in a jailbreak from fear. Some people meditate, some people get chemical assistance, some people have methods of their own. The method doesn't matter as long as it gets you there.

    16. #16
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      I used to have a hard time socializing also, a very hard time, i was really introverted, but you DO NOT need medication to combat this, it doesn't matter how depressed you are. You just stop being scared...it really is THAT simple. It can be something as easy as smiling, or laughing, it gets you out of the depressing mood. If you can't do that than there must be some kind of problems, like abuse or something as a child or depersonalization/derealization.

      But even still, weed cures all of that shit, because you hit the weed and forget all about that shit. I'm not condoning weed, but this is how i see it. Weed makes you focus on the "here and now", which is exactly what you should be doing anyway. Not being depressed about something that happened in the past.

      I think Big Pharma is a joke. I've been happy/positive every since I started reading mystical things. I havn't been sick yet. I havn't been sick for a while..maybe like 2 years or something.

      You'd be surprised, some of the nastiest diseases and ailments can be prevented just by breathing properly ( diaphragmatic breathing ). In FACT, this is WHY people get sick because they breathe shallow and it causes stress and all kinds of other shit. Your lungs NATURALLY clean themselves, the process speeds up once you breathe deeply.

      I know all of this because I almost had a massive panic attack my 2nd or 3rd time smoking weed. And I understand how all this depression and anxiety shit works now. Just breathe deep..relax and be happy. That's all. RELAX.

      Cheer up:




















      [edit]Another thing I wanted to bring up, look at video games and movies. Pay attention to how you breathe, their comes times when you stop breathing for like 5 or more seconds when you interact with video games and movies. This is not good. ESPECIALLY video games. Imagine this going on for years on end. Not saying games and t.v. are bad, but pay attention to how you breathe....shallow breathing is the leading causes to MOST if not ALL problems in life. [/edit]

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shallow_breathing
      http://www.holisticonline.com/Yoga/h...Importance.htm

      . If the brain does not gets proper supply of this essential nutrient, it will result in the degradation of all vital organs in the body.

      The brain requires more oxygen than any other organ. If it doesn't get enough, the result is mental sluggishness, negative thoughts and depression and, eventually, vision and hearing decline. Old people and those whose arteries are clogged often become senile and vague because oxygen to the brain is reduced. They get irritated very quickly.
      EVERYBODY, just breathe seriously.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5evzMox6_U
      Last edited by Majestic; 12-03-2009 at 03:44 AM.
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      Thinking

      When Einstein thought through a problem, he always found it necessary to formulate his subject in as many different ways as possible, including using diagrams. He visualized solutions, and believed that words and numbers as such did not play a significant role in his thinking process.

    18. #18
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      hmm, I wouldnt say I have this problem in social situations, I can chat just fine...the time I think too much is before bed. when I lay down it usually takes a half hour to an hour (on a good night) to fall to sleep unless I am completely exhausted. My mind rambles through a myriad of things both good and bad and I just cant seem to do anything about it except let it run its course.

      saying this...I guess its not REALLY a bad thing, except it reduces the amount of time I get to sleep. But I think there comes a point when you really can think too much. That point comes when you get so caught up in your thoughts that it starts to effect your day to day life. I have an example but idk if its really appropriate to go in to it here.
      <img src=http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q50/mckellion/Bleachsiggreen2.jpg border=0 alt= />


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      Only those who attempt the absurd can achieve the impossible.

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      I know my subconscious thoughts are chaotic as hell ( the thoughts you have when you're in sleep but yet still a bit aware state ). It's like wtf..it drives me nuts and I can't sleep when I'm aware of my subconscious thoughts, I toss and turn and shit. But eventually i get to sleep.

      But as far as thinking, the real fun begins when you start being aware( NOT THINKING ). You notice shit. The guys you "thought" were tough...you realize that to a certain degree they are scared themselves...

      Most "people" are scared ( socially anxious to a degree ) themselves. It's funny to me. Look them in the eyes, do they look away? at the ground? anywhere but at "your eyes" when speaking? They must be lying..Compulsive liars? Ego booster? LOL

      Most people are in a state of fear, look them in the eyes ( you'll know ). That's why it's so funny to me. Once you experience this, it is actually liberating.
      Last edited by Majestic; 12-05-2009 at 08:23 AM.
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    20. #20
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      I used to be pretty shy myself, and I always used to overthink everything. The thing that really helped was simply to spend a lot of time around people. I'm living in a 7-man suite in college this year, and spending so much time around my friends really helped me learn to put my guard down and be spontaneous. Not that thinking too much is really a bad thing, but I just find it so much more liberating when I'm confident enough to "go with the flow" and say what's on my mind. Good luck with working on that. I'm welcome to chat, if you ever want to.

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      Yes singularity, the best thing to do is to interact with other people and the outside world.

      And the "WEIRDEST" thing happened last night, I was smoking with friends and came into the house. I was so high off weed last night that I experienced hypnagogic hallucinations as I layed in bed. It was crazy as shit, because I did not need to relax or do any technique, I was already 10x relaxed because of the weed so it was like I layed in bed and went directly into a sleep state. But the chaotic thoughts were driving me nuts at the same time.

      It's becoming obvious to me that weed takes you directly to the subconscious mind, the true you. Not that I'm condoning weed but this may help answer some questions to those who DO smoke.

      I may make a topic about this in the research department.
      Last edited by Majestic; 12-06-2009 at 06:26 PM.
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      Being thoughtful and tactful is a good thing, but I think if you focus too much on what may or may not come out of any given social situation, you are putting far too much weight on simply "being", if that makes any sense.
      Thinking about the lasting consequences of anything you say to the point of paralysis or developing a fear is not good. I think a part of social anxiety is wanting to have too much control over things. You can control what people think of you only to a certain extent, hell you can only control your future to a certain extent, chance plays a huge part in that.

      But I dunno..I'm only speaking from my personal experience with it, which has been pretty severe.

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      meepkin I agree..

      But I think that the archetype is really simple. Happiness or Fear. Everything stems from these too. You think too much of one way and that archtype will manifest and multiply itself in many different ways.

      We must learn to think positive.
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      Quote Originally Posted by sheogorath View Post
      Recently, i have noticed that people do not think that much. I never really payed much attention before, not until a conversation with a friend. It came up that i dont talk much. I dont, for many reasons. I have Kind of a mild Social Anxiety problem. not much, but i have trouble starting conversations and talking to people who change subjects a lot. In a way this is bad, because it leads to poor social skills, but it also leaves me time to just sit and think alot.

      My friend asked what i do when everyone is talking but me, and i was surprised. I just think. I asked him dont you ever just sit and think, and question the world, and what makes you human, and what are our thoughts and if they are really others implanted into us. he just kind of looked at me like i was crazy and said that i need talk more.

      But nobody ever just thinks. they always have to have something to do. Always everyone is playing video games (i love video games, but still) or watching TV.

      a different friend tells me i think too much about stuff. Is that possible? I would like to familiarize myself with as many possibility as possible, wouldn't you? before you talk to someone, should you not think of lasting consequences over the the words that you choose. Is not manipulation done by small and weak strikes that eventually shift the direction of the future?

      In that case, is "Social anxiety" REALLY a disadvantage, or is not having it a disadvantage. Am i over thinking, or are others under thinking?

      I dont mean to rant, but this has been on my mind for a while. It is easy to tell people who think alot. they have a certain appeal about them to me. It seems so shallow when people talk to simply entertain themselves and not for any information or thought or feeling.

      As a side note, dont you hate girls that act stupid( or maybe they really are stupid?) so that they seem attractive to guys. Just as bad are the guys that like this kind of behavior. I would rather have an intelligent conversation of philosophy than chat about how last night on WOW I did VOA 10m for the 100th time. ( i dont mean to offend, this just irks me) you would think that there would be and evolutionary trait to prevent this... but my theory of humanity screwing with our evolution is a whole different story, with the people with low IQs having more kids that those with high IQs and with no death rate due to humanity feeling the responsibility to feed the cancer...

      any way, tell me what you think, and like i said, i dont mean to offend anyone.
      I've often thought this as well. First off how old are you, because when I was in like 8th-9th grade I used to think I had "Social Anxiety," or in other words, not being able to talk on the same level with other people. For example, a lot of the stuff that I am interested in (Politics, Philosophy, Science at times, History), most of my peers could not care less about. Even most adults dont care.

      Dont worry about yourself, man. I came to realize later on that I am my own person, I shouldnt let the cultural influences of American modern society run my life and make me worry about my social skills, etc. Im 17 now, and I still don't connect with a lot of people when everyone starts talking about American Idol and College Football and Tiger Woods and Desperate Housewives and Taylor Swift and Twilight and Homecoming and fashion and on and on and on and on, because honestly I do not care at all about any of those things. I am my own man, and although the people out there who are like me are few and far between, every now and then I meet someone who I can sit down with and have a classic discussion

      Me and you used to be the normal type of personality in society. Look at the culture of the 18th and 19th centuries in America. People didnt obsess over celebrities and gossip and sex, etc etc, but people actually still had a sense of class. You could invite a good friend into your house and sit down and eat a meal with them, and talk about intellectual things. Now the definition of a "friend" is, by my observations, somebody who you make jokes with. Friendship thesedays is basically just a comedy club. Male to male friendships are on average just two guys insulting each other all the time and then saying "just kidding bro", and male to female friendships almost always involve one of them flirting with the other. Cant we just have some decency people.
      "La bellezza del paessa di Galilei!"

    25. #25
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      Quote Originally Posted by Hercuflea View Post
      I've often thought this as well. First off how old are you, because when I was in like 8th-9th grade I used to think I had "Social Anxiety," or in other words, not being able to talk on the same level with other people. For example, a lot of the stuff that I am interested in (Politics, Philosophy, Science at times, History), most of my peers could not care less about. Even most adults dont care.

      Dont worry about yourself, man. I came to realize later on that I am my own person, I shouldnt let the cultural influences of American modern society run my life and make me worry about my social skills, etc. Im 17 now, and I still don't connect with a lot of people when everyone starts talking about American Idol and College Football and Tiger Woods and Desperate Housewives and Taylor Swift and Twilight and Homecoming and fashion and on and on and on and on, because honestly I do not care at all about any of those things. I am my own man, and although the people out there who are like me are few and far between, every now and then I meet someone who I can sit down with and have a classic discussion

      Me and you used to be the normal type of personality in society. Look at the culture of the 18th and 19th centuries in America. People didnt obsess over celebrities and gossip and sex, etc etc, but people actually still had a sense of class. You could invite a good friend into your house and sit down and eat a meal with them, and talk about intellectual things. Now the definition of a "friend" is, by my observations, somebody who you make jokes with. Friendship thesedays is basically just a comedy club. Male to male friendships are on average just two guys insulting each other all the time and then saying "just kidding bro", and male to female friendships almost always involve one of them flirting with the other. Cant we just have some decency people.
      you read my mind. Maybe it is different elsewhere in the world.

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