Thread: Haiti

Originally Posted by Kiza

Fuck you, shitheads. What kind of horrible fucking assholes do you think you are? 200,000 people are estimated dead, and 3 Million people were affected by the quake. That's almost a third of the population of Haiti. Here are some pictures of "just another disaster" that can maybe wake you up to how self-absorbed and snivelling you are being right now:

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/201...urs_later.html

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/201...ays_later.html

Why thank you for your wonderful compliment
I do in fact know I'm a horrible asshole, and I know how many people died. No, those pictures didn't "wake me up" but they did tell me that you're intent on a subject that doesn't affect you. It also tells me that you're compassionate about other people, but I'm not.

Originally Posted by Kiza

You think you're gonna miss 10 dollars? What are you gonna spend it on, a fucking Green Day CD? I'm unemployed and I donated $50. It's ridiculously easy to donate: text "Haiti" to 90999 and they stick it on your phone bill. There, you've just donated $10. But no, you two will sit at home and you won't donate a dollar because you can't bring yourself to care. Even if you can't make yourself care, The Lucid, you don't even have to: just donate. You're not going to miss $10.

No, I wouldn't miss $10, money means next to nothing to me. The only reason I earn and use it is because it means something to others and is almost nessecary (spelling??) to live these days. As a matter of fact, I have all the Green Day Cds (just saying XD) but it's pretty low to go to something I like a lot to try to ridicule or insult me. I don't have a phone bill, I use a prepaid
If I don't believe in a cause or can't bring myself to care why would I donate money that could be used on my food??

Originally Posted by Kiza

You two need to grow a fucking pair, and realise how terrible you are being. There's nothing worse than indifference. If this kind of thing hit where you lived, you'd be begging for the charity of others. But no, you don't care about it when it doesn't affect you.

I wouldn't beg for the charity of others, sure I'd take what I could get, but begging?? No. Anyway, I don't care about what doesn't affect me. Once something hits Massachusettes or Sierra Vista I'll care, but right now. Right now I couldn't care less.

Originally Posted by Kiza

Tragedies happen every day. You can't help the survivors of all of them. But you can easily help out in this one. There's nothing stopping you but your shitty attitude. So shut your dumb traps for a moment, feel some fucking empathy, and maybe, just maybe, you'll be able to evolve from the sewer-crawling, shit-eating, selfish dicks those three posts have led me to believe you are.

If I could possibly feel empathy for these people, don't you think I would?? I will never "shut my trap" when I'm speaking my voice for my beliefs and what I feel. But thanks for caring enough to try

Originally Posted by Kiza

Just in case you think it's not easy to donate, here you fucking go:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2010/01/13/help-haiti

https://american.redcross.org/site/D...a&NoJSReload=1

http://www.cidi.org/incident/haiti-10a/

http://donations.ebay.com/charity/event.jsp?NP_ID=-52

http://www.dec.org.uk/donate_now/

https://donate.doctorswithoutborders...e=ADR1001E1D01

https://secure2.convio.net/dri/site/...sevc94.app245b

https://secure.oxfamamerica.org/site...rm1&df_id=3600

I'd rather not, thanks

Originally Posted by Kiza

Have a nice fucking day. Listen to some Green Day.

Have a nice one your fucking self. I planned on it, assimus.

Originally Posted by juroara

how do you know this?

Are you psychic? Do you read peoples minds to know to whom and to what they have donated to?

How can you know without a doubt that these individuals only donate to disasters spoken about in the media?

Yes.


On a totally unrelated note, look up the words 'tendency' and 'many' in the dictionary

Originally Posted by Scatterbrain

Exactly. Millions of people (or is it over a billion?) suffer from starvation. There's also disease. And currently there are several or dozens of ongoing conflicts occurring around the world.

People are expected to act sad and altruistic with the flashy news-worthy events. But not with the other nameless "boring" situations.

Exactly. Starvation is preventable. Disease is somewhat preventable. And we can provide shelter for them as well.

The Haiti earthquake was just something that happened. Nothing could of prevented it. But that doesn't mean we should stop caring either. I'm just kind of neutral. If I could help, I would. But like you said, we're just in high school. And I got my own problems.. not that I'm saying they are greater than those in need on the other side of the world, but still..

In case any Americans in here think Haiti is some really far off and "irrelevant" place, it is not. For whatever it might be worth to you, Haitians are our neighbors. Cuba is 90 miles from the southern tip of Florida, and Haiti is Cuba's next door neighbor. Puerto Rico is further away, and it is one of our provinces.

Originally Posted by Scatterbrain

It appears my point is being missed. Never did I say we shouldn't help others.

I criticized the fact people tend to only help flashy mainstream tragedies (often ignoring tragedy right at their doorsteps). Regardless of that, and worse yet, many seem to think that the fact they donated an insignificantly small amount of money to charity automatically puts them in some higher moral ground and in the right to pass judgement onto others. "Uhhh, I effortlessly pressed a button to donate 20€, a mere few % of my monthly income, to poor people. I'm so much of a better person than you monsters."

yeah, those are very valid points. I completely agree that it's wrong for people to think that the purpose of helping others is to put yourself on some higher moral ground with the intention of feeling superior to others. Charity should be an action that was motivated by a true desire to help the suffering of another person, even if it does give you those "warm fuzzies" inside of feeling like you did some good. I don't think there's anything wrong with that as long as you don't suddenly consider yourself so much better than everyone else and give for that specific reason.

.... But what made you think my original comment was aimed at you? I haven't gone through and read all of the posts; I just skimmed over a lot of negativity and put in my two cents. I probably didn't even read your comment(s), and if I did, I skimmed over it too fast to remember what you said

Originally Posted by Kiza

Fuck you, shitheads. What kind of horrible fucking assholes do you think you are? 200,000 people are estimated dead, and 3 Million people were affected by the quake. That's almost a third of the population of Haiti. Here are some pictures of "just another disaster" that can maybe wake you up to how self-absorbed and snivelling you are being right now:

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/201...urs_later.html

http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/201...ays_later.html

You think you're gonna miss 10 dollars? What are you gonna spend it on, a fucking Green Day CD? I'm unemployed and I donated $50. It's ridiculously easy to donate: text "Haiti" to 90999 and they stick it on your phone bill. There, you've just donated $10. But no, you two will sit at home and you won't donate a dollar because you can't bring yourself to care. Even if you can't make yourself care, The Lucid, you don't even have to: just donate. You're not going to miss $10.

You two need to grow a fucking pair, and realise how terrible you are being. There's nothing worse than indifference. If this kind of thing hit where you lived, you'd be begging for the charity of others. But no, you don't care about it when it doesn't affect you.

Tragedies happen every day. You can't help the survivors of all of them. But you can easily help out in this one. There's nothing stopping you but your shitty attitude. So shut your dumb traps for a moment, feel some fucking empathy, and maybe, just maybe, you'll be able to evolve from the sewer-crawling, shit-eating, selfish dicks those three posts have led me to believe you are.

Just in case you think it's not easy to donate, here you fucking go:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2010/01/13/help-haiti

https://american.redcross.org/site/D...a&NoJSReload=1

http://www.cidi.org/incident/haiti-10a/

http://donations.ebay.com/charity/event.jsp?NP_ID=-52

http://www.dec.org.uk/donate_now/

https://donate.doctorswithoutborders...e=ADR1001E1D01

https://secure2.convio.net/dri/site/...sevc94.app245b

https://secure.oxfamamerica.org/site...rm1&df_id=3600

Have a nice fucking day. Listen to some Green Day.

I guess i should donate to every single thing that happens in the world then? Some poor people are hungry, give them my paycheck! a snowfall in a snowy place that has alot of people trapped, give them my next paycheck! more poor people starving, that is 3 paychecks gone. I donate every year $300-$500 to PC childrens charity, i don't need to be giving all of my fuckin money to every single disaster, or to everyone that needs it. I even helped a guy out for a long while who had child services on his neck. I GUESS I AM A BAD GUY BECAUSE I DID NOT DONATE TO SOME STARVING CHILDREN OH NOES! Shit happens every single day in the world, am i some type of money maker who has all kinds of money to throw away to every single bad thing in the world? i also did not donate to the trade towers thing, i guess i am a bad person? i coulda donated my paperoute money for that! but instead i kept it, and stayed in school. Don't forget the animal cruelty in the world ontop of human suffering. You sound like one of those people from the "give us money to help them get a better life" people.

Originally Posted by LucidFlanders

I guess i should donate to every single thing that happens in the world then? Some poor people are hungry, give them my paycheck! a snowfall in a snowy place that has alot of people trapped, give them my next paycheck! more poor people starving, that is 3 paychecks gone. I donate every year $300-$500 to PC childrens charity, i don't need to be giving all of my fuckin money to every single disaster, or to everyone that needs it. I even helped a guy out for a long while who had child services on his neck. I GUESS I AM A BAD GUY BECAUSE I DID NOT DONATE TO SOME STARVING CHILDREN OH NOES! Shit happens every single day in the world, am i some type of money maker who has all kinds of money to throw away to every single bad thing in the world? i also did not donate to the trade towers thing, i guess i am a bad person? i coulda donated my paperoute money for that! but instead i kept it, and stayed in school. Don't forget the animal cruelty in the world ontop of human suffering.

Amen

Originally Posted by Jesus of Suburbia

Why thank you for your wonderful compliment
I do in fact know I'm a horrible asshole, and I know how many people died. No, those pictures didn't "wake me up" but they did tell me that you're intent on a subject that doesn't affect you. It also tells me that you're compassionate about other people, but I'm not.



No, I wouldn't miss $10, money means next to nothing to me. The only reason I earn and use it is because it means something to others and is almost nessecary (spelling??) to live these days. As a matter of fact, I have all the Green Day Cds (just saying XD) but it's pretty low to go to something I like a lot to try to ridicule or insult me. I don't have a phone bill, I use a prepaid
If I don't believe in a cause or can't bring myself to care why would I donate money that could be used on my food??



I wouldn't beg for the charity of others, sure I'd take what I could get, but begging?? No. Anyway, I don't care about what doesn't affect me. Once something hits Massachusettes or Sierra Vista I'll care, but right now. Right now I couldn't care less.



If I could possibly feel empathy for these people, don't you think I would?? I will never "shut my trap" when I'm speaking my voice for my beliefs and what I feel. But thanks for caring enough to try



I'd rather not, thanks



Have a nice one your fucking self. I planned on it, assimus.

The guy is an idiot, just ignore him.

Originally Posted by LucidFlanders

The guy is an idiot, just ignore him.

I'm fine, thanks for the advice though. I've been dealing with haters who can't mind their own fucking buisness my whole life. If Kiza wants to argue, let him. He's just another mindless drone that society has created to be the perfect, caring, money-giving, yeerk that everybody loves.

Originally Posted by Xaqaria

China has the third largest economy in the world and has been the fastest growing economy for the last 30 years.

Originally Posted by Jeff777

[B][COLOR="Red"]China and India are both emerging as new super powers. How is China a poor country?

Alrighty then. China has a population of 1.325 billion. Its nominal GDP is 4.327 trillion. Its nominal per capita GDP is about 3,250 dollars, ranking 104 of 180 countries. China would have to grow its economy 1,480% to 64,100,323,000 trillion dollars in order to reach the per capita GDP of the United States. And the United states is only number 13 in terms of per capita GDP. A post in this thread says China is donating 10 million and that the US is donating 150 million. Proportionally, China is donating about as much as America.

So yes, China is a poor country.

Originally Posted by Jesus of Suburbia

I'm fine, thanks for the advice though. I've been dealing with haters who can't mind their own fucking buisness my whole life. If Kiza wants to argue, let him. He's just another mindless drone that society has created to be the perfect, caring, money-giving, yeerk that everybody loves.

I think it's funny how this guy affirmed nearly everything Kiza said about him.

Originally Posted by Black_Eagle

I think it's funny how this guy affirmed nearly everything Kiza said about him.

I did no such thing, sire.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...e-relationship

As always, the money is not spent as we wanted it to...

Originally Posted by lagunagirl

yeah, those are very valid points. I completely agree that it's wrong for people to think that the purpose of helping others is to put yourself on some higher moral ground with the intention of feeling superior to others. Charity should be an action that was motivated by a true desire to help the suffering of another person, even if it does give you those "warm fuzzies" inside of feeling like you did some good. I don't think there's anything wrong with that as long as you don't suddenly consider yourself so much better than everyone else and give for that specific reason.

.... But what made you think my original comment was aimed at you? I haven't gone through and read all of the posts; I just skimmed over a lot of negativity and put in my two cents. I probably didn't even read your comment(s), and if I did, I skimmed over it too fast to remember what you said

I figured you were talking about me when you mentioned turning people away from helping. But the reply wasn't exclusively targeted at your post.

Originally Posted by Scatterbrain

Yes.
On a totally unrelated note, look up the words 'tendency' and 'many' in the dictionary

The interesting thing about generalizations is they entirely illusionary. You do NOT know what other people think, feel, or do in their own personal lives, if they have or have not donated to a cause more personal to them than Haiti.

The interesting thing about generalizations is we base them off ourselves. If you feel people are hypocrite, then you feel people are hypocrite because you are a hypocrite.

The other interesting thing is we human beings simply aren't robots. You can tell a human a number like "1 million people have died today" and they are completely unchanged. Not because they don't care. Not because they are heartless or apathetic. But because the conscious human mind can't even fathom what the number 1 million is. We use six zeros to represent it. And while this representation works for math, it still doesn't illustrate to the human mind what one million really looks like. Let alone that this number is representing real conscious sentient humans. Go ahead and try to imagine a million distinct units in your head! YOU CAN'T!!

All human beings are emotional. All of us speak the human body language. All of us know the language of pain and suffering when shown to us by the human face. And despite what ever you say or think, we all react to each others body language!!!

Our apathy and hypocrisy is partly due to how information is given to us. In numbers, in statistics. But none of these things equate to reality in the human mind. What the media has to offer us is a chance to understand and realize there are real human lives behind these arbitrary and meaningless numbers. Which is why media coverage is important! And when we SEE their faces, we react! Even if its just on an unconscious level. The same just isn't true with numbers.

And what you are seeing are many people waking up and realizing for the first time that these numbers represent real people. But don't think it ends with Haiti. Once people are able to understand the suffering happening in one place, they are able to understand better the very real suffering happening in another place. You can yell at them and judge them all you want. It's not helping anyone. It's not going to help them connect to these people.

If you really care about the suffering, then you would help these individuals are still 'asleep' wake up and understand the reality behind these numbers. And we need to see their face! Or even better, hear their voice.

And for the argument that people donate to feel superior? No..no no no no....No...No!!......... There is no such thing. How do I know? It's simple. If these donating individuals donate to feel superior, why would they ask you to do the same? Why would they get angry if you don't donate like them? If they really wanted to feel superior they would conclude "Nah, I don't want you to donate and be on the same level as me! I would rather that you remain worthless and not donate!"

They aren't donating to feel superior to other people. Because they would rather that everyone donated just like them! Are they being judgmental? Yes they are judging you for not being more like them. But does it mean that to judge you is the motivation behind their desire to donate...NO! They donated for honest and good intentions, and everyone who donates does!

In short, it's wrong to judge an individual based on when and where they donated and to whom, regardless of which side of the donation argument you are on. Instead, we should understand that we will always donate to the cause that effected us on an emotional level. And that depends on whether or not we can fathom and understand that real human lives, faces, were involved. . . . . . Numbers, statistics, these things don't influence us unless we can relate it to a previous experience.

Rather than judging each other for doing or not doing - we should help educate each other on the suffering in the world, and help empower each other to create change, understanding that change can be created even if we only help one person. Global or local, that's your choice!

What are you going to gain by judging people for being hypocritical donators out to feel superior, except to make yourself feel superior to these people??

Originally Posted by juroara

And for the argument that people donate to feel superior? No..no no no no....No...No!!......... There is no such thing. How do I know? It's simple. If these donating individuals donate to feel superior, why would they ask you to do the same? Why would they get angry if you don't donate like them?

An argument that some people donate to feel superior stands correct. They ask others to do the same and they tend to get angry because of a parent ego state, they need to patronize, therefore feel superior. Think about it, cause you obviously just touched the surface of the given behaviour's cause.

Everyone acts in their own self-interest. Whether or not you agree with this or not, it has a shocking tendency to hold true. Why do people donate to charity? A multitude of reasons, but especially to feel good and/or stave off guilt. (This is more of a debate for another thread, but in a philosophy class with 30+ students, we couldn't think of a single exception). It all comes down to the individual doing what he/she thinks best...and "best" here meaning bring them the greatest amounts of joy. $10 is very little, and when you get to feel like you're helping someone, I'd say it's well worth it.

Originally Posted by Black_Eagle

And the United states is only number 13 in terms of per capita GDP. A post in this thread says China is donating 10 million and that the US is donating 150 million. Proportionally, China is donating about as much as America.

So yes, China is a poor country.

They have four times as many people as us, yet we can donate 10 times more money with the same GDP percentage. Doesn't that speak volumes about the effectiveness of capitalism? Our relatively low taxes are the REASON for our ability to have so much money and donate so much money. If we majorly raised our taxes and gave a much higher percentage of our GDP to foreign aid, we would not be able to give anywhere near as much foreign aid, which we lead the world in... out of 193 countries in the world. Capitalism should not be fucked with. It works.

"The path forward seems to go backward." - Lao Tzu

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

They have four times as many people as us, yet we can donate 10 times more money with the same GDP percentage. Doesn't that speak volumes about the effectiveness of capitalism? Our relatively low taxes are the REASON for our ability to have so much money and donate so much money. If we majorly raised our taxes and gave a much higher percentage of our GDP to foreign aid, we would not be able to give anywhere near as much foreign aid, which we lead the world in... out of 193 countries in the world. Capitalism should not be fucked with. It works.

"The path forward seems to go backward." - Lao Tzu

....I'm not sure I know who or what that's directed at.

Originally Posted by juroara

The interesting thing about generalizations is we base them off ourselves. If you feel people are hypocrite, then you feel people are hypocrite because you are a hypocrite.

Solid logic there Aristotle.

And for the argument that people donate to feel superior? No..no no no no....No...No!!.........

I didn't say people donate to feel superior. I said many people who donate act and talk as if that make them better persons than those who don't. And voila...

If you really care about the suffering, then you would help these individuals are still 'asleep' wake up and understand the reality behind these numbers.

.

What are you going to gain by judging people for being hypocritical donators out to feel superior, except to make yourself feel superior to these people??

I didn't assert moral judgement onto anyone. I merely logically demonstrated the common hypocrisy that goes around in charity.

Originally Posted by Black_Eagle

....I'm not sure I know who or what that's directed at.

You and your quote.

Originally Posted by Universal Mind

You and your quote.

I don't remember making any references to capitalism. Maybe you should re-read my post.

Originally Posted by Black_Eagle

I don't remember making any references to capitalism. Maybe you should re-read my post.

I pointed out something important about what you pointed out.

Also, you were talking about what I brought up. I was the person who first mentioned the China and U.S. donation comparison. We are just having a conversation.

Originally Posted by Luanne

An argument that some people donate to feel superior stands correct. They ask others to do the same and they tend to get angry because of a parent ego state, they need to patronize, therefore feel superior. Think about it, cause you obviously just touched the surface of the given behaviour's cause.

They get angry because they don't understand why someone would willingly choose not to donate. But I'm not saying they have a right to be angry. There are more causes to donate to than most of us can donate to.

...I, for one, have a desire to save the whales. Who will join me?