Hahaha, I love DV. |
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Hahaha, I love DV. |
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~XeL's DJ~
~Adopted by Cygnus~
Because there is no, abosolutely no evidence of god whatsoever. Thats why we are atheists. |
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I will not believe in something on faith alone. I believe in science because it offers the most evidence for its claims. Prove to me YOUR God (Argument from inconsistent revelations) exists, and I will believe in God. |
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The burden of proof lies with the one making the claim
Goals:
10 Lucids [X]
Look at my reflection [X]
Dream sex [X] with climax [X]
Even if god was true i still wouldn't follow him. |
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I never believed in God growing up. I was educated about Christian/buddhist/pagan religions among many other things. I think I was very lucky growing up because I was told that there were lots of religions out there and if I felt pulled to one, then I should seek faith. I even met the Dalai Lama when I was six. |
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"...and we want punks in the palace, 'cos punks got the loveliest dreams..." - A Silver Mt. Zion
It was the best of times. It was the end of times.
I feel like the only member of the 'old breed' still around (pre 2008), I'm starting to feel ancient. Anyway, I don't believe in god because of the lack of evidence for his existence. There isn't a single definitive fact that supports theism, it is all coincidence; the death of my mother opened my eyes. As far as god goes, even if he did exist, I don't think I'd want to be on His side, he is nothing but a tyrant; homicidal and hypocritical. Of course this is all just my opinion (I won't at this time back it with fact) and I try to be incredibly open minded, to each his and or her own. |
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Last edited by Lucid_boy; 05-19-2010 at 07:31 PM. Reason: Added some things and deleted others
Infinitly greater than you are... Damn that missing E.
I became atheist because I dont think He is here. I think that's enough on my part. |
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Hgld1234 wuz here!
My dream goals
Complete a ToTM [] Hypnotize a DC [] Summon a DC [X] Teleport [X] Play with fire []
It just sort of happened. I was in eighth grade I think. My family and I were all at Synagogue. Everyone was chanting, and I just... realized... I didn't think God existed. |
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Well, to take care of the atheist vs agnostic bit: do you believe there is a god? This is not the same as "do you completely deny the possibility that any sort of god could exist," it's just whether or not you actually think there is one out there. By the sound of your post, I'd say you're probably atheist in that you don't believe there is a god out there, but agnostic in that you don't completely deny the possibility, either. This would make you an agnostic atheist, I guess. |
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i was raised catholic Ive been an atheist most of my life until a couple years ago. i don't believe in a moral judeo-christian lawgiver god. I would agree more with the Hindu perspective of god as being the web that interconnects all of existence. I strongly disagree with organized religion but I still have yet to hear a halfway logical argument for the non existence of "god" from the people on this site besides the "i don't perceive him with my five senses therefore he doesn't exist" argument. under the same logic you would half to admit that emotions are fake too since you cannot perceive them with your senses. I agree with the mentality that we should question everything but do you question the big bang or the existence of subatomic particles? or just blindly except them to be infallible truths because scientist know more than you do? |
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A better question would be to give me a good reason why god exists. Would you believe that there's an invisible flying spaghetti monster out there, just because someone told you there was? Or how about that there's a teakettle in the asteroid belt? There is more to the nonexistence of god argument than just "we can't perceive it." Emotions are perfectly perceivable. God is not. We can experience emotions. We can feel anger, love, joy, all that. Not so with god. But on top of our inability to perceive him directly, it just isn't all that feasible an argument. Now, your example with the beach...we KNOW that people tend to get stranded on islands once in a while. We KNOW that SOS is the universal signal of distress for a person trapped on an island. It WOULD be more plausible that a creator was responsible for that, as that solution contains the fewest variables. We know people exist, and we know they can arrange rocks to make distress signals in times of distress. BUT, life in general is not so straightforward. We don't know if there's a divine being or not. We don't know what it's like or if it's responsible for life if it does exist. We do know that amino acids are found all throughout the universe, and that they can be formed by chemical reactions that we can replicate and reproduce. To make the conclusion that life exists from a creator, you must first make the large assumption that there's an all-powerful being without any evidence. With the island scenario, you can make an educated guess. Not so much with life. Now, if YOU were a god and you knew about other gods, and you found Earth, you could assume one of them did it. Fewer variables. But, without any evidence, knowledge, or perception of a designer, it actually contains more variables than other theories, and so is less likely. |
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Would you even have the concept of god that you do now if it weren't for organized religion? If not, then you either have to believe that a supernatural deity revealed itself to a select few in ancient times, or that the same people made it up. Occam's razor. |
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no worries Spariate. I never claimed to "solve" as you say, the problem of the existence of god. the island metaphor is not the proof of anything. its a logic game. mostly everyone will assume that the SOS was created by a designer not random events. It is too coincidental. The reason i brought it up was so that someone will prove me wrong. Neither of you could provide a logical explanation why god doesn't exist like i asked. You say i am foolish for putting limits on the universe but you do the same when you write off the existence of a designer. As for mario92 i was referring to the feeling IE touching sensation. We can not physically touch/feel anger or love they are abstract concepts(not saying they dont exist).spariate you are completely right we are just a speck of dust in the hourglass of time so who are we to say what the universe is capable of? thank you for replying i look forward to more thought provoking responses. |
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Like i said i brought the Island metaphor up for the sake of argument so someone can prove me wrong. im not trying to convert anyone to any belief and im not trying to disrespect anyone's beliefs by any means. Im just trying to reach a better understanding. |
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Again, its a logic game. its no proof that god exists. All it is trying to say is that rationally most people will consider the SOS to be the work of a designer. It would not be rational to say it was an accident. Deserted island. SOS. Too coincidental. Lets forget about the island for a minute. After all its just a metaphor. Not proof that god exists ok? So the big bang was an explosion of energy and matter that created the universe and life. This is the most popular theory for the origins of the universe. Most people logically assume that since the galaxies are expanding away from each other they came from one central point at one time. Life evolved randomly possibly from organic soup. But lets think about how evolution works. Species evolve as a result from external stimuli. They don't evolve because they feel like it, they evolve because they are presented with an external challenge that they must overcome or they die. So what external forces caused life to evolve from organic molecules in the first place? We all know life comes from other life. So why is this designer theory considered irrational? Im just trying to use logic to figure this out and I would appreciate others opinions as well. |
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Your argument relies on the premise that "everything needs a designer", which leads to an endless chain of questions. (Who was god's designer? And god's designer's designer? etc) If you say that god doesn't need a designer you're admitting the falsity of the very premise used to prove his existence. |
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Last edited by Scatterbrain; 06-16-2010 at 12:36 AM.
- Are you an idiot?
- No sir, I'm a dreamer.
wow I did not think of that before. that brings up a very good point. im definitely stumped for now. i need a bit to think about it. thanks this is exactly what i wanted. |
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Yes I realize it's a metaphor but how does it apply to real life. I too would assume that a person created the SOS on the island, but I see nothing in real life that can compare. It's like saying "if you go to a deserted island and meet god, it would be logical to believe that god exists". Yes it would... but since god doesn't present himself in real life, how is that a valid argument? |
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Humans are born neither theist nor atheist. It is because they don't have a concept of God at birth that they are not capable of a position. Being an atheist is negating, disbelieving or disagreeing with a concept of a God. You are not even born an agnostic, because that is also a position that is relative to a belief or concept. Nobody is born with a belief about things they don't understand, especially when they have not even understood words or language. |
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The Ultimate Lucid Mp3 Thread Link
Mp3 track available here (02/2015): http://www27.zippyshare.com/v/36261038/file.html
The idea of intelligent design only works if you decide to take consciousness as the absolute entity above all other objects we perceive to exist (in the objective world). Just because I perceive things and conceive concepts doesn't make me some sort of an authority. Why would it... do we know what an atom is? What gives us the right to use our pathetic little ideas and concepts to state them as dominant over the objective reality. Concepts like design... |
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This reminds me of the quote (which was attributed to Ryan Hanson): |
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