Psionics v. Witch Craft

[Xedan]

I was thinking about psionics the other day and the thought popped into my head "Could there be a connection between psi abilities and witchcraft?" It made enough sense to me. Both cause supernatural things to happen, based on the loose command of a person. The only problem was that incantations aren't exactly the same things as meditation. By which I mean spells work in more of an "eventually" time frame and are more powerful, and psi works in a "right now" time frame and isn't much more that moving/seeing objects with your mind. So What do you think? Could there be a connection between magick and psioncs? Are a psion and a witch the same? Are both these notions a load of shit? feel free to speak your opinion.

[Xei]

There's no evidence for either. This is rather conspicuous considering that psi abilities should be very easy to prove in experimental conditions, and that there is a huge incentive for doing so.

[Xedan]

You fail in terminology. There is evidence of both. You meant to say 'proof'. And due to the incentive, the test are made to be impassible.

[MementoMori]

I believe it's the same thing, just differents means to different varied ends. Praying is like a small meditation, just like incantations are. So i'd say there is some conection here

[Xei]

Fraid not, I'm using the terminology of scientific method and rationality. We never talk about 'proof' in science, only evidence for or against a hypothesis. If there is any evidence for something, you have a reason for believing it to be true. There is however no evidence for either of those things; that's the current view, anyway. If you can produce some then that is a different matter. Your last statement does not make any logical sense. Incentives make you want to do something. This includes the scientists doing the tests. That's what the word 'incentive' means.

[Xedan]

Yea, but a million dollars is a lot to give away to someone if they aren't certain. Psychokinesis is a more or less invisible action. Therefor it is hard to make sure beyond the shadow of a doubt that psi is at work. And as for evidence, it's called a psi wheel. Most common way to show psi at work. It is proven not to be strings, any other cheap tricks, or convection. A psi wheel alone is evidence. On top of MANY other things. Just because something isn't understood by current science doesn't make it any less of evidence.

[Noogah]

Don't think so. Witchcraft is usually the communication and conjuring of demonic entities and spirits. To my knowledge psionics is the manipulation of energy. Witchcraft is explicitly forbidden in the Bible, and it also forbids "soulish" activity, if my memory sevres right, which I believe refers to any type of psychic stuff.

[ExoByte]

Yea, but a million dollars is a lot to give away to someone if they aren't certain. Psychokinesis is a more or less invisible action. Therefor it is hard to make sure beyond the shadow of a doubt that psi is at work. And as for evidence, it's called a psi wheel. Most common way to show psi at work. It is proven not to be strings, any other cheap tricks, or convection. A psi wheel alone is evidence. On top of MANY other things. Just because something isn't understood by current science doesn't make it any less of evidence. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdBE3t2S95I

[Xedan]

The bible forbids a lot of things. Hardly any makes sense. I hope what you're wearing is 100% cotton (or silk, whatever the material was) if you want to abide by the bible.

[Noogah]

I hope what you're wearing is 100% cotton (or silk, whatever the material was) if you want to abide by the bible. No such rule exists. The Bible forbids things that do not condone a healthy spiritual life. They are foolish to the physical world, but to Christians, they make perfect sense.

[Xedan]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdBE3t2S95I yea, that would be convection. but people do it using only their hands, and convection wouldn't be caused when you put a glass bowl over it, which people do.

[Tyler]

Psi wheels are shit. They don't prove anything. I've got an open mind about this kind of thing, but psi wheels are shit.

[Xedan]

No such rule exists. The Bible forbids things that do not condone a healthy spiritual life. They are foolish to the physical world, but to Christians, they make perfect sense. Well it's some material. But yea, it exists. There are very dumb rules in the bible. Just as there are dumb laws. They just can't be avoided for some reason.

[Xedan]

Psi wheels are shit. They don't prove anything. I've got an open mind about this kind of thing, but psi wheels are shit. Really, you could easily elaborate.

[ExoByte]

yea, that would be convection. but people do it using only their hands, and convection wouldn't be caused when you put a glass bowl over it, which people do. Right, because heat can't transfer through surfaces or be contained within a sealed area.

[Tyler]

They are too easy to set moving. The heat kicks on, there is some sort of change in the air current, and the wheel starts to spin. You automatically think "Hey! I moved it!"

[Xedan]

Right, because heat can't transfer through surfaces or be contained within a sealed area. But by hands? really? it doesn't make sense for the kind of movement some get.

[Xei]

Psychokinesis is by its very definition not invisible. It is a tangible thing and in fact very easy to test. Just ask somebody to state their intention with regards to some remote physical action and then see if that action occurs. Psi wheels move by themselves. All you have to do is set one without a human nearby for a long time and see if it moves. Convection currents are one of the main reasons, why don't you think they are? If it doesn't move after a long time, then it's safe to see if you can move it and see if you get results. This is clearly a vital part of the testing process, in science known as a 'control'. Yet nobody has ever been able to make a psi wheel move in these necessary conditions. They can only ever do it with wheels which move by themselves, or are not actually isolated. Unless of course you have some evidence to the contrary.

[Tyler]

Right, because moving your hands around couldn't disrupt an air current.

[Xedan]

They are too easy to set moving. The heat kicks on, there is some sort of change in the air current, and the wheel starts to spin. You automatically think "Hey! I moved it!" I do agree, if you're pretty dumb you can be fooled. But that's not to say there aren't people who know about controlling variables.

[Tyler]

If you can use psychokinesis, great! But if the only evidence you can show me is that you can make a paper thin wheel turn, you need to move on to bigger things.

[Xei]

In response to the new posts; heat can penetrate glass believe it or not. Or indeed the lower surface. And even people could move psi wheels... what exactly does this contribute to humanity? Clearly nobody can do any actual useful work, being unable to exert forces in excess of a few millinewtons.

[Xedan]

Right, because moving your hands around couldn't disrupt an air current. Not with a glass bowl! assume from now on that I am talking about the glass bowl set up, as it is the hardest to do anything by accident.

[Tyler]

Not with a glass bowl! assume from now on that I am talking about the glass bowl set up, as it is the hardest to do anything by accident. But aren't air molecules constantly moving?

[ExoByte]

In response to the new posts; heat can penetrate glass believe it or not. Or indeed the lower surface. Not with a glass bowl! assume from now on that I am talking about the glass bowl set up, as it is the hardest to do anything by accident. This. (10 Character bullshit)