Thread: OOBE's proved wrong

Originally Posted by Oneironaught

If I'm misunderstanding you, I apologise. But I don't see how people can use the philosophical argument that "what I don't know must not exist." Sure, to the one who is unaware, it's not there for consideration. But, just because you aren't aware doesn't make it not so.

How doesn't it make it not so?
There is simply nothing to base the assumption on that i don't perceive there to be, everything there is to me.
Never has there been any indication whatsoever that there is something You Yourself don't see as being there.
That assumption itself = Your point of view, and proves itself to You by seeing things that way. Which only approves my point of view.

Originally Posted by Mocari

How doesn't it make it not so?
There is simply nothing to base the assumption on that i don't perceive there to be, everything there is to me.
Never has there been any indication whatsoever that there is something You Yourself don't see as being there.
That assumption itself = Your point of view, and proves itself to You by seeing things that way. Which only approves my point of view.

What??? Anyway, just because I don't see or become effected by something doesnt mean it's non-existent. It still effects those who are exposed to it.

I have no idea what you're trying to get at.

Mocari is just messing around at concepts I guess.


Most of the time I do not feel my heart beat, but it affects me doesn't it? That proves you wrong. Period.

Originally Posted by Oneironaught

What??? Anyway, just because I don't see or become effected by something doesn't mean it's non-existent. It still effects those who are exposed to it.

I have no idea what you're trying to get at.

I don't understand how it doesn't mean it's non-existent. If You are aware it effects those who are exposed to it than of course that's the way it is. But if You aren't, i don't see how it can be existent.

What i initially was getting at is that we shouldn't believe so easily, or hold on to so often, to what science shows us as credible.
I wanted to show one of its limitations. And in doing so i stumbled upon a different view on the world. After this i tried to clarify and grasp the small difference in thinking, that splits up into these two almost opposite views.
But that's harder to show than i had hoped.

Congratulations :bravo:

I see the astounding members of DV have managed to muster another [SIZE=5]5 [SIZE=2]page topic into existence I knew it would happen again, but I didn't think this topic would actually go that far.


Now I am sure that many of you have noticed this with all arguements on this forum as I am sure it is everywhere that there are TWO SIDES to every arguement. For instance in this case there are those who believe in Out Of Body Experiences & Those Who Do Not.

I seriously doubt you will ever get the other side to see your view on things and as you can see 5 Pages Later you are still arguing about the same thing nobody has accepted the others side take on things and I doubt this post will make any difference.

But nobody is going to go "Oh that's a good point I think I will agree with you now."

So really I don't see the point in arguing this topic any further. I do believe this is called "Arguing For The Sake Of Arguing" or something to that effect.

Yours Truly,

Brandon Heat

i'll proved it right IF and only if i have OOBE and i heard that u can wander around in RL?? if that's true i'll wander to a new neighbour hood n remember all the detail! then when i wake up i'll visit it to see if it matches.

If yes> yeah souls and hell n heaven is all real n i'll do gd deed but other ppls wont believe nvm i alone know the ans will be enough xD

Originally Posted by Mocari

I don't understand how it doesn't mean it's non-existent. If You are aware it effects those who are exposed to it than of course that's the way it is. But if You aren't, i don't see how it can be existent.

What i initially was getting at is that we shouldn't believe so easily, or hold on to so often, to what science shows us as credible.
I wanted to show one of its limitations. And in doing so i stumbled upon a different view on the world. After this i tried to clarify and grasp the small difference in thinking, that splits up into these two almost opposite views.
But that's harder to show than i had hoped.

I understand that you're using a philosophical argument. But it only works in the realm of philosophical thinking. That concept holds no water when considering real life. Awareness has no bearing on ultimate reality.

Originally Posted by MrDeJaWu

i'll proved it right IF and only if i have OOBE and i heard that u can wander around in RL?? if that's true i'll wander to a new neighbour hood n remember all the detail! then when i wake up i'll visit it to see if it matches.

If yes> yeah souls and hell n heaven is all real n i'll do gd deed but other ppls wont believe nvm i alone know the ans will be enough xD

I sometimes wish people would use WORDS when they post.

Originally Posted by Oneironaught

I understand that you're using a philosophical argument. But it only works in the realm of philosophical thinking. That concept holds no water when considering real life. Awareness has no bearing on ultimate reality.


I sometimes wish people would use WORDS when they post.

If You see that as truth, i'm not arguing that it isn't. The same way science only works in the realm of scientific thinking, the same way God exists in the eyes of the Christian. Philosophical thinking is very much a part of my reality.

Originally Posted by Brandon Heat

Now I am sure that many of you have noticed this with all arguements on this forum as I am sure it is everywhere that there areTWO SIDES to every arguement.

Well actually there are at least three sides to this discussion, as I don't believe in NDE's exactly, but I don't think Penn and Teller is a good source for proof.

Originally Posted by Xaqaria

...but I don't think Penn and Teller is a good source for proof.

True. I wouldn't say they could supply proof of anything except that jerks who go out of their way to ruin magic and to piss off the magic community can actually make a very good living doing magic shows and being annoying pr!cks. Go figure.