Thread: Why WILD is uncertain method

*sigh* So ideally, we need to wake up after a dream (REM), and go directly into another REM period? And doesn't deep sleep cease to happen after roughly 4.5 hours of sleep, as shown in charts like this one? If so, what we would need to do is wake up naturally after 4-5 or more hours of sleep, after a dream (in REM), do a WILD technique and pray that REM sleep comes next instead of light sleep, lol.
Or of course, aim for a REM period and try to wake up right during it. But has this been proven effective? How many people figured the hour they need to wake up at and had a successful WILD? Because I've always only heard minimal discussion of the importance of waking up at the right time, and if it really boosted the chances considerably, I imagine people would talk about it more. Most people only talk about the WILD techniques themselves.

Also, would it be okay to try WILD twice in the same morning, by waking up in one REM period (after 5 hours of sleep), and then if that fails, try the next one (after 6.5 hours)? Would that disturb the body's sleep pattern, or would it ignore the fact that you woke up and continue its usual schedule?

Originally Posted by mimihigurashi

And doesn't deep sleep cease to happen after roughly 4.5 hours of sleep, as shown in [URL="http://www.luciddreamexplorers.com/dreamscience/sleep_cycle_REM_8_hour_graph.jpg"]charts like this one[/UR

Hey mimihigurashi, good remarks.

First about those sleep charts - Everyone has different sleep pattern every night. Factors that affect it are for example food, drink, lenght of sleep previous nights, depression, emotion, illness, number of awakening last night, age and so on. If you are healthy and avoiding all substances that affect sleep (caffeine, alcohol...) and you have solid sleep routine, then your sleep patterns are similar, not the same, but similar. I'm in deep sleep phase only in the first 3 hours of sleep usually.

This is why it's complicated to know, when your REM is and when is ideal to wake up for wild and how long to be awake. I don't have recipe for this so far.

Or of course, aim for a REM period and try to wake up right during it. But has this been proven effective?

I think this is the best way because I had wilds only in this case, so I've got it proven on myself.

Because I've always only heard minimal discussion of the importance of waking up at the right time, and if it really boosted the chances considerably, I imagine people would talk about it more. Most people only talk about the WILD techniques themselves.

I think that this is why so many people failing at wilds so often. Everybody talks about how you should move your finger or ass or whatever, what you should think and how you should lie and other crap. I don't care about this, wild is easy for me under the right conditions - rem-wake-hi-rem. If I'm lucky to have this ''brain chemistry'' I usualy use basic visualization to enter a lucid dream. It's really easy. But if I'm not lucky in the condition, I will never have WILD. If there is light or deep sleep after, I sometimes have DILD but that depends on light sleep a deep sleep phases lenght ahead of REM.

Also, would it be okay to try WILD twice in the same morning, by waking up in one REM period (after 5 hours of sleep), and then if that fails, try the next one (after 6.5 hours)? Would that disturb the body's sleep pattern, or would it ignore the fact that you woke up and continue its usual schedule?

I wouldn't agree. Yes it would change your sleep pattern, but not disturb. (if you aren't using alarm and wake up naturally)

Originally Posted by Nfri

If you are healthy and avoiding all substances that affect sleep (caffeine, alcohol...) and you have solid sleep routine, then your sleep patterns are similar, not the same, but similar. I'm in deep sleep phase only in the first 3 hours of sleep usually.

Is that so? Well, lucky me then, I fit those criteria. So the more routine and normal your life is, the more likely you are to have a normal sleep cycle, makes sense. I did go through my dream journal out of curiousity, I wish I had marked the fall asleep and awake time of more successful WILDs I had in the past, but from the few that I found with time details written, they all coincided with the patterns indicated in the sleep charts, the WILDs were successful roughly after 5 and 6.5 hours of sleep, during the 3rd and 4th REM period. I'm going to start experimenting with this from tomorrow morning on.

I think that this is why so many people failing at wilds so often. Everybody talks about how you should move your finger or ass or whatever, what you should think and how you should lie and other crap. I don't care about this, wild is easy for me under the right conditions - rem-wake-hi-rem. If I'm lucky to have this ''brain chemistry'' I usualy use basic visualization to enter a lucid dream. It's really easy. But if I'm not lucky in the condition, I will never have WILD. If there is light or deep sleep after, I sometimes have DILD but that depends on light sleep a deep sleep phases lenght ahead of REM.

Amen to that. I'm definitely no expert but I think it makes a lot of sense that the time at which you attempt WILD is the most important, the technique is secondary. There's a thread that's been going on for a while now called "Testing SSILD for a month" or something, and now I wonder how many of those people are actually waking up at the right time. It's possible that a large chunk is waking up in light sleep, attempts SSILD, it fails because REM is not next on the list, and blame the failure on something else, even SSILD itself.