Thread: my beliefs...and yours discussed

Originally Posted by Bosco

Yes, I am interested in reading it. It may be best to share in that thread though (or a new one).

So, you are saying that God directed all the events to conception, sperm, and ovaries in order for you to come here..? (Feel free to address this is a new post or thread)

I think if your were supposed to be here, you are going to be here.

You're implying fate here. If that is the case, then you are also implying that there is no free will as we have no choice about how we come about or facilitate our life.

Heres what i think though. We live in the physical world. The ground you touch, the food you eat and so on are real. They have scientific backing for why they are what they are. God is part of this world but has no physical form other than....well everything that has ever existed.

So, you are saying that God is in everything? What is the difference between this God and energy?

Lets say that yes i was born out of the hundreds of thousands of sperm that caught the egg...yes thats luck that that one made it. But thats why there are so many. In order for something from the mental world to come into our physical world there has to be scientific backing for how it happened.

God curses a very sick person through a miracle, no no no thats wrong because you see the sickness went away due to medicine right?

I don't get this. You are saying that medicine defies Gods will?

Gods will has to have some scientific backing here in our world because, well it has too. Do you understand? if not i will go into more detail.

No; unfortunately just saying "it has too" is not enough for me to understand what you are saying. Please elaborate.

Evolution is real, but again since we live in the physical world it had to be that way because there has to be scientific backing for it here, since its in the physical world

Right. Where are you separating it into a God then? Are you simply attributing anomalous events or very coincidental things to a God? If that is the case; chaos theory.

If you are saying that God is simply the energy that binds us; then I have to ask what is the difference then between this God and just plain ol' energy? Are you giving it a consciousness..?
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Originally Posted by O'nus

You're implying fate here. If that is the case, then you are also implying that there is no free will as we have no choice about how we come about or facilitate our life.



So, you are saying that God is in everything? What is the difference between this God and energy?



I don't get this. You are saying that medicine defies Gods will?



No; unfortunately just saying "it has too" is not enough for me to understand what you are saying. Please elaborate.



Right. Where are you separating it into a God then? Are you simply attributing anomalous events or very coincidental things to a God? If that is the case; chaos theory.

If you are saying that God is simply the energy that binds us; then I have to ask what is the difference then between this God and just plain ol' energy? Are you giving it a consciousness..?
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alright bud i tried, no medicine does not defy gods
you dont understand, it was good trying to try to explain it,
God is energy also, i started that before, my philosophy is too hard to explain not in person

Let me say this though, i am trying to say god and science are the same thing, when a miracle happens there will be scientific data saying why it happened, when your born there was scientific data sayying why you were born. For everything in the world to of become there was the big bang. We live in the physical world, for everything science will explain it.

Originally Posted by Bosco

alright bud i tried, no medicine does not defy gods
you dont understand, it was good trying to try to explain it,
God is energy also, i started that before, my philosophy is too hard to explain not in person

If I had to put a catch phrase on it: "Cosmic Humanism". God being energy/everything is a pretty common belief...

Why even classify anything as "god" when "god" is science? It seems a bit redundant. As far as I'm concerned God either exists or does not. If God does not exist, than science is just science.

Originally Posted by Bosco

alright bud i tried, no medicine does not defy gods
you dont understand, it was good trying to try to explain it,
God is energy also, i started that before, my philosophy is too hard to explain not in person

You said you would elaborate if you had to...lol

Originally Posted by Bosco

alright bud i tried, no medicine does not defy gods
you dont understand, it was good trying to try to explain it,
God is energy also, i started that before, my philosophy is too hard to explain not in person

Why do you keep calling me bud? Are you wolverine?

I am just inquiring to your beliefs in order to clarify issues, don't take it too out of context.

If God is energy, then where are you making the difference between simply "God" and "energy"? It seems to me that you are using them synonymously.

Let me say this though, i am trying to say god and science are the same thing, when a miracle happens there will be scientific data saying why it happened, when your born there was scientific data sayying why you were born. For everything in the world to of become there was the big bang. We live in the physical world, for everything science will explain it.

So, what is God then? I am not exactly seeing the distinguishment here. You would use language to convey this idea in person, would you not?
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Originally Posted by Bosco

God curses a very sick person through a miracle, no no no thats wrong because you see the sickness went away due to medicine right?

Gods will has to have some scientific backing here in our world because, well it has too. Do you understand? if not i will go into more detail.

I don't understand what you're saying here. (Please don't be offended by the following, I'm being sincere) Is English your first language? This just seems a bit muddled. If it helps, pretend that we're idiots who have no idea what you're talking about. Try not to assume that we understand where you're coming from at all.

Originally Posted by thegnome54

I don't understand what you're saying here. (Please don't be offended by the following, I'm being sincere) Is English your first language? This just seems a bit muddled. If it helps, pretend that we're idiots who have no idea what you're talking about. Try not to assume that we understand where you're coming from at all.

I agree with gnome, this is probably a good standpoint to begin with so that we can best understand your point of view.

In addition to what you said; couldn't we attribute the contraction of diseases to epidemiology? We can show and explain how diseases are contracted and come to be. Remember, people used to think that epilepsy was demon posession but now we have means to control it, explain it, and predict it. Thus, it is no longer regarded with a dogmatic attachment.

Just questions to help us understand your view clearly... and question ourselves simultaneously.
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yes english is my first language and in that sentence i was being comepletely sarcastic.

You see, you guys are thinking way to much into details that you are not understanding which is likely my fault

We live in the physical world. For every action there is a reaction, scientific reasoning. If god wants to perform a miracle he will BUT since we are in the physical world, there is an explaination from science for how it happened.

evolution, that is the scientific explaination for how we got here.
We had to go through evolution to be what we are now.
Science is gods waybuilding the physical world. We cant just magicly appear outta no where, it took time.


is this clearer?

Originally Posted by Bosco

yes english is my first language and in that sentence i was being comepletely sarcastic.

You see, you guys are thinking way to much into details that you are not understanding which is likely my fault

This is why we ask you to start from an easier standpoint.

We live in the physical world. For every action there is a reaction, scientific reasoning. If god wants to perform a miracle he will BUT since we are in the physical world, there is an explaination from science for how it happened.

evolution, that is the scientific explaination for how we got here.
We had to go through evolution to be what we are now.
Science is gods waybuilding the physical world. We cant just magicly appear outta no where, it took time.


is this clearer?

It is clear in the fact that you are saying God has no influence over the physical world because he chooses to have no influence over it. Furthermore, you are then arguing then that there is absolutely no reason to believe in God, and never will be.

Are you saying that God functions as the explanation for the big bang, etc? Because then arn't we just filling in any gaps which science cannot explain with "God"?

We once did not know what the sun was and called that God. We also did not know what was past the skies above us, and we assumed that to be God. We also thought that the soul resided in the heart, now it does not seem to have a specific resting place. Religion also once fervently held that the Earth must be the center of the galaxy, and that was changed.
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Originally Posted by O'nus

This is why we ask you to start from an easier standpoint.



It is clear in the fact that you are saying God has no influence over the physical world because he chooses to have no influence over it. Furthermore, you are then arguing then that there is absolutely no reason to believe in God, and never will be.

Are you saying that God functions as the explanation for the big bang, etc? Because then arn't we just filling in any gaps which science cannot explain with "God"?

We once did not know what the sun was and called that God. We also did not know what was past the skies above us, and we assumed that to be God. We also thought that the soul resided in the heart, now it does not seem to have a specific resting place. Religion also once fervently held that the Earth must be the center of the galaxy, and that was changed.
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i never said anything you just stated, im done

Originally Posted by Bosco

i never said anything you just stated, im done

Well then, help me out here.

You seemed to imply that God is not relevant to the physical world and exists independtly and chooses to do so. Right..?

If I am irrelevant, please address where I deviated because your beliefs seem to have an odd dichotomy that I do not understand then.
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Originally Posted by O'nus

Well then, help me out here.

You seemed to imply that God is not relevant to the physical world and exists independtly and chooses to do so. Right..?

If I am irrelevant, please address where I deviated because your beliefs seem to have an odd dichotomy that I do not understand then.
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i never said god is not relavent in this world, tell me where i did, either believe it or not i dont come online to lie about shit

Originally Posted by Bosco

i never said god is not relavent in this world, tell me where i did, either believe it or not i dont come online to lie about shit

Originally Posted by Bosco

We live in the physical world. For every action there is a reaction, scientific reasoning. If god wants to perform a miracle he will BUT since we are in the physical world, there is an explaination from science for how it happened.

evolution, that is the scientific explaination for how we got here.
We had to go through evolution to be what we are now.
Science is gods waybuilding the physical world. We cant just magicly appear outta no where, it took time.

As you explained here above, we have a physical world that has scientific reasoning to explain how it is facilitated. However, God exists independent of this physical world and utilizes science as a means to manipulate the world.

In other words, God=Science. Correct...?
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Originally Posted by O'nus

As you explained here above, we have a physical world that has scientific reasoning to explain how it is facilitated. However, God exists independent of this physical world and utilizes science as a means to manipulate the world.

In other words, God=Science. Correct...?
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God is god, and i feel it, i do not undertand ppeople who dont and try to pick out every detail to deny it, i really am done and am not responding anymore,

Originally Posted by Bosco

We live in the physical world. For every action there is a reaction, scientific reasoning.

I'm sorry, but that doesn't make any sense to me. Can you elaborate?

Originally Posted by Bosco

i never said god is not relavent in this world, tell me where i did, either believe it or not i dont come online to lie about shit

How old are you?

Originally Posted by Bosco

God is god, and i feel it, i do not undertand ppeople who dont and try to pick out every detail to deny it, i really am done and am not responding anymore,

Do not make the mistake of thinking that I am picking apart your beliefs in order to deny it; I am asking questions of you in order to find a reason to believe it.

Note; this still does not define your "God". Tautological explanations do not show anything. I can also say, "Rain is rain" or "Zigyfix is zigyfix". Both say nothing, and in the latter, you have no idea what I am even talking about (which resembles what you are offering us).
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I believe he is trying to say that God works in a way that can be understood by science. For example, God created us through evolution. Even though its evolution, it was His plan for evolution to bring us into existance.

Just a guess :S

Originally Posted by grasshoppa

I believe he is trying to say that God works in a way that can be understood by science. For example, God created us through evolution. Even though its evolution, it was His plan for evolution to bring us into existance.

Just a guess :S

exactly

Originally Posted by grasshoppa

I believe he is trying to say that God works in a way that can be understood by science. For example, God created us through evolution. Even though its evolution, it was His plan for evolution to bring us into existance.

Just a guess :S

That reveals a deep misunderstanding of evolution. Evolution is an emergent phenomenon which occurs because of a variety of physical laws.

All he's really saying is that God made physical laws - which is fine, but that's certainly not scientific evidence of god. It's just a non-falsifiable confabulation.

Your god is no less made up than anyone else's god. Not necessary.

the main problem with you entire argument bosco, is that you're starting with a god taken for granted, and fitting the world around him.

What you should be doing is starting with what you can see and know; ie physcial laws and evidence. And then trying to work out whether God exists from this.

Im just going to jump in and give a little analogy. God is like oxygen, You can't see it, hear it, feel it, smell it, taste it, But you know it's there.

Originally Posted by Riot Maker

Im just going to jump in and give a little analogy. God is like oxygen, You can't see it, hear it, feel it, smell it, taste it, But you know it's there.

Could you not say the samething about reason to believe in Santa Claus? How about Zeus? A flying spaghetti monster..?
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knowledge and exploration for the truth and most logical answear. with that said i think it's perrty obvious that flying speghetti monstor was the creator.