Thread: Logic to convince me to be skeptical of reality.

Okay, here's my theory. Dreaming is the default state instead of reality (perception-wise). Before you do anything you wouldn't do in waking-life (stepping away from "reality") or would rather be doing something else in your dream, do an RC to see which rules to abide by. Here is my logic behind this:

The more you accept your current situation as reality, the less chance of it being real there it. Sometimes, I question, "what is reality"? In a dream, you always accept your surroundings as reality. Thus if you think you are in "reality" you are probably not in reality because sometimes I think waking life is real less than I think dreams are real. I ALWAYS think dreaming is real, but I only MOSTLY think waking life is real. Thus, I must always assume I am dreaming.

To be safe, before action, comes RC.

I'm trying to get this working on a "gut" level so that I always RC, and thus, start DILDing.

I find one hole in my logic so far, more time is spent awake than in dreams. However, in a dream, I will not know which is which, thus assuming always in a dream is safe.

I would like comments and/or you pointing out holds in my logic.

EDIT: Oh, I thought of a more concise way to put it. I am innocent of being awake until proven guilty.

EDIT: I have an example.

I see a vending machine. "I can smash that and try the things inside." *Does RC. I am awake.* "I won't now, but next time I probably can do it."

Reality is just your perception of the world. Take blind people for example, color isn't reality for them.

Merrily marrily merrily merrily life is but a dream

I think I've got it almost working.

Here's a quick sketch of it: I feel an impulse. Instead of automatically saying "no," I say "I could do X." Then I RC. In waking life, I would then say "Next time I will probably be able to do it."

wow is because of my subject, not your topic or whatever ... also little drunk...
kill yourself in a dream
kill yourself in real life

which are you more angered and repulsed by? real life.
you have probably died in a dream before, and by experience, you probably know you will wake up or false awakening into another dream and everything is fine...

in real life, ever died before? ever heard of someone saying hey, i died and now im alive again? without them seeming like a complete quack (generally you can tell because everything else they say makes no sense and follows no logical pattern at all)... in summation, true you dont know if you're dreaming or awake at any time, but you have to assume real life is real because you have no evidence of any other reality (dreams are not evidence of another reality because you can manipulate them in any way you can possibly imagine, and unless you are god, that is not a reality... so if you've got a god complex ... well im not going to say anything because im sad about what i tried to say just now but im not going to say it because i know thats not nice and etc so good night and i think you get my drift and if you dont it doesnt matter because i dont care

peace

Interesting. I will now try to patch those holes in my logic.

This theory is about the state of mind that you have in a dream. It could be called a god complex, I guess. Anyways, when you RC normally, you check to see if you are dreaming. As if dreaming is this little experienced state. This logic switches the goal of RC. Now, when I RC, I see if I am awake. As if being awake is the exception. Thus you are skeptical of reality by default, instead of happening to remember to RC every once in a while.

"I could be doing something different right now," is something you would say in a dream. Thus you say this whenever, RC, then act accordingly.

Originally Posted by Rawracookie

Interesting. I will now try to patch those holes in my logic.

This theory is about the state of mind that you have in a dream. It could be called a god complex, I guess. Anyways, when you RC normally, you check to see if you are dreaming. As if dreaming is this little experienced state. This logic switches the goal of RC. Now, when I RC, I see if I am awake. As if being awake is the exception. Thus you are skeptical of reality by default, instead of happening to remember to RC every once in a while.

"I could be doing something different right now," is something you would say in a dream. Thus you say this whenever, RC, then act accordingly.

The greatest hole in one's logic is usually the one so big, they just don't see it. Names are conventional. The first principle of logic, which is never taught, is that there is no theory, statement, idea, worth a damn, if the construction violates the original naming convention. Good thing people are generally too asleep to even realize that language rests upon a convention of names.

With just this one idea, one can even trash Einstein.

I've read so many stories of people doing an RC in the dream, say they are dreaming, and then proceed to nonlucid dream. That's why skepticism is important.

I don't think anything dangerous will be done if I don't cut a 2 second RC off at the wrong time.

I think what he's trying to say is, you shouldn't try to get yourself in the mindset that you're always dreaming. I agree, if you actually train your mind to always assume you're dreaming, you may do something dangerous. Although I'm not sure that's even possible, whenever I do a reality check, I'm pretty sure I'm awake. The problem is, in a dream, I never question my reality. The fact that I am able to question my reality at all is a likely sign that I am awake.

You may want to just do your RCs as normal so that it becomes habitual. I'm not entirely sure that it's crucial for you to be that skeptical about your environment, rather you just want to make it part of your routine. Since dreams often take on the subject of something you did that day or often (I.E. I was playing Majora's Mask last night and I had a dream that I was at work, having to play a song on the ocarina to replace steps on the staircase because some were missing... oddly enough, lol), it makes sense that doing reality checks every day will make a reality check happen in your dream. If I were you, I would simply continue with normal methods, since it's been proven to work.

I think your mindset is a good one to have. I wouldn't worry about doing something dangerous in real life because you thought it was a dream. The odds of that happening are astronomically low. I might just steal your idea now!....just need an architect, chemist, and few other things...lol

lol

The logic is only to help convince me to be in that mindset. By posting here, I further grind into my mind that I am dreaming now. If it helps other people, that's just awesome.

I bet it helps me DILD, soon. (I originally said "hope," but that doesn't work with the midset.)

The logic I use is simply to realize how often I am "certain" that I am awake, and then it turns out I am in a dream. Thinking about that, I have no problem being skeptical of reality. I have trained myself to think of dreaming as the most likely reason for unusual things that happen, because most of the time unusual things that happen are happening in dreams. You just have to look at the big picture. 50% of the time when I go to class or use a public restroom it is a dream, so the logical thing is to think that it may very well be a dream. Going to my former university is a dream 90% of the time, so when I visit in real life my first thought upon going through the door is "I am pretty sure that this is a dream".

Not questioning reality is illogical in itself, but most people have developed the habit of thinking they are always awake. I look at RC's as a way to try and break that habit. If you consider the big picture, it really is faulty thinking to assume you are not dreaming when half the time you are.

My other thought is that most people have developed the habit of not thinking about whether they are awake or dreaming at all. Think about it. Are you dreaming now? Chances are, you haven't even thought about it and will have to take a moment to check. Personally, I don't know what I was just doing unless I pause and think. A few days ago while walking to class I decided to do just that, and I remembered that the last thing I remembered doing was sleeping. I suddenly realized that I hadn't woken up yet! It wasn't that I had forgotten, it's just that we don't bother to consider it most of the time unless something reminds us.

But I digress. Yes, the mindset helps greatly. For me, anyway.

I was in a dream recently where i was talking to 2 friends, one had recently died (hadn't seen him in 20 years, but found out he was dead a few weeks ago) the other was not. I realized in the dream that one of them was dead and i couldn't be in reality so i must be dreaming. Realizing this went outside where another old friend of mine comes up to me and says "hey man whats up". I said "Gregg, when's your birthday?" i personally did not know it, but i figured if the person i was talking to was real, he would know their own B day. he of course did not or coulnd't answer since in reality I didnt know? upon which i told him we were in a dream. He didn't get it and stormed off pissed i told him he wasn't real. The dream gets freakier after that but i wont get into it here.

i told him we were in a dream. He didn't get it and stormed off pissed i told him he wasn't real. The dream gets freakier after that but i wont get into it here.

Hahahahaha he stomped off haha. Stupid Greg. Hey tell me what happened after you darted changing your dream! I'm curious about how peoples minds react upon lucidity, since mine always reduces the clarity and the flow of the dream. Could you PM me if you don't want to say it here?