I'm good at getting into SP, but i can't seem to get passed it.

[lucidlistener]

As the topic title suggests, my problem is getting from SP to LD's or even OBE's. I know I'm in SP due to a number of clues; such as all-around heaviness, the odd sense of slight separation, and most notably -- the shift in awareness (described as 'a new sense of clarity to my thoughts' and 'a lack of other, miscellaneous thoughts'). Point being made is that I DO get into SP. Problem is, I can't seem to enter a LD or OBE thereafter. If I keep up with my 'awareness' or 'sense of self', I end up just lying there for what will seem like forever! If I let my thoughts drift, I end up falling asleep -- without awareness. what do?

[Arch]

Transition is the hardest part, you need to relax yet be aware, try listening to some relaxing music and just pay attention to whats going on in like a 3rd party sense, don't interfere, just let it happen.

[lucidlistener]

hmmm, makes sense and thanks for the reply. I heard the OBE transition is similar to LDing difference being: separating in your dream room vs separating into a random dream location. I guess what I'm asking is whether OBE's are just localized lucids or not? Putting that aside, you're saying to simply distance yourself from the process is the key? Like watching vs partaking?

[Arch]

hmmm, makes sense and thanks for the reply. Putting that aside, you're saying to simply distance yourself from the process is the key? Like watching vs partaking? Exactly.

[lucidlistener]

Okay then, I'll give it a shot. Although I feel the the acknowledgment of my situation is the most subtle I can get in regards to my awareness. Oh and you didn't answer my "off-topic" question... :p

[nina]

Can you move at all? Have you tried? If not, then you don't know for certain whether you are in SP or not. The heaviness and separation you experience could be that initial numbness you get after lying still for awhile, but it's not yet SP. At least, not full SP. If you've never entered the vibrational stage, then it's likely you haven't progressed too far into SP. The reason I think this, is because once you DO enter full SP, usually the lucid dream happens relatively quickly after. But once you lay still for awhile and get the numbness and hynagogic hallucinations and such, you can end up lying there for a long time before you enter full on SP. The key with WILDs is timing. You really need to time it properly so that you aren't too tired and you aren't too awake. The WILDing guides will tell you the best times to attempt to WILD, but I prefer to try after only 3 or 4.5 hours of sleep. That way, when I do become lucid I have hours to spend in my dreams, unlike when you try to WILD after 6 or so hours of sleep. But you gotta find the best time for yourself.

[lawilahd]

I agree with Nina, timing is really important in WILD'ing and usually when I WILD, I don't even notice anything different until the vibrational stage, and even in that stage I can still slightly move my feet/hands. The times that I have really tried hard to enter or create a dream scene were the times I also failed, in my most recent WILD 2 days ago, I just let the vibration get louder and louder and waited for what seemed like 45 seconds and boom, i was in a LD

[Kilpikonna]

When I feel "ready", like what you describe as SP, I start experimenting with different LD entry techniques, some of those are regarded as OBE exit techniques, but I consider many OBEs as LD. (Well, guess one could also state, any LD is in a way a OBE, as the experience is not in ones physical body, but in ones dream body) Every time something else does work. Here some of the things I do: Suggest/allow to flow/slide down the bed towards the foot end. (This can lead in me sitting up on the foot end of a dream bed or entering a random dream scene). Allowing my legs to move/slide to the side until they drop down the side of the bed. Results in me sitting up. Starting to rock body parts, the feeling of getting a swing started. Making swimming movements with arms and legs - first very small and slowly getting bigger. Allowing my hands to move together over my belly and start to rub them. The above are reliable in me staying aware. If those do not (yet) work, I experiment with other techniques. For example I imagine climbing on a chair to get a cup of coffee from a high shelf. When this turns into a hypnagogia feeling, I let myself fall to the side to the ground. The falling sensation does get my dream body start moving and then one of the above does work. Just experiment a bit and see what works for you! Eventually something will work.

[lucidlistener]

Can you move at all? Have you tried? ... The key with WILDs is timing. Yes, i can always move a finger or a toe if i try, (but i'm told not to as to maintain the effect). As for the "vibrational stage", i don't think i've ever experienced anything greater than "tingling" in SP. Maybe this is a sign that i'm not in it for long enough - although i usually remain still after "apparent SP" for 10-20 min. You're right about the timing part; if i wake up after 3-4hrs of sleep i can usually enter SP with ease. When I feel "ready", like what you describe as SP, I start experimenting with different LD entry techniques, some of those are regarded as OBE exit techniques, but I consider many OBEs as LD. (Well, guess one could also state, any LD is in a way a OBE, as the experience is not in ones physical body, but in ones dream body) Every time something else does work. Here some of the things I do: ... These are some great suggestions, i thank you. And i agree in accordance to OBE's simply being "localized" LD's (as i suggested earlier in a question). -- I suppose i simply need to wait it out a bit more, thanks for the replies/suggestions, and i'll be sure to post results!

[nina]

Mkay, well in sleep paralysis you can't move anything, except your eyes. So it's likely you haven't yet reached SP.

[Ctharlhie]

Can you move at all? Have you tried? If not, then you don't know for certain whether you are in SP or not. The heaviness and separation you experience could be that initial numbness you get after lying still for awhile, but it's not yet SP. At least, not full SP. If you've never entered the vibrational stage, then it's likely you haven't progressed too far into SP. The reason I think this, is because once you DO enter full SP, usually the lucid dream happens relatively quickly after. But once you lay still for awhile and get the numbness and hynagogic hallucinations and such, you can end up lying there for a long time before you enter full on SP. The key with WILDs is timing. You really need to time it properly so that you aren't too tired and you aren't too awake. The WILDing guides will tell you the best times to attempt to WILD, but I prefer to try after only 3 or 4.5 hours of sleep. That way, when I do become lucid I have hours to spend in my dreams, unlike when you try to WILD after 6 or so hours of sleep. But you gotta find the best time for yourself. I find that if I wake too early in the night I'm too tired to think properly, I literally think 'Wtf is this alarm doing waking me at 2 o'clock?' *switch off alarm, zonk out* and completely forget about lucid dreaming. I tried WILDing this morning 3 hours after I woke up (I'd just gone about my daily routine in those 3 hours) I got to a point where I was tingling almost all over my body and then I started having some pretty painful spasms in my leg and couldn't help jerking. I also lost track of my counting a few times (doing the the same set of 10 numbers a few times). Are these good signs?

[lucidlistener]

Mkay, well in sleep paralysis you can't move anything, except your eyes. So it's likely you haven't yet reached SP. See, that's what i'm thinking... but the whole shift in awareness seems like a definable characteristic of "true" SP. If someone can tell me that the "heavyness" and the "conscious shift" are early-set features of SP then yes, i need to hold out. Also, haven't experienced any HH yet... this could be another indication if it happens to most everyone in SP. Thanks for the help tho <3

[fgopl]

So to me, it sounds like you are on top of tall building. You are going to fall. All you are holding onto is am thin thread of consciousness. If you let go, you fall into the unknown land of an unconscious dream.

[Chriskozlak]

Once sp hits, wait 5 seconds, and then simply stand up. Trust me.

[cheerleader1212]

SAME! I feel like im in sleep paralysis but i can still move if i try. I get the feeling of heaviness too but nothing really else. I dont hear any weird noises or stuff anybody else gets. I just lay there for an hour feeling numb and when i try to enter a dream its just me actually sitting up in my bed. Im not actually dreaming i just woke myself up.