Thread: Inherited Lucid Dreaming

Two points.

There is no such thing as Inherited Lucid Dreaming. You can't inherit it.

Loaf is a troll.

Originally Posted by lucidmax15895

Loaf is a troll.

You're an idiot. Boohoo I disagree with you and I'm not afraid to say it, I must be trolling. You embarrassment.

Originally Posted by Loaf

You're an idiot. Boohoo I disagree with you and I'm not afraid to say it, I must be trolling. You embarrassment.

LOL loaf, I said only one on topic thing, and it was

Originally Posted by lucidmax15895

There is no such thing as Inherited Lucid Dreaming. You can't inherit it.

So basically,

Boohoo I disagree with you and I'm not afraid to say it

That made me LOL. Stop being so sensitive.

First off, Loaf you seem to be acting as if you are an authority on this discussion. It seems to me that any argument you have is a complete assumption. I truly have no idea if a slight edge in lucid dreaming can be passed genetically, and neither do you. It seems very possible to me that inherited genetics could make one more susceptible to being consciously aware in the dream state. As for genetics directly aiding lucidity, I doubt that would be the case. Some dreamers minds can more easily adapt to lucidity and the awareness that leads to lucidity. Do you not think that could be passed on to another generation? I don't see why not.

Just to throw this out there, I found out a couple months ago that my grandfather is a natural lucid dreamer. Me, my father, and I were watching Inception and I brought up lucid dreaming. My dad knows I am a lucid dreamer and he has had one himself basically from hearing me talk about it (which is understandable). What blew my mind, however, was my 72 year old grandpa joined in and I learned he had been naturally lucid dreaming all his life. Now, he didn't have them every night, but he said he has had around 5-10 a month ever since he can remember. Sooooo, its also possible that it skips a generation like so many other inherited traits. Just saying.

Originally Posted by KingYoshi

First off, Loaf you seem to be acting as if you are an authority on this discussion. It seems to me that any argument you have is a complete assumption.

No, I speak on experience and evidence I can find. Please don't tell me you will even humour the idea that a 5 year old has more mental capacity to learn lucidity than an adult, you know that isn't true and I do because, as I said, I am around young child a lot and I live in a family with them. Yes, that doesn't mean its the end all of that side of the discussion but that doesn't mean I am assuming either.

Originally Posted by KingYoshi

I truly have no idea if a slight edge in lucid dreaming can be passed genetically, and neither do you.

You are totally right. So since we can't prove you can, lets not walk about saying we can! Bring some evidence to the table and prove me wrong. c:

Hmm...

Originally Posted by Loaf

No, I speak on experience and evidence I can find. Please don't tell me you will even humour the idea that a 5 year old has more mental capacity to learn lucidity than an adult, you know that isn't true and I do because, as I said, I am around young child a lot and I live in a family with them. Yes, that doesn't mean its the end all of that side of the discussion but that doesn't mean I am assuming either.

I'm strictly speaking on inheriting a genetic trait that would allow you to more easily distinguish between the dream state and waking life. A genetic trait that affects/aides the mind. It seems extremely possible. I had lucid dreams off and on ever since I can remember. My earliest memory of becoming lucid is like 1st grade. I have had at least one or two a month nearly my entire life. I didn't even know the term lucid dream until I joined Dream Views at 20 years old. I had my first purposely induced lucid dream the night I joined Dream Views and I have had at least 10+ every month since. Now, I'm not saying I am proof, but I easily picked up on lucid dreaming because I had a slight natural ability. This is why I believe there could possibly be some sort of genetic make-up that could aide lucid training/practice. That paired with the fact that my grandfather has been lucid dreaming all his life and never even knew the term "lucid dream."

You are totally right. So since we can't prove you can, lets not walk above saying we can! Bring some evidence to the table and prove me wrong. c:

First off, why am I proving you wrong? Where is your proof? Secondly, read the above paragraph for the closest thing I have to proof.

Originally Posted by Velzhaed

Everyone is a natural lucid dreamer. What would an 'unnatural lucid dream' be?

No, no...everyone is NOT a natural lucid dreamer. A natural lucid dreamer is someone who becomes lucid without doing anything. Someone who has had lucid dreams all of their life, without ever being told/informed about lucid dreaming in the first place. Someone who naturally distinguishes the dream state from the waking state without purposely setting forth to do so.

Originally Posted by Loaf

I think he is implying the ability to regularly and unknowingly become aware you are asleep. Everyone I know becomes aware randomly in their sleep every so often. Just none of them understand it and don't utilize it.

No they do not Loaf. Where do you get this stuff? I have talked extensively to many, many people about lucid dreaming. 70% (an estimate of course) of these people have never once realized they were dreaming whilst within a dream. Please refrain from making these wild assumptions.

I am not making wild assumptions King Yoshi, claiming so is only fueling your own ignorance. You wrote it, not me. Unless you are unable to use the English language correctly, thats what you wrote. And what aren't you understanding? I am saying no proof = no theory. You telling me I'm wrong? Or just making a moot point. There is no evidence there is any genetic relation to lucid dreaming, get some or get out.

Originally Posted by Loaf

I am not making wild assumptions King Yoshi, claiming so is only fueling your own ignorance. You wrote it, not me. Unless you are unable to use the English language correctly, thats what you wrote. And what aren't you understanding? I am saying no proof = no theory. You telling me I'm wrong? Or just making a moot point. There is no evidence there is any genetic relation to lucid dreaming, get some or get out.

Lol, there is no ignorance in my post, or any of my posts for that matter. Just a little heads up for you. You just told me that EVERYONE you know has become naturally lucid before. I am sorry, but that is a wild assumption. Plain and simple.

Originally Posted by AL3ZAY

Why would you imply I have a strange relationship with my parents based on a hypothetical example? Every child, from age 4 - 13 pretty much does have the same religious views as their parents. Show me a 6, 8, 10, or 12 year old who's got differing religious views from their parents based on knowledge they've gathered on their own. And I used my 5 year old cousin as an example, so I don't know what you mean by a 12 year old, as I never mentioned one.

Originally Posted by AL3ZAY

That's because children ARE open minded and curious. All children are like this starting out, and it's their parents and other adults that shape the beliefs and behaviors they display in a place like school.

If a child's mom tells them "dreaming doesn't exist", the child will believe that, and defend what his mom told him for forever and a day, because that's his mom and she has to be right. That's a belief being set in the curious child who had to ask a question to receive the response that shaped the belief in the first place. It's not that the child isn't naturally curious, it's that his curiosity has already been met with an answer from a trusted source of information, which creates the belief and removes the curiosity from that particular subject.

You guys have got to stop using these words... "all, everyone, every, everybody." Didn't you guys learn that in school. Not all children think imaginary things are real. Ever since I first heard the story of Santa Claus I knew it wasn't real. I never believed it once. I was around 3 years old, questioning every hole in the Santa Claus story. I may have been in the minority, but I guarantee there are plenty of other children just like that. Not all children believe that a fat man in a red suit flys reindeer around the world to every single house in a single night. I knew how long it took to get from point A to B. I road in many a car as a child. I have never saw this "magic" everyone spoke of. I was the kid who ruined the thumb removal trick for everybody. I guarantee I wasn't the only one either. I was forced to go to church from an early age, but I was never an actual believer. Even as a child. Just because you are a child doesn't mean you are unintelligent. Surely, you understand this?

For the record, if you use "every," "all," or any variation of these, 99% of the time, you are wrong in your statement.

Originally Posted by KingYoshi

You just told me that EVERYONE you know has become naturally lucid before. I am sorry, but that is a wild assumption. Plain and simple.

God KingYoshi, you are such an arrogant person. I talk about lucid dreaming with my friends, my information is legitimate, I should know. Telling me I am making this up is offensive, and very ignorant.
What, you know better than me when it comes to where I get my sources and what I do with my contacts? You are talking out of your place.

Originally Posted by KingYoshi

Lol, there is no ignorance in my post, or any of my posts for that matter. Just a little heads up for you. You just told me that EVERYONE you know has become naturally lucid before. I am sorry, but that is a wild assumption. Plain and simple.





You guys have got to stop using these words... "all, everyone, every, everybody." Didn't you guys learn that in school. Not all children think imaginary things are real. Ever since I first heard the story of Santa Claus I knew it wasn't real. I never believed it once. I was around 3 years old, questioning every hole in the Santa Claus story. I may have been in the minority, but I guarantee there are plenty of other children just like that. Not all children believe that a fat man in a red suit flys reindeer around the world to every single house in a single night. I knew how long it took to get from point A to B. I road in many a car as a child. I have never saw this "magic" everyone spoke of. I was the kid who ruined the thumb removal trick for everybody. I guarantee I wasn't the only one either. I was forced to go to church from an early age, but I was never an actual believer. Even as a child. Just because you are a child doesn't mean you are unintelligent. Surely, you understand this?

For the record, if you use "every," "all," or any variation of these, 99% of the time, you are wrong in your statement.

At what point did I state that children were unintelligent? I have been defending the intelligence and ability to grasp the concepts and understand lucid dreaming by a child the entire time.

As a child, were you not naturally curious and open minded to new concepts and ideas?

I will refrain from saying that all and every, but so far as natural curiosity, I believe it to be there in all children. I've yet to meet a young kid who already knew everything about everything without a hint of curiosity about anything.

Apologies for that: 5 year old. But I don't think we're getting anywhere. I'm saying that as a 30 year old who has worked in the public school system I have a decent grasp of what children are capable of. You don't agree. I don't think everyone under 13 automatically believes everything their parents say. That's where my 'strange relationship' comment came from. Did you really just accept everything your parents said before you were 13? Were you home every day before dark so the strangers wouldn't take you home? Did you never lie cause they told you not to? Were you nice to everyone cause that's the Golden Rule? I can say from MY experience- No. Nor is that what I have seen.

Public school compared to home are two very different things when it comes to learning. For instance (this is just me obviously), public school never, not once engaged my imagination. I wanted to know when I could go home, all day long, every single day. The work I was given was boring to do, and I hated going through the motions of school in general. I associated learning and school with being boring. At home I was creative, I loved to draw, and read, and that was what I brought over into school to aid me getting through the long, boring day. Now I will have to concede to the point of children not believing EVERYTHING that is said by their parents, because even I didn't believe it all, but usually that was because my experience with what I was being told seemed or was different than what I was being told. With zero previous experience, sometimes I would accept the information as valid. That was something I should have approached differently.

I'm not so sure if Lucid Dreaming has a correlation to genetics, though I think seeing some studies being done on it would be cool. However, as one user mentioned before.. some studies show that sleep paralysis can in fact be genetic.

Sleep paralysis occurs most often after jet lag or periods of sleeplessness that interrupt the normal REM patterns. It affects both sexes equally and occurs at all ages but is most common in teenagers. Sleep paralysis can be familial and may be genetic (inherited) in some cases.

Perhaps lucid dreaming is to genetics the same way as being an olympic runner is to genetics. While the runner may have been born with genes that predisposed him to being a better athlete, his hard work and training is what got him to the olympics.

-shrug- Food for thought.

I think he is implying the ability to regularly and unknowingly become aware you are asleep. Everyone I know becomes aware randomly in their sleep every so often. Just none of them understand it and don't utilize it.

You're lumping children into this "open minded curiosity" that I can not agree with. I worked in a grade school for three years, and I watched first graders break down into tears cause they couldn't hit a ball, and 6th graders who believed everything an adult said to them was a bold-faced lie. I think your generalizing too much.

I am convinced AL3ZAY is speaking strictly from his own experience and expecting it to be generalized across everyone else. Its weird. 0_o

Originally Posted by Whear

Hello everyone ! First of all, this is my first post here I started reading this forum 2 months ago, but it was only yesterday that I created an account in the eventuality that I'd like to express something. I still didn't experience a "real" lucid dream ( I did however realize I was dreaming 3 times, but the dreams disintegrated faster than I could consciously think of stabilizing them ). I also wasn't consistent in training this skill the whole time because of school and personal problems stressing me too much. However, I've absorbed a lot of information and tried a lot of techniques, so I think I'm on the right track ( theory wise ). Anyway, what I want to share with you is something else. Today, while I was working ( delivering pizzas at Domino's ) an interesting idea came into my mind : since all skills are coded in our genes, could someone who is well trained into lucid dreaming pass this amazing skill to his descendants ? I'm not saying the inheritor should be able to lucid dream without any practice/training, but does he have a great potential at doing it ? Would he do it more naturally if it already has the information in his DNA ? That would mean that we're not only expanding our own limits, but the limits of the whole future humanity ( viewed from a large perspective ) I'd like to hear your opinions about this, especially if you have some knowledge about genetic inheritance ( mine is at most basic ).


Andrei

Going all the way back to the OP...I think you'll find that opinions on the subject vary.

All I am saying is if there is no proof that genetics do have influence, it is more reasonable to say it doesn't than it does. Its like saying God must exist because we can't disprove him. I don't believe thats a reasonable approach, but if you disagree well okay that is fine too.

Originally Posted by Loaf

All I am saying is if there is no proof that genetics do have influence, it is more reasonable to say it doesn't than it does. Its like saying God must exist because we can't disprove him. I don't believe thats a reasonable approach, but if you disagree well okay that is fine too.

But by saying that it doesn't have any influence when it possibly could, you're making a definitive statement about a possibility. Can't we simply say that it's a possibility and leave it at that?

Originally Posted by AL3ZAY

But by saying that it doesn't have any influence when it possibly could, you're making a definitive statement about a possibility. Can't we simply say that it's a possibility and leave it at that?

...if you're willing to admit that it might not, and leave it at that.

Originally Posted by Velzhaed

...if you're willing to admit that it might not, and leave it at that.

And that I am willing to do, haha.

Originally Posted by AL3ZAY

But by saying that it doesn't have any influence when it possibly could, you're making a definitive statement about a possibility. Can't we simply say that it's a possibility and leave it at that?

At this point in time, as far as anyone knows, genetics have no influence. We must accept that. That isn't to say we shouldn't explore it, but we can not go around and start saying it must be true with no evidence. Keep pursuing it, but don't make any claims until you have backing.

Originally Posted by Loaf

All I am saying is if there is no proof that genetics do have influence, it is more reasonable to say it doesn't than it does. Its like saying God must exist because we can't disprove him. I don't believe thats a reasonable approach, but if you disagree well okay that is fine too.

I'm done with this argument. You are comparing a being that lives in the sky and controls everything on earth, to inheriting a genetic trait that could slightly help influence/sway the human mind/brain. Do you not see how irrelevant that is?

Originally Posted by KingYoshi

You are comparing a being that lives in the sky and controls everything on earth, to inheriting a genetic trait that could slightly help influence/sway the human mind/brain. Do you not see how irrelevant that is?

You really are stupid if you can't comprehend an analogy. Pathetic. I tried to be level with you but you obviously aren't civilized enough to return the favour.

I think to me in the end it would be about personality, not genetics. I *believe* that everyone is a natural lucid dreams because *in my experience* any time I've asked "You how sometimes you're dreaming, but you know you're dreaming?" everyone has always said "yeah."

But personality I can see as having an effect. For a loose example, think of drugs. There are some people who just can not relax after taking something like acid, or even smoking weed. The loss of control makes them nervous, they get tense, and they freak out. To me that's a personality trait, not a genetic trait. It might be a learned behavior, but if you took the child of an uptight mother and raised them in a relaxed household I don't think the kid would be uptight.

Now apply that to lucid dreaming. I think having the right personality will make someone learn faster, especially in the begining when you're on that balance-beam of assuming control without destorying your dreamstate.

The only thing pathetic is how bad your analogy is. Better luck next time, champ .

Originally Posted by KingYoshi

The only thing pathetic is how bad your analogy is. Better luck next time, champ .

Being told its a bad analogy from someone who didn't even understand what it was, then a little condescending ending to try to grab a sense of authority back. Ha ha.
You are the one who looks bad; nobody cares what I say, but people won't take as much exception to a staff member being an idiot.